22 replies to this topic

[vroom-vroom]

From Formula1.com:

A report in Gazetta dello Sport claims that Paul Stoddard, owner of European Aviation and their F3000 team, European Racing, is considering buying the Minardi team. The Italian outfit has been in financial difficulties since PSN pulled out of a deal to take a majority stake in the team last year. They have no engine deal and no major sponsors, and doubts are beginning to surface as to whether they will line-up on the grid for the first Grand Prix in Australia. European Racing ran as Arrows' junior team for most of the 2000 season, with current Benetton test driver, Mark Webber, as their lead driver.

If Stoddard gets Minardi, if they get an engine, sponsors, and if they ever make it to the grid, watch for a Alonso-Webber pairing next season - not too shabby a driver lineup, IMO.

[doohanOK]

Little advantage for Webber to go to Minardi. He already is test driver for Benetton, and most likely would in any case have to pay for a seat at Minardi.

He's better off staying at Benetton for the time being.

regards,
doohanOK.

[Pacific]

So the racing world caught up with my speculation finally. That's true to a degree, but mine was based on the possibility the Renault or Meccachrome would make Minardi their secondary team. In which case, Alonso and Webber would still test for Benetton, but also race for Minardi and test some for Minardi, thus giving them MUCH experience in one year and a great way to gauge their F1 talents. If Renault were to give Minardi a decent customer engine, they'd keep up with the field. They'd still be last, because I doubt a Renault customer engine would keep up with a Ferrari customer engine, or a BMW, Cosworth, Honda, or AMT. But, they'd still be at that 104% mark and it'd make it worthwhile.

The only difference would be that Minardi would become an official F1 Junior Team, which it has been for years. Ask Giancarlo Fisichella, Jarno Trulli, and perhaps Marc Gene and Gaston Mazzacane.

Minardi: Top developer of F1 talent.

Or: Official supplier of talent to F1.

That's right, not F3, not F3000, not Formula Renault...Minardi

Seriously, I am hopeful my prediction of Alonso-Webber comes true with a Renault connection. It still wouldn't solve sponsorship problems, but having a decent engine and two marketable drivers would certainly help. I mean, I think everybody here likes Mark Webber and everybody is impressed with Alonso as well. Both are top talents and I'd love to see some more top youngsters get a shot. I'm certain Alonso would succeed and very confident Webber would as well.

[Witt]

Webber wouldn't take a drive at Minardi/Stoddart in a million years! He's been saying for the past 4 years that he would never sign a deal with a Minardi type team, and is probably the reason he refused to sign Tom Walkinshaw's proposed five year contract last year.

Unless, as you say Pacific, the cars are powered by Mechachrome engines (therefore a Renault link). This makes some sense, actually quite a bit of sense. Webber is contracted to Benetton this year and Alonso is contracted to Flavio Briatore. Webber will still be required to test for Benetton in between races, but would be allowed to drive for Minardi/Stoddart. Flav owns Supertech, Renault own Mechachrome. We all know that Mechachrome engines can not run themselves without Flavio's Supertech in the middle. A very strong common link. But, it would all depend on the cars being powered by Mechachrome/Supertech. If they use those shitty 3 year old fords, i don't think Webber could swallow his pride to drive the thing knowing his only competition would be his team mate (and the 107% rule).

[Ross Stonefeld]

Webber doesnt strike me as much of a racer with that kind of mindset

I know a guy who if he doesnt get stuff sorted for this season applied to be the janitor at a CART team!

[Witt]

Don't get him wrong Ross. He could easily have signed for a crap team already, but he fears he will fade into oblivion if he does, and get a bad reputation. If he ever gets to F1 he wants to do it with the right team so his impact is big. That is the mindset of a racer, he wants the best car where ever he drives.

His views might be old fashioned, in line with the eighties where there were 40 car grids and only ten drivers capable of making an impact. In todays F1, drivers like Fisichella, Trulli & Gene have all proved it's possible to make an impact in a Minardi. I think when Webber finds he can't secure a drive with a top line team in F1, he will take a drive with a minnow. If he succeeds in F3000 this year at Supanova, it probably would have all been worth the wait.

[Ross Stonefeld]

No driver is overlooked if he's got the goods.

You'd think he'd rather race, than not race

[Witt]

He'd rather drive for a front running team in F3000 and fight for wins than fight the 107% rule at Minardi. Put it that way. He's a racer who wants to win.

Mercedes didn't look him over when he drove an underfunded F3 car to fourth place overall in the 1997 British Championship. They had so little money at ADR that Mercedes had to step in half way through the year. At the Australian GP Ball of that year, Mark approached Norbert Haug and said "Keep your eye on me". Norbert was probably thinking "Who the F*** does this kid think he is". At the British GP Mark impressed Haug enough (his overtaking manouver around Johnny Kane (champion that year) on the outside at Stowe was the talk of the F1 paddock) ensuring his racing in Europe would continue for another two years. Albeit, it was in Sportscars but how could you pass up an opportunity to race for Mercedes? After the Lemans fiasco in 1999, Mark had the balls to pay himself out of his own Mercedes contract to take a chance on a reletively new F3000 team. He finished third in the championship, rookie of the year, won a race in the worst conditions. How can you not be impressed?

The only goods these days is money. Talent is of secondary importance. If it were the other way around he'd already be in F1. In motor racing, being Australian is like being associated with poverty and third world countries. The teams all know that Australia puts almost nothing into European racing and as a result they are unwilling to put anything into an Aussie. Someone like Raikonnen has Finland behind him. Sauber didn't need money up front because he knows the Finns will pay big bucks for sponsorship riding on the wave of Mika Hakkinen's success. Kimi is garanteed a lot of attention at home thus the money will be there.

[Daemon]

Ross - I know you'd jump at the chance, so I can see your point of view, and Mark would probably consider it long and hard. However, Aussies have recently gone about getting an F1 drive with the tail enders, - David and Gary Brabham the two notables, and both were rated very highly. Well, their teams collapsed and they never had much in the way of sponsorship, so their F1 days were over.

Webber is in exactly the same boat.

Personally I'd love to see him drive for Minardi. There is no team in the pitlane which I have more respect for. They are affiliated with Benetton through Briatore. Alfonso and Webber are both under contract to Benetton, so we may see Minardi become what Sauber is to Ferrari.

Here are his choices. The best team in F3000 or the perennial backmarker team of F1. Tough call, considering he's already testing the Benetton.

[Ross Stonefeld]

Oooooooh well thats different

Super Nova F3000 vs Minardi well duh, SuperNova

I thought you meant he said he wasnt going to drive at all if all he could get was Minardi, THAT would have been dumb



The Mercedes story is interesting. How did he afford to buy himself out of a contract? And since Mercedes sportscars died in 1999 wouldnt they have let him go anyways?

[Witt]

I thought you'd have known about the Supanova deal, sorry if i seemed a bit defensive about Webber. If he ever makes it to F1, or any aussie for that matter, watch out. Us Aussies are as bad as the Brazilians and Dutch when it comes to supporting our drivers.

I beleive Paul Stoddart footed most of the bill to pay-out Webber's contract. It was only about 100,000 pounds, but it's 100,000 pounds he could do with. I'm not sure what Mercedes planned to do with Webber in 2000. He may have had a CART offer, at the very worst they were going to place him in the DTM. Webber thought he deserved a place in the Mclaren Junior F3000 team but they wouldn't put him there, he and Stoddart showed them! In hindsight he was better off at European Racing anyway.

Webber believes that going to CART is a backwards step from F3000. "It's too easy to be forgotten over there" or something like that he's always says. However, i'm pretty sure Bruno Junquiera won't be forgotten after winning the F3000 championship, so if Mark were to win this year, he might change his stance on CART if he can't get an F1 drive.

[Ross Stonefeld]

Mark seems to have that Austrlian almost too head strong attitude I hope he had a good manager to keep him under control

I knew of the SuperNova deal and was under the impression he was all but signed and delivered, but wasnt aware it was a Supernova vs Minardi situation

[Witt]

There is no Supanova V's Minardi situation anywhere but this thread.

Sorry if we've confused you here. We're just a bunch of over-hypothesising F1 nuts who really want to see an Aussie in F1.

I think he's got former Rugby star David Campese managing him. However, now that he's at Supanova, i wouldn't be suprised to see Sears take over, or even Flav.

[iconic]

he should drive the big v8 supercars... has he done that before? that would kick arse i reckon... hmm... if he signed the contract with TWR, he may have got a race at HRT?

[Daemon]

Walkinshaw has offered Mark a drive at Bathurst with HRT twice I beleive. He turned Tommy down both times. Seems like Mark is fully focused on single seaters, and has no interest at this stage in the ATCC.

Hopefully after he wins a few World Championships ;)

As for single seater drivers returning to the ATCC, anyone else reckon Jason Bright is gonna kick some serious ass in the HRT. Lowndes to Ford, Brighty to HRT, no problems with that switch. Please stay there. I've no doubts he'll go very close this year if not win it, although Skaify certainly does seem to be improving with age.

[iconic]

i haven't been following v8s lately... coz of school work hahaha

but i've read stuff that the v8s are becoming more nascar'ish with standardized components.. better racing? i reckon it'll be... hey does any watch the boc gases toca australia races? not shown on channel 7 anymore=( is there going to be a revivial such as one happening for the btcc now? that would kick arse coz i reckon there is much more closer racing in the 2 litre super tourers...

[Nasty McBastard]

yeah, i saw a aus 2l touring car race not long ago on fox..or C7...

14 no name drivers, covered by 20 odd seconds in Q, on crap "local" race tracks

it sure turned my crank

[Nasty McBastard]

still.. having said that.. the only 5l race i REALLY watched last year was bathurst...

multipul heats, ****ing around with the grid in the top 6 or whatever etc etc...

maybe im turning into a motorsport yuppie...but i say let em go...one race, no tinkering...

aussie v8's branching out into other countries (where theyre wanted), one race (something worthwhile like 1 or 2 hours worth) instead of 2 or 3 "sprints", no grid altering etc...

now thats somethign ive been hoping for for years

[Daemon]

Tony Cochrane and AVESCO seem to be pushing for more 1 race formats, but all the drivers seem to prefer the 2 or 3 race format. Better racing they say. Thats not how I see it either.

[Pacific]

Well, a lot of things point to Alonso racing for Minardi.

A. He has a contract with Minardi.
B. If Renault/Meccachrome are involved in Minardi, look for Flavio to be completely happy with Alonso testing for Benetton AND racing for Minardi.

As for Webber, that was all my speculation due to the Renault/Meccachrome connection and my wishes to see Mark in F1.

As for Minardi vs. SuperNova. I disagree. Name me a good driver for Minardi who hasn't really moved up lately? Everybody has. Jarno Trulli, impressed, snatched up by Prost quite fast. Giancarlo Fisichella, Jordan bit pretty quick and now he's at Benetton getting beaten by Alexander Wurz at Indy because he doesn't have the ambition to ever be anything really special. Unlike say the ambition Michael Schumacher has shown and I suppose Mika Hakkinen. But, he impressed at Minardi, and occassionally wows at Benetton, usually only at tracks in Quebec though. Marc Gene was taken by Williams-BMW to test and we all know that if he can impress in testing similar to how Panis did last year. Even Gaston Mazzacane has made the step up, of course, Gaston has something Mark doesn't, sponsorship.

If Renault is going to give engines to Minardi AND have Alonso and Webber racing there, they aren't going to feed Minardi/European Aviation, whatever, crap. They want to see their young drivers perform. Gustav Brunner and the Minardi team have shown they can produce a good car, now it's really, when the hell will an engine manufacturer and some sponsors wake up to the potential Minardi have? Prost over Minardi...that's for ONE REASON alone, Alain Prost is involved. It sure as hell ain't for performance, because it seems like ever since he bought Ligier, results have been less and less forthcoming each season.

[vroom-vroom]

Prost over Minardi...that's for ONE
REASON alone, Alain Prost is involved. It sure as hell ain't for performance, because...

You'd think that, by now, people would have realized that the very fact that Prost [and Alesi] is involved implies doom to the team in question...

[iconic]

paul morris and that policeman in the vectra.. that was the close racing i was talking about... 2 people=)

[Turbo]

iconic - Speedvision in the USA shows Aussie Super Touring on a VERY delayed basis (a few weeks or even more). Though Morris is basically running away with it as of Mallala, he's had some great battles with Henderson (the Sydney policeman), Lakeside was especially good.