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#551 Hugo Boecker

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 13:23

Tim, Mercedes gave the 35 Masaryk race a miss. Car #22 is from Monza 34, poles were there im 1934 due to track-layout. so it's Henne.

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#552 Holger Merten

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 13:24

According to Louis Sugahara a W 25 with the number 22 was driven in June 1934 at the Eiferennen by Fagioli, in July at Monthléry by von Brauchitsch, and in September at Monza by Henne; in September 1935 at San Sebastian by von Brauchitsch and, finally, in June 1936 in Budapest by von Brauchitsch, again.


Sure and I agree with Rob, not Nürburgring, I have a picture with Momberger at Monza with the same b/w striped signs beside the track.

Edited by Holger Merten, 10 December 2009 - 13:28.


#553 Tim Murray

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 13:34

Tim, Mercedes gave the 35 Masaryk race a miss.

Oh dear, so they did. I feel very stupid. I should have remembered - Rosemeyer's first win and everything, Sorry everyone. :blush:



#554 D-Type

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 13:59

So, if #22 was photographed at Monza, which I think is 90% certain, it was definitely silver so it gives a good basis for comparison with the other pictures. They don't look noticeably different which suggests that they also show a silver car. But, and it's a big but, do we know when they were taken?

#555 Holger Merten

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 14:03

Tim, Mercedes gave the 35 Masaryk race a miss. Car #22 is from Monza 34, poles were there im 1934 due to track-layout. so it's Henne.



Okay Hugo, you were faster. :lol:

#556 jsfernst

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 20:21

Posted Image Posted Image

Maybe one should see it from a different angle. Compare the photos and they tell us a (the) story: The weight limit was at 750 kg without fluids (with brake fluid) and without tyres. IMO with one more year of experience the cars of 1935 were much more near the limit then the year before. So they had to get the tyres off for scrutineering. In 1934 it was evidently not necessary.


Looking through the thread I found the image of the W 25s on the scale. The star is missing which should have been a badge rather than being painted on (as it began occurring in 1935). See post 18 for this.

#557 jsfernst

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 20:23

Hey guys, has anybody tried asking Paul Pietsch? He was at that race and later drove for A-U (and I can imagine they were keeping one eye on Mercedes), so it's not unreasonable to assume he might have seen or remembers something... Methinks it's worth a shot- esp. as he isn't getting any younger (like everybody else).

Yes, he said the Mercedes-Benz drove in white for several rounds during the training sessions.

#558 Doug Nye

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 21:33

Yes, he said the Mercedes-Benz drove in white for several rounds during the training sessions.


Dubious testimony, I fear...

DCN

#559 Holger Merten

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 00:41

Yes, he said the Mercedes-Benz drove in white for several rounds during the training sessions.


With all respect for Mr Pietsch, here he wants wants to be part of the story, sorry. Having so many problems to handle the AU compared to the other cadet driver Rosemeyer in the 1935 season, he is unlucky to have signed a contract with AU instead of MB until today.


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#560 jsfernst

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 07:57

So, if #22 was photographed at Monza, which I think is 90% certain, it was definitely silver so it gives a good basis for comparison with the other pictures. They don't look noticeably different which suggests that they also show a silver car. But, and it's a big but, do we know when they were taken?

It is Monza.
Posted Image

Edited by jsfernst, 11 December 2009 - 08:17.


#561 Doug Nye

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 12:32

I'm sorry to have to say as much, because with advancing years memory does become less reliable and reactive responses to questions might be very much less carefully considered than they once were, but back about three years ago Paul Pietsch responded like this to the direct question of whether or not the EifelRennen W25s were ever white-painted:

To the best of his recollection (at that time) he said that "...the silver arrows were always silver. I can't remember any
overnight paint scratching activities, but I wasn't there to
see such activitiy. I only ever recall seeing the cars in silver."

DCN

Edited by Doug Nye, 11 December 2009 - 12:33.


#562 Vitesse2

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 12:37

Okay, let's review these. Having eliminated the Henne picture, I've rearranged them, starting with the three pictures which look to be Caracciola. I think they are from three different occasions: the first two are in distinct locations and note that in the third, the driver's wind cap is lower on his brow. Alternatively, it looks almost as though he's not wearing goggles in that one: could this be a slow testing run on the Betonschleife?


Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image

Next, three of Fagioli, from two different sessions - notice how his shirt sleeve is rolled up higher in the third picture, the location which matches the second Caracciola picture. As the first pair include the "mystery Monza" picture and are taken in the same general locations as the first one of Caracciola, I'd venture to suggest that those three are from the same session: but of course if Hugo's theory is correct then they aren't from the Eifelrennen at all.

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Finally, the one which looks to me to be von Brauchitsch. Like the tarmac surface pictures in the two previous sequences it has obviously been taken in a lunch-time session: note the shadows which indicate that the sun is high in the sky. In this and the Fagioli picture the shadow is sharp and well-defined, in the Caracciola one, less so.

Posted Image

#563 HDonaldCapps

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 18:43

First off, I wish to thank the good Dr. Ernst for continuing to share the fruits of his research with us, an effort which has continued for nearly two and a half years after our symposium at the Classic Centre. I continue to be impressed by his efforts to pursue this topic even if the trail might not necessarily lead where one hopes. It has led us to to places (such as the Zoltan Glass Collection) that will benefit us all in the coming years, which makes it time very well spent in my opinion.

Which brings me to the, "Alas," part of my post.

Alas, I continue to see nothing which would lead me to think that the machines were anything but sliver at both the Eifelrennen or elsewhere on a race track, nor that the wonderful tale that Herr Neubauer related actually took place. I state this after much thought and even longer consideration. Nothing in the new pictures leads me to change my conclusion.

Having said that, I wish to thank Mercedes and Dr. Ernst for the great effort and support that they have given to this question. As my colleague in the "English Corner" remarked, it may have been "Much ado about nothing," but it has been great fun as well.

Josef, my best wishes and hope to see you soon.

Warm regards,

Don

#564 Victor

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Posted 12 December 2009 - 12:40

Sorry guys, you are all missing the real point here. As Calvin's father could explain to you better than me, the truth is that the world was black and white at that time and colour only appeared suddenly quite a few years later. All of the pictures of that time proof what I am saying.
Cheers

#565 Doug Nye

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Posted 12 December 2009 - 20:54

Eh???????????? :confused:

DCN

#566 Vitesse2

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Posted 12 December 2009 - 21:17

Doug, I believe Victor is attempting to make some sort of reference to the strip cartoon "Calvin and Hobbes".

It's American humor [sic], which probably tells you all you need to know: I've always found it to be a bit of a curate's egg - good in parts (but not very .... nor in very many).

#567 Rob G

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Posted 12 December 2009 - 21:28

Here's the comic strip in question.

http://www.cooperati...te-pictures.gif

#568 RStock

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 03:03

Posted Image


Fagioli in the second and fifth pictures, but whose Monza? Maag's was #16, Penn-Hughes' #17. 19 should be Frankl's Bugatti.


Could this explain it ?

When practice started Eifelrennen winner von Brauchitsch showed his hunger for a repeat victory by going out and doing some very fast laps. But then he crashed badly and broke an arm, a shoulder blade, the collarbone and five ribs. There was crisis in the Mercedes pits as reserve driver Henne also was sick leaving Fagioli and Caracciola as the only drivers. To Neubauer's great relief Caracciola showed that he was back on his old form again but the team needed another driver at short notice. Mercedes employee Geier, who had done some sports car racing, got to his surprise an order to immediately come to Nürburgring. He was put in Caracciola's old Alfa Romeo for a few test laps and then entered as Mercedes' third driver.


So that would make the photo from the 1934 German GP at Nurburgring . And it looks like the photo , as well as a few others , were taken in the "Castle corner" .



#569 Rob G

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 03:54

Could this explain it ?

I don't think that's Caracciola's old Alfa, since the car looks like it bears the Prancing Horse (difficult to tell for sure if that's what the badge is in this shot). The Alfas that Caracciola drove in 1932 were works entries rather than those of the Scuderia Ferrari, and his brief 1933 campaign was for a new team owned by Chiron and himself.

Edited by Rob G, 13 December 2009 - 03:57.


#570 Rob G

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 04:14

I just checked Racing the Silver Arrows, and in it Geier states that the ex-Caracciola Alfa that he tested in had been purchased by Mercedes after Rudi's 1933 Monaco accident. Presumably, then, it remained white.

#571 RStock

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 04:49

I just checked Racing the Silver Arrows, and in it Geier states that the ex-Caracciola Alfa that he tested in had been purchased by Mercedes after Rudi's 1933 Monaco accident. Presumably, then, it remained white.

I hadn't noticed it but yes , that does appear to be a Ferrari badge on the Monza .

I knew Mercedes had bought the car of Rudi's . They had rebuilt it and did some testing with it . So I highly doubt it would have had a Ferrari emblem on it . So that's probably not it in the photo .

That number is curious though . It looks like no. 13 to me , which doesn't show up on the records from the German GP or Eifelrennen that year .

It could be number 18 , which Chiron used at the German GP that year , but he was in a P3 .

Edited by REDARMYSOJA, 13 December 2009 - 05:40.


#572 Rob G

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 06:31

That number is curious though . It looks like no. 13 to me , which doesn't show up on the records from the German GP or Eifelrennen that year .

It could be number 18 , which Chiron used at the German GP that year , but he was in a P3 .

The number on the radiator is definitely 19, which makes the number on the cowl all the more curious. It looks like they couldn't decide whether to make it 13, 18 or 19.

#573 Jonas

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 08:51

I don't know why the Alfa Romeo in these pictures has been identified as a Monza. It clearly isn't! It's a P3, or Tipo B.
So the discussion whether it could be Caracciola's car that Mercedes had bought after the 1933 Monaco crash can immediately be but to rest, because that WAS a Monza.

#574 Holger Merten

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 09:14

(...) And it looks like the photo , as well as a few others , were taken in the "Castle corner" .


The correct name of your castle corner is simply Nordkehre, so everybody knows what you are talking about.

Edited by Holger Merten, 13 December 2009 - 09:27.


#575 Otto Grabe

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 10:14

Posted Image Posted Image

After some photoshopping it is like Rob said definitely 19 and a P3, I think. So it should be the Moll car at GP weekend?

Edited by Otto Grabe, 13 December 2009 - 10:25.


#576 jsfernst

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 10:31

Here's the comic strip in question.

http://www.cooperati...te-pictures.gif

"Truth is stranger than fiction" -- exactly.

#577 Simon Davis

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 11:32

Okay, let's review these. Having eliminated the Henne picture, I've rearranged them, starting with the three pictures which look to be Caracciola. I think they are from three different occasions: the first two are in distinct locations and note that in the third, the driver's wind cap is lower on his brow. Alternatively, it looks almost as though he's not wearing goggles in that one: could this be a slow testing run on the Betonschleife?


josefmb4.jpg

josefmb1.jpg

josefmb6.jpg


I agree that the first of the three pictures is Caracciola. However, I have my doubts about the other two. It doesn't look like Caracciola to me. The driver in the second picture seems too stocky in build around the shoulders. In the third picture the face is the wrong proprtion ie, long and narrow rather than round and fleshy. Could it be Geier?

#578 RStock

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 18:02

The correct name of your castle corner is simply Nordkehre, so everybody knows what you are talking about.


Thanks Holger . I wasn't sure of the proper name for the corner , and figured most would know what I meant by "castle corner".

#579 RStock

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 18:04

Posted Image Posted Image

After some photoshopping it is like Rob said definitely 19 and a P3, I think. So it should be the Moll car at GP weekend?


I couldn't see the 19 until you posted that photo . I'd say more than likely it's a 19 on the cowl also .

And it looks like a P3 to me also , but I don't know enough to say .

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#580 jsfernst

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 21:29

Posted Image Posted Image

After some photoshopping it is like Rob said definitely 19 and a P3, I think. So it should be the Moll car at GP weekend?

Blown up the Ferrari horse becomes visible on the hood. If this picture were taken during practice for the Eifelrennen then either Louis Chiron (no. 6 in the race) or Mario Tadini (no. 7) could be sitting in the Scuderia Ferrari Alfa.

#581 jsfernst

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 22:08

Okay, let's review these. Having eliminated the Henne picture, I've rearranged them, starting with the three pictures which look to be Caracciola. I think they are from three different occasions: the first two are in distinct locations and note that in the third, the driver's wind cap is lower on his brow. Alternatively, it looks almost as though he's not wearing goggles in that one: could this be a slow testing run on the Betonschleife?


josefmb4.jpg

josefmb1.jpg

josefmb6.jpg


I agree that the first of the three pictures is Caracciola. However, I have my doubts about the other two. It doesn't look like Caracciola to me. The driver in the second picture seems too stocky in build around the shoulders. In the third picture the face is the wrong proprtion ie, long and narrow rather than round and fleshy. Could it be Geier?

Could it be Ernst Jakob Henne during practice for the Eifelrennen on Friday? The Rheinisch-Westfälische Zeitung of 2 June 1934 reports that “Henne drove several rounds, as well, while 'Caratsch' followed the procedures with great interest from his cabriolet.”

#582 Holger Merten

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Posted 13 December 2009 - 22:38

For sure the 1st picture is Caracciola with his dark colored googles, compared with other pictures, no doubts..

The 2nd one looks like MvB for me.

And the 3rd one could be Fagioli. But Geier is an option, too.

Did all the drivers use the same car, with a flag beside the cockpit and a missing (my impression) rear mirror? During the race, all cars were mounted with rear mirrors.

Edited by Holger Merten, 15 December 2009 - 09:32.


#583 Holger Merten

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Posted 17 December 2009 - 08:03

Yes, he said the Mercedes-Benz drove in white for several rounds during the training sessions.


I have a copy of an e-mail request to the Paul Pietsch office from 2005/6, in which he answered, that he never saw a white painted Mercedes at the Eifelrennen. He saw them always silver and that he doesn't know, if they scraped off the paint, cause he was not part of the team.


#584 Vitesse2

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Posted 17 December 2009 - 09:47

Did all the drivers use the same car, with a flag beside the cockpit and a missing (my impression) rear mirror? During the race, all cars were mounted with rear mirrors.

That's not actually a flag, Holger, although I'd agree it could look like the short-lived red/white/black design from 1933-4 which appeared on the cars' tails at Montlhéry. It's actually two small parallel air vents, as can be seen in Figs 1, 3 & 4 of Sugahara's book. This could indicate that it is either the original prototype (c/n 86120) or the second prototype (86121), but it doesn't seem to have the extra shielding for the exhaust which Sugahara says was first fitted for the Eifelrennen. If we could see the other side, we'd be able to tell as both those chassis had external handbrakes!

#585 Holger Merten

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Posted 17 December 2009 - 10:49

Thanks Richard for the enlightment, must check my Sugahara a little bit better.

Edited by Holger Merten, 17 December 2009 - 10:50.


#586 Hugo Boecker

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Posted 17 December 2009 - 14:12

Has anyone a picture of the 1934 Mercedes reserve driver Walter Gaertner ? Could it be Gaertner on the "Caracciola pictures" ?

#587 Fabienne

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Posted 02 January 2010 - 14:12

Hallo Herr Müller

Zuerst alles Gute, viel Glück und Gesundheit im 2010!
Kürzlich schrieben Sie mir, dass Herr Berthold Rückwarth D I E Kapazität zum Mercedes SSKL sei. Kennen Sie dessen E-mail-Adresse?
Würden sie diese mir bitte senden? Ich hätte ein paar Fragen an ihn bzgl. des SSK/SSKL.
Herzlichen Dank im Voraus und

freundliche Grüsse

Max Thierstein

#588 Holger Merten

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Posted 02 January 2010 - 19:36

Max, when we had private mail contact several weeks befor, I thought you know something about rules. Not only in this, but especially for this forum. Your last post, which I identify as a cry for help, ignores every written or unwritten rule inside here...., Believe me or not, you won't get any answer by writing in German. Except of mine.

By the way. This thread depends to the beginning of the 750 kg formula and not to the history of the SSK/SSKL era.

Hallo Max, wir hatten ja bereits das Vergnügen privaten Austauschs, bei dem ich davon ausging, dass Du die Umgangsformen in Foren kennst, insbesondere für dieses Forum gelten diese Regeln in besonderem Masse, und das ist gut so, deshalb ist es zu dem Forum geworden. Dein post erscheint mir als Hilfeschrei, aber glaub mir oder nicht, wenn Du hier auf Deutsch loslegst, wirst Du noch weniger erfahren als Du annimmst, weil Du Dich weder an die geschriebenen noch ungeschriebenen Regeln hier hälst. Abgesehen von meiner Antwort hier natürlich.


Nebenbei bemerkt, Du missbrauchst egoistisch dieses Thread, dass sich intensiv und tiefschürfend mit dem Beginn der 750 kg Formel beschäftigt für Deine hier total deplazierte Anfrage zum SSK/SSKL, die woanders bei TNF sicher bestens aufgehoben ist. Ich bediene jetzt aber nicht für Dich die Suchfunktion. Unter uns, ein wenig mehr schweizerisch bitte.

**** happens.

#589 Fabienne

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 13:58

I am very, very sorry to all of this forum!!!

I posted my post in the wrong threat. I intented to send a private message to Mr. Müller and others. That is the only reason why I wrote in German.

You are right, Holger, I am not very used in this forum and on my relatively new PC. So I made some mistakes. But after all, it was to late
to remove the post. Again sorry to all!!!!!!!!

Holger, you write "a little bit more "schweizerisch"". What do you mean? You mean the way you blame me in such a way for my mistakes?
What does mean here with "egoistisch"? My intension was, hopefully, to bring light in some unanswered questions of the past.
I didn't want to break rules.
S O R R Y!!!!

Greetings
Max

#590 Holger Merten

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 18:33

I sent you two PMs on 17 December without any reply, you will find a new one from today. I won't abuse this thread any longer with this discussion.
.

#591 Ray Bell

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 20:30

Originally posted by Fabienne
.....My intention was, hopefully, to bring light in some unanswered questions of the past.
I didn't want to break rules.....


I don't know about you breaking any 'rules'...

Certainly, posting in German makes it hard for us to understand and we much prefer you don't do that.

But answering difficult questions is always welcome here. Go right ahead, we look forward to it.

#592 Michael Ferner

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 13:38

Ich glaube, an dieser Stelle gehört es sich ein paar Dinge zu sagen:

Holger, findest Du nicht dass Du ein wenig zu brüsk reagiert hast? Die Anfrage von Herrn Thierstein mag zwar deplatziert sein in diesem Diskussionsfaden, sie aber als egoistischen Mißbrauch zu beschreiben halte ich für maßlos übertrieben! Falls es, wie es nun scheint, einen privaten Hintergrund für Deine Reaktion gibt, so fände ich es angebracht diesen Vorfall nicht im öffentlichen Teil von TNF zu erörtern!!!!

Herr Thierstein, dieses Forum ist wohl international das bedeutendste seiner Art, und es hat zu Recht eine große Anzahl von Teilnehmern in der ganzen Welt gefunden. Damit verbunden sind natürlich Schwierigkeiten in der Kommunikation, und wie so oft üblich (auch in der akademischen Welt) bedient man sich hier des Englischen, was zu Nachteilen bei denjenigen führt die nicht mit dieser Sprache aufgewachsen sind. Dennoch wollen viele, deren Englischkenntnisse eher dürftig sind, an den Diskussionen hier im Forum teilnehmen, und der Großteil der Gäste hier ist an jedem gehaltvollen Informationsaustausch interessiert, daher werden auch fremdsprachliche Beiträge (in Grenzen) toleriert!

Meines Erachtens nach sollte niemand auf Grund von Sprachschwierigkeiten von der Teilhabe an Diskussionen mit internationaler Beteiligung abgehalten werden, schon allein um der Sache Willen. Es finden sich immer helfende Hände, wenn einen die eigenen Fähigkeiten einmal im Stich lassen...


Sorry, Ray and all, but I thought this necessary. Carry on, now...

#593 Der Pate

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Posted 04 January 2010 - 18:56

:up:

Danke Michael...!!!

#594 bradbury west

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Posted 05 January 2010 - 22:36

In his column in this month's C&SC Mick Walsh discusses a visit to the National Media Museum in Bradford, where the archives of Zoltan Glass are being digitised and should be available for public access from April this year. With funding from MB they are going through the 6000plus images. In among the boxes are some shots which Glass had taken at the '34 Eifelrennen, and more of early running of the W25. They are being studied by Josef Ernst from DB Heritage Press, who has been visting there 5 times over the past 2 yearsso there may be some more period information emerging in due course.
Roger Lund

#595 Catalina Park

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Posted 06 January 2010 - 03:42

In his column in this month's C&SC Mick Walsh discusses a visit to the National Media Museum in Bradford, where the archives of Zoltan Glass are being digitised and should be available for public access from April this year. With funding from MB they are going through the 6000plus images. In among the boxes are some shots which Glass had taken at the '34 Eifelrennen, and more of early running of the W25. They are being studied by Josef Ernst from DB Heritage Press, who has been visting there 5 times over the past 2 yearsso there may be some more period information emerging in due course.
Roger Lund

Awaiting a photo of the Mercedes team with paint scrapers in hand. :rotfl:


#596 Holger Merten

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Posted 06 January 2010 - 19:07

Awaiting a photo of the Mercedes team with paint scrapers in hand. :rotfl:


Audi Tradition has visited the archive as well. May they sorted them out. :rolleyes:


#597 Ralf Pickel

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Posted 11 January 2010 - 18:37

Now- have I missed anything important?
In the newest issue of German mag "Motor Klassik" is an article which says, that now it is a proven fact - thanks to the Glass photos- that the W25 s have been white and so Neubauers story is true.
The show all the photos which have been posted sometime ago here.
For example - the one with the small building in the background shows the darker brakedrums in comparison to body colour.
The Glass photos are also proving ( so says historian Dr. Ernst), that the cars of von Brauchtisch andFagioli are clearly white.
And - as additional prove there is the word from Mr. Pietsch : "During qualifying the cars have been running for afew laps painted white"

Discuss...

Cheers,
Ralf

Ps sorry for my style of writing and mistakes - have no Computer here and am writing via phone...

Edited by Ralf Pickel, 11 January 2010 - 18:48.


#598 HDonaldCapps

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Posted 11 January 2010 - 19:30

What issue of "Motor Klassik" is this?

I must admit that I am more than somewhat dubious of this claim at the moment, particularly if the photographs being used in the magazine are those that have been provided for use on this thread.

Until I see the evidence and can examine it and ask questions there is nothing that I have seen that would convince me that the W25 cars at the Eifelrennen were anything but silver in color.

In other words, it better be pretty damn good because the burden of proof is, and always has been despite the Tony Kaye post, squarely on the "defense," and to date thay simply have not delivered.

HDC


Now- have I missed anything important?
In the newest issue of German mag "Motor Klassik" is an article which says, that now it is a proven fact - thanks to the Glass photos- that the W25 s have been white and so Neubauers story is true.
The show all the photos which have been posted sometime ago here.
For example - the one with the small building in the background shows the darker brakedrums in comparison to body colour.
The Glass photos are also proving ( so says historian Dr. Ernst), that the cars of von Brauchtisch andFagioli are clearly white.
And - as additional prove there is the word from Mr. Pietsch : "During qualifying the cars have been running for afew laps painted white"

Discuss...

Cheers,
Ralf

Ps sorry for my style of writing and mistakes - have no Computer here and am writing via phone...



#599 Ralf Pickel

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Posted 12 January 2010 - 07:37

Okay, let's review these. Having eliminated the Henne picture, I've rearranged them, starting with the three pictures which look to be Caracciola. I think they are from three different occasions: the first two are in distinct locations and note that in the third, the driver's wind cap is lower on his brow. Alternatively, it looks almost as though he's not wearing goggles in that one: could this be a slow testing run on the Betonschleife?


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I agree that the first of the three pictures is Caracciola. However, I have my doubts about the other two. It doesn't look like Caracciola to me. The driver in the second picture seems too stocky in build around the shoulders. In the third picture the face is the wrong proprtion ie, long and narrow rather than round and fleshy. Could it be Geier?

Could it be Ernst Jakob Henne during practice for the Eifelrennen on Friday? The Rheinisch-Westfälische Zeitung of 2 June 1934 reports that “Henne drove several rounds, as well, while 'Caratsch' followed the procedures with great interest from his cabriolet.”


The whole report is in the February issue of Motor Klassik, on the newsstands in Germany today or tomorrow.

If have quoted the post above to show some of the rather strange evidence.
The third of these photos is the one, which supposedly shows darker brakedrums and therefore shall prove the white colour.
Another photo printed in the mag is similar to nr. 2 above - from a slightly lower angle and different background, but probably same car, same driver, same date. According to the text it is Carraciola and the photo proves a white paint on the car supposedly confirmed by experts from the LKA (Landeskriminalamt, kind of state police).
According to Dr. Ernst, until now this was the only photo from practice at the Eifelrennen which showed the car painted white.

And now he seems to have found an unknown box from Glass, which contains the negatives from the practice showing the Fagioli and von Brauchitsch cars clearly painted white and with partly white wheels.

If anyone is interested - I have scanned the four pages from Motor Klassik and can mail it - please send me a PM.

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#600 Ray Bell

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Posted 12 January 2010 - 09:27

Please do...

My e.mail address is below: