71 replies to this topic

[AustinF1]

I've mentioned a couple times having heard a rumor of a GP in the works on the West Coast, likely the Bay Area. Here's a story re: a SF firm considering a bid for the F1 commercial rights:

http://www.gpupdate....ponders-f1-bid/
http://formula-one.s...ews-briefs-121/

My apologies for botching the title on the first attempt!

[Amphicar]

I've mentioned a couple times having heard a rumor of a GP in the works on the West Coast, likely the Bay Area. Here's a story re: a SF firm considering a bid for the F1 commercial rights:

http://www.gpupdate....ponders-f1-bid/
http://formula-one.s...ews-briefs-121/

My apologies for botching the title on the first attempt!

Both links are quoting from a report in the Daily Express by Christian Sylt. The Express and Christian Sylt - a marriage made in the deepest pit of Hell!

[Sakae]

True or not, but an American ownership of F1 would spell end of F1 as we know it today.

[Amphicar]

True or not, but an American ownership of F1 would spell end of F1 as we know it today.

Oh yes - Hellman and Friedman is an American private equity company who will only be in it for the money whereas CVC is a British private equity company who are only in it for the money. Clearly a world of difference, especially as H & F previously owned 37.5% of SLEC.

[nimbus111]

True or not, but an American ownership of F1 would spell end of F1 as we know it today.

yes clearly it will go to sh*t in american hands it just might be better, scary thought i know. NASCAR is just doing terrible. hhhhhh

Edited by nimbus111, 19 December 2011 - 19:27.

[primer]

What's the news here? "A SF firm considering a bid for the F1 commercial rights"? Considering?

I am considering a bid, too. Just need some spare cash is all.

[metz]

Both links are quoting from a report in the Daily Express by Christian Sylt. The Express and Christian Sylt - a marriage made in the deepest pit of Hell!

From experience I have found that when it comes to F1 financial matters, Christian Sylt is right on the money.
He got my respect when Bernie refused to give him an interview.

[phoenix101]

Why would someone be mulling a purchase now? A new Concorde hasn't been hammered out so they don't even know what they are buying.

[primer]

From experience I have found that when it comes to F1 financial matters, Christian Sylt is right on the money.
He got my respect when Bernie refused to give him an interview.

Is this some form of sarcasm that I'm not aware of....

[metz]

Is this some form of sarcasm that I'm not aware of....

No.
The first part as a pun, a;though true.
The second part you need to think about.

[Ross Stonefeld]

Eh? These days Sylt is little more than Bernie's representative here on earth.

[metz]

Eh? These days Sylt is little more than Bernie's representative here on earth.

You mean, he took the money?
Sylt was relentless on Bernie during the whole banker sale to CVC thing.
Admit I have not read much of his stuff in the last while.

[Sakae]

yes clearly it will go to sh*t in american hands it just might be better, scary thought i know. NASCAR is just doing terrible. hhhhhh

No need to go beserk under any circumstances. My thoughts merely are, that US based financial interest might want to spike up ROI, and without BE modulating commercial side, new changes might be demanded from FOM. Objective is not to run F1 "as is", but something that would make money for them, even if that could mean changing completely character of the serie, just to make it acceptable to Americans and TV networks. One change could be inclusion of ovals...

I know its only speculation, but I am not convinced that an American ownership is good thing to happen for what is essentially European product (which I like to watch).

Edited by Sakae, 19 December 2011 - 20:17.

[nimbus111]

No need to go beserk under any circumstances. My thoughts merely are, that US based financial interest might want to spike up ROI, and without BE modulating commercial side, new changes might be demanded from FOM. Objective is not to run F1 "as is", but something that would make money for them, even if that could mean changing completely character of the serie, just to make it acceptable to Americans and TV networks. One change could be inclusion of ovals... I know its only speculation, but I am not convinced that an American ownership is good thing to happen for what is essentially European product (which I like to watch).

this would be my main concern. though i cant see the teams themselves allowing this to happen. im assuming FOTA if its still around would be able to block moves like these?

[Fastcake]

No need to go beserk under any circumstances. My thoughts merely are, that US based financial interest might want to spike up ROI, and without BE modulating commercial side, new changes might be demanded from FOM. Objective is not to run F1 "as is", but something that would make money for them, even if that could mean changing completely character of the serie, just to make it acceptable to Americans and TV networks. One change could be inclusion of ovals...

I know its only speculation, but I am not convinced that an American ownership is good thing to happen for what is essentially European product (which I like to watch).

If it's just another private equity firm, nothing would change from now.

[Sakae]

FOTA is currently without power. Concorde Agreements needs to spell what will, or will not be acceptable. I am not trying to suggest that it would be all bad, but I did watch American open wheel racing on parallel basis with F1 for several years; I even did (literally) forced myself to watch NASCAR for a year, and conclusion is - I do not like it. It has nothing do with God, chairman Mao or anything else - I just fall asleep seeing ovals. That included 500 milles Indy. I was there at Indianapolis for inag. NASCAR 400, people on the plane were jumping with joy, ... I was out of it. That's the fear what American ownership might bring.

Edited by Sakae, 19 December 2011 - 23:41.

[nimbus111]

FOTA is currently without power. Concorde Agreements needs to spell what willl or will not be acceptable. I am not trying to suggest that it would be all bad, but I did watch American open wheel racing on parallel basis with F1 for several years; I even did (literally) forced myself to watch NASCAR for a year, and conclusion is - I do not like it. It has nothing do with God, chairman Mao or anything else - I just fall asleep seeing ovals. That included 500 milles Indy. I was there at Indianapolis for inag. NASCAR 400, people on the plane were jumping with joy, ... I was out of it. That's the fear what American ownership might bring.

i couldnt agree more. as suggested i would think the only changes will be whose pocket the money flows to while maintaining the current model or lets hope.

Edited by nimbus111, 19 December 2011 - 20:52.

[bourbon]

I just wish they would bring us a GP here on the west coast. Perhaps these dudes could put their money into that....

[slmk]

I just wish they would bring us a GP here on the west coast. Perhaps these dudes could put their money into that....

Private equity does not undertake highly unprofitable ventures.

You guys just don't know what private equity is/consists of. Hellman & Friedman won't NASCAR-ize F1 for the sake of it, or because they are American. They'll just do whatever they can to increase the value of their investment...

[noikeee]

F1 on ovals is never going to happen again for obvious safety concerns and logistical nightmares in adapting the cars.

I wouldn't want F1 americanized, but it could take some marketing tips from the american scene. American ownership of the sport's commercial rights could probably be good actually.

[Sakae]

To assume that an american investor/owner would not try to change F1 to make it more acceptable and draw in an American fan is a lot of faith to have. American contingent of drivers and several races on ovals will be some changes I would expect to happen. Specifications for the car shall have to change, but it was done before, thus it could be done.

US has NASCAR, Europe has F1, and perhaps that's where it should remain, but I doubt that will be a case. Rhetoric (like "Europe is finish") is rather promissing interesting, and I fear stressful times for fans like me. Well, maybe divorce from "new F1" will be painful, but I will have time to turn my full attention back to football, which could be good too. We will have to wait and see how it ends. Pitty that we will not have access to a draft of new CA.

[slmk]

To assume that an american investor/owner would not try to change F1 to make it more acceptable and draw in an American fan is a lot of faith to have. American contingent of drivers and several races on ovals will be some changes I would expect to happen. Specifications for the car shall have to change, but it was done before, thus it could be done.

US has NASCAR, Europe has F1, and perhaps that's where it should remain, but I doubt that will be a case. Rhetoric (like "Europe is finish") is rather promissing interesting, and I fear stressful times for fans like me. Well, maybe divorce from "new F1" will be painful, but I will have time to turn my full attention back to football, which could be good too. We will have to wait and see how it ends. Pitty that we will not have access to a draft of new CA.

If your rhetoric is not anti-americanism, then I don't know what is. You clearly don't know what you are talking about.

[Eden]

Perhaps that change of ownership may be what we need.

[Sakae]

If your rhetoric is not anti-americanism, then I don't know what is. You clearly don't know what you are talking about.

Setting insults aside, it would be helpful to be more specific why your opinion is more qualified than mine is.

[nimbus111]

Perhaps that change of ownership may be what we need.

[Concorde]

Perhaps that change of ownership may be what we need.

No thank you, I like my F1 just fine as it is now.

[Felix]

You mean, he took the money?
Sylt was relentless on Bernie during the whole banker sale to CVC thing.
Admit I have not read much of his stuff in the last while.

Strange but true: Sylt seems to have disappeared; the last thing he wrote was for Express in early January, and nothing since according to Google. Page through Pitspast (if you can stand the suspense) and there have been no references to its bargain basement 'Business Editor' having his non-stop lunches with Ecclestone for two months - since around the time Ecclestone was forced to take the stand in Munich. Nor have Sylt's previously regular outlets heard from him recently - one which carried his stuff for years has not heard a peep from him since Christmas, and that was via Xmas e-card.

Edited by Felix, 26 February 2012 - 12:44.

[cheapracer]

True or not, but an American ownership of F1 would spell end of F1 as we know it today.

That would entirely depend on who controlled the helm - if they got John Bishop into it for example then it would probably end up brilliant for all of motor sport whereas if they got Bernie Ecclestone to run it, it would end up ... oh wait..

[cheapracer]

No thank you, I like my F1 just fine as it is now.

Set him on fire.

[Sakae]

That would entirely depend on who controlled the helm - if they got John Bishop into it for example then it would probably end up brilliant for all of motor sport whereas if they got Bernie Ecclestone to run it, it would end up ... oh wait..
d

I do not have any special knowledge what's in the pike, but we know how investments, totally absent of any altruism, operate. With this new ownership I fear that character of F1 would be set for a big change. Perhaps not immediately, but incrementally. Some might like it, others, especially oldtimers, might not. Forthcoming CA negotiations will be crucial.

[cheapracer]

I do not have any special knowledge what's in the pike, but we know how investments, totally absent of any altruism, operate.

Most businesses tend to collapse actually, how many times have we seen an old established business have the founder retire and hand it over to their sons to run ...

I mentioned John Bishop above, most probably don't know what I'm talking about ...

http://en.wikipedia....rts_Association

[FerrariFanInTexas]

Strange but true: Sylt seems to have disappeared; the last thing he wrote was for Express in early January, and nothing since according to Google. Page through Pitspast (if you can stand the suspense) and there have been no references to its bargain basement 'Business Editor' having his non-stop lunches with Ecclestone for two months - since around the time Ecclestone was forced to take the stand in Munich. Nor have Sylt's previously regular outlets heard from him recently - one which carried his stuff for years has not heard a peep from him since Christmas, and that was via Xmas e-card.

He used to post on this forum years ago. Believe his handle was csylt

[Ross Stonefeld]

Wait, are CVC altruistic?

[Felix]

He used to post on this forum years ago. Believe his handle was csylt

Yeah, I believe he was invited out of the forum for some reason.

[David M. Kane]

FOTA is currently without power. Concorde Agreements needs to spell what will, or will not be acceptable. I am not trying to suggest that it would be all bad, but I did watch American open wheel racing on parallel basis with F1 for several years; I even did (literally) forced myself to watch NASCAR for a year, and conclusion is - I do not like it. It has nothing do with God, chairman Mao or anything else - I just fall asleep seeing ovals. That included 500 milles Indy. I was there at Indianapolis for inag. NASCAR 400, people on the plane were jumping with joy, ... I was out of it. That's the fear what American ownership might bring.

Don't confuse American businesses with the Obama Administration and how his cronies have bent over for the American Banks. It's insulting to those of us who haven't bought into the lies and the hypocrisy.

What F1 REALLY needs is for BE to retire and to be replaced by a younger Executive attuned to the World business scene in a realistic down to earth sense.

[Option1]

And throwing in your ignorant political bias is insulting to the rest of us.

Neil

[Sakae]

Don't confuse American businesses with the Obama Administration and how his cronies have bent over for the American Banks. It's insulting to those of us who haven't bought into the lies and the hypocrisy.

What F1 REALLY needs is for BE to retire and to be replaced by a younger Executive attuned to the World business scene in a realistic down to earth sense.

It was not my intention to drag politics into this, and reading my post again, I am not sure what makes you think I did. I do agree with you that F1 might need a different mechanism how it operates, but admittedly I also do not know who is a right person to take over after Bernie. My expressed point of view is limited to the opinion, that investment company might not be a best solution to take this business over for several reasons stated earlier in the thread. Now, this point of view seems to be uppsetting some posters around here to the level calling me ignorant. There is nothing much I can do about it.

[Sakae]

Most businesses tend to collapse actually, how many times have we seen an old established business have the founder retire and hand it over to their sons to run ...

I mentioned John Bishop above, most probably don't know what I'm talking about ...

http://en.wikipedia....rts_Association

I do not know the man, but still, I hope that you will agree, F1 is not a one man show (sorry, not mean to "lecture"), and I think that all, FOTA, commercial backers, and FIA needs to get on one page, regardless who is in charge.

[AMG FAN]

Don't confuse American businesses with the Obama Administration and how his cronies have bent over for the American Banks. It's insulting to those of us who haven't bought into the lies and the hypocrisy.

What F1 REALLY needs is for BE to retire and to be replaced by a younger Executive attuned to the World business scene in a realistic down to earth sense.

talking about insults and hypocrisy,you should look in the mirror.

[icecream_man]

The Americans seem to be very good at taking a basically boring sport and turning it into a spectacle (ie rounders, netball, and driving around in circles for 500 laps), and all credit to them for doing that I say, but how things would go with a highly technical and in-depth sport I don't know, there isn't really any presidence as far as I can see, so I think I'd personally be a little bit nervous if such a thing were to happen...

Edited by icecream_man, 26 February 2012 - 21:35.

[olliek88]

The Americans seem to be very good at taking a basically boring sport and turning it into a spectacle (ie rounders, netball, and driving around in circles for 500 laps), and all credit to them for doing that I say, but how things would go with a highly technical and in-depth sport I don't know, there isn't really any presidence as far as I can see, so I think I'd personally be a little bit nervous if such a thing were to happen...

Someones been watching TopGear...............

Edited by olliek88, 26 February 2012 - 21:40.

[icecream_man]

Someones been watching TopGear...............

Haha yeah you caught me out there ! But seriously though, I thought what he said was absolutely spot on, which isn't unusual because I've read a couple of Clarkson's books and it's like he's reading my mind

[Tsarwash]

If your rhetoric is not anti-americanism, then I don't know what is. You clearly don't know what you are talking about.

And what's wrong with being anti-American ?

[Option1]

The Americans seem to be very good at taking a basically boring sport and turning it into a spectacle (ie rounders, netball, and driving around in circles for 500 laps), and all credit to them for doing that I say, but how things would go with a highly technical and in-depth sport I don't know, there isn't really any presidence as far as I can see, so I think I'd personally be a little bit nervous if such a thing were to happen...

Aside from idiotically quoting Clarkson, it also shows how little you know about NASCAR. The cars may be somewhat primitive in spec, but believe me the tech and aero that goes into them to scrape every millimetre of speed is only slightly less than F1. But hey, let's follow the way of your hero and not let the facts get in the way of a good story.

Neil

[icecream_man]

Aside from idiotically quoting Clarkson, it also shows how little you know about NASCAR. The cars may be somewhat primitive in spec, but believe me the tech and aero that goes into them to scrape every millimetre of speed is only slightly less than F1. But hey, let's follow the way of your hero and not let the facts get in the way of a good story.

Neil

I'm not denying the tech, I'm well aware of that actually, it's the driving round in a circles for 500 laps, lets be honest now, if you put it down on paper it doesn't sound like the most exciting sport on the planet now does it ? And yet the Americans make it work, and extremely successfully at that, but would it have anywhere near the same sort of following if it was rolled out across Europe ? I seriously doubt it.

Problem is that generally speaking what works in the US doesn't necessarily work in Europe, we're very very different, not just in relation to sports but many other areas too.

EDIT: PS, quoting Clarkson may be idiotic in your opinion, for many others he merely has the guts to stand up and say what we're thinking. Clearly you don't like him, that's your prerogative

Edited by icecream_man, 26 February 2012 - 22:20.

[Option1]

Geezzzz, and go back to the original story, how has it been transmogrified from "San Francisco-based private equity firm Hellman & Friedman is considering a bid for the commercial rights of Formula 1" to "US COMPANY TO TAKE OVER F1 AND MAKE IT ALL OVALS".

Seriously, some of you people need to put your panic buttons back in your pockets and pull your heads out of your arses. For a start owning the commercial rights does NOT mean they make the rules per se.

Neil

[slmk]

I'm not denying the tech, I'm well aware of that actually, it's the driving round in a circles for 500 laps, lets be honest now, if you put it down on paper it doesn't sound like the most exciting sport on the planet now does it ? And yet the Americans make it work, and extremely successfully at that, but would it have anywhere near the same sort of following if it was rolled out across Europe ? I seriously doubt it.

Problem is that generally speaking what works in the US doesn't necessarily work in Europe, we're very very different, not just in relation to sports but many other areas too.

EDIT: PS, quoting Clarkson may be idiotic in your opinion, for many others he merely has the guts to stand up and say what we're thinking. Clearly you don't like him, that's your prerogative

Just like Santorum, lol.

Clarkson is entitled his opinion but it doesn't make it right.

As for the actual news item, Hellmann & Friedman is no different from CVC; they are both large private-equity firm, so the way they will run the business on a day-to-day basis will be similar; after all, their goal is to buy a business with a lot of (cheap) leverage in hope that it will generate massive returns.

What American ownership could do though, is tap that massive US market that is still very much untapped and possibly make it more fan-friendly. But then this is all speculation of course.

[icecream_man]

Seriously, some of you people need to put your panic buttons back in your pockets and pull your heads out of your arses. For a start owning the commercial rights does NOT mean they make the rules per se.

And some need to keep their hair on
Completely missed my point, but hey, I really can't be arsed....

[slmk]

Geezzzz, and go back to the original story, how has it been transmogrified from "San Francisco-based private equity firm Hellman & Friedman is considering a bid for the commercial rights of Formula 1" to "US COMPANY TO TAKE OVER F1 AND MAKE IT ALL OVALS".

Seriously, some of you people need to put your panic buttons back in your pockets and pull your heads out of your arses. For a start owning the commercial rights does NOT mean they make the rules per se.

Neil

I don't know why Europeans have a chip on their shoulders with respect to North America. Or a superiority complex, I guess. Either way, there is this hostile behaviour between NA/EU which isn't very healthy.

[icecream_man]

What American ownership could do though, is tap that massive US market that is still very much untapped and possibly make it more fan-friendly. But then this is all speculation of course.

Which is relevant to my intended point that what is fan-friendly over there may not be fan friendly in Europe. Certainly F1 has never made it big in the US before so it's not unreasonable to suggest that to make it fan-friendly over there could potentially take away what makes it fan-friendly in Europe.

We have Football, which is not that popular in the US, the US has American football, which is not that popular in Europe.
We have F1, which is not as popular in the US, the US has Nascar, which is not so popular in Europe.
The US have baseball, basketball, drag racing, which are.... well, you must be seeing the pattern by now surely ?

And in response to the above post, I have no chip on my shoulder, neither am I hostile, I'm simply pointing out we have significant differences...

Edited by icecream_man, 26 February 2012 - 22:40.