164 replies to this topic

[RB213]

de La Rosa & Karthikeyan @ HRT has raised the question in my mind...that's pretty lacklustre, but i'm not too sure about the worst pairing ever though

What does everyone think? And which driver pairings in the history of F1 have been worse?

[toroRosso]

I rank the two above before Maldonado, Senna. Karthikeyan used to drive for points and de la Rosa has been up there in 2nd place in his best GPs

[TeamSideways]

definitely definitely narain + dela rosa is the worst driver pairing ever

[Mastah]

Friesacher + Albers 2005
Bruni + Baumgartner 2004
Gene + Mazzacane 2000
Badoer + Gene 1999
Rosset + Takagi 1998
Nakano + Tuero 1998 and so on...

Yeah, PdlR and Narain is one of the worst, if not the worst pairing EVER .

[Peat]

Rosset/Sospiri (although Vincenzo had a decent bakground and never got the chance...)

Lamy/Lavaggi


.......must be more.

At least DLR and Narain are reasonably safe pairs of hands....

[Jackmancer]

What are HRT's ambitions, I wonder. Oh well, if the car is crap it doesn't really matter if the driver is good or not.

[TecnoRacing]

De La Rosa is sensible choice since he's good development driver...but not pairing him with a young quick driver really doesn't make much sense...

Definitely a not so great pairing, but in no way the worst...

[Rob]

definitely definitely narain + dela rosa is the worst driver pairing ever

Not even close.

Friesacher + Albers 2005
Bruni + Baumgartner 2004
Gene + Mazzacane 2000
Badoer + Gene 1999
Rosset + Takagi 1998
Nakano + Tuero 1998 and so on...

These pairings all look quite good compared to some we've had!

Rosset/Sospiri (although Vincenzo had a decent bakground and never got the chance...)

Lamy/Lavaggi

Lamy and Sospiri were decent drivers.

For one race in 1994, Larrousse ran Hideki Noda and Jean-Denis Deletraz.
For some races in 1995, we had Andrea Montermini teamed up first with Giovanni Lavaggi, then with Deletraz.

I put it to you that the pairings I've mentioned far and away trump those already mentioned.

[Ferrari_F1_fan_2001]

Given the right circumstances and ego boost, most drivers would perform well.

However, if you are repeatedly being touted as '****', not talented, pay driver etc etc must inevitably destroy confidence of some drivers. We'llnever know the full potential of some drivers.

Others however are just mentally strong (Senna, Alonso, Schumacher etc) that nothing seems to faze them.

[King Six]

Personally it's only this forum and maybe a few other places that constantly touts Narain as the worst ever driver in Formula One. It's never made any sense to me, he's not the fastest but he's far from the worst. And then unproven drivers like Ricciardo and Vergne are touted as World Champions, makes no sense. It's all about politics, even for the fans. I'm not a fan of old people staying on the grid, but if you're at the back you might aswell, for Toro Rosso it's more of a shame.

[jamiegc]

Senna & Maldonado, by a distance.

[xtremespeedjunkie]

1] Senna and Maldonado. Takes the cream

2]Ricciardo and Vergne : Has any of them even scored a point yet ? Why should anybody suck up to them , just cos they have a sugar daddy in Red-bull ? what is their CV in f1 ?

Narain is a much much better than the Mr second name Senna . Senna has to be given the award for blowing the biggest chance in f1 history when all he was given a chance to drive for a top team like Renault. Senna spent most of the time crashing in to other drivers , barriers , running off the road and visiting Stewards room after the races.

Edited by xtremespeedjunkie, 03 February 2012 - 09:44.

[jamiegc]

2]Ricciardo and Vergne : Has any of them even scored a point yet ? Why should anybody suck up to them , just cos they have a sugar daddy in Red-bull ? what is their CV in f1 ?

[xtremespeedjunkie]

Oh i made the mistake of comparing the next Button and Hamilton with average drivers .. my bad sorry mate..

Edited by xtremespeedjunkie, 03 February 2012 - 09:54.

[Meanbeakin]

Personally it's only this forum and maybe a few other places that constantly touts Narain as the worst ever driver in Formula One. It's never made any sense to me, he's not the fastest but he's far from the worst.

I think it's because a unfortunately large portion of people in this forum act is if Formula One has only existed for the last 10 years (if that).

[xtremespeedjunkie]

Personally it's only this forum and maybe a few other places that constantly touts Narain as the worst ever driver in Formula One. It's never made any sense to me, he's not the fastest but he's far from the worst. And then unproven drivers like Ricciardo and Vergne are touted as World Champions, makes no sense. It's all about politics, even for the fans. I'm not a fan of old people staying on the grid, but if you're at the back you might aswell, for Toro Rosso it's more of a shame.

Well said mate

[jamiegc]

Oh i made the mistake of comparing the next Button and Hamilton with average drivers .. my bad sorry mate..

No, you said that two F1 rookies were the worst driver pairing in F1 because 'they have no CV in F1'...

[Meanbeakin]

2]Ricciardo and Vergne : Has any of them even scored a point yet ? Why should anybody suck up to them , just cos they have a sugar daddy in Red-bull ? what is their CV in f1 ?

About the same (Actually even more sparse) than Kimi Raikkonen's when he first came into F1.

Narain is a much much better than the Mr second name Senna . Senna has to be given the award for blowing the biggest chance in f1 history when all he was given a chance to drive for a top team like Renault. Senna spent most of the time crashing in to other drivers , barriers , running off the road and visiting Stewards room after the races.

I find this a real problem in this forum, skewed explaining of things rather than a sober assessment.

Now lets have a look back since the testing ban of the experience of drivers coming in mid season to a team:

- Jaime Algaursauri, Romain Grosjean and Luca Badeor in 2009. Badeor was a disaster, Grosjean did so badly that Renault dumped him after half a season and Jaime spent most the rest of the season coming last
- Nick Heidfeld, Sakon Yamamoto and Christian Klien in 2010. Going on HRT's happenings in 2010 and how much they were chopping and changing drivers, it's hard to gauge exactly who was getting what equipment when at any time during a season. Heidfeld on the other hand when from being able to equal Kubina in 07 and 09 to suddenly being unable to beat Kobayashi after taking the Sauber seat mid season.
- Bruno Senna and Daniel Ricciardo in 2011. Daniel took probably longer that many would have liked to get on top of Liuzzi and Bruno mixed up some great efforts with some pretty ordinary ones

Therefore, any doubts about drivers coming in midseason and not lighting up the world? And any thoughts about the testing bans since 2008 that have contributed to this?

The guy had HRT 2010 and came in mideason 2011. I will be the first to admit if he fails to impress this year with a full pre season and backing of the team then he's not cut out for F1. But saying it before that happens is a bit unfair.

Edited by Meanbeakin, 03 February 2012 - 10:14.

[sosidge]

HRT have nailed the worst driver pairing in recent memory... PDLR is a "nice guy" and probably a big development asset, but he has never been quick. NK is "meh" and has never been close to being as quick as PDLR.

I wonder which Indian billionaire NK has compromising photos of?

[Petroltorque]

HRT have nailed the worst driver pairing in recent memory... PDLR is a "nice guy" and probably a big development asset, but he has never been quick. NK is "meh" and has never been close to being as quick as PDLR.

I wonder which Indian billionaire NK has compromising photos of?

I really don't think De La Rosa will be any benefit for development since thats down to the deisgners and engineers. He got a reputation as a 'develepment' driver simply because he spent so long as a test driver. Whats ironic is that HRT have hired 2 driver that lost their previous seats mid season.
It will be interesting if Karthikeyan prooves the faster since the team will as a rule default setup to the faster driver.

[Andrew Hope]

Narain Karthikeyan and Pedro de la Rosa the worst ever driver pairing? Are you ****ing kidding me? I don't even think they're the worst pairing on the grid this year, and to rip a team apart for having the 'worst' driver pairing seems to me a bit like calling the losing states at the Miss America Pageant ugly old slappers. They're probably still pretty god damn hot, just as the 'worst' F1 drivers on the grid are still F1 drivers on the grid. This isn't Alonso and Button teaming up, sure, but I think both are solid, solid drivers. HRT don't really need a guy like Kobayashi, who might be lightning fast during the race but always one misjudgement away from an accident, when they may not be able to provide a car that can guarantee lasting the race distance. They need a pair of steady hands in each car, and this is what they've got, and good luck to them. All it takes is for a rainy race like Canada last year, a few mechanical retirements and bam, an HRT in 9th or 10th place and bam, according the F1 stats book HRT will have been more successful than Marussia with Glock or Caterham with Kovalainen, two drivers better than anyone HRT has ever had and still equally unlikely to score a point. You know, those proper teams, the ones no one really like to **** on, who have had just as much time and plenty more resources than dear old Hispania to score a point in F1 and failed nearly as hard as HRT (Caterham) and even harder (Marussia) in the last two years.

[LucaP]

Regarding modern F1 only, Tuero-Nakano takes the cake.

[Rob]

Regarding modern F1 only, Tuero-Nakano takes the cake.

Tuero wasn't that bad. Nakano was OK but not as bad as Alex Yoong.

[Wi000]

Jos Verstappen and Domenico Schiattarella in their short-lived 1995 Simtek campaign.

[Dolph]

HRT is the new Minardi - a South European team with a small budget and paydrivers.

[kar]

Unless one of them gets hit by an ambulance car at the Hungaroring I think Taki Inoue & Gianni Morbidelli have this sown up.

[DanardiF1]

Unless one of them gets hit by an ambulance car at the Hungaroring I think Taki Inoue & Gianni Morbidelli have this sown up.

Agree.

Also like to nominate Pacific with any one combination of Gachot/Deletraz/Lavaggi paired with Montermini...

[King Six]

HRT is the new Minardi - a South European team with a small budget and paydrivers.

I guess we should all hope it's bought by a big company who already owns a team and turns it into a soulless nursery

[Myrvold]

Regarding modern F1 only, Tuero-Nakano takes the cake.

I remember Tuero as surprisingly fast, and only being 19yo he had some talent.

[Amphicar]

Agree.

Also like to nominate Pacific with any one combination of Gachot/Deletraz/Lavaggi paired with Montermini...

Nah - I'd go for the 1994 Pacific lineup of Bertrand Gachot and Paul Belmondo.

Or the 1983 Osella (bad)dream team: Corrado Fabi and Piercarlo Ghinzani

[Seanspeed]

1] Senna and Maldonado. Takes the cream

2]Ricciardo and Vergne : Has any of them even scored a point yet ? Why should anybody suck up to them , just cos they have a sugar daddy in Red-bull ? what is their CV in f1 ?

Narain is a much much better than the Mr second name Senna . Senna has to be given the award for blowing the biggest chance in f1 history when all he was given a chance to drive for a top team like Renault. Senna spent most of the time crashing in to other drivers , barriers , running off the road and visiting Stewards room after the races.

Maldonado is a GP2 champion.

Senna came close and has done quite well for himself overall considering how late he started racing. His name helps, but he's not gotten this far due to that alone.

These two might not be future world champions, but they are sure step above your typical paydriver.

As for Ricciardo, he whooped Liuzzi last year after being thrown in the car on short notice, so he's got some F1 cred already. Cant really expect him to have scored a point in the HRT, so I dont know what your point is there. Alonso couldn't score a point in a Minardi, either, ya know?

Vergne is known for getting up-to-speed quickly in whatever formula he joins. He's impressed in the F1 tests he's participated in and during FP1 in Abu Dhabi, was just a quarter second off of Alguersuari's time in 11th place. He and Ricciardo both are being groomed for a possible Red Bull drive, which tells you how much the team thinks of them.

Karthikeyan and De La Rosa are by far the worst pairing on the grid, but worst ever? Not at all.

[Fulcrum]

2010 HRT :
Lalli-Yamamoto

[lemec]

... PDLR is a "nice guy" and probably a big development asset, but he has never been quick.

Bahrain 2005

fastest: Pedro de la Rosa McLaren MP4-20 1'31.447

(Kimi Räikkonen McLaren MP4-20 1'31.822)

[Rob]

Unless one of them gets hit by an ambulance car at the Hungaroring I think Taki Inoue & Gianni Morbidelli have this sown up.

Morbidelli was good! He got a podium in that Arrows. Footwork. Whatever it was called then.

Also like to nominate Pacific with any one combination of Gachot/Deletraz/Lavaggi paired with Montermini...

What's with all the Gachot hate? He was a decent driver. Gachot was leagues ahead of Lavaggi, who to be fair was leagues ahead of Deletraz...

[MinT]

The big draw of having Narain in is that he doesnt drive quick enough to shake any bits loose off the car.......

[jmkaos]

Well, I'd take a guy who has been developing McLarens for a lot of time and that has scored a 2nd place on a rainy GP before many others despite his age nowdays. De la Rosa is not as bad as many of you think he is...

There has been MUCH WORSE driver pairings over the years than this year's HRT.

[muramasa]

Amati and van de Poele

[prty]

Personally it's only this forum and maybe a few other places that constantly touts Narain as the worst ever driver in Formula One. It's never made any sense to me, he's not the fastest but he's far from the worst. And then unproven drivers like Ricciardo and Vergne are touted as World Champions, makes no sense. It's all about politics, even for the fans. I'm not a fan of old people staying on the grid, but if you're at the back you might aswell, for Toro Rosso it's more of a shame.

I think that he comes from India plays a big part in people's perception.

Edit: And probably PDLR being Spanish too. The guy outqualified Raikkonen when he was thrown into the car in Bahrain 2005, got the fastest lap there, he is a podium finisher, and nobody remembers that in 2006 he was used to homologate the engines.

Edited by prty, 03 February 2012 - 19:01.

[Radoye]

There has been MUCH WORSE driver pairings over the years than this year's HRT.

[Risil]

Alonso and Hamilton probably, if we're talking about a pairing.

[olliek88]

Senna & Maldonado, by a distance.

Really?

GP2 winner and a GP2 runner up the worst ever driver pairing? I dread to think what your opinion of GP2 is then.

[Victor_RO]

Amati and van de Poele

Amati maybe, van de Poele isn't a driver who you'd really be able to call "shabby". He nearly scored points in the Modena Lambo only to have the engine pack up on the last lap at Imola in '91, and he has a very solid record outside F1.

[frp]

Or the 1983 Osella (bad)dream team: Corrado Fabi and Piercarlo Ghinzani

A European F2 Champion and a European F3 Champion.

Mmm...

[BuzzingHornet]

Taki Inoue (surely the worst driver ever in F1?) and Max Papis.

[Paolo]

Taki Inoue (surely the worst driver ever in F1?) and Max Papis.

Max Papis has shown in the US that he was quite good, actually.

[wepmob2000]

Taki Inoue (surely the worst driver ever in F1?) and Max Papis.

This is all complete rubbish - in 20 years of watching F1 I've yet to see a driver that truly didn't warrant a place on the grid. Yes there's always some more deserving drivers who aren't on the grid, and I didn't see Amati race but even so, we're not talking about complete muppets in any of the cases touted above. Phillipe Adams was generally once reckoned to one of the worst ever, but even he finished 2nd in British F3 championship prior to F1.

[IceSkyrim]

AYRTON SENNA...................................................and Johnny Dumfries [the count was so so bad that royally dragged Senna's name to the abyss].

Edited by IceSkyrim, 04 February 2012 - 02:57.

[ashnathan]

Andrea De Cesaris and somrebody, theres a few possibilities, Bruno Giacomelli at Alfa, Katayama at Tyrell, i really dont know how De Cesaris managed 14 years in F1.

[Risil]

Giacomelli was an excellent driver.

And surely De Cesaris gets a pass on his ability for his two non-finishes at Spa in 1983 and '91? It's one thing to say he was wild, inconsistent, there because of his money, keeping better drivers out of good cars, but with better engine reliability he could've won those two Grands Prix.

(I realise that asking the Alfa not to break down while in a good position is a bit like, well, asking Taki Inoue to drive quickly.)

[Red17]

This is all complete rubbish - in 20 years of watching F1 I've yet to see a driver that truly didn't warrant a place on the grid. Yes there's always some more deserving drivers who aren't on the grid, and I didn't see Amati race but even so, we're not talking about complete muppets in any of the cases touted above. Phillipe Adams was generally once reckoned to one of the worst ever, but even he finished 2nd in British F3 championship prior to F1.

Amati didnt race in Formula 1, she always failed to qualify and was replaced by an unknown named Damon Hill. Strange enough, I often see Damon himself being very underated.

Andrea De Cesaris and somrebody, theres a few possibilities, Bruno Giacomelli at Alfa, Katayama at Tyrell, i really dont know how De Cesaris managed 14 years in F1.

Hardly the worst kept secret in Formula 1: Marlboro Lira, but at least he was sort of charismatic in the way that when he finished it was news.