24 replies to this topic

[JayP]

Greetings to all,
I have been lurking on this forum for a couple of years and have been amazed at the amount of information the members possess and hopefully some can help me with a quest. I have recently been asked by a friend in the UK to help him find information on any AC Aces that raced at Sebring from 1956 to 1962. The gentleman interested in the info is the AC Ace registrar for the AC Owner's Club and has posted the information he has so far in a thread on the AC Owner's club forum at the link below. I am hoping there are people on this forum that might be able to provide more details/pictures for any of the cars/drivers that were raced at Sebring. I have found the thread that details Lonnie Rix's involvement, and hopefully there is more information like that available.

http://www.acownersc...amp;whichpage=1

Thanks in advance for any help.

Jay

[Wirra]

Start here in 1956 and work through the years

http://www.racingspo...1956-03-24.html

(edit)
1957
http://www.racingspo...1957-03-23.html

1958
http://www.racingspo...1958-03-22.html

1959
http://www.racingspo...1959-03-21.html

1960
http://www.racingspo...1960-03-26.html

1961
http://www.racingspo...1961-03-25.html

1962
http://www.racingspo...1962-03-24.html

Edited by Wirra, 22 July 2012 - 04:59.

[D-Type]

I think their listings are incomplete and only list cars they have a picture of. There's a complete listing of the entries on World sports racing prototypes (Martin Krejki's site). But I think Jay will have that information and is looking for more detail.

Edited by D-Type, 23 July 2012 - 14:14.

[Jerry Entin]

Jay: Sebring in 1960:

The #34, AC Ace driven by Mike Rothschild and Bob Grossman

Photo: Willem Oosthoek Collection

Edited by Jerry Entin, 22 July 2012 - 22:29.

[Jerry Entin]

#36, AC Ace raced by Bud Hulsey and Harry Washburn.

photo: Willem Oosthoek collection

Edited by Jerry Entin, 22 July 2012 - 22:36.

[Jerry Entin]

The third and last one is of #77, raced by Tony O'Sullivan, Peter Procter and Jef Stevens [who was the husband of Alice Bixler at the time]


photo: Willem Oosthoek collection

Edited by Jerry Entin, 22 July 2012 - 22:41.

[JayP]

Thanks for the responses and as Duncan stated we have much of the basic info regarding entries, but are looking for detail info/pictures such as what Jerry posted.
Jerry, Great shots and I am curious if Harry Washburn is related to Shelly Washburn.

Jay

[raceannouncer2003]

A couple more shots here:

http://www.barcboys....1959Sebring.htm

http://www.barcboys....2SebringPg3.htm

Vince H.

[Jerry Entin]

Bud Hulsey ran his 1960 Sebring car at Longview, Texas, a month later, under #136. Was it owned by him or by Harry Washburn? Hulsey was a Texan but Longview is relatively close to Shreveport, Louisiana, where Washburn ran his VW dealership. Alas, no chassis number.

Photo: Willem Oosthoek Collection

Edited by Jerry Entin, 23 July 2012 - 11:12.

[Jerry Entin]

Peter Proctor's AC at Longview
With doubts expressed earlier that it may not have been England's Peter Procter in the #77 AC at Sebring in 1960, here is a photo of Peter Proctor of Dallas in his AC at Longview, one week after Sebring. Perhaps the English licence plate offers a clue about its chassis number?

Photo: Willem Oosthoek Collection

Edited by Jerry Entin, 24 July 2012 - 17:24.

[JayP]

Jerry/Vince,
Thanks for the pics and links, they are excellent.

Jay

[JayP]

Another question regarding some of the rules that were in effect for racing at Sebring. In 1958 Luke Stear (Steer?) and his team drove BEX297, # 72, into 15th place and third in the 2.0 Sports class. Coming in 15th made this car the best placed Ace O/A, but Dr Richard Milo, who placed 19th, won his class because he was entered in the 2.0 GT class. Subsequent entries in the following years saw Aces usually entered in the 2.0 GT class, which would seem a sensible move because the 2.0 Sports class included the works Ferrari and Maserati racers.
The question is what modifications were allowed/required for competing in the 2 different classes?

Thanks again for any help

Jay

[Jerry Entin]

Based on an updated Sebring entry list dated March 19, the following four AC entries were to take the start:
Sports Class E
#37 Woodbury/Dressel [AC Cars Ltd]

Grand Touring Class 7

#38 Moore/Love/Crowder [AC Cars Ltd]
#39 Fuller/Day/Briggs [AC Cars Ltd]
#72 Stear/Norris [AC Cars Ltd]

All had the 1,971 cc engine.

The organizing ARCF tended to follow the rules set by the SCCA, which meant that only limited modifications could be made to GT cars. Apparently some of the AC entries that showed up featured factory upgrades that were not available to the average amateur driver in the U.S. early in 1958, so not yet approved by the SCCA. This meant a bump up to the far more competitive E-Modified class, competing with 2-liter Ferraris, Maseratis and the slightly smaller-engined Porsches.

It is ironic that #37, originally shown as an EM entry, was the one running as a GT.

What the new upgrades were for Sebring in 1958, I will leave to a marque specialist.

all research: Willem Oosthoek

Edited by Jerry Entin, 28 July 2012 - 22:03.

[JayP]

Thanks for the explanation and I think things make some sense now.

Woodbury/ Dressel were slated to drive #37 which may have been chassis AE205 (picture below). AE205 was the AC factory Lemans car and had bodywork that would have pushed it into the modified class and was owned by Dr Milo. Unfortunately, the car was involved in an accident on the way to the track and so Dr Milo returned home, picked up his road going car, BEX229, moved the engine from AE205, and then ran BEX229 with
McCluire/Forlong.


If this is the case, it is not clear is why they would have run BEX229 instead of Dressel/Woodbury. Also, I am not sure how Stear ended up in the Sports class. I have seen a picture of the #72 of Stear at Sebring with a cut down windshield. Would that would be enough to move him to the Sports class?

[rudi]

Thanks for the explanation and I think things make some sense now.

Woodbury/ Dressel were slated to drive #37 which may have been chassis AE205 (picture below). AE205 was the AC factory Lemans car and had bodywork that would have pushed it into the modified class and was owned by Dr Milo. Unfortunately, the car was involved in an accident on the way to the track and so Dr Milo returned home, picked up his road going car, BEX229, moved the engine from AE205, and then ran BEX229 with
McCluire/Forlong.


If this is the case, it is not clear is why they would have run BEX229 instead of Dressel/Woodbury. Also, I am not sure how Stear ended up in the Sports class. I have seen a picture of the #72 of Stear at Sebring with a cut down windshield. Would that would be enough to move him to the Sports class?

Here 72 before the race

[JayP]

Thanks Rudi and here is another view of the Stear car from a different angle. It looks to have a few more mods than just the cut down windshield I remembered.

[Jerry Entin]

That is Luke Stear bending over. He was a former test pilot and worked as an executive at Allison Aircraft Engine.

[JayP]

We have been digesting the great information so far and now have another question about the 1958 Sebring. In '58, car #39 was driven into 16th place and 4th in class by Fred Fuller, Art Tweedale and Tony Briggs. Unfortunately, we have not been able to find much information on this team. Does anyone know anything about them or where they ran prior to Sebring? Based on pictures of the car we believe it t be BEX244, but have been unable to find any definitive information.

[Robin Fairservice]

[quote name='JayP' date='Aug 11 2012, 08:02' post='5870161']
We have been digesting the great information so far and now have another question about the 1958 Sebring. In '58, car #39 was driven into 16th place and 4th in class by Fred Fuller, Art Tweedale and Tony Briggs. Unfortunately, we have not been able to find much information on this team. Does anyone know anything about them or where they ran prior to Sebring? Based on pictures of the car we believe it t be BEX244, but have been unable to find any definitive information.

Art Tweedale was a mechanic who emigrated from England in 1954 to USA and was involved with Elva's in the USA. There are many references to him in the new book "Elva, the cars, the people, the history".

[Jerry Entin]

Jay:

Can't help much with the #39 car at Sebring 1958, apart from the fact that in the program's entry list it was still assigned to: F. Fuller, Alan Day, T. Briggs.

I did find additional details on the Forlong/Milo/McClure entry. Source: the March 23, 1958 edition of the Tampa Sunday Tribune.

"Duncan Forlong, co-driving with two Pittsburgh, Pa, men, Dr. Dick Milo and George McClure, claimed the class seven GT class. The Tampan did most of the driving in the AC Bristol."

" Forlong pulled into the pits for gas and to have the windshield cleaned at 7:30 PM and was told that he had pushed the car from dead last in its group to the lead. The Tampan had been doing so well that the other two drivers stepped aside, letting Forlong take additional turns at the wheel. Although sharing the car with two other drivers, he put in a good six hours in the bucket seat, half of the 12-hour race. The Bristol's good position came as something of a surprise since the class has been dominated by the Triumphs. The team figured at 7:30 to keep Forlong in the car until 9:30, when it would have to come back in again for gas, and then the car's owner, Dr. Milo, would step in and keep it up front."


all research; Willem Oosthoek

[raceannouncer2003]

We have been digesting the great information so far and now have another question about the 1958 Sebring. In '58, car #39 was driven into 16th place and 4th in class by Fred Fuller, Art Tweedale and Tony Briggs. Unfortunately, we have not been able to find much information on this team. Does anyone know anything about them or where they ran prior to Sebring? Based on pictures of the car we believe it t be BEX244, but have been unable to find any definitive information.

Some results here...Fred Fuller raced an AC in 1957, so was it his car they raced at Sebring in 1958?

http://www.racingspo...Fuller-USA.html

Photo from 1958 here:

http://www.racingspo...8-03-22-039.jpg

Also, found this from 1959

"Frederic W. Fuller '54, operator of a
foreign car agency in Charlottesville, Va.,
was killed January 3 in a traffic accident in
Charlottesville.

His wife and four children survive."

Some of the 1957 programs show Fred Fuller as Frederic W. Fuller of Charlottesville, Va.

Vince H.

[JayP]

Jerry,
You continue to be great source of info and you are keeping the Ace registers busy as they try to connect the dots from what you are providing with what they already have.

Robin and Vince,
Thank You for the leads on Art Tweedale and Fred Fuller. Using this info and doing a few searches, it looks like the 3 drivers (Tweedale, Fuller, and Briggs) were only teamed together for the '58 Sebring, but did campaign separately. As Robin stated, Art was involved with Elvas and it looks like Tony Briggs was involved with Alfas. I could only find references to Fred Fuller for a couple of years (primarily driving an Ace) and maybe his untimely death explains the small amount of information available. I think Robin is probably correct that the #39 Ace was owned by Fred Fuller since he was racing an Ace in '57 and it shows some things that would make it an early car.

Jay

Edited by JayP, 12 August 2012 - 14:01.

[Jerry Entin]

It is ironic that, just like Fred Fuller, Hap Dressel lost his life in a car accident on the public road. It happened during the early morning hours near Washington, DC., on a road slippery following a rain storm. Can't find the exact date right now, but thought it happened in 1959.

all research: Willem Oosthoek

[JayP]

Thanks again Jerry.
The information of the untimely death of Hap Dressel connects a few more dots in the AC history chain. The registrars were unsure why Hap did not appear in very many races after his accident with Stirling Moss in Venezuela in late '57. Also according to AC records, importation of ACs moved from Hap Dressel's dealerhip to one in NY and this information helps explain the reason for both events.

Moving to the '57 Sebring;
Car was #72, (chassis BEX 154), was entered and driven by the husband and wife team of John and Evelyn Mull. Both were very active on the SCCA scene - this car is generally attributed as belonging to Evelyn, for John Mull also owned an Ace as well. Unfortunately the car was a DNF, with the problem attributed to the rear axle (half shaft failure?) but does anyone have more information on the reason for DNF? Also, there are rumors this car is housed in a museum somewhere in the US and can anyone confirm this and perhaps provide a location? This is a fairly significant car as it was the first AC Bristol imported into the US and dropped out of sight.


As always TIA for all information,
Jay

[Jerry Entin]

Bill Steele in his AC
JayP:
Can't help with the whereabouts of the Mull-owned AC, but here is another early one: Bill Steele at Galveston in 1957.

Photo: Bob Jackson
Willem Oosthoek Collection

Edited by Jerry Entin, 19 August 2012 - 16:55.