64 replies to this topic

[Skinnyguy]

Read the OP.

There was even less of an issue on the outside than on the inside, sorry that I did not concentrate on nothing.

No mate. Main issue is going fully back to the racing line after defending the inside and forcing to the outside the rival. Main issue is Schumacher´s move back towards the outside. You can have whatever view about if that´s OK, but please, understand what´s being discussed first.

[CoolBreeze]

Whats the issue here? No biggie, IMO.

[nOfe4r]

No mate. Main issue is going fully back to the racing line after defending the inside and forcing to the outside the rival. Main issue is Schumacher´s move back towards the outside. You can have whatever view about if that´s OK, but please, understand what´s being discussed first.

I understand whats being discussed, I watched the onboard, I'm racing myself. The difference between our views is that its only your personal opinion that the move from right to left was an issue. So let's agree to disagree...

[schubacca]

I dont see it.....

MS is just driving that POS Mercedes the best that he can....

[baddog]

No mate. Main issue is going fully back to the racing line after defending the inside and forcing to the outside the rival. Main issue is Schumacher´s move back towards the outside. You can have whatever view about if that´s OK, but please, understand what´s being discussed first.

My issue is that he did not actually defend the inside at all, he was simply on that line through the previous curve. It might not be much of a curve but it IS one. Your rule would effectively mean no-one could ever defend the outside on a short straight into a turn following a curve in the same direction..

It looked 'worse' to a less-then-observant viewer because Vettel didnt go up the inside as he was free to do, because he didnt WANT to overtake.

[britishtrident]

My issue is that he did not actually defend the inside at all, he was simply on that line through the previous curve. It might not be much of a curve but it IS one. Your rule would effectively mean no-one could ever defend the outside on a short straight into a turn following a curve in the same direction..

It looked 'worse' to a less-then-observant viewer because Vettel didnt go up the inside as he was free to do, because he didnt WANT to overtake.

Vettel's intentions aren't important, Schumacher made a dangerous entry to the pit lane that could have resulted in a major incident, if it were me sitting in the Stewards seats I would give a 2 race ban -- a very hard sentence but Schumacher has too much prior form.
Look at this way could Pastor Maldonaldo have done it and not get punished ?

[Icicle]

I thought it was pretty normal defensive driving. It was only afterwards things looked a bit exaggerated due Schumacher locking up heavily and going deep into corner, trying to wring back car back into pit lane and Seb trying not to follow Schumacher in to pits.

[Chubby_Deuce]

How is this thread still going? Giving Schumacher a 2 race ban for RACING when Grosjean got a 1 race ban for almost killing someone?

Oh right, it's Schumacher. Rational thinking goes out the window!

[baddog]

Vettel's intentions aren't important, Schumacher made a dangerous entry to the pit lane that could have resulted in a major incident, if it were me sitting in the Stewards seats I would give a 2 race ban -- a very hard sentence but Schumacher has too much prior form.
Look at this way could Pastor Maldonaldo have done it and not get punished ?

No-one would have been punished, as nothing at all worth investigating happened. If Schumacher had not locked a wheel there wouldnt even be a discussion, it just made it look like an incident. And amusingly if Schumacher was behind and ran into the back of another car as you think Vettel should have, HE would have got a penalty.

As for a ban.. hilarious really. I know you hate the guy but come on..

[goldenboy]

what the?...

move along people, your clogging up the first page

[penta1998]

what the?...

move along people, your clogging up the first page

This thread still going on from penalty to 2 race ban. hmmm... i say they should strip him of all 7 titles No one was hurt, it was exciting.. Lets move on. On to Monza

Edited by penta1998, 06 September 2012 - 16:45.

[spacekid]

Vettel's intentions aren't important, Schumacher made a dangerous entry to the pit lane that could have resulted in a major incident, if it were me sitting in the Stewards seats I would give a 2 race ban -- a very hard sentence but Schumacher has too much prior form.
Look at this way could Pastor Maldonaldo have done it and not get punished ?

The fact there is a serious suggestion for a 2 race ban as a result of two guys racing each other sums this thread and its intentions up perfectly.

[Skinnyguy]

My issue is that he did not actually defend the inside at all, he was simply on that line through the previous curve.

That´s clueless. He did stay glued to the right until Vettel moved to the outside. That´s a defense. Just like when people stay glued right in the way to the Hockenheim hairpin.

Your rule would effectively mean no-one could ever defend the outside on a short straight into a turn following a curve in the same direction..

What are you talking about? My rule? No, it´s how it works, I didn´t make it like this!! People staying right for the entry to the Hockenheim hairpin are considered to have defended, despite they haven´t steered anywhere during the previous "straight". The same for Australia turn 3 and many other corners. After staying glued to the edge forcing your rival to the outside, you can´t slot in their face again, especially not before a braking zone.

It´s not that hard, mate. In a straight after a left hander and before a right hander, you have two options: doing the normal triangle line -not defending the inside for next corner- and staying glued to the right edge until the other guy moves to your left -that´s defending-. After you have forced your rival to the outside line, you CAN´T come fully back to the left edge. So yes, you CAN defend in that scenario, just as Schumacher did: staying all the way down the inside. That´s defending after all.

It looked 'worse' to a less-then-observant viewer because Vettel didnt go up the inside as he was free to do, because he didnt WANT to overtake.

Again, where each one braked was totally irrelevant to the topic, that you can´t still spot: the move back to the racing line. Some smoke a second after the move discussed won´t distract anyone and is irrelevant Vettel trying a pass or not is irrelevant to Schumacher´s move back to the racing line. Oh, and by the way, Vettel would have outbraked Michael if he could. He just couldn´t. They were trying to get rid of him, passing him on the track is just that

PS: The guy asking for bans... are you serious, man?

[baddog]

That´s clueless. He did stay glued to the right until Vettel moved to the outside. That´s a defense. Just like when people stay glued right in the way to the Hockenheim hairpin.



What are you talking about? My rule? No, it´s how it works, I didn´t make it like this!! People staying right for the entry to the Hockenheim hairpin are considered to have defended, despite they haven´t steered anywhere during the previous "straight". The same for Australia turn 3 and many other corners. After staying glued to the edge forcing your rival to the outside, you can´t slot in their face again, especially not before a braking zone.

Watch again. Schumacher moves smoothly left immediately on passing the curve apex. I am not saying he did not defend the left, I am saying he did not defend the right first. You apparently disagree but try to understand my statement.

[black magic]

so clearly according to bt we should have a rule for next spa that any car intending to enter the pits must at all times stay to the right of the chicane thereby giving up the racing entry if another car is close behind

in effext it now becomes the responsiblity of the car in front to avoid the car behind hitting it, despite being on the racing line, despite being technically in front as defined by rear wheels ahead of the car behinds front wheels.

yup - can see the logic in that.