25 replies to this topic

[JayWay]

Villeneuve upset with blame over tragedy [16/03/01 - 00:03]

"I made an effort to be neutral in my comments.”






Jacques Villeneuve/BAR


BAR driver, Jacques Villeneuve has finally spoken about the events at the Australian Grand Prix just under two weeks ago that resulted in the death of safety marshal, Graham Beveridge. The Canadian was very distraught about the tragedy, however he is upset over the fact that some people have seen fit to blame him, especially because at the time he went out of his way to stay neutral and not point the finger of blame at anyone.

The accident occurred when Villeneuve slammed into the back of Ralf Schumacher's Williams, causing the BAR to go airborne and into the safety barrier. A wheel ripped loose from the chassis and hit the marshal in the chest, causing his death. Luckily Jacques walked away from the incident with just some heavy bruising, but the loss of the marshal's life was very upsetting to all involved in the sport.

"I made an effort to be neutral in my comments, to make sure I didn't put the blame on anybody and the other side reacted like a bunch of babies trying to point their fingers," Villeneuve said. "I thought that was highly unacceptable. Ralf had problems with his front tires and he was extremely, extremely slow and he was braking earlier than everybody else on the racetrack. So if that happens, and you know that that's what's happening then don't stay in the middle of the racetrack. Stay on the left or the right and give enough room for someone else to react. If you are going to brake 30 meters earlier than everyone else because you have problems there's no way the other people can react."

Villeneuve knows that accidents are a part of everyday Formula One life as drivers fight for position, trying to overtake whenever the opportunity presents itself. However with the series becoming so much more competitive, aggression is beginning to show itself more so, something the Canadian believes is good for the sport, but the problem is that with aggression, comes accidents, and with accidents, comes blame.

"Accidents like that will happen," he added. "We're not on a road with signs and 'oh please, it's your turn now'. We're both trying to fight for the same corners and the same lines on the racetrack. Maybe we are becoming slightly more aggressive now, which is a good thing, it's a part of racing. You need to be aggressive but I think that with mistakes now, there's much more blaming than there used to be."

From F1-Live.com

[Nikolas Garth]

It would be good to see Ralf's telemetry to see if he breaked appreciably earlier, than he did on the previous lap.

[JayWay]

Salo said that Villeneuve should have known that Ralfs tyres were going bad and he was going to be braking earlier. Obviously JV knows this but contests it is an issue of position on the track.

[JaqFan]

Obviously he did, Nik, since he was on the inside, but after watching the clip a few times (on board with JV), I have determined that RS braked at about the 150m mark. JV then hit the tremendously slowing RS at about 130m-140m. Decide for yourselves if that is too early to brake when on the inside of a slow corner...

[Simioni]

Nik,

The mpegs of the crash show that Ralf braked in between the 150 and 100m marks, normal braking point was at the 100m mark or later. That would be the 30m Jaxs is talking about. With another car ready to get a shot at him, you'd expect Ralf to brake in the last possible moment. I think Ralf was being over-cautious with a car that clearly wasn't handling too well.

[Indian Chief]

Ralf obviously had to brake earlier than usual because he had the tight inside line and he was braking on the dusty part of the track. Somebody with JV's experience should have been able to work that out.

[Sean L]

Apparently the Michelins have stuff all grip at the front compared to Bridgestone even when new. Who knows how bad they are after a few laps. The in-car pics of Motoya fighting the understeer confirm this. Did Ralf push the tyres too hard in the opening laps?

[HP]

Originally posted by Sean L
Did Ralf push the tyres too hard in the opening laps?

RS went wide a few corners before and lost some positions, maybe his tires were somehow damaged by that shunt. The running wide bit I found at galeforce. I think that info explains some things.

[Loz]

All of a sudden Patrick Head is admitting the tyres had problems...funny, how he talks about it now that JV and others have commented on it.

[Simioni]

Indian Chief,

Not true, a driver on the inside can brake pretty much as late as the guy on the outside, only his exit will be messed up which is normal when fighting for position. If they had to brake 30m earlier, overtaking on the outside would be a breeze.

[BARnone]

Hi Indian Chief:

I hate to open this argument again - but looking at Villeneuve's onboard video of the crash I looks like Ralf was in the middle of the track - not inside or outside. I could be wrong though.....

BARnone.

[mtl'78]

I have read the full interview in today's La Presse. Here's th rest of what he said:


On the effects of the crash: "physically, I had a slight concussion, nausea and headaches. Psychologically, it was tougher, I felt so powerless, standing there watching them try to recessutate [the marshall] was very difficult to take, but there was nothing I could do, and you must accept that these are the risks of racing. "

"Ralf braked very early, but I don't think he was brake-testing me, he was 20km/h slower than me in fast corners, but his engine was incredible and he accelerated with a force that left me standing there."

Then, the interviewer claims that on a passing attempt on the previous lap, Ralf gave JV the finger!!!???!!! Has ANYONE heard or seen this???

Then in a statement that has angered Michelin Boss Pierre Dupasquier, JV said "His tyres were finished. I don't know why but the Bridgestone runners all found that he [Schumacher] was braking early at every corner the whole race."

Dupasquier, an old friend of Gilles, was scathing "Jacques Villeneuves has visibly not learned all that you must know to race in Formula One. His father would have known better."

Villeneuve went on to describe his crash: "It's kind of like Einstein's theory of relativity. Everyone else watching say that the crash lasted 2 or 3 seconds, no more. Inside the cockpit however, time was slowed down considerably. There's no doubt in my mind that this is because of the high level of concentration we have in those situations. In our everyday life our brain handles all kinds of information at once. We chew gum,listen to music, talk on the phone and all that while we're driving. And our brain could handle a 100 more tasks at once. But when you're racing, your brain is 100% concentrated on one task. It's crazy, you have time to analyse, how am I going to strike the wall, quick check to my mirrors to see if anything,s coming from behind, angle your body to brace for the impact. It's the subconcious that takes over, but you are still aware. Very strange, the lenght of the accident is much longer from within the cockpit."

[Sammyed]

"I made an effort to be neutral in my comments, and a lot of people has reacted like a babies trying to find guilties"
Mr. Jacques Villeneuve (16/03/01 00:04)

Babies Mr Villeneuve?.

[CONOSUR]

From the Friday press conference, as posted on Autorace.com

Q. There have been a lot of comments about two weeks ago, about the accident, about blame here, there and whatever. You have had time now to analyse the lift-off distances going into that corner. Can you tell us about Jacques' lift-off distances on the previous lap and on the lap of the accident?

Craig Pollock: Well, from what we can see, and I'm sure Patrick will know a lot more than I will because he understands the technical side, I don't think either driver was lifting off any earlier or any later than before. Certainly it was earlier than he'd be lifting off in qualifying, but I think it was just a basic racing accident, and that's how I would like to leave it.

Q. Is that the way you see it, Patrick [Head]?

PH: Certainly, looking at the data, Ralf's braking-point was the same or slightly later than on the previous lap. I think it was fairly well known that the Michelin tyres had a bit of a dip in them in their early laps, so I think Ralf was probably struggling with a bit of understeer at that time, and I'm sure Jacques had in his mind that he was going to overtake him. But whatever it was, somehow there was a misjudgment and the cars hit each other. I think one thing that has to be looked at closely is, fundamentally, the car came to a halt with Jacques quite safely, but there are eight wheel ties on the car and each one of those eight parted, and I think that's the biggest thing that we have to have a good look at, to understand why, and to make sure that we improve the performance of the wheel ties to make sure that they do what they're intended to do.

I'm making no statements here, just passing on what the principals had to say.

[Engineguy]

Originally posted by JayWay
Salo said that Villeneuve should have known that Ralfs tyres were going bad and he was going to be braking earlier. Obviously JV knows this but contests it is an issue of position on the track.

Sadly, BAR passed on the optional "WARNING... WARNING... RS TIRES BAD... WILL BRAKE EARLY... CAUTION... CAUTION" feature when they purchased their telemetry/dash display system.

Should have known?

[Mrv]

Who cares what Ralf did. He can brake whenever he wants to . It is the responsiblilty of Jv to have avoided him. JV is 100% at fault and Spa 98 Comes to mind.

[Engineguy]

Originally posted by Mrv
Who cares what Ralf did. He can brake whenever he wants to . It is the responsiblilty of Jv to have avoided him. JV is 100% at fault and Spa 98 Comes to mind.

It's every driver's responsibility to keep their car on the track. In some situations they are unable to do so.
It's every driver's responsibility to avoid bumping wheels at the frantic start of a race. In some situations they are unable to do so.
It's every driver's responsibility to let a driver on his hot lap through cleanly in qualifying. In some situations they are unable to do so.
Certainly it was JV's responsibility to not run into Ralf. In this situation he was unable to do so.

What's the big obsession with villifying someone here? They can't leave big margins for everything another driver MIGHT do. Sometimes that catches them out. So what?

[Raelene]

An examinatiokn of TELEMETRY data and video tape by race stewards confirmed (RS) claim that he didn't brake early or slow unexpectedly.


Auto Action - Australia

[Dimo]

Yet another one of these threads...ohmygawd...

It comes down to this. Ralf's braking point, although "regular" for him at that time, was not JV's braking point. Different tires, different braking capabilities, different drivers, etc. The fact that Ralf hit the binders at the same spot as the previous lap doesn't mean that it was the same spot that JV would have, nor that it was reasonable for JV to expect it to happen there.

JV was pulling to the outside to pass and outbrake Ralf. Ralf clamped down earlier than JV expected. It was an awfully close thing. If Ralf braked a few meters later it would have been a non-issue. If JV pulled to the outside a few meters earlier it would have been a non-issue. Unfortunately the both did what they did at exactly the same time, with tragic consequences.

Why are so many people completely unwilling to let this go?

[pRy]

Patrick head's comments could be read as an admital that Ralf had a problem. First he says the tyres had dropped in performance, causing understeer. Then he says ralfs braking was "consistant". The word consistant could mean two things, consistant with the rest of the field, OR consistant with ralfs other corners. I say he meant the later. RS may have been slowing earlier because he was having trouble turning.

If you step back and look at the statements, of the two cars, Williams are the only team who have made any mention of an "issue" with either car.

[LuckyStrike1]

I think that all our thoughts should be with the family of the tragically killed marshal rather than trying to find out someone to blame for the accident. That's what JV has wanted as well, and it was none less than Ralf that started this non-sense debate to blame JV. Does he try to cover up and hide something himself ?

The simple truth is, this was a freak racing accident, a racing incident that got tragicconsequences. But no one could have foreseen this one I think, despite that something similar happened at Monza last year. Ralf went unusually slow, I think the on-board pictures shows that and in that situation it was a misunderstanding between JV and Ralf resulting in this tragic accident.

So trying to find someone to blame for this accident isn't just unnecessary, it's also stupid and doesn't lead to anything constructive. Something Ralf should know too but then, Schumis have never been famous for being good at admitting their own part in incidents

[TheDestroyer]

engine,

i would agree with you with the following exception.

if ralf was going slower than he should have been then he should have gone off line. ralf's and jv's telemetry would definitely be interesting to see

remember spa and Schumi's collision with DC? DC was at fault for that and he was the lead car.

[Williams]

if ralf was going slower than he should have been then he should have gone off line.

Since it has become tradition for the a slower driver in front to simply "hold his racing line" and "drive defensively", for what possible reason should RS have moved off the line for the driver behind him ?

(Actually, I agree with your sentiment, but in the light of racing attitudes today, I can see no reason why a driver would do that).

[baddog]

according to patrick head ralf braked at or slightly after his previous laps braking point. there was ample room to his left for another car. he was a long way off line, the line is to the left there. He didnt however blame jacques, and nor do I, as jacques clearly just didnt realise that ralf was braking a little earlier into bends than him, and was watching his own line rather than ralfs car.. and ralf could have perhaps left more room.. but then he was just taking care where he was not watching Jacques. just a big unfortunate accident with tragic aftermath. fault is a stupid word to use.

Those watching the video and claiming ralf braked early are mistaken and should accept this.. watching a crappy mpeg is hardly up there with telemetry which is what head has available. unless of course you are going to call patrick a liar.

Oh and whoever mentioned Spa 1998.. dont talk such rubbish, the two situations couldnt be less related to each other. a lapping situation in zero visibility is a bit different to two drivers on the same lap in perfect conditions.

Shaun

[Raelene]

Destroyer

re: Spa


DC was not the lead car - he was being lapped by Schumacher... different scenario.

As posted earlier - the STEWARDS have examined the telemetry and found that Ralf DID NOT brake earlier.,

that said, the lead driver, has the right to chose his own braking positon.

[jonpollak]

Fascinating....
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