185 replies to this topic

[kosmos]

It seems this is the real translation, I don't speak German, I can't say wrong or right.

Interviewer:
"..and then comes the nephew of Aryton Senna, and here in brazil crashes in the back of your car, what did you think at that moment?"

Vettel: (smiles) "Well let's see, the grave of Ayrton Senna is here in Sau Paulo, at the gaveyard in Murumbi.One has to go there and tell him what is nephew did today. which did not help us ..."

[Headspin]

Why is this thread open when Alonso one got shut right away? Next season I really hope Alonso is either out of championship before summer break or wins it, this constant bitching and BS spouting from sore losers is unbearable.

[KnucklesAgain]

I have a question to all who really think that the gearbox change was no "dirty trick":

If Red Bull had done exactly the same thing, changed Webber's gearbox, put him 5 places down the grid, so that Vettel gains one, what would you have called it?

I can tell you what the reaction would have been, the forum would have exploded, and all kind of expletives slung against Red Bull.

But when Ferrari does such a thing it's somehow "normal" for some people, nothing to complain about. Does tell also something about the level of fairness in which Ferrari operates generally, when you think that such tricks are normal (but only when Ferrari does it of course).

There never was a gearbox change, and no claim of damage. Get your facts right.

Cue Kai Ebel, Germany's Eddie Jordan squared, who tells him that he was "hit by Ayrton's nephew" without expressing any doubt at who's at fault. And Vettel, struggling to find anything funny to say, comes up with a pretty stupid comment obviously intended as a humorous quip rather than a "below-the-belt hit".

Don't insult Eddie! Kai Ebel is horrible and talking to him it's easy to look bad, he will drag you down to his level. And one usually isn't quick-thinking enough, probably, to consider that nothing that comes from Ebel's mouth can be taken as fact, I guess particularly not when you just got out of the car and are used to talking to brilliant people all week, like Seb.

Edited by KnucklesAgain, 27 November 2012 - 18:08.

[Der Pate]

In Austin Ferrari denied every kind of sportmanship...

Isn´t there a rule regarding team-play in F1, that it´s only allowed, if it doesn´t damage the sport?

[Uwe]

Never had a high opinion of Vettel, and that shows exactly why. Hope he'll have a bad car and then everyone would see the real Sebastian, a spoiled brat.

Especially when compared to the classy guy that you are.
http://forums.autosp...w...t&p=6046540
http://forums.autosp...w...t&p=6048215

[tifosiMac]

I am not a Vettel fan, nor Red Bull fan -- as a matter of fact, I do not do fanaticism in any form. I am just a dude loving F1.

I do not 'dish out' at drivers generally, but I do, on occasion, express my thoughts about some issues. Like I did here.

I like the fact that you can muster sound judgement as well.

My post was a general observation and not aimed at you. I have no idea you you support nor do I care. Please ignore the 'you' part and realise it was expressed to a number of people.

Edited by tifosiMac, 27 November 2012 - 18:16.

[bourbon]

Red Bull has no right to call the dogs of F1 out for their behavior during the year? I'll be damned if they don't. How dare anyone call them or ungracious (Seb spoke here, but Christian has also mentioned the dirty tricks in his latest interview and supported Seb's sentiments - they speak for the entire team). What the hell do you want them to do? Stand nodding and salivating with with demented glee as top teams and individuals throw out accusations of cheating, lying, stealing and evading, left and right? Trying desperately to throw them off their game, take away the advantages they gained and wipe out their results? And now people want to call RBR ungracious when they bite back - at least they didn't mention any names and out and out demean and denegrate the teams and individuals in the press.

That is how you do "hard grace". It won't resolve anything - those teams/individuals will be after RBR next year too and the bag of dirty tricks will come out again. But RBR is sending a little message of advisement - they are ready for it and just like these last three years, they will deal with whatever is thrown at them.

Go Red Bull - fight those dirty dug drama queens with everything you got! I'm behind you 100%. I remember painfully sitting after 4 races - 3 or more hours, waiting for stewards and the FIA to make decisions regarding the outcome of Sebastian's races this year - friggen ridiculous. And I remember waiting between times as the FIA looked into protests made by other teams as to how it might effect RBR. If they want to tell the world they overcame what they saw as dirty tricks, they have every right to do so - more than that, they owe it to their longsuffering fans to do so.

Much appreciated RBR. I am not a fan of teams, but if I were to back any one, it would be Infiniti RBR - they are unique in the history of the sport, in culture and discipline and the negativity they receive is both unwarranted and exaggerated. If their statements upset people - to bad. Hopefully it is the same people that were making loose and fast accusations at RBR throughout the season. Maybe they will stop and think before engaging in similar behavior next year.

Rock on Red Bull!!

Edited by bourbon, 27 November 2012 - 18:26.

[eff1fan]

But Vettel turned directly into Bruno causing the crash? It was not Senna's fault at all.

Actually Vettel should have gotten a drive through for taking another car out by turning in on them.

Interesting that somehow, Vettel has managed to escape certain penalties this year, isn't it?

[Pothead4Philosopher]

My post was a general observation and not aimed at you. I have no idea you you support nor do I care. Please ignore the 'you' part and realise it was expressed to a number of people.

Hah,

Actually so was mine. A general statement of my philosophy. Except the final part which was acknowledgement of your sound mind.

;-)

[Cenotaph]

Interesting that somehow, Vettel has managed to escape certain penalties this year, isn't it?

I know, right? It's like he wasn't even investigated at all this season... Oh wait, that was Alonso. Carry on.

[wepmob2000]

The strange thing is this thread is only 5 pages long - if Hamilton had said the same thing in the same circumstances, the thread would be 105 pages long, and servers somewhere would be melting............

[eff1fan]

Red Bull has no right to call the dogs of F1 out for their behavior during the year? I'll be damned if they don't. How dare anyone call them or ungracious (Seb spoke here, but Christian has also mentioned the dirty tricks in his latest interview and supported Seb's sentiments - they speak for the entire team). What the hell do you want them to do? Stand nodding and salivating with with demented glee as top teams and individuals throw out accusations of cheating, lying, stealing and evading, left and right? Trying desperately to throw them off their game, take away the advantages they gained and wipe out their results? And now people want to call RBR ungracious when they bite back - at least they didn't mention any names and out and out demean and denegrate the teams and individuals in the press.

That is how you do "hard grace". It won't resolve anything - those teams/individuals will be after RBR next year too and the bag of dirty tricks will come out again. But RBR is sending a little message of advisement - they are ready for it and just like these last three years, they will deal with whatever is thrown at them.

Actually,if they have proof they should call it out, otherwise it's just griping on their part.

Go Red Bull - fight those dirty dug drama queens with everything you got! I'm behind you 100%. I remember painfully sitting after 4 races - 3 or more hours, waiting for stewards and the FIA to make decisions regarding the outcome of Sebastian's races this year - friggen ridiculous. And I remember waiting between times as the FIA looked into protests made by other teams as to how it might effect RBR. If they want to tell the world they overcame what they saw as dirty tricks, they have every right to do so - more than that, they owe it to their longsuffering fans to do so.

FIA should definitely be more understanding of your suffering between decisions, you should take it up with them.

Much appreciated RBR. I am not a fan of teams, but if I were to back any one, it would be Infiniti RBR - they are unique in the history of the sport, in culture and discipline and the negativity they receive is both unwarranted and exaggerated. If their statements upset people - to bad.

I like your passion in the way you demonstrate that you are not a fan .

Hopefully it is the same people that were making loose and fast accusations at RBR throughout the season. Maybe they will stop and think before engaging in similar behavior next year.

Rock on Red Bull!!

Unlike you, I am a fan of a team, the one that came close but only because of favourable weather patterns and a brilliant driver...

[jerriy]

[showtime]

Red Bull has no right to call the dogs of F1 out for their behavior during the year? I'll be damned if they don't. How dare anyone call them or ungracious (Seb spoke here, but Christian has also mentioned the dirty tricks in his latest interview and supported Seb's sentiments - they speak for the entire team). What the hell do you want them to do? Stand nodding and salivating with with demented glee as top teams and individuals throw out accusations of cheating, lying, stealing and evading, left and right? Trying desperately to throw them off their game, take away the advantages they gained and wipe out their results? And now people want to call RBR ungracious when they bite back - at least they didn't mention any names and out and out demean and denegrate the teams and individuals in the press.

That is how you do "hard grace". It won't resolve anything - those teams/individuals will be after RBR next year too and the bag of dirty tricks will come out again. But RBR is sending a little message of advisement - they are ready for it and just like these last three years, they will deal with whatever is thrown at them.

Go Red Bull - fight those dirty dug drama queens with everything you got! I'm behind you 100%. I remember painfully sitting after 4 races - 3 or more hours, waiting for stewards and the FIA to make decisions regarding the outcome of Sebastian's races this year - friggen ridiculous. And I remember waiting between times as the FIA looked into protests made by other teams as to how it might effect RBR. If they want to tell the world they overcame what they saw as dirty tricks, they have every right to do so - more than that, they owe it to their longsuffering fans to do so.

Much appreciated RBR. I am not a fan of teams, but if I were to back any one, it would be Infiniti RBR - they are unique in the history of the sport, in culture and discipline and the negativity they receive is both unwarranted and exaggerated. If their statements upset people - to bad. Hopefully it is the same people that were making loose and fast accusations at RBR throughout the season. Maybe they will stop and think before engaging in similar behavior next year.

Rock on Red Bull!!

That would have been a nice speech if RBR would have make a reasoned well explained accusation/protest. The way they did things it looks like they are afraid of an open war, maybe because they might have more to loose. You and RBR love to talk about dirty tricks but the fact is this season only they have been caught underfueling, taking drivers out of the track, using illegal parts on the car...

[baddog]

Having 2 drivers that jump out of the way whenever necessary, and 1 driver that is suppose to be equal but never has KERS isn't a big help?

Mark had the MORE reliable Red Bull this year. Really. By a large margin. He also in no way drove to help his teammate.. There is not the slightest chance that Vettel has had even a fraction of the help Alonso got.

That said, that help is legitimate and not 'dirty tricks' so I dont know what he is on about either.

[joshb]

Interesting that somehow, Vettel has managed to escape certain penalties this year, isn't it?

maybe because he wasn't at fault...

[1Devil1]

What a bullshit discussion about Vettel's words perhaps you should no as non-natives (most of you can't speak german I guess) and only read the article. He said this in very different tone as some users here want to believe. He was fine and didn't care much about the contact with Bruno. He was over happy by winning his third title and answered in a funny mood "perhaps I should go to the grave, it' here near the circuit, what his nephew did today". Perhaps it was a little bit over the top. You have to be careful when talking about a dead person. But it was never that bad as some here want to suggest. He was not angry. But the political correctness wave just caught him again

And you have to know he is very interested in motor sport history every other other driver wouldn't care about where Senna's grave is. He did know and I guess he visited it once before.

Edited by 1Devil1, 27 November 2012 - 20:28.

[TecnoRacing]

What a bullshit discussion about Vettel's words perhaps you should no as non-natives (most of you can't speak german I guess) and only read the article. He said this in very different tone as some users here want to believe. He was fine and didn't care much about the contact with Bruno. He was over happy by winning his third title and answered in a funny mood "perhaps I should go to the grave, it' here near the circuit, what his nephew did today". Perhaps it was a little bit over the top. You have to be careful when talking about a dead person. But it was never that bad as some here want to suggest. He was not angry.

You're missing the point...the fact that it is a joke is what is so tacky and repugnant...

Typical of Vettel's sardonic humor though...Incidentally Vettel can never make it through an interview without breaking out into giggles over his own apparent 'cleverness'

[sniper80]

Vettel is an ***hole. He's always comparing himself to F1 history & former champions like Senna, Prost. I remember him saying "I feel like Senna in '91". And now this, he should be ashamed.
The success of Adrian Newey's designs have risen above his head, he's not being humble or respectful lately and thinks he can say anything he wants/thinks.
This guy needs to be learned a lesson on the track next year

And one other thing: why does he feel the need to go clever or philosophical on car radio or press conferences? This guy is 25 years old, he has everything done for him, and never had to work for money. His only problem in the world is getting a car around the track. So p-l-e-a-s-e, stop talking sh** and stop being a smarta$$! He knows nothing 'bout life.

Edited by sniper80, 27 November 2012 - 22:38.

[ayali]

Vettel is an ***hole. ................................
He knows nothing 'bout life.

Glad you're not bitter about things son

[Higli]

There's so much nonsense spread around this forum at the moment, I think I'll have a winter break until Australia.

Vettel haters, Vettel defenders, Alonso lovers, Lewis bashers... This is just Formula 1 (= car racing sport), not the Nürnberg trials.

[Zippel]

Is this going to be like Michael Richards and haunt Vettel for the rest of his days?

Vettel: HE'S A SENNA! HE'S A SENNA! HE'S A SENNNNNNA!!!!

[sniper80]

Glad you're not bitter about things son

Oh I'm not bitter, I would have preferred Alonso this year as he was the more deserving driver, but it's ok, Vettel did well too.
But he needs to stop acting like the clever guy because he isn't. Needs to drive the car, doesn't need to be a half-cooked comedian or clown, it's not funny & nobody is laughing.

[ayali]

it's not funny & nobody is laughing.

Hmm I checked papers from half a dozen countries the last 2 days and many seem to think he's funny, articulate and amazing.
But then they don't have a chip on their shoulder about the youngest WDC ever

I do agree though that he shouldn't have mentioned the "dirty tricks", best to keep shttt and laugh at the opposition when you've won.

[1Devil1]

Vettel is an ***hole. He's always comparing himself to F1 history & former champions like Senna, Prost. I remember him saying "I feel like Senna in '91". And now this, he should be ashamed.
The success of Adrian Newey's designs have risen above his head, he's not being humble or respectful lately and thinks he can say anything he wants/thinks.
This guy needs to be learned a lesson on the track next year

And one other thing: why does he feel the need to go clever or philosophical on car radio or press conferences? This guy is 25 years old, he has everything done for him, and never had to work for money. His only problem in the world is getting a car around the track. So p-l-e-a-s-e, stop talking sh** and stop being a smarta$$! He knows nothing 'bout life.

Vettel is the only guy I like to listen at press conference. It seems he is the only one (including Kimi) who doesn't give a **** about what other people might think. He also likes to talk much more than other drivers and his answer have more quality in my eyes as this standard bla bla (car was good, team is great). Sometimes he goes over the top, he is a human, he is talking in front of million of people, give him a rest and don't weigh every word of the drivers. On the one side we complain about this zero personalities like DiResta on the other side we don't allow the drivers to make mistakes in front of the camera showing a human side. I didn't like the bash fest for Hamilton after his tweets and I don't like in Vettel's case. In think its good when it happens from time to time adds a human side to the drivers. Don't get my wrong they shouldn't cross the border every time but leave them some air to breath. Imagine some would pull a Senna of 1992 (complaining about Prost blocking the other seat of Williams). Atlasf1 would burn down

Edited by 1Devil1, 27 November 2012 - 22:59.

[Sakae]

...Go Red Bull - fight those dirty dug drama queens with everything you got! I'm behind you 100%. I remember painfully sitting after 4 races - 3 or more hours, waiting for stewards and the FIA to make decisions regarding the outcome of Sebastian's races this year - friggen ridiculous. And I remember waiting between times as the FIA looked into protests made by other teams as to how it might effect RBR. If they want to tell the world they overcame what they saw as dirty tricks, they have every right to do so - more than that, they owe it to their longsuffering fans to do so....

Very much so.

I would add, that some pretty nasty language was used around in here about RBR "cheating", despite when it comes to hard facts; FiA really has not levied penalties against the RBR for any infringements, as far as I can recall. Ambiguities of grey areas in regulations are being explored by all teams at every opportunity they see that to their advantage, be it Ferrari with a broken seal, Brawn in 2009 with his diffuser, and again in 2012 with his diffuser, and I am sure McLaren has had their skeletons in closet too, if one digs deep enough.

I am not sure what Seb had exactly on his mind after race while his heart was still racing in high beats, but fact is, that season has not begun well for RB due to technical changes, which, no offense to anyone, one could viewed as a plain attempt not to let Vettel repeat 2011 season all over again, thus RB had to be slowed down. Gearboxgate was perhaps little too much of an in your face act, but that’s F1 as we know it.

[Higli]

That's the difference between Vettel and Alonso:

Vettel talks openly into the microphones, always in danger of talking rubbish and being crucified by the Internet community afterwards.

Alonso has his Twitter and the Ferrari press office.

[superdelphinus]

There's so much nonsense spread around this forum at the moment, I think I'll have a winter break until Australia.

Vettel haters, Vettel defenders, Alonso lovers, Lewis bashers... This is just Formula 1 (= car racing sport), not the Nürnberg trials.

I agree with this. This place seems to have gone mental in the short time I've been here. Pages and pages and pages of people trying to change opinions which are never going to be changed. Immovable object v unstoppable force.

See you in March :)/

[showtime]

That's the difference between Vettel and Alonso:

Vettel talks openly into the microphones, always in danger of talking rubbish and being crucified by the Internet community afterwards.

Alonso has his Twitter and the Ferrari press office.

So Vettel talks openly into the microphones, the rest just whines Not 24h have past since Alonso had an open thread about what he said on the PC after the race and you are talking about him not being open in front of the press and Vettel being the only one crucified by the Internet community.

[OO7]

Stop the press. Someone made a really bad joke, and people that already didn't like that person don't like the joke! DRAMA!

[choyothe]

You're missing the point...the fact that it is a joke is what is so tacky and repugnant...

Typical of Vettel's sardonic humor though...Incidentally Vettel can never make it through an interview without breaking out into giggles over his own apparent 'cleverness'

So all this was bc of Vettel not always being PC and sometimes going over the top in his humor? First time I've seen anyone being called a vile bastard for such offenses?

[study]

What a bullshit discussion about Vettel's words perhaps you should no as non-natives (most of you can't speak german I guess) and only read the article. He said this in very different tone as some users here want to believe. He was fine and didn't care much about the contact with Bruno. He was over happy by winning his third title and answered in a funny mood "perhaps I should go to the grave, it' here near the circuit, what his nephew did today". Perhaps it was a little bit over the top. You have to be careful when talking about a dead person. But it was never that bad as some here want to suggest. He was not angry. But the political correctness wave just caught him again

And you have to know he is very interested in motor sport history every other other driver wouldn't care about where Senna's grave is. He did know and I guess he visited it once before.

The thing is that makes it worse, Bruno wasn't even at fault. Vettels being a total and utter tit, pity his fans can't see that and still have to defend the undefensible.

[Uwe]

The thing is that makes it worse, Bruno wasn't even at fault. Vettels being a total and utter tit, pity his fans can't see that and still have to defend the undefensible.

Have you ever heard of the concept that who is in front owns the corner?

[mattferg]

Vettel is an ***hole. He's always comparing himself to F1 history & former champions like Senna, Prost. I remember him saying "I feel like Senna in '91". And now this, he should be ashamed.
The success of Adrian Newey's designs have risen above his head, he's not being humble or respectful lately and thinks he can say anything he wants/thinks.
This guy needs to be learned a lesson on the track next year

And one other thing: why does he feel the need to go clever or philosophical on car radio or press conferences? This guy is 25 years old, he has everything done for him, and never had to work for money. His only problem in the world is getting a car around the track. So p-l-e-a-s-e, stop talking sh** and stop being a smarta$$! He knows nothing 'bout life.

Have you seen the shite Alonso posted on his twitter thoughout the year?!

Also the Senna quote is in retaliation to Bruno saying him AND his dead uncle want Alonso to win.

[sniper80]

Have you ever heard of the concept that who is in front owns the corner?

That's the best humour in ages. Let's just hope Seb puts himself out of the race next time he tries your concept

[D.M.N.]

Constructive discussion here stopped a long while ago, so thread closed.