42 replies to this topic

[F1nomics]

Ex-Williams boss Adam Parr has been pretty vocal about how the creation of a F1 Fan Forum would change the sport for the better e.g. if we decided that ticket prices for races were too high or race-track facilities were sub-standard, we could demand changes from a united front. http://www.autosport...t.php/id/105095

Does anyone have any views on this? I personally think it is a good idea in theory but it would be a mighty task to unite F1 fans all over the world. And even if you managed that, there is no guarantee Bernie would pay attention to us.

[Kingshark]

Does Bernie read this forum? Just curious. You can answer me now, Mr. Ecclestone.

[Tonka]

IIRC didn't Parr make comments about UK F1 fans getting their tv coverage on the cheap for too long when Sky got involved?

[Fastcake]

IIRC didn't Parr make comments about UK F1 fans getting their tv coverage on the cheap for too long when Sky got involved?

Something to that effect yeah, as well as saying the TV rights income was still too low and Bernie should be charging more. Clearly a man who's looking out for the fans.

[F1nomics]

Something to that effect yeah, as well as saying the TV rights income was still too low and Bernie should be charging more. Clearly a man who's looking out for the fans.

Putting aside the Adam Parr history, does the idea of a Formula One Fan Forum sound good in principle? And how would you suggest the fans organise themselves?

[Tonka]

Putting aside the Adam Parr history, does the idea of a Formula One Fan Forum sound good in principle? And how would you suggest the fans organise themselves?

No chance. There's already non-stop squabbling between the teams, the dwarf and the FIA, there's no way any of them would allow a 4th party to get involved.

Who would run a fans forum? Pretty much the same type of person who's already involved with the FIA, who'd be on the lookout for what he/they could make off the back of the forum.

[F1nomics]

No chance. There's already non-stop squabbling between the teams, the dwarf and the FIA, there's no way any of them would allow a 4th party to get involved.

Who would run a fans forum? Pretty much the same type of person who's already involved with the FIA, who'd be on the lookout for what he/they could make off the back of the forum.

Fair question, but to be independent and effective, it would have to be run "by a fan, for the fans". I found this podcast online http://www.f1inpubs....p/pubscast.html

[jonpollak]

OK, I'll do it.
What we need though is more of an action group or suicide force than fan forum.
I've set up a facebook page for all us militant f1 fans worldwide

Look out you oligarchs.. we comin' to git yo ass.



Jp

Edited by jonpollak, 13 January 2013 - 20:27.

[olliek88]

Great idea! I'm going to put my heart, soul, blood, sweat and tears into getting our voices heard by the out of touch big wigs, now is the time for us to rise up and show the sport just how importa.....

Edited by olliek88, 13 January 2013 - 21:36.

[pingu666]

its pretty clear they dont care about the average low-middle income fan

[Watkins74]

The FIA fan survey and listening to that is what got us DRS and entertainment tires. The last thing I want is for F1 to listen to fans with attention spans that last less than 5 seconds.

[study]

A F1 fan forum?

God help me no! could you find a more spiteful, hateful, biased, raciest gathering if you tried :-p

[Sin]

OK, I'll do it.
What we need though is more of an action group or suicide force than fan forum.
I've set up a facebook page for all us militant f1 fans worldwide

Look out you oligarchs.. we comin' to git yo ass.



Jp

I'll sign up... I'm bringing war axes and swords...

but really sounds like a good idea after I looked at the prizes for getting a seat to watch at Nürburgring or Hockenheim

[Risil]

The most meaningful protest against high ticket prices I can think of would be F1 fans going off and watching another kind of motor sport. But then would they be F1 fans? And whither their forum?

[Sin]

The most meaningful protest against high ticket prices I can think of would be F1 fans going off and watching another kind of motor sport. But then would they be F1 fans? And whither their forum?

the people who go watch f1 live probably have the money anyway... so if the people who dont have the money stay away it wouldn't change anything... before 2014 I cant watch f1 lack of money

[Risil]

the people who go watch f1 live probably have the money anyway... so if the people who dont have the money stay away it wouldn't change anything... before 2014 I cant watch f1 lack of money

Not trying to sound like a heartless capitalist, but have you considered going to cheaper racing events? I've never been to an F1 race either, the prices make me feel ashamed and besides I'm not rich. But MotoGP has the same level of professionalism and preparation. Le Mans prototypes have the same level of technological advancement. Rallying has the same incredible emphasis on driver technique. National-level series are fun and competitive, usually have great support classes and they'll quite often let you into the paddock. See the cars being prepped, talk to the competitors. When I was 11 I asked an F3 team engineer what those pods are on the side of the engine covers. They didn't have the Stupid Question Thread back then so he was an invaluable source of info.

Formula One is sanctioned by an international non-profit organisation on the behalf of all motorists, so perhaps there is some sort of public right not to be priced out of its events. But whatever, it's been hijacked by greedy price-gougers whose main priority seems to be cosying up to dictators. So take your money and your respect elsewhere.

[Risil]

Not sure about the practicality of a whole-F1 fan forum. For a start, it would be nearly impossible to maintain a shared interest. How many fans just want F1 to give the best chances to their preferred team? How many of them have some genuine goal in mind (e.g. freer engine development, more aero restrictions) that would tip the competitive scales in favour of a single outfit (Ferrari)?

And besides, who do they lobby? By voting with their feet, fans only affect the income of race circuits -- given that high on the list of complaints is "too many races outside Europe with no history/character", this would strike many as counterproductive. Football Supporters' Trusts in Great Britain seem only to have a transformative effect when their club falls on hard times, and needs their fundraising ability to survive.

On the other hand, Bernie Ecclestone is almost certainly in the last act of his career now. If the ensuing power vacuum is handled badly then the future of top-level motor racing will be up for grabs, and an articulate fans' lobby which can claim broad support may be useful for all sorts of things. Just a thought.

Edited by Risil, 14 January 2013 - 14:12.

[Sin]

I'm really just intrested in Formula 1... at least so far... tho I been debating to see the MotoGP race... which different than hockenheim is not 400km away but just 70km

[Risil]

I'm really just intrested in Formula 1... at least so far... tho I been debating to see the MotoGP race... which different than hockenheim is not 400km away but just 70km

Yowch. World Superbikes at the Nurburgring must be a little closer to your doorstep though. The VLN is pretty damn cool too.

[Sin]

Yowch. World Superbikes at the Nurburgring must be a little closer to your doorstep though. The VLN is pretty damn cool too.

nürburgring is 400 km away too

[One]

Something to that effect yeah, as well as saying the TV rights income was still too low and Bernie should be charging more. Clearly a man who's looking out for the fans.

This is insider info?
Quotes?

[Tonka]

This is insider info?
Quotes?

http://thejudge13.co...he-long-knives/

Parr then uses his experience to draw other sporting revenue models as examples. ‘The problem is our total TV revenues as a sport are less than 500 million US dollars (£308million). By comparison, the NFL is 4.2 billion US dollars (£2.6billion) and Turkish soccer is a little bit more than us. I think it’s time that we challenge him.”

That is not "F1 fan friendly" by a long way.

For some reason Parr has decided to stand outside the tent and piss in. I have no idea what his long term aims are, but I don't believe he'd make a replacement for the dwarf.

[Risil]

For some reason Parr has decided to stand outside the tent and piss in. I have no idea what his long term aims are, but I don't believe he'd make a replacement for the dwarf.

Trying to impress the capitalists at CVC, I'd imagine.

[Tonka]

Trying to impress the capitalists at CVC, I'd imagine.

Time for F1 to have an undertaker ?

[Tommorris747]

Time for F1 to have an undertaker ?

Seems that Parr doesn't just have fans.
http://globalmotorsp...EASE-150113.pdf

[Deluxx]

It wouldn't work.

1. Everyone would say prices are too high...
2. F1 fans don't know what we want. That's why we watch racing on TV and not run a promotion ourselves.

[Rubens Hakkamacher]

Actually, I'm quite sure a number of F1 big wigs keep an eye on things here. Quite often what they seem to need to address in public almost directly mirrors things here.


.. and it's not a bad idea for them to do so. Remember the Michelin/Renault "tire footprint/radius while turning" situation? While I was wrong (I think?) about MS magically shifting gears while adjusting brake bias, *someone* was reading here (or maybe that was the Speed board...?).

FOM had better start paying attention. Lots of empty seats, not a lot of young people at races (anyone else notice that...?)... and a general malaise regarding the 2014 rules (c'mon... who here LIKES smaller engines, less hp? Really?).

... and it's cheaper for me to go to another country than to go to the race in my own country (USA)? WTF?

Bernie is a Real Deal 1%er. But there are a lot of uber rich people around F1 that might suddenly find themselves wondering "where'd the money go?" if they're not careful.

[sheepgobba]

Actually, I'm quite sure a number of F1 big wigs keep an eye on things here. Quite often what they seem to need to address in public almost directly mirrors things here.


.. and it's not a bad idea for them to do so. Remember the Michelin/Renault "tire footprint/radius while turning" situation? While I was wrong (I think?) about MS magically shifting gears while adjusting brake bias, *someone* was reading here (or maybe that was the Speed board...?).

FOM had better start paying attention. Lots of empty seats, not a lot of young people at races (anyone else notice that...?)... and a general malaise regarding the 2014 rules (c'mon... who here LIKES smaller engines, less hp? Really?).

... and it's cheaper for me to go to another country than to go to the race in my own country (USA)? WTF?

Bernie is a Real Deal 1%er. But there are a lot of uber rich people around F1 that might suddenly find themselves wondering "where'd the money go?" if they're not careful.

Kinda tough considering F1 is up against Sports such as Football, tennis etc. The fundamental aspects of those games will remain the same, while F1 has to evolve and adapt to the World's changing circumstances. Keeping the next generation of Fans and attracting them will be difficult as you mentioned the lack of youth at events. This is even more worrying considering the cost of tickets.

[jonpollak]

How about this ..Kids under 18 get in free
For each under 18 the circuit lets in CVC gives them back $£€150.00 and then writes it off as investment in the future.

May have to wait for a certain funeral to take place though.

Jp

[Owen]

How about this ..Kids under 18 get in free
For each under 18 the circuit lets in CVC gives them back $£€150.00 and then writes it off as investment in the future.

May have to wait for a certain funeral to take place though.

Jp

When that funeral happens (or should event's 'overtake' said person) then I suspect this 'show' might get run and be structured in a very different way.

[pingu666]

tbh f1 has a magic about it, so it gets away with far more crappyness than other motorsports

[fifi]

good luck to them with that

would be like here but a million times worse

[Abranet]

There was an attempt to get a F1 fans association together around the same time FoTA was set up.

http://www.fofassociation.com/

Not sure how much success they had or if they managed to keep any momentum going. Don't have time to browse the site atm.

[tifosi]

Putting aside the Adam Parr history, does the idea of a Formula One Fan Forum sound good in principle? And how would you suggest the fans organise themselves?

Isn't THIS an F1 fan forum?

[BoschKurve]

Since the F1 fan survey gave us the magic of DRS and silly putty tires, I'd prefer the fan input is kept to a minimum at this point.

Too bad fans didn't request cutting down on the cowcatcher front wings and all the various aero **** that's been going on for awhile. It's amazing how exciting F1 can be when mechanical grip and powerful engines is the main focus.

[Risil]

Isn't THIS an F1 fan forum?

Yeah but how's Adam Parr going to make any money out of us?

[Vitesse2]

How about this ..Kids under 18 get in free

Jp

As first proposed by - and I kid you not - the British Motor Racing Organisers Association in 1938.

[Vitesse2]

Yeah but how's Adam Parr going to make any money out of us?

Didn't you buy his book?

[Risil]

Didn't you buy his book?

Hey! It was for a gift!

Edited by Risil, 15 January 2013 - 21:09.

[Red17]

When that funeral happens (or should event's 'overtake' said person) then I suspect this 'show' might get run and be structured in a very different way.

It's unnavoidable, the real question is: are teams dumb enough to atempt a coup and run (down) Formula 1?

The idea of fan forum is goood, on paper. You can't lease greeks and trojans at the same time. Someone will get mad/bore/angry/frustrated and leave.
People should focus on the core: racing.

[siberianlady]

There was an attempt to get a F1 fans association together around the same time FoTA was set up.

http://www.fofassociation.com/

Not sure how much success they had or if they managed to keep any momentum going. Don't have time to browse the site atm.

WE are still very much alive and kicking but we knew it would take years to get off the ground! So if you want to support us then look us up and send us ideas on how to improve!

[Rubens Hakkamacher]

May have to wait for a certain funeral to take place though.

Jp

I'd suggest - just as the music industry found out - the idea that F1 in it's historically present form *doesn't necessarily have to exist*. CVC could go the way of a lot of corporations - the top guys bail out while they can, then the company goes "poof".

Is there F1 without CVC?

[billm99uk]

Didn't you buy his book?

Is it any good?