16 replies to this topic

[HistoryFan]

Lauda and Wolff at Mercedes - so Mercedes will be more Austrian.

But we had also Austro-Daimler before WWII.

has anyone a complete list of GP races that Austro Daimler appeared?
Details about the cars?
interesting stories?

[Vitesse2]

How deep are your pockets?

http://www.boehlau-v...05-77639-0.html

[D-Type]

You have, I hope, already found Leif Snellman's "Golden Age" site

[Roger Clark]

You have, I hope, already found Leif Snellman's "Golden Age" site

Did Austro-Daimler race during the period covered by that site?

[raceannouncer2003]

Here are some Austro Daimler race results:

http://www.racingspo..... Daimler.html

Vince H.

[D-Type]

Did Austro-Daimler race during the period covered by that site?

HistoryFan had not told us what sites he had already found and I thought Leif Snellman is always a good bet so I felt a reference might help.
The periods don't coincide for GP racing but the hillclimb list does cover the whole inter-war period.

[Roger Clark]

I think the most notable Austro-Daimler competition successes were before the First World War in the Prince Henry and Alpine Trials. After the war, they produced the small Sascha cars which ran with some success in the 1922 Targa Florio, one of them driven by Alfred Neubauer. All of these cars were designed by Ferdinand Porsche, who was the technical director of Austro-Daimler. The Targa Florio cars were identified by playing card motifs: hearts, clubs, diamonds and spades. Almost 50 years later, Porsche did the same on the 1970 908/3s.

[Michael Ferner]

Austro-Daimler built a pukka Grand Prix car in 1922, which wasn't raced admittedly, but later "semi-stock" racing cars ran in the German (1926/7) and Monaco (1929/30) GPs. Hans Stuck was also pretty successful in hill climbs with his car.

Edited by Michael Ferner, 22 January 2013 - 17:45.

[Roger Clark]

Can you tell me more about the grand prix car?

[Michael Ferner]

Not without doing research I don't have time for right now, no. There is a tendency to think those cars were simply enlarged Saschas (and maybe they were), but in any case, they were built especially for a 1922 Grand Prix, so that makes them Grand Prix cars, no?

[Roger Clark]

Is a Grand Prix Austro-Daimler mentioned in Karl Ludvigsen's biography of Ferdinand Porsche?

[D-Type]

According to David Hodges's A-Z of Grand Prix Cars two Sascha Austro-Daimlers ran in the Gran Premio de Vetturette which was the inaugural race at Monza in 1922. A week later two Austro-Daimlers were entered for the Italian Grand Prix but were withdrawn after Kuhn was killled driving one. Hodges says "... the Grand Prix entry was presumably two Saschas with the larger engines sometimes fitted..."

[Roger Clark]

I thought that the engines fitted to the Saschas were 1100 or 1500cc. Kent Karslake, in Racing Voiturettes, says that the cars raced at Monza were 1100cc. The 1100s had a short stroke for the time but it would seem unlikely that they could be increased in size to become pukka Grand Prix cars. If they had 1100s and 1500s it seems logical to race the larger engines in the voiturette race unless they were holding them back for the Grand Prix.

[Roger Clark]

Is a Grand Prix Austro-Daimler mentioned in Karl Ludvigsen's biography of Ferdinand Porsche?

I've just been reading an article by Karl Ludvigsen in The automobile January 2009 on hte Grand Prix Austro-Daimlers. It is based on of his book on Ferdinand Porsche.

It seems there were two. the first was known as the ADM-R and was built for the 1921 3-litre formula. The name was intended to suggest a relationship with the production ADM but it was a unique design. THe car was't raced by A-D but one car was imported to England by George Newman. It was raced at Brooklands until 1930, eventually lapping at 118mph.

In 1922 the Grand Prix formula required 2-litres and Porsche produced the ADS II-R. Its cylinder dimensions were the same as the ADM-R's and its chassis was a shortened version of the ealier car's. The cars were entered for the Italian Grand Prix to be driven by Alfred Neubauer, Fritx Kuhn and Lambert Pöcher. Kuhn crashed fatally early in practice and the cars were withdrawn. Francis Luther of Beardmore imported at least one of he carsand race it successfully at Brooklands. In 1928 the car appeared with a new 1.5-litre supercharged engine built by Laystall and became known as the Laystalll special.

The controversy over Kuhn's crash caused Porsche to leave A-D and move to Daimler in Germany but I don't know what happened to him after that.

[karlcars]

Thanks for the mention. The article was derived from information in my book, Ferdinand Porsche -- Genesis of Genius, which takes the story from the beginning to the early 1930s. Published by Bentley, it is I think still available.

The little Sascha racers were remarkably in advance of their time, extremely quick for their category. Several raced in the UK after their continental careers, one driven by Malcolm Campbell. The larger cars also came to the UK to compete, chiefly at Brooklands.

[GMiranda]

One exciting remark I always remember when I see Austro-Daimler's name is that the future Yugoslav president Josip Broz Tito worked for them at their factory at Wiener Neustadt and was often called to races and rallies and even to test the cars!! He worked there between 1911 (?) and 1913 or 1914 when the Austro-Hungarian army conscripted him. Previously, Tito also worked for Skoda and Benz.

[P0wderf1nger]

One exciting remark I always remember when I see Austro-Daimler's name is that the future Yugoslav president Josip Broz Tito worked for them at their factory at Wiener Neustadt and was often called to races and rallies and even to test the cars!! He worked there between 1911 (?) and 1913 or 1914 when the Austro-Hungarian army conscripted him. Previously, Tito also worked for Skoda and Benz.

 

By strange coincidence, Whitney Straight not only broke the three-year old Shelsley Walsh record set by Hans Stuck in an Austro-Daimler. Eleven years later, he personally delivered a jeep to Tito in Petrovac.