58 replies to this topic

[trogggy]

I really don't understand how anyone could vote "yes" in one poll and "no" in the other, considering that both situations were more-or-less identical...

(Yes/Yes)

Because it looked like in 1 case the lead driver's pace was severely compromised and in the other's not would be a valid reason.
Mine is a yes / don't know - as I don't know the Mercs' relative fuel levels.

I don't equate telling drivers they can race up until a point, eg last pit-stop, and then bring the cars home, with showing favoritism to 1 driver. Yes they're both examples of team orders, but only one is unfair.

[RoryF1]

I really don't understand how anyone could vote "yes" in one poll and "no" in the other, considering that both situations were more-or-less identical...

(Yes/Yes)

That's because you have a brain. Both situations are identical with the faster car behind. One driver followed team orders and the other didn't. It's easy to see why one was "wrong" and "an afront" to modern racing. It has everything to do with the driver that was benefited and not team orders.

If someone claims no for one and yes to another it's an easy way to identify someone with terrible reasoning ability or with an agenda.

Edited by RoryF1, 25 March 2013 - 00:14.

[BenettonB192]

If there was the poll option i would have voted "no, but" on both occasions. I think how team orders was applied was wrong today for RBR and Mercedes. I can see the necessity for team orders given the current tyre situation. But then they should really favor the faster driver or make it clear who's number 1 ala Ferrari.

And after that, Seb shouldn't have apologised, at least not in awkward way he did. He did what he did and should have said: "OK, sometimes I'm a bastard, that's just me" (grin). Or as an alternative should have apologised more in a true Machiavellian way. IMHO his artistic performance left a lot to be desired. He might e.g. need some lessons from Fernando biggrin.gif

I agree with that. The apology made him look weak which irks me as a fan. The more i think about that i get a bit angry at RB too that they put him in this awkward situation to begin with. As 3-time champion and title holder it should come as perk that he doesn't have to disobey orders to win a race in what's going to be a tight championship battle against someone who gets the preferential treatment by his team already. This is widely overlooked by the hate train imo. Let's get real. Mark and Seb are not contrahents on eye level anymore like in their first year together. Probably not making myself friends with this opinion because it touches the "Let Michael pass for the championship"-area. But as we've seen today handling it differently is no recipe for love and harmony either.

Edited by BenettonB192, 25 March 2013 - 00:45.

[Sin]

One thing I realized when trying to sleep in the eve is, that I generally don't like team orders, that is probably also the reason why I never like Michael Schumacher in his first career...

if F1 really is a Teamsport they should remove the WDC from it... as long as there is the WDC racing should never be comprimised in any way

[apoka]

I disliked both team orders, but I understood the Merc one less. There was almost no risk involved and it might have gained them another position. It's also the second race of both drivers together and it is not clear who will be the main WDC challenger. (Well, it was not clear before the team order.) For RB, I understand that they wanted to play it safe, but in contrast to Merc the roles in the team are clearer - it is most likely Vettel challenging for WDC - so their policy most likely reduced WDC chances and they engaged it very early in the race even before the last pit stop. So we have:

Merc:
* team order because of tyre deg issues / fuel / safely bringing it home
* team order with no clear #1 / #2 driver roles
* swapping positions early enough might have gained them a position

RB:
* team order because of tyre deg issues / safely bringing it home
* team order in favor of the driver likely to finish behind in WDC based on the last 4 seasons

I voted no/no, but I am very surprised that people believe the Merc team orders were better than those for RB. I think the opposite is true.

[Jimisgod]

The fastest man should always win.

Of course the man who detunes his engine on team orders will be slower than the one who ignores the orders.

[Briz]

Of course the man who detunes his engine on team orders will be slower than the one who ignores the orders.

I'd like to know how fast Mark could bring engine settings back to normal and if he did. On the other hand I also think Vettel should have informed the team that he will race instead of being sneaky.

I dislike those team orders mainly for one important reason - I think it forces drivers to choose only strategies where they are strong at the beginning and middle of the race instead of strategies where they hold back some performance for a later stage. There's no point to choose such a strat if the team will force you to stay behind your teammate when you have the performance advantage as planned (that's definitely what happened with Rosberg)

[mnmracer]

On the other hand I also think Vettel should have informed the team that he will race instead of being sneaky.

Do you for a fact know he didn't?
Mark seemed pretty ready to take on the fight.

[OoxLox]

I'm taking a simple stand on this - I want to see good racing, and team orders kills that. If an order is given then yes it should be followed, because drivers are employees after all and none of them would win anything running around the track without a car, but I don't think the order should be given in the first place. I know we'd be back in the "let's pretend it's not happening" situation we had a few years ago when coded messages and pit strategy would be used to engineer a result, but it's got to be better than the whole world listening to drivers and teams arguing on the radio about rigging it. There was coverage on the mainstream breakfast news in the UK that made the sport look seedy and the results rigged. Who will start watching the sport if they think it's fixed?

I'd be an awfully annoyed punter if I put £100 on Rosberg to podium, or the same on Webber to win. FFS, we call this motorSPORT!!