130 replies to this topic

[Forma1]

Lot of people love RB, lot of them hate them. What do you think of them? Which weekend do you think was RB's easiest weekend in terms of pace? 

 

Personally I think the most irritating stuff about them is the theatre they come up with. Vettel has just said that this year had been a diffucult weekend for them. What? Is my English that bad that I can't make a difference between difficult and easy? Both in the qualy and race RB had 8 tenth over the rest (yesterday Webber was on pair with the Mercedes guy on the supposedly 7-8 tenth slower tyre, today Vettel was just cruising for the last 25 laps, despite that he had 30 seconds margin over Nico).  

 

Anyway a big congrat to the technical staff of RB. That is really something that needs to be given credit.

[HoldenRT]

No one cared about Redbull in 2006.  They only care now because they are so good.

[Massa]

You are tyring seriously. Red bull vettel red bull vettel red bull vettel.

[Brother Fox]

The toys are going to come out of the pram in the next 36 hours huh

[Nitropower]

It's a great team. But it makes no sense that the FIA imposes budget caps while they have 4 cars on track.

 

"Difficult weekend" is corporate speak. They have been sweeping the floor with the competition for the last 4,5 years quite easily. They've probably had the best car by a margin in 70 of the last 90 Grand Prix and there is no discussion about that.

 

The team? The team is great. Best engineers, best mechanics (fastest pitstops), and a brilliant driver. They make the sport boring to be honest.

[V3TT3L]

Its better to have a breath of fresh air than standing the suffocating vicious lazy patronized aristocrats.

Edited by V3TT3L, 27 October 2013 - 11:37.

[pdac]

They have perfected all areas - car, driver, pit crew - everything works as best as it can. A truely fantastic team effort. The only problem is, after each win, we have to listen to CH.

[RockyRaccoon68]

Silverstone 2009...barely a Red Bull cap in sight

 

Silverstone 2013...a sea of Red Bull 'fans'

 

Amazing how success can buy popularity...incidentally the very ethos behind Red Bulls involvement in the sport.

[V3TT3L]

It's a great team. But it makes no sense that the FIA imposes budget caps while they have 4 cars on track.

 

"Difficult weekend" is corporate speak. They have been sweeping the floor with the competition for the last 4,5 years quite easily. They've probably had the best car by a margin in 70 of the last 90 Grand Prix and there is no discussion about that.

 

The team? The team is great. Best engineers, best mechanics (fastest pitstops), and a brilliant driver. They make the sport boring to be honest.

Funny that some fans didn't complain when Ferrari dismantled 2xWDC Benetton using the force of money.

Ferrari took away Schumacher, Ross Brawn and Rory Byrne and became WDC/WCC practically buying it from Benetton.

 

Since they can't snatch anybody from RedBull, the tifosi keep bitching.

[LuckyStrike1]

It's fantastic. 

[Lights]

The thing that amazes me the most is how teams like Maranello and Woking cannot deal with them over a long period of time.

 

Red Bull have upped team performance like Schumacher upped driver performance in the 90's.

 

It's not only about bringing the best car to the track, it's also about everything you do there, and Red Bull does that best.

[P123]

No one cared about Redbull in 2006.  They only care now because they are so good.

 

I still don't care.

[Shambolic]

I struggle to "like" any of the teams, but some cause more of a bad taste than others. Red Bull as a team seem to embody the drink that funds them - Far more costly than makes sense, a facade of fun and laughter, and leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

 

When Red Bull bought the team that "bought" Stewart (from day one the team has been presented as something I've felt it's not) they gave this fun, relaxed, presentation. The "spontaneity" of Monaco pool jumpings, the witty amusing banter.. It all seemed so refreshing viewed through naive eyes.

 

Of course, it's all bullocks really, they're the same greedy arrogant cut throat lying backstabbers as the rest of the grid, they just put a different spin on how they present themselves.

 

The "theatre" is sickening from a cynic's point of view - It's like they as a team have decided to emulate the moustachioed brummy in the false belief that making every point scored seem like an epic challenge against the odds will win them favour with potential bullwater buyers.

 

The truth is they've made the best car, and put one of the best of the current drivers in it. Their success comes from immense spending power and buying the right ingredients, and not from some battle of mythic proportions. The same would be said about virtually any team that had a winning streak, even the humble Brawn turns out to have been one of, if not the most expensive car ever designed.

[Disgrace]

...

 

Red Bull have upped team performance like Schumacher upped driver performance in the 90's.

 

...

 

Well said.

[Roscoe]

Just because they have the best car doesn't mean they can turn up at a race, not try and win.  No-one knows what goes on behind the scenes, how much work people from the drivers down to the tea lady put in.  For all we know Red Bull do twice as much work as any of the other teams to make a car that can be 8 tenths faster than anyone else.

 

It's not their fault Ferrari, McLaren and to an extent Mercedes haven't produced much that can challenge them.

[SenorSjon]

Ferrari's Ace card: testing on their own track was binned by 2009. McLaren is very capable of shooting in their own foot on multiple occasions. RB had the advantage Renault was able to develop their engine last. They got multiple upgrades to balance with Mercedes and Ferrari. En passant, they introduced the exhaust blowing and gained a lot from it.

 

The difference between the 2 RB cars is appalling. It seems they can't put 2 identical cars to the race.

[fastwriter]

I struggle to "like" any of the teams, but some cause more of a bad taste than others. Red Bull as a team seem to embody the drink that funds them - Far more costly than makes sense, a facade of fun and laughter, and leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

 

When Red Bull bought the team that "bought" Stewart (from day one the team has been presented as something I've felt it's not) they gave this fun, relaxed, presentation. The "spontaneity" of Monaco pool jumpings, the witty amusing banter.. It all seemed so refreshing viewed through naive eyes.

 

Of course, it's all bullocks really, they're the same greedy arrogant cut throat lying backstabbers as the rest of the grid, they just put a different spin on how they present themselves.

 

The "theatre" is sickening from a cynic's point of view - It's like they as a team have decided to emulate the moustachioed brummy in the false belief that making every point scored seem like an epic challenge against the odds will win them favour with potential bullwater buyers.

 

The truth is they've made the best car, and put one of the best of the current drivers in it. Their success comes from immense spending power and buying the right ingredients, and not from some battle of mythic proportions. The same would be said about virtually any team that had a winning streak, even the humble Brawn turns out to have been one of, if not the most expensive car ever designed.

 So why do you watch F1 at all if you hate the greedy arrogant cut throat lying backstabbers in the paddock so much?

[RockyRaccoon68]

I struggle to "like" any of the teams, but some cause more of a bad taste than others. Red Bull as a team seem to embody the drink that funds them - Far more costly than makes sense, a facade of fun and laughter, and leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

 

When Red Bull bought the team that "bought" Stewart (from day one the team has been presented as something I've felt it's not) they gave this fun, relaxed, presentation. The "spontaneity" of Monaco pool jumpings, the witty amusing banter.. It all seemed so refreshing viewed through naive eyes.

 

Of course, it's all bullocks really, they're the same greedy arrogant cut throat lying backstabbers as the rest of the grid, they just put a different spin on how they present themselves.

 

The "theatre" is sickening from a cynic's point of view - It's like they as a team have decided to emulate the moustachioed brummy in the false belief that making every point scored seem like an epic challenge against the odds will win them favour with potential bullwater buyers.

 

The truth is they've made the best car, and put one of the best of the current drivers in it. Their success comes from immense spending power and buying the right ingredients, and not from some battle of mythic proportions. The same would be said about virtually any team that had a winning streak, even the humble Brawn turns out to have been one of, if not the most expensive car ever designed.

 

 

 

Well said!! 

 

 So why do you watch F1 at all if you hate the greedy arrogant cut throat lying backstabbers in the paddock so much?

 

It's possible to enjoy the on track action whilst hating the theatrics that surround it.

Edited by RockyRaccoon68, 27 October 2013 - 11:53.

[stillOrange]

RedBull are a great team.
Over the years they have built a car that has flexed boundaries, they innovated and improved to the point of domination.
They have jumped into a space previously reserved to old manufacturers teams.
They have curated a young driver into someone that already, at his young age, deserves a place amongst the all time greats.
Their operations, pit wall and pit lane teams are the best amongst the whole paddock.
That is all that makes them successful and win everything that is there to win.
That is their presence.

[ensign14]

Funny that some fans didn't complain when Ferrari dismantled 2xWDC Benetton using the force of money.

Ferrari took away Schumacher, Ross Brawn and Rory Byrne and became WDC/WCC practically buying it from Benetton.

 

Since they can't snatch anybody from RedBull, the tifosi keep bitching.

 

You have to remember that to many Ferrari never have, never will and never can do anything wrong ever.  Look how the tifosi embraced Schumacher even though he was a cancer to sporting integrity.

[ElDictatore]

How is their fault?

 

They produce the best car, have the best strategies, the best pit stops. They do everything better than anybody else on the grid. When did you last hear them saying that they didn't find the right setup?

Edited by ElDictatore, 27 October 2013 - 12:25.

[August]

I respect them for doing best job in the grid.

 

But I don't really like the team. RB seems to be in only to promote the energy drink. I prefer privateers like Williams and Sauber whose main business is racing, or car manufacturers which have always been a part of motor racing.

 

If energy drinks' advertising were ever banned, I could imagine RB selling the team.

[AyrtonSauna]

Not a fan of the corporate machine that Red Bull is.I can't stand them to be honest, but being a fan of competition they are really good for the sport even with their false charisma.The more heavy weights in F1 the better.

 

Victory will be sweeter when they are beaten.

[DutchQuicksilver]

What do I think of Red Bull? Never been a fan of them and probably never will be. They will never build the history and traditions that McLaren, Ferrari and Williams for example have. They will always be seen as that energy drinks selling company who bought a toy to be in F1. If it wasn't for Newey, they would still be fighting the likes of Sauber.

[cartmann]

A team that is more interested in winning by what ever means necessary, and feign a real interest in the "sport". Heck Coca Cola would be more sporting without trying. Make fast cars tho.

[JHSingo]

Motorsport would be a poorer place without Red Bull. Literally.

 

Not just F1, but think of all the forms of motorsport around the world you see Red Bull backed cars/bikes in these days. Think of the drivers/riders they have supported too. Would Vettel even be in F1 if it wasn't for Red Bull's backing? I'm not certain. I'd argue Red Bull have done more for the wider world of motorsport than Ferrari or McLaren have in recent years.

 

Fact is, they don't support any other sport in the world like they do motorsport. And that's somehow a bad thing?

 

I just can't help but find it hilarious how many people can't stand the sight of a "fizzy drink company" beating the likes of Ferrari/McLaren/Williams. Once upon a time, those teams didn't have history or tradition either. Did people sneer at them back in the day, or dismiss them quickly? No.

 

Just get over it.

Edited by JHSingo, 27 October 2013 - 13:35.

[stillOrange]

Are we talking here about a racing team or about a company that owns and sponsors that team?

[GlenP]

Red Bull are currently doing F1 the way to is supposed to be done, and much better than everyone else. What exactly is the problem there?

 

Just because they aren't the team you arbitrarily chose to like first, doesn't mean they aren't currently the best.

[cartmann]

Beating is such a subjective term...

[cartmann]

Its not about being the best, its about what you do to get there. The guy could have driven through the whole field twice today with one eye closed. Does that make you feel that you witnessed something special?

[Owen]

Red Bull are currently doing F1 the way to is supposed to be done, and much better than everyone else. What exactly is the problem there?

Just because they aren't the team you arbitrarily chose to like first, doesn't mean they aren't currently the best.

They certainly have done a great job. Does anyone know if RBR or Vettel are popular, they never seem to have many fans on this board but one has to assume VET is popular in Germany.

[Nonesuch]

Red Bull as a company is doing a lot of different sports a favour by sponsoring events, teams, and participants. I can't see much being wrong with that.

 

Red Bull Racing as an F1 team has been doing a fantastic job over the last few years, but they've also been involved in controversy from time to time - as in 2011 and 2012 when they raced cars of dubious legality. The people involved in the team are obviously real petrol heads, as are most people who spend so much time travelling the world to race cars. Yes, Red Bull is a drinks company. But let's not pretend as though Ferrari or McLaren are funding their teams solely by selling road cars. Yet you don't hear people mocking Ferrari for being an oil company/a tobacco brand/a bank.

 

I don't care for Red Bull's PR, which often sounds more juvenile than anything else, but that's fair enough. Different strokes for different fo--- consumer demographics. That said, I'm not sure anyone is still buying the whole 'IT WAS SUCH A TOUGH WEEKEND' schtick that Horner and his goons get up to every time Vettel crosses the finishline half a minute in front of anyone else.

Edited by Nonesuch, 27 October 2013 - 13:51.

[GlenP]

Its not about being the best, its about what you do to get there. The guy could have driven through the whole field twice today with one eye closed. Does that make you feel that you witnessed something special?

If you don't think that represents special driving you are a lost case. Brilliant drive - perfect start, not at all phased by being dropped slap into the middle of the pack. Exceptional in every way. Yes - special.

[cartmann]

If you don't think that represents special driving you are a lost case. Brilliant drive - perfect start, not at all phased by being dropped slap into the middle of the pack. Exceptional in every way. Yes - special.

Happy you are happy.

[Seanspeed]

Another Red Bull victory - another Forma1 thread whining about them.  EVERY time.

 

C'mon man.  You have some good posts, but seriously, this sour grape stuff is getting old. 

Edited by Seanspeed, 27 October 2013 - 14:05.

[Megacale]

I dont see it as Redbull winning every race, i see it as Jaguar winning every race... Oh that green livery was the bomb!!!

[f1RacingForever]

If i said what i really felt about redbull, there would probably be a server overload from all the angry replys from redbull fans and i don't feel like getting attacked, so i'll just say that i do not like them. That puts it very mildly.

[pathogen]

IMO As a Team the give fresh air to F1. They build a real force form the Jaguar (Ford Motor Company) debris and take the spot of winner teams like Williams or Renault in the last 10 or 12 years. I am not a RedBull fan, but for me their style, personality and development criteria is a new benchmark for every body.

[Clatter]

Red Bull are currently doing F1 the way to is supposed to be done, and much better than everyone else. What exactly is the problem there?

 

Just because they aren't the team you arbitrarily chose to like first, doesn't mean they aren't currently the best.

Well said.

[Afterburner]

I'll go out on a limb and say that if it weren't for Red Bull, F1 would look even more ridiculous than it does now, because they prove that even with all the gimmicks and bogus-ness like DRS and fading tyres that have been pre-designed into the sport, the best still come out on top. They're a major reason the integrity of the competition in the sport holds any weight right now whatsoever, in my opinion, because if we were still getting different winners in every race and a five-way title fight every year then F1's status as a lottery would be complete.

Edited by Afterburner, 27 October 2013 - 20:50.

[DoodoolTalla]

nothing more than a drinks company for me.

[Exb]

What do I think about Red Bull? What they have done the past few years in exceptional, they epitomise what F1 is all about to me. They have raised the bar and its up to all the other teams to catch them up, they seem to be the best in nearly all departments except PR, they definitely don't help themselves there!
Also the amount of money put into motor racing, and through their young driver program has to be a good thing for the sport.

Love them or hate them? - no neither, I appreciate what they do as an F1 fan and can only congratulate the whole team on the past 4 years and for showing the rest of the paddock how its done. I just hope the others can bring the fight to them next year.

[chrisj]

Congratulations to Red Bull -- they are showing everyone how it should be done, and don't seem to have a weak area. Team management, design, and driver are all on top form. Compare that to the likes of Williams, who have been in decline since Newey left, McLaren, who are perennial underachievers, and Ferrari, who managed to dismantle their superteam and haven't won anything since. If not for the Brawn trick diffuser, we'd be talking about 5 in a row.

[Andrew Hope]

They aren't doing anything the precious "real" teams like Williams and McLaren and Ferrari haven't done in the past, or wouldn't do in Red Bull's place right now.

 

I agree with the fans saying there are a lot of irritating things about Red Bull, because there clearly are quite a few: making out like every race was a struggle, irritating radio transmissions, questionable team tactics. Playing up the "little team that could" angle. They have more money than God, but F1 has always been about money. That doesn't become a bad thing just because your favorite team isn't richest/fastest anymore. And it's not like Red Bull is the only company that does that ****, they're just the ones who do it best right now. I find Ferrari's policy of picking one driver and then acting like the entire second half of their team is there to blindly support him instead of trying to win on their own is a little irritating. So what? I think that cat fight over who got to be called Lotus a couple seasons ago by two teams that didn't give two shits about the Lotus name itself and just wanted to capitalize on overly-nostalgic and mindlessly-sentimental anoraks was annoying too.

 

And off track **** doesn't matter either. Yeah, Red Bull cans cost a bit more than other energy drinks. So? Ferraris cost more than other cars, but Red Bull doesn't require you to have bought five other kinds of Red Bull drinks from the 80s and 90s if you want to buy a new and improved can now. Red Bull doesn't make you jump through hoops and pass pretentious little tests to prove you have what it takes to give them money. I don't see any Williams Air Races. I don't see Force India sending a man into space. I don't see Mercedes expanding into NASCAR or Caterham sponsoring bike racers. Nothing off-track should matter, but if you want to attack companies based on their F1 relationships, Red Bull should be pretty God damn far down the list of companies to laugh at. I don't like the taste of Red Bull either, but they didn't make 80 trillion billion dollars last year because that's a popular opinion. The idea that they aren't a real racing team is laughable, but even if that was true, wouldn't that be something you'd keep as quiet as you could? It's obviously a bullshit point because if it was true no one would point it out. No one ever complains about being beaten by someone who didn't know what they were doing and didn't belong there.

 

I'm getting tired of people saying Red Bull isn't a proper racing team, because if you hate Red Bull, there are a thousand legitimate things to decry about them. I just listed six or seven of them. Almost all of the people in that team seem like massive douchebags. But calling them a fake team is just ******** nonsense. As a man who is no stranger to embarrassing himself I feel a lot better about my own stupidity when I read others trying to paint Red Bull as a phony racing team when for the last four seasons they've been demonstrably better at winning car races than any other team in a sport that is supposedly the pinnacle of motor racing. Maybe it's time for the real racing teams to step up or shut up.

Edited by Andrew Hope, 27 October 2013 - 21:16.

[Absulute]

I'm mostly indifferent towards them.

 

One thing I don't like is they should NOT be allowed to run 4 cars every weekend.  I'm not saying it has in any real way contributed to their success, but it's a massive conflict of interest and wouldn't be allowed in most other sports.  

[Raven8]

New richs for me, who will dissappear  when Mateschitz  loses interest, or stops pumping his  millions into it

[V8 Fireworks]

Personally I think the most irritating stuff about them is the theatre they come up with. Vettel has just said that this year had been a diffucult weekend for them. 

Why?  Because their car is hopelessly unreliable with rubbish KERS.

 

 

http://m.cdn.blog.hu...mage/sauber.jpg

 

It should be obvious to everyone that DM is here in F1 for the long haul.

 

Red Bull have been in F1 for nearly 20 years.  All credit to them!! 

Edited by V8 Fireworks, 27 October 2013 - 21:40.

[apoka]

New richs for me, who will dissappear  when Mateschitz  loses interest, or stops pumping his  millions into it

 

(Parts of) the team are around for quite some time already though.

[UPRC]

I respect them for doing best job in the grid.

 

But I don't really like the team. RB seems to be in only to promote the energy drink. I prefer privateers like Williams and Sauber whose main business is racing, or car manufacturers which have always been a part of motor racing.

 

If energy drinks' advertising were ever banned, I could imagine RB selling the team.

 

Pretty much how I feel, too. Also doesn't help that the only guy in the team I like is Webber. Most of the Red Bull faces (Horner, Marko, Vettel) come across as being very off putting.

[Moosed]

Don't mind Vettel, can't stand Red Bull

 

Cringeworthy company who try desperately to market themselves as cool and trendy.

 

Also sick and tired of the predictable radio messages from Rocky trying to convince the world they are right on the edge of everything falling apart, and how they like to make out every weekend was really tough... go and work for Marrussia and find out what tough really is.

Edited by Moosed, 27 October 2013 - 22:11.