196 replies to this topic

[August]

Ha that 2003 shunt was right on front of me.

That's where a guy died a couple years ago. They even had a small chicane there for productipn car races. Weird how Formula 1 handles that turn better.

 

F1 has so much downforce.

[Sheepmachine]

They might just have a mad last lap or two dash.

[Peat]

I still don't think there should be amateur GT cars in a World Championship...........

Oh, here we go....

[nosecone]

Is it true they had to change the SC because it was running out of fuel?

[Exb]

I think Webber might just have handed his teammate the win here

Or cost it - the Toyota is now right behind the Porsche

 

 

Thank goodness Mark seems OK, that looked absolutely horrific - the car just disintegrated but seems the cockpit must have been OK - thumbs up for the safety tests these cars have to be put through.

Strangely it was Marks terrible accident here in 2003 that turned me into a fan of his - watching my 1st F1 race I was shocked by the violence of that crash and was very pleased to see he was OK and driving at the next race and he was the driver I looked out for as a result (along with Fernando)

[DanardiF1]

Before the medical team got to the car I did see the left hand door pop open as if Mark was attempting to get out but perhaps he had been advised to stay put due to a g-meter emergency reading...

[Sheepmachine]

That's it game over. Congratulations to porsche!

[AllenT]

crapy end

[DanardiF1]

I said it'd be between the 8 and 14....

[Sheepmachine]

Before the medical team got to the car I did see the left hand door pop open as if Mark was attempting to get out but perhaps he had been advised to stay put due to a g-meter emergency reading...

I'm not sure I think that may have blown open in the impact.

[DanardiF1]

I'm not sure I think that may have blown open in the impact.

 

No it was way after the car had come to a halt...

[Sheepmachine]

The end of an era for Tom Kristensen.

[nosecone]

We got deprived of a exciting finish. But Webber is ok which is more important.

 

Good Bye Tom Kristensen. I will always associate him with LeMans and endurance racing.

Edited by nosecone, 30 November 2014 - 21:05.

[Richard T]

Thank you Tom, Mr. Le Mans, the end of an era.

Here's to an amazing sportscar season!

Edited by Richard T, 30 November 2014 - 21:06.

[midgrid]

The video of the crash is already on YouTube.

 

[Sheepmachine]

Great race, I really enjoyed it. Shame about the way it ended. Congratulations to porsche for winning. Congratulations to Anthony Davidson and sebastien Buemi for confirming there championship. And a great way for Tom Kristensen to end his career.

[Exb]

Glad Tom gets on the podium to finish.

[DanardiF1]

A season with all three factory P1 teams winning... Porsche came on really strong towards the end of the season, augurs well for 2015?

[Sheepmachine]

No it was way after the car had come to a halt...

Seeing the video again you are right.
Mark is awake and alert according to the FIA WEC.

[DanardiF1]

Seeing the video again you are right.
Mark is awake and alert according to the FIA WEC.

 

Great to hear... I imagine the checks are related to the g-meter spike, checking for concussion etc.

[redreni]

The video of the crash is already on YouTube.

 

 

Wow. That 919 was a right old mess.

 

Judging from this video and what the Radio Le Mans guys were saying, the cameras didn't pick up the beginning of this incident. So unless anybody's seen the onboards, it seems odd that anybody would want to imply that it must be the amateur driver's fault. Looked to me from the tragectories of the two cars as they came into view, that Webber had tried to squeeze through on the inside, but you have to be sure that the GT car is not already commited to his apex when you decide to do that. I'm certainly not willing to apportion blame until and unless we see the moments leading up to the initial contact.

Edited by redreni, 30 November 2014 - 21:20.

[Nonesuch]

Great podium, as wished for by the commentators right at the start. Porsche wins for the first time, Toyota takes the team-trophy in style, and Tom Kristensen gets a nice end to his fantastic career.

 

It would have been exciting to see how the #8 vs. #14 battle would have played out, but there you go.

[Risil]

Shame about the ending but that was a magnificent race. Fine driving from many of the competitors.

[Ben1445]

Until that crash it was a stunningly good race. Congrats to Toyota for finally confirming their championship! Congrats to Porsche on their first win...although I'm sure thats not the way they would have wanted it. I think the 8 had a real chance of catching them before then. But hey ho, a win is a win...

[Disgrace]

Here's a .gif of the impact. Amongst the worst kind of crash there is. Didn't he have some trouble with lapped runners at that spot earlier in the race?

[RosannaG]

Thanks Mr. Kristensen. An awesome driver and a true gentleman! 

[Afterburner]

So, in the last three years, we've had McNish, Rockenfeller, Davidson and now Webber suffer huge accidents as a result of colliding with GT Ferraris.  Quite a coincidence.

Don't forget Memo Gidley:

 

 

Maybe it's because they keep hiring drivers like this to run in the Pro classes:

 

[TimRTC]

Great RLM commentary as usual - keeping calm and not making a drama.

 

@afterburner - there were plenty of poor drives from the prototype classes as well this year in USC:

 

[OSX]

FIA WEC 6 Hours of Sao Paulo - Race Highlights

 

http://www.dailymoti...with-music_auto

 

[OSX]

A couple of shots of Webber's totaled car...

 

 

 

[Exb]

That car is a mess but the cock pit area looks pretty intact thank goodness. Still a horrific accident, I wish there had been a statement released confiming he has been checked and released, its almost 4 hours now with no news - I know they said he was conscious but that doesn't necessarily mean he hasn't suffered an injury. I'm just worrying now

Edit: Just as I post that an update - he has been taken to the local hospital for further checks and can have visitors.

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/116992

Edited by Exb, 01 December 2014 - 00:30.

[Afterburner]

Great RLM commentary as usual - keeping calm and not making a drama.

 

@afterburner - there were plenty of poor drives from the prototype classes as well this year in USC:

 

I watched that one happen, actually. Worked at 16a that weekend and was around the station (but not on shift) at the time. Was kind of a one-off in my opinion as I've watched Kearby race in SCCA for a while now and that's not exactly characteristic of him. PC was (and still is, as far as I know) pro-am in TUSC, with Kearby as the car's gentleman driver.

 

Still doesn't change the trend of Ferrari GT drivers causing unusual accidents, especially as it still seems to happen in the pro classes anyhow.

Edited by Afterburner, 01 December 2014 - 00:34.

[Exb]

Wow. That 919 was a right old mess.
 
Judging from this video and what the Radio Le Mans guys were saying, the cameras didn't pick up the beginning of this incident. So unless anybody's seen the onboards, it seems odd that anybody would want to imply that it must be the amateur driver's fault. Looked to me from the tragectories of the two cars as they came into view, that Webber had tried to squeeze through on the inside, but you have to be sure that the GT car is not already commited to his apex when you decide to do that. I'm certainly not willing to apportion blame until and unless we see the moments leading up to the initial contact.

Yep - the Ferrari could have just been in the wrong place at the wrong time - according to Cressoni he was hit by the Porsche only after Mark had already lost control (see the link in my last post to the autosport story)
 
Edit: ‏@matteocressoni Thanks all guys! I will stay in the hospital tonight but everything seems ok. Now I think at @AussieGrit !!

Edited by Exb, 01 December 2014 - 01:02.

[TF110]

Just finished watching the replay of the end. A great race, probably the best 'racing' all year. But theres a couple of gripes I had with the race-

1. The commentary. I appreciate rlm having the historic 'voice', but at times Hindy makes me cringe with his comments. Not just the repetitive "35% less fuel, lap record" but the way he gets names wrong that he's been announcing all year; "Sebastian Sarrazin", really? The biggest problem I have is you can tell when he's stuffing his face! Talking with his mouth half full trying to mask the fact he's eating. Its a turn off.

2. The race directing. The officiating is ok, but theres times I dont understand the need for a full course yellow with just a slow or stranded car. A local yellow or even a slow zone is more appropriate. The last incident with Webber was confusing as well. It shouldnt take 35 minutes to move two cars, clean some oil and debris and get the race going. They seemed content to have the final race of the season finish behind a safety car. Its as if they wanted the Porsche win/Kristensen podium storybook ending.

3. The broadcast. Im not going to say it should be free, or they dont have a right to charge. But, since they do charge, they really need to get on top of their game. The cutting out of audio/video, lack of timing for the broadcasters, the stream dying etc. That doesnt make me feel like spending money on these races.

Aside from that, it was an awesome race. Congrats Toyota on the first FIA sanctioned world championship in 15 years (wrc being the last)!

[Ev0d3vil]

Did Mark crash at the same corner in 2003 as well?

 

Thank goodness he's okay.

Edited by Ev0d3vil, 01 December 2014 - 02:36.

[midgrid]

His F1 accident was just a little further back, I think (or there aren't tyres there any more).

 

[Ricciardo2014]

Just finished watching the replay of the end. A great race, probably the best 'racing' all year. But theres a couple of gripes I had with the race-

2. The race directing. The officiating is ok, but theres times I dont understand the need for a full course yellow with just a slow or stranded car. A local yellow or even a slow zone is more appropriate. The last incident with Webber was confusing as well. It shouldnt take 35 minutes to move two cars, clean some oil and debris and get the race going. They seemed content to have the final race of the season finish behind a safety car. Its as if they wanted the Porsche win/Kristensen podium storybook ending.

Webber was trapped inside a car that had just been through something close to a plane crash, and was on fire for over a minute before the marshals arrived.

And you feel they took too long to get him out and clean up the mess ? ? ?

I'm astounded to be honest.

Thank god you're not in charge !

[Nonesuch]

So, in the last three years, we've had McNish, Rockenfeller, Davidson and now Webber suffer huge accidents as a result of colliding with GT Ferraris.  Quite a coincidence.

 

Perhaps not if you phrase it like that, but it's probably best to take a few other factors into account. First, that it's not uncommon for an LMP1 crash to be a 'huge accident'. These cars are not much slower than F1 cars. Second, there are plenty of LMP1 accidents that happened without any GT Ferrari's being involved. It didn't take a Ferrari GT for Loïc Duval to reduce his Audi to bits at Le Mans this year, or for Marc Gené to write off his Peugeot three years earlier. Third, if an LMP1 driver is going to become involved in a collision with a GT car, there's a good chance it'll be a Ferrari; simply because there are a lot of Ferrari's in the GT category.

 

Almost all the headlines today are about Webber and his crash. Somewhere in the second paragraph people will bother mentioning that Matteo Cressoni was also involved. That focus on the top-category is understandable, but Cressoni's race was just as ruined as Webber's.

Edited by Nonesuch, 01 December 2014 - 09:57.

[SophieB]

Toyota Motor Corp. ‏@ToyotaMotorCorp  14h14 hours agoTokyo-to, Japan

Congratulations to @FIAWEC World Champions @Toyota_Hybrid from everyone at #Toyota!!! #FIAWEC #6hSaoPaulo

 

[redreni]

Webber was trapped inside a car that had just been through something close to a plane crash, and was on fire for over a minute before the marshals arrived.

And you feel they took too long to get him out and clean up the mess ? ? ?

I'm astounded to be honest.

Thank god you're not in charge !

 

Nevertheless, once the driver had been taken from the scene, all that was required was to clear the debris, take away the cars, put some cement dust down and sweep up. Some of those tasks could be undertaken concurrently. If it wasn't possible to do it in the time available, fine, that's just unfortunate, but I don't really get the implication that the seriousness of the incident for the driver justifies not attempting to clear the track asap and apparently preferring that the race should finish under the SC.

[FerrariV12]

Fantastic race, obviously not a great ending but pleased that Webber and Cressoni both appear to be OK.

 

The racing this year has reminded me a lot of the F1 I first got hooked on in many ways, gaps opening and closing up as the race ebbs and flows, pit stops and accompanying strategy made out of necessity rather than because of deliberately under-engineered tyres, the gaps actually tending to mean something rather than the usual "stay out of DRS range then don't push too hard in case of the safety car".

 

Can't say I share the Hindy hate either, I know commentators are a very personal preference but I'd go so far as to say he's my second favourite I've listened to in my time watching the sport, behind you know who. Maybe the odd gaffe but for me he has the combination of enthusiasm and knowledge that make a good commentator. I'll always take commentators enthusiastic about the sport as it is (both on and off track) over them bitching and moaning about the "show" as happened with a few in Sochi (and Will Buxton for the last two GP3 seasons)

[TF110]

I dont have any 'Hindy hate'. But to me people like to excuse him because its a familiar voice, he's enthusiastic and he's experienced. That doesnt mean he's always good at what he does. Things like munching down while youre on air is disgusting imo. Take the mic off if youre chewing your food, Graham Goodwin was there to cover. He was also correcting him every other sentence. Getting cars mixed up, drivers names mixed up, positions mixed up etc. That might not all be his fault, which goes to show that they need better systems in place so the 'official' commentating knows what is going on. The racing is awesome most of the time. They have room to improve on other areas, but that dont take nothing away from the series! Bring on 2015!

[redreni]

I dont have any 'Hindy hate'. But to me people like to excuse him because its a familiar voice, he's enthusiastic and he's experienced. That doesnt mean he's always good at what he does. Things like munching down while youre on air is disgusting imo. Take the mic off if youre chewing your food, Graham Goodwin was there to cover. He was also correcting him every other sentence. Getting cars mixed up, drivers names mixed up, positions mixed up etc. That might not all be his fault, which goes to show that they need better systems in place so the 'official' commentating knows what is going on. The racing is awesome most of the time. They have room to improve on other areas, but that dont take nothing away from the series! Bring on 2015!

 

I agree with FerrariV12 about Hindy. A lot of the stuff he does with Motors and RSL can be a bi rough around the edges, and I can see why some might think its not as polished and professional as it should be, but let's not forget what happened when the BBC brought in one of its most polished, professional staffers to do the F1 gig. Legard might have mugged up on the basics, but his knowledge of the sport was paper thin as was his interest, and his enthusiasm was non-existant. Hindy, on the other hand, may be rough around the edges and might sometimes get complacent about memorising the entry list and the spotters' guide, but he has a very deep and nuanced understanding of the sport and a huge passion for it which, for me, makes him my preferred commentator for a sports car race. He may be talking with his mouth full, but at least he talks out of his mouth rather than another orifice.

Edited by redreni, 01 December 2014 - 22:13.

[FerrariV12]

Regarding the timing and scoring - one gripe I do have and have noticed a few times this year, when the leader passes a certain beam, in the time between that and a car on the same lap passing said beam, the gap is shown as "+1 LAP" even when they are on the same lap, and as I say the nature of this racing the difference between say a 20 and 40 second gap is significant (a good thing), but maybe if they programmed it to show the gap at the last lap/sector until they both pass the next one, that'd be an improvement. But yeah, I probably agree with all here when I say it's been a great season and bring on 2015!

 

EDIT: The above applies to the T&S shown on the TV feed, haven't tried the app or anything yet so don't know if that's different, although I'd have assumed they'd both be feeding off the same data.

Edited by FerrariV12, 01 December 2014 - 22:37.

[Wingcommander]

Regarding the timing and scoring - one gripe I do have and have noticed a few times this year, when the leader passes a certain beam, in the time between that and a car on the same lap passing said beam, the gap is shown as "+1 LAP" even when they are on the same lap, and as I say the nature of this racing the difference between say a 20 and 40 second gap is significant (a good thing), but maybe if they programmed it to show the gap at the last lap/sector until they both pass the next one, that'd be an improvement. But yeah, I probably agree with all here when I say it's been a great season and bring on 2015!

 

EDIT: The above applies to the T&S shown on the TV feed, haven't tried the app or anything yet so don't know if that's different, although I'd have assumed they'd both be feeding off the same data.

 

The live timing isn't very good and it's the same in the app aswell. Every time the leader completes a lap it just throws that +1 LAP in there so you can't just take a quick look to see what is going on. You have to wait until every car on the same lap has completed that lap. It's also sometimes quite difficult to tell if a car has been lapped. Maybe it's just me, but having got used to the F1 style timing the WEC version just seem ancient.

[August]

His F1 accident was just a little further back, I think (or there aren't tyres there any more).

 

Tyres replaced with a SAFER barrier.

[turssi]

Here are my pics from Interlagos two weeks back, enjoy!