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McLaren Honda MP4-31


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#101 Owen

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 14:42

Nice assessment by Mika;

 

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/122273



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#102 UraNage

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 14:46

Personally I think a genuinely realistic expectation for McLaren is to give a good competition to the likes of Force India and Toro Rosso in midpack and finish in top 6 in constructors championship. But when have fans been modest with their wishes? :D

thats not realistic , did you predict the same for ferrari before 2015 season ?

its not like honda is a midget company no one ever heard about it out side tochigi province 

any thing less than trying to overtake ferrari regularly and i'll be hugely disappointed starting after the third race.



#103 Marklar

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 14:52

Ferrari was 4th last year, just edged out by Williams in the last race for the 3rd place. I think predicting based on last year a 2nd place for Ferrari is pretty equal to predicting based on this year something around a 5th place for McLaren.

Personally I think lower than P6 would be disappointing. Being 3rd next year should be one target.

Edited by Marklar, 17 December 2015 - 14:56.


#104 Christophe77

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 14:55

When is winter testing starting again?  

 

Boy I sure hopes it goes well, cause if it doesn't I wouldn't be surprised to see Fred running for the hills....(and hiding for a year).



#105 Marklar

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 14:57

22nd february. Long time to go...

#106 sopa

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 15:03

thats not realistic , did you predict the same for ferrari before 2015 season ?

its not like honda is a midget company no one ever heard about it out side tochigi province 

any thing less than trying to overtake ferrari regularly and i'll be hugely disappointed starting after the third race.

 

No, I thought Ferrari would compete for at least 3rd or 4th in WCC.

 

The reason is that Ferrari's starting platform was far better. Their 2014 was far better than McLaren's 2015. Alonso scored 161 pts in 2014 in the Ferrari, as opposed to 11 in McLaren now. Quite a huge difference, isn't it?



#107 mirrorboy

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 15:29

The case for dramatic improvement;

http://www.thef1sour...-mclaren-honda/

 

I know it's just opinion, but I find it surprising that this article isn't having any attention...



#108 Christophe77

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 16:30

Anyone think they'll change the livery? (sorry, just couldn't resist  :p



#109 muramasa

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 16:45

Anyone think they'll change the livery? (sorry, just couldn't resist  :p

I want them to change that red thing on monocoque, that looks too much tsukinowaguma (meaning "crescent necked" sort of) bear to me.... :well:

 

DSCN5556.jpg

 


Edited by muramasa, 17 December 2015 - 16:45.


#110 purpleturtle

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 17:22

Anyone catch Ron's f1.com interview? Gold:

" I’ve already said that Spa and Monza stand out in my memory as particularly joyless weekends, and that’s because the flat-out nature of those old-school racetracks tested acutely the upper echelons of our power unit’s performance envelope."



#111 BillBald

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 17:30

Yeah, total idiots for giving their fair opinion on that.

 

Idiots for not being able to see past the weak PU.

 

By Abu Dhabi, it was very clear that the McLaren had lots of downforce. This year's car will have Prod involved from the start, so it should be even better.



#112 Marklar

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 17:37

Idiots for not being able to see past the weak PU.
 

By Abu Dhabi, it was very clear that the McLaren had lots of downforce. This year's car will have Prod involved from the start, so it should be even better.

 

Well, first of all they are talking about the season 2015, not about 2016. Secondly they are trying to judge the chassis independend from the PU (which nobody can accurate) and in my opinion it is not unlikely that this years McLaren chassis was weaker than Mercedes, Ferrari, Red Bull and Toro Rosso. So yes, you can claim that they didnt even had a Top 4 chassis without being a idiot. Of course you can also claim that they - besides Red Bull and Mercedes - had the best chassis, this would be as accurate as the former.



#113 BillBald

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 18:07

Well, first of all they are talking about the season 2015, not about 2016. Secondly they are trying to judge the chassis independend from the PU (which nobody can accurate) and in my opinion it is not unlikely that this years McLaren chassis was weaker than Mercedes, Ferrari, Red Bull and Toro Rosso. So yes, you can claim that they didnt even had a Top 4 chassis without being a idiot. Of course you can also claim that they - besides Red Bull and Mercedes - had the best chassis, this would be as accurate as the former.

 

There is no way that the Toro Rosso had a better chassis by the end of the season, unless you think that Max V is a very overrated driver. Look at how difficult it was for Max to get past Jenson at Abu Dhabi. He overtakes on the straight, loses the advantage by braking earlier, and only gets it back again by running off-track.



#114 muramasa

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 19:20

is that Ron interview really raw transcript of face to face improvised interview, not text format exchange? :eek:  I mean he said all these things about what happened to royal family in 1992, remember other teams history in detail (i dont really remember what year Stewart GP started and when bought by Ford then RedBull), whatever Covey's quote, total number of grid penalty this year (310? is it? I dont think many people incl journos know and can tell instantly)....and "JB and FA started 537 Grands Prix and have won 47 of them"? Catch Horner, Toto or Arrivabene in the paddock or airport or wherever to ask them how many GP their own drivers started and won how many, and I highly doubt they can answer that question :lol:



#115 Mc_Silver

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 19:50

is that Ron interview really raw transcript of face to face improvised interview, not text format exchange? :eek:  I mean he said all these things about what happened to royal family in 1992, remember other teams history in detail (i dont really remember what year Stewart GP started and when bought by Ford then RedBull), whatever Covey's quote, total number of grid penalty this year (310? is it? I dont think many people incl journos know and can tell instantly)....and "JB and FA started 537 Grands Prix and have won 47 of them"? Catch Horner, Toto or Arrivabene in the paddock or airport or wherever to ask them how many GP their own drivers started and won how many, and I highly doubt they can answer that question :lol:

 

This is what we call Ronspeak. He's legend of F1 for sure. 



#116 shonguiz

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 20:14

here full intervieuw of Ron Dennis like they promised

 

https://www.formula1...horribilis.html

Surprsingly, every time F1.com interviews him, they really put the gloves off and go on with it, something they don't do with the rest. I thought it was the Mosely team who didn't like him, BE team appears to be in the same boat too. Oh and i love how he completely dodged the Magnussen question while at the same trying to make it appear as an honest answer.


Edited by shonguiz, 17 December 2015 - 20:15.


#117 UraNage

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 01:42

No, I thought Ferrari would compete for at least 3rd or 4th in WCC.

 

The reason is that Ferrari's starting platform was far better. Their 2014 was far better than McLaren's 2015. Alonso scored 161 pts in 2014 in the Ferrari, as opposed to 11 in McLaren now. Quite a huge difference, isn't it?

stats is not every thing and never showed a complete image , honda was a newcomer with her own design surely can do mistakes it did,

regulations didn't help , however they managed with their flawed PU to pull the third fastest lap in abu dhabi gp with  successfully a full deployment lap , that should give you a hint about the potentials after fixing the PU no? you just can't underestimate a mclaren honda :up:  



#118 MikeMM

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 06:58

stats is not every thing and never showed a complete image , honda was a newcomer with her own design surely can do mistakes it did,

regulations didn't help , however they managed with their flawed PU to pull the third fastest lap in abu dhabi gp with  successfully a full deployment lap , that should give you a hint about the potentials after fixing the PU no? you just can't underestimate a mclaren honda :up:  

 

On what place that driver finished?



#119 Marklar

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 07:02

stats is not every thing and never showed a complete image , honda was a newcomer with her own design surely can do mistakes it did,

regulations didn't help , however they managed with their flawed PU to pull the third fastest lap in abu dhabi gp with  successfully a full deployment lap , that should give you a hint about the potentials after fixing the PU no? you just can't underestimate a mclaren honda :up:  

Wait. That is based on a lap with much fresher tyres and being just one of a few drivers out on super soft? And as it sounded it was also a qualifying lap on porpuse. You know that in the past midfield/back teams managed in this way to even set the fastest lap time?

 

Edit: I'm not saying btw that they didnt improve towards the end. They did. Both on the chassis (the car looked more stable in the corners) and on the engine (they managed to stay more often ahead of faster cars), but to see a third fastest lap time in the last couple of laps with much better tyres, doing that on porpuse, as an indicator that they will be so good next year that everything less than being ahead of Ferrari would be disappointing is BS.


Edited by Marklar, 18 December 2015 - 07:53.


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#120 KnucklesAgain

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 08:02

Nice one by Ron in the F1 interview:

I’m not perfect, and sometimes I’m guilty of answering a question a little more irritatedly than ideally I should do.

 



#121 Marklar

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 08:14

Nice one by Ron in the F1 interview:
 

 

I’m not perfect, and sometimes I’m guilty of answering a question a little more irritatedly than ideally I should do.

Understatement :smoking:



#122 Quickshifter

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 08:34

That was a fantastic interview by Ron.



#123 UraNage

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 08:34

MikeMM Marklar

 

it was a flawed layout i'm the one who realy surprised they managed to fade from sauber sight despite never change the layout till end of the season.

beside you said it was qualifying lap on porpuse, but do you remember what JB actual  qualy lap time 1:42:570 !!  i ain't BSer



#124 mclarensmps

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 17:15

There's so much hate for Ron on these boards. I'm going to throw my hat in the "I love Ron" camp. He's a legend in my eyes. He IS McLaren, for me. 



#125 LuckyStrike1

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 17:38

There's so much hate for Ron on these boards. I'm going to throw my hat in the "I love Ron" camp. He's a legend in my eyes. He IS McLaren, for me. 

 

 

Does such a camp actually exist?? 



#126 Maustinsj

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 17:42

MikeMM Marklar

 

it was a flawed layout i'm the one who realy surprised they managed to fade from sauber sight despite never change the layout till end of the season.

beside you said it was qualifying lap on porpuse, but do you remember what JB actual  qualy lap time 1:42:570 !!  i ain't BSer

 

 

Well, that explains the lack of progress:

 

DSC_7459.JPG



#127 Marklar

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 17:46

There's so much hate for Ron on these boards. I'm going to throw my hat in the "I love Ron" camp. He's a legend in my eyes. He IS McLaren, for me.

He is loved for his unique way...

#128 mclarensmps

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 21:09

Does such a camp actually exist?? 

 

It's crazy, I know, but yes!

http://forum.sky.it/...t112490-20.html

 

:lol:

 

It's even more ironic that it's Italian!!  :clap:


Edited by mclarensmps, 18 December 2015 - 21:10.


#129 Marklar

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 21:12

It's crazy, I know, but yes!

http://forum.sky.it/...t112490-20.html

 

:lol:

 

It's even more ironic that it's Italian!!  :clap:

Last post 22.03.2009.....



#130 mclarensmps

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 23:14

Last post 22.03.2009.....

 

I can sense your disapproval from miles away.



#131 BillBald

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 23:15

He is loved for his unique way...

 

Would I want him as my boss? Maybe not,

 

Do I recognise his achievements? I certainly do, and I greatly admire those achievements.

 

Did he give me this great idea of asking myself questions? Yes he did, and when I have finally mastered Ronspeak...


Edited by BillBald, 18 December 2015 - 23:15.


#132 mclarensmps

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 23:17

I want them to change that red thing on monocoque, that looks too much tsukinowaguma (meaning "crescent necked" sort of) bear to me.... :well:

 

Spoiler

 

I just realised how similar the first picture is to the Iraqi Minister of Information picture that was doing the rounds on the internet. It's quite fitting, really!



#133 Exb

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Posted 18 December 2015 - 23:50

I give up trying to embed gifs on here  :(  :(  (one day I will learn how to work the internet)
 
link instead: https://twitter.com/...902674940022784
 
 


Edited by Exb, 18 December 2015 - 23:53.


#134 UraNage

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 02:12

Well, that explains the lack of progress:

 

DSC_7459.JPG

:stoned:

N6zuqoz.jpg



#135 UraNage

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 02:18

I give up trying to embed gifs on here  :(  :(  (one day I will learn how to work the internet)
 
link instead: https://twitter.com/...902674940022784
 
 

its not gif its mp4 however i too can't manage to post pic from the fast reply i have to go more replay option though nothing extra i do 



#136 Marklar

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 07:13

:stoned:
N6zuqoz.jpg

image.jpg Doesnt excuse to type a typo up :p

Edited by Marklar, 19 December 2015 - 08:15.


#137 Lemans

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 07:24

No launch date yet? I'm getting impatient.



#138 CPR

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 10:23

Q&A with Arai:

http://en.f1i.com/ma...ns-on-2015.html

 

Key points: "more sophisticated size zero" engine for 2016, main ERS issue was pinpointed in August.

 

There's a fair bit of discussion about expectations too.



#139 chhatra

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 10:56

Q&A with Arai:
http://en.f1i.com/ma...ns-on-2015.html

Key points: "more sophisticated size zero" engine for 2016, main ERS issue was pinpointed in August.

There's a fair bit of discussion about expectations too.


I don't know whether to be excited or worried by the continued push for size zero design.

About two months till we see this beauty on track.

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#140 Dalton007

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 13:31

They WILL be quick next season.  :up:  My expectations are they will be regular top 10 qualifiers and perhaps an odd podium.  :cat: Once they get that extra downforce coupled with remedying the ERS, I don't see why big leaps can't be made, just not race winners, I can't see anyone but Ferrari toppling the mighty merc.



#141 Lemans

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 19:45

CV8f7kLU4AEpau4.jpg



#142 Marklar

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 20:06

They WILL be quick next season.  :up:  My expectations are they will be regular top 10 qualifiers and perhaps an odd podium.  :cat: Once they get that extra downforce coupled with remedying the ERS, I don't see why big leaps can't be made, just not race winners, I can't see anyone but Ferrari toppling the mighty merc.

Pretty much my expectations too.



#143 shonguiz

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 20:41

Q&A with Arai:

http://en.f1i.com/ma...ns-on-2015.html

 

Key points: "more sophisticated size zero" engine for 2016, main ERS issue was pinpointed in August.

 

There's a fair bit of discussion about expectations too.

 

They were really clueless about the direction to take with their first developments.

 

Also in the middle of the season in August we found out what our weak point was in a more concrete way. Even though we understood that our package’s weakness came from the MGU-H and ERS deployment, it had been a struggle to pinpoint the cause. Fortunately, in August everything became clear and we were free to start fully rectifying the situation.


Edited by shonguiz, 19 December 2015 - 21:14.


#144 Quickshifter

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Posted 20 December 2015 - 04:52

The interesting bits from his interview to f1i.com are

 

“It had a huge impact because with the discovery we realised that in the races and testing we need more energy to actually use the deployment. But in the meantime we feel we cannot change the turbo and the MGU-H in the actual season because it is a layout issue, so it is very difficult to change everything. So we realised it but could not change it.”

 

 

It’s very good communication and they understood everything, so we keep the philosophy and concept of the size zero package and we improve on it next year to have a more sophisticated size zero.”

Even smaller?

 

 

Now Arai talks about continuing the size zero philosophy yet says the deployment issues warrant a layout change.

 

So i am massively curious as to how they are going to change the layout yet keep the size zero philosophy.


Edited by Quickshifter, 20 December 2015 - 04:53.


#145 Fatgadget

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Posted 20 December 2015 - 09:25

^^Well,size zero is pretty much whatever you want it to be! :p

#146 mp4x

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Posted 20 December 2015 - 12:34

The interesting bits from his interview to f1i.com are

 

 

 

Now Arai talks about continuing the size zero philosophy yet says the deployment issues warrant a layout change.

 

So i am massively curious as to how they are going to change the layout yet keep the size zero philosophy.

 

 
In order to shrink the bodywork even further and go beyond size-zero concept maybe they want to change the intercooler layout, the new layout can be similar to Mercedes's and they can switch to air-water-air intercooler. 


#147 DrFurby

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Posted 20 December 2015 - 15:07

The interesting bits from his interview to f1i.com are

 

 

 

Now Arai talks about continuing the size zero philosophy yet says the deployment issues warrant a layout change.

 

So i am massively curious as to how they are going to change the layout yet keep the size zero philosophy.

 

 

You just change the PU to size one or size 0,5 and keep calling it size zero. McFans happy because of the cool "size zero" factor :rotfl:  :rotfl:  :rotfl: .

It's the same strategy that  Steve Jobs,  for example, used. Rest in peace.


Edited by DrFurby, 20 December 2015 - 15:07.


#148 Muzzyf1

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Posted 21 December 2015 - 08:54


Its almost a given that they go the water to air cooler it makes much more sense to do so


In order to shrink the bodywork even further and go beyond size-zero concept maybe they want to change the intercooler layout, the new layout can be similar to Mercedes's and they can switch to air-water-air intercooler.



#149 Revvolutions

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Posted 21 December 2015 - 15:00

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#150 mclarensmps

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Posted 21 December 2015 - 15:22

I wasn't the only one!!!!  :clap: