3999 replies to this topic

[Marklar]

Into their 2nd year as team mates can Kimi challenge Vettel after his clear defeat last year? Or will Vettel dominate again?

We will get the answers for this question this year. Looking forward to a great year and an hopefully great battle

[jonpollak]

Go Seb..

He's da man I'z pulling fo this year.

 

Jp

[Radion]

I'm telling people Rai will retire as a two times wdc. Mark my words fam. 

[Kelateboy]

IMO, Sebastian would still have the advantage over Kimi in qualifying and race but the margin would be much closer.

 

I am much more interested to see whether Ferrari could be close to Mercedes in Q3 tomorrow.

[RacingXO]

I think Vettel will come out on top, but I really like Kimi and hope he comes out on top.....

[as65p]

I expect roughly the same as last year.

[Zava]

I expect Kimi to be closer, but still behind, he'll score at least about 80% of Vettel's points. 

[Raikkonen94]

Still expect the same end result as last year, albeit with a smaller margin. 

[hello86]

I think that Seb will be the better one but hope Kimi is getting close and avoids mistakes.

[VolvoT5]

I think Kimi wants to stay in F1 in 2017 onwards and he knows he has to impress this year.  If Ferrari don't keep him he could be competing for a seat with Button and Massa at Renault,  Haas or Williams.  Therefore I expect Kimi to cut out the silly errors of last year and re-establish himself as a 'safe pair of hands'.  In particular I'm thinking of the two crashes with Bottas, the incident with Alonso and the spin at Silverstone.... 4 errors which cost him a lot of points in relation to Vettel last year. 

 

The good news is the gossip around is that Kimi really likes this car, so he has a good a chance as ever.     Seb will still come out on top at the end of the year,  but I believe (or optimistically hope...) Kimi will win a race or two this year and will push Seb harder.

 

If they are more closely matched I do hope they are allowed to race wheel to wheel on an equal status basis.  Seb has earned the right to call himself no.1 driver but that doesn't mean Ferrari should revert to the Schumacher or Alonso era where the other driver is instructed to move over or given inferior strategy on the occasions where they are genuinely faster than the no.1 guy. 

Edited by VolvoT5, 18 March 2016 - 13:40.

[CrashPad]

What I hope for is Kimi to get back on the level of performance he had in 2012-2013, and thus challenge and maybe even trump Seb.

What I expect however is Vettel to still outscore him, though I think the margin will be a lot smaller this time around.

[Ultrasoft]

Last year the car was not suitable for Kimi. In fact, it was so far away as can be.

 

This year, Kimi will defeat Sebastian. 

[CrashPad]

Last year the car was not suitable for Kimi. In fact, it was so far away as can be.

 

I think that honor goes to F14T. Last years car was a lot better, and even as a fan of Raikkonen I wouldn't really say that the cars characteristics were a real problem last year.

But then again what do I (or anyone else outside the Ferrari pitbox) know 

[Lone]

My heart says Kimi will beat Seb this year but my head says the opposite. So, Kimi it is then  !

[ConsiderAndGo]

Same result as last year, albeit by a smaller margin. 

 

Kimi to retire at the end of the season.

Edited by ConsiderAndGo, 18 March 2016 - 14:35.

[Timantti]

If life has taught me anything, it's not to get hyped about Kimi before the season starts. I hope for the best, fear for the worst. The latter being the much more likely scenario.

Edited by Timantti, 18 March 2016 - 14:35.

[Ijsman]

If life has taught me anything, it's not to get hyped about Kimi before the season starts. I hope for the best, fear for the worst. The latter being the much more likely scenario.

Your pic really suits what you said lol

[Zilbert]

With these new tyre rules in place, if Ferrari often opts to split strategies in order to upset the Mercs, this thread will consist mostly of long, painful debates about which driver was disadvantaged, irregardless of which one will finish in front. In quali however, i don't see Kimi challenging Seb regularly (hope I'm wrong though). 

[Jovanotti]

Within 3/4 of Seb's points at the end of the year is all I expect. Everything else is a bonus.

[cokata]

Hopefully Kimi does a lot better this year, because his performance last year was nowhere near good enough.

[Ultrasoft]

I think that honor goes to F14T. Last years car was a lot better, and even as a fan of Raikkonen I wouldn't really say that the cars characteristics were a real problem last year.

But then again what do I (or anyone else outside the Ferrari pitbox) know 

Last year, the pull-rod was really challenging for Kimi. SF16-H is specially made to fit Kimi's driving style (because of the push-rod). But also tire rule will help Kimi.

 

At least I hope so

Edited by Ultrasoft, 18 March 2016 - 14:51.

[shonguiz]

I think kimi will really be closer and i hope much more consistent.

[DrF]

Hopefully the extra compound and new suspension layout will help wipe the last two seasons from Kimi's legacy.

[cokata]

He doesn't need to beat Vettel to have a good season, if he can do what Rosberg does (beat almost always all cars that are slower than the Ferrari) he would have done a perfect job

[VolvoT5]

Hopefully the extra compound and new suspension layout will help wipe the last two seasons from Kimi's legacy.

Well we can only hope.   If Massa, Button and Alonso can still perform to a high standard there is no reason why Kimi shouldn't be able to.  The last 2 seasons were dire (although 2015 not as bad as 2014). It would be nice if Kimi puts that right this year because people have forgotten what an incredible talent he was back in the day.... and even what a solid job he did at Lotus for 2 years.

 

I have a feeling Kimi will win a race this year and feature on the podium a few times. (I may have to eat those words in 7 or 8 months time).   I would love for Kimi to win a second WDC, but I think that is unlikely as unless Seb has a season full of bad luck he is simply a bit faster than Kimi in qualifying.   However Kimi will play a large role in Seb's challenge if he can regularly get involved at the front.  Mercedes already have inter team issues to deal with, if they have to keep an eye on both Ferraris instead of one their strategy becomes even more complicated for them. 

 

Kimi is smart enough to realise what his role is and is old enough to be comfortable with that role for as long as he is treated equally with respect. On the flip side Vettel does respect Kimi but is also happy because he feels his best is just a bit better than Kimi's best.  That is why I feel if Kimi can regain his consistency he really is the ideal driver for Ferrari, even going into 2017..... and that is also why Seb vs Kimi will be fun this year.  Watching how the relationship unfolds if Kimi is able to beat Seb now and then will be interesting. 

Edited by VolvoT5, 18 March 2016 - 15:45.

[MasterOfCoin]

Last year the car was not suitable for Kimi. In fact, it was so far away as can be.

 

This year, Kimi will defeat Sebastian. 

Saying this actually does a disservice to Kimi, if the same was said about Lewis, Seb or Alonso after having a bad year, people would laugh them out of the thread.

[Zilbert]

He doesn't need to beat Vettel to have a good season, if he can do what Rosberg does (beat almost always all cars that are slower than the Ferrari) he would have done a perfect job

Perfect from whose perspective exactly? Kimi wont be happy finishing behind Seb all the time and he shouldn't be. One can read a lot of comments nowadays how he is content to play second fiddle, i don't think that's true. There is a difference between taking defeat in a good manner which is a trait of a great sportsmen and taking it for granted. I for one hope we never witness another driver taking on a submissive role like the one poor Felipe was forced into couple of years back. It was painful to watch. Anyways, sorry for the rant, it was probably just poor phrasing on your side   

[ch103]

No matter what Ferrari say, they will always have a #1 driver and a #2 driver.  Kimi is the #2, unfortunately.  In the event he comes close to Seb, they will adjust the strategy so that Seb comes out on top. 

 

Pulling for a Kimi win or two this season, so that he can retire with his head held high.

[Vesuvius]

I believe Kimi will be closer to Seb then last year, should be easy as long as he won't make as much mistakes and have so many car problems. A way back to win a race would be nice to see.I believe Kimi wants to continue 2017.

Both Kimi and Seb have lost weight for this season. Kimi has trained harder than ever during the winter and has lost 2,5kg according to Turun Sanomat.

Kimi has also been more positive about the car, more then any other cars ever before...will this be seen on result? Will have to wait and see.

[Claudiu]

No matter what Ferrari say, they will always have a #1 driver and a #2 driver.  Kimi is the #2, unfortunately.  In the event he comes close to Seb, they will adjust the strategy so that Seb comes out on top. 

 

Pulling for a Kimi win or two this season, so that he can retire with his head held high.

 

I really don't think this is the case, Ferrari needs a strong Kimi and he will turn out faster then Seb he will finish in front. The nr. 1 in Ferrari is earned on the track , not given.

Edited by Claudiu, 18 March 2016 - 16:46.

[beqa16v]

Seb should be ahead again but by a smaller margin. Kimi should concentrate on his races and dont get nervous about Seb. Only way I can see Kimi doing better is if he manages to benefit from his tire choices (makes softer tire strategies work thanks to his smooth driving). Another reason (although much less likely) could be a return to a pushrod suspension, implying that the pullrod was hampering his performance way too much.

[cokata]

Perfect from whose perspective exactly? Kimi wont be happy finishing behind Seb all the time and he shouldn't be. One can read a lot of comments nowadays how he is content to play second fiddle, i don't think that's true. There is a difference between taking defeat in a good manner which is a trait of a great sportsmen and taking it for granted. I for one hope we never witness another driver taking on a submissive role like the one poor Felipe was forced into couple of years back. It was painful to watch. Anyways, sorry for the rant, it was probably just poor phrasing on your side 

Honestly i was never a "driver" fan. I am a team fan. I thought i was a MSC supporter, but when he joined Mercedes i could not cheer for him. So i have nothing against Kimi, and certainly don't want him to be a second driver, but if he is to beat Seb i would want that to be because he improved drastically, and not because Seb is having a bad season.

Edited by cokata, 18 March 2016 - 17:14.

[Zilbert]

Honestly i was never a "driver" fan. I am a team fan. I thought i was a MSC supporter, but when he joined Mercedes i could not cheer for him. So i have nothing against Kimi, and certainly don't want him to be a second driver, but if he is to beat Seb i would want that to be because he improved drastically, and not because Seb is having a bad season.

I understand that. So you are assuming from the team perspective the biggest chance Ferrari has of winning WDC is to not have their n2 driver taking away any points from n1. However, this is driver vs driver thread where the underlying assumption has to be that both drivers are aiming to beat the other, and are given equal support by the team. Otherwise it makes no sense at all to have this thread.

[marcainley]

Big Kimi fan here. I enjoyed the two wins in 2012 and 2013, especially as they were quite unexpected. After two disappointing years I'm hoping to enjoy seeing him win at least one more race!

[Niceman]

I'm expecting to see the Kimi we know this year.  The compromised front-end is now gone and he will be able to match or beat Seb.

[anneomoly]

And so it begins.

[Menace]

What I hope for is Kimi to get back on the level of performance he had in 2012-2013, and thus challenge and maybe even trump Seb.

What I expect however is Vettel to still outscore him, though I think the margin will be a lot smaller this time around.

 

Yup, that's pretty much how I see it.

[Timantti]

What I hope for is Kimi to get back on the level of performance he had in 2012-2013, and thus challenge and maybe even trump Seb.

What I expect however is Vettel to still outscore him, though I think the margin will be a lot smaller this time around.

 

I actually think 2012 Kimi was very similar to 2014-2015 Kimi, the difference being that his teammates were hell of a lot better than a returning Grosjean that year. 2013 Kimi could probably beat Seb from time to time but not outscore him.

Edited by Timantti, 18 March 2016 - 19:07.

[Alexandros]

If testing is any indication of how the season will go (Kimi's car had issues on all days), I expect various problems throughout the season as well. Whether mechanical, setup issues, pitstop issues, miscommunication... hey even the chef might come down and "cook" his tires for dinner .

 

So my prediction is that no matter how well Kimi performs, he will still be out-scored for a long list of ...reasons (or excuses - depending how one sees it). I'd be happy to be proven wrong though.

 

Mathematically speaking, it shouldn't really be that way as variance over many years would tend to even things out and we wouldn't even be talking about these things. However variance is not getting better for Kimi at Ferrari, despite all his years there. This is not how it went while driving for other teams. For example in Mclaren he had a bad '02 and then a good '03. You don't consistently get bad years full of problems. You don't go to testing and ask beforehand "who's driving?" and just know that the car will have plenty of downtime if it's Kimi's day... But I guess that's how Ferrari+Kimi combo is and I think it won't change this year either.

 

In terms of liking the car etc etc, these again are all relative. I doubt Kimi likes the current formula with very low df, low tire grip, weak front-end etc. He might get better as he will be able to drive closer to what he likes by the addition of extra grip but still it isn't what fits his style. Despite that, Kimi's race pace will be among the best (if not THE best) in the races even if he loses out in qualify (where driving on the limit exposes the handling problems of the current cars vs his driving style).

Edited by Alexandros, 18 March 2016 - 19:17.

[LongTooth]

I'd like to see Kimi get a win this year, but I'm sure Vettel will out score him.

[ch103]

I really don't think this is the case, Ferrari needs a strong Kimi and he will turn out faster then Seb he will finish in front. The nr. 1 in Ferrari is earned on the track , not given.

 

"Felipe, Fernando is faster than you"

 

Is that what you mean by earned on track?

[famousfive]

This is the most obvious result out of all intra team battles. Vettel will crush Kimi 

[Seanspeed]

"Felipe, Fernando is faster than you"

 

Is that what you mean by earned on track?

Mostly yea.  Fernando was their title hope.  Massa was too far behind and Alonso had been outperforming him all year long.  Pretty obvious decision.  And it also turned that race that - lo and behold - Fernando was actually faster, pulling away from Massa afterwards while Massa came under threat by the end of the race from Vettel.   

 

If Kimi is beating Vettel this year consistently and is in the title hunt, Ferrari will not hesitate to give Kimi no.1 status when the time calls for it.  Both Kimi and Massa got no.1 driver 'perks' that they earned in 2007 and 2008 respectively.  Every year is a restart.  

Edited by Seanspeed, 18 March 2016 - 21:26.

[ch103]

Mostly yea.  Fernando was their title hope.  Massa was too far behind and Alonso had been outperforming him all year long.  Pretty obvious decision.  And it also turned that race that - lo and behold - Fernando was actually faster, pulling away from Massa afterwards while Massa came under threat by the end of the race from Vettel.   

 

If Kimi is beating Vettel this year consistently and is in the title hunt, Ferrari will not hesitate to give Kimi no.1 status when the time calls for it.  Both Kimi and Massa got no.1 driver 'perks' that they earned in 2007 and 2008 respectively.  Every year is a restart.  

 

I'll give you Kimi and Felipe in 2007/8.  Fair point.

 

Alonso was the default #1 the day he signed with the Scuderia.

Edited by ch103, 18 March 2016 - 21:35.

[Seanspeed]

I'll give you Kimi and Felipe in 2007/8.  Fair point.

 

Alonso was the default #1 the day he signed with the Scuderia.

No, he really wasn't.  You have absolutely nothing to back that up with.  In fact, in Australia, 2nd race of the season in 2010, Alonso got stuck behind Massa and the team never let him by.  Boom.  End of story.  

 

Ferrari aren't idiots.  They aren't going to compromise their campaign backing a driver they dont know will actually deliver in the end.  If anything, 2007 and 2008 should have been clear evidence that not only do they not back a driver until they need and have deserved backing, but also that they would know quite well in the future to not put their eggs into one basket before there is justifiable cause for doing so.  

 

Both Vettel and Kimi are starting this season on equal footing.  Nobody is going to get preferential treatment unless it becomes necessary.  Ferrari run a fair ship, despite what many like to assume.  This isn't the same Ferrari of 2002.  Hasn't been in a long time. 

Edited by Seanspeed, 18 March 2016 - 21:43.

[balmybaldwin]

Hmm... I'm seeing hints of the old Iceman I wonder.... nah Vettel will still edge it

[Juan Kerr]

I actually think 2012 Kimi was very similar to 2014-2015 Kimi, the difference being that his teammates were hell of a lot better than a returning Grosjean that year. 2013 Kimi could probably beat Seb from time to time but not outscore him.

What about the returning Kimi Raikkonen in 2012?

[Vettelari]

While apparently everybody on here thinks Kimi will be closer to Seb this season, I tend to go the opposite way. Kimi will be absolutely embarrassed by Seb. By year's end everybody in the sport will be begging for him to retire. Kimi is washed up and has no business driving a car capable of winning races. In my worthless opinion, as always.

[turssi]

I hope Seb gets the WDC this year.

[Disgrace]

Vettel really ought to demolish Raikkonen yet again. The former is entering his prime years as Kimi enters what is probably his final season in F1. Even if he can close in pace, Kimi just makes too many poor mistakes these days. It would be damaging for Vettel if he loses.