39 replies to this topic

[Rainbowtrout]

I noticed on a previous thread that people like to knock Flavio Briatore.

But as far as I can see, FB won two championships with Bennetton.

FB also build up all the Bennetton business in the US which is quite impressive when you think where they started from.

FB might not be a technical guru but he seems to know what he is doing as a team manager. He knows how to hire, judge, motivate and manage people.

From what I've heard so far the Renault people seem to think highly of him.

I'm not even mentionning Ms. Campbell!

[MacFan]

Whatever his successes in business, Flavio didn't win the WC, Schumacher did, and geting Schumacher to drive for Benetton was Tom Walkinshaw's idea. Walkinshaw was also responsible for the strength of Benetton's technical team - Ross Brawn was a long time TWR employee, to give one example.

Flavio strikes me as a bit of a flash in the pan. He was happy to take the credit for Schumacher's successes, but didn't achieve anything once his star driver had left. The way he has treated almost every Benetton driver since Schumacher suggests his motivating and managing skills are a but suspect.

The final nail in his coffin is that he isn't a racer - he admitted to not being particularly interested in F1 before he became Benetton team manager.

[The Kanisteri]

Flavio is just DICK.

[baddog]

this is a family forum and so I am unable to contribute my thoughts on flavio briatore to the thread. sorry ;)

Shaun

[BuzzingHornet]

i'll second that Shaun

[Nikolas Garth]

Flavio is a funny guy. I enjoy seeing him run amok.

[JayWay]

Flavio is a family man. He makes Mr Rogers look like Lucifer

[Zawed]

Flav is one of the greatest showboats in F1 ever, mind you, he did help build Benetton in a WC winning outfit. At one stage he had nearly a quarter of the grid in his back pocket in some way !(Benetton, Ligier, Minardi)

[ebe]

It would be better for Benetton, if FB would focus his efforts more on Ms C.

[Max Torque]

Originally posted by Rainbowtrout
I noticed on a previous thread that people like to knock Flavio Briatore.

But as far as I can see, FB won two championships with Bennetton.

FB also build up all the Bennetton business in the US which is quite impressive when you think where they started from.

Did you, perhaps, also notice how people like to knock a certain Ron Dennis??

As far as anyone can see, RD has won countless more championships.

RD also built up all the McLaren bussiness worldwide. And this is quite more impressive.

So, what is your point Rainbowtrout?

-Just because a man is capable in his job, he is also a good person?
The answer is NO.

-Just because a man is capable in his job, he deserves respect?
The answer is YES.

Start respecting Ron Dennis first and then we can talk about Flavio.

[malc]

Originally posted by Max Torque


-Just because a man is capable in his job, he is also a good person?
The answer is NO.

-Just because a man is capable in his job, he deserves respect?
The answer is YES.

Start respecting Ron Dennis first and then we can talk about Flavio.

well said.

I, for one, have always respected Ron very high, and not only
as a professional, but as a person. Sure, he´s a (very) bad loser,
but I don´t think there´s anything else wrong with him.

Flavio is something else. Never achieved anything ON_HIS_OWN!

Just a crappy personality, I just hope he doesn´t totally ruin Fisi´s and Jenson´s careers.

[BuzzingHornet]

And Trulli's... if he ever wanted to drive for Benetton he should check out how Button is doing

[daydream]

Originally posted by Max Torque


Did you, perhaps, also notice how people like to knock a certain Ron Dennis??

As far as anyone can see, RD has won countless more championships.

RD also built up all the McLaren bussiness worldwide. And this is quite more impressive.

So, what is your point Rainbowtrout?

-Just because a man is capable in his job, he is also a good person?
The answer is NO.

-Just because a man is capable in his job, he deserves respect?
The answer is YES.

Start respecting Ron Dennis first and then we can talk about Flavio.

How can you expect anyone to respect Ron Dennis who is on the verge of insanity because of his unhealthy hatred of red cars??
Is Ron Dennis a bull??......a bull hates Red Colour. ....perhaps Ron will only cool down his hatred towards Ferrari if the racing colour is white.

Ron Dennis is really a bull......no wonder he talks so much bullshit!

[daydream]

Ron Dennis owes all the world championships to Alain Prost, the great Senna and Adrian Newey.

Ron Dennis as little to do with all the world titles.

Ron Dennis is just a lucky guy at the right place and right time

[daydream]

Flavio Braitore's style of handling his business is very crude

[daydream]

Flavio Briatore do not have loyalty and credibility of people like Frank Williams

Look at how many places Flavio had gone to since Michael left his Benetton. He just lost heart in Benneton when it went from hero to zero after MS left.


I can't understand how he can be recruited back to be a team manager again. This is a big mistakes.

Flavio Briatore seriously rival Craig Pollock as the worst team manager. But the winner is still Pollock. Dont worry, Flavio Briatore has plenty of opportunity to prove otherwise

[The_Z_Man]

Originally posted by daydream
How can you expect anyone to respect Ron Dennis who is on the verge of insanity because of his unhealthy hatred of red cars??
Is Ron Dennis a bull??......a bull hates Red Colour. ....perhaps Ron will only cool down his hatred towards Ferrari if the racing colour is white.

Ron Dennis is really a bull......no wonder he talks so much bullshit!

Am I the only one whose irony meter pegged when he read this !?

The_Z_Man

[The_Z_Man]

Originally posted by daydream
Ron Dennis is just a lucky guy at the right place and right time

Is that the reason of all the bile, hatred and sheer negativity that you spew on this BB ? You're just a jealous guy ?

The_Z_Man

[Gemini]

Originally posted by daydream
Ron Dennis owes all the world championships to Alain Prost, the great Senna and Adrian Newey.

Ron Dennis as little to do with all the world titles.

What's your point, daydream?

Contracting the right drivers, the right technical stuff, getting engine deal and ... most important: organizing money to pay for it all, is EXACTLY what team manager is credited for.

[PeaQ]

Originally posted by daydream
Ron Dennis owes all the world championships to Alain Prost, the great Senna and Adrian Newey.

Ron Dennis as little to do with all the world titles.

Ron Dennis is just a lucky guy at the right place and right time

Yep, I agree, Dennis is just a lucky guy at the right place and right time. But so is Mika Häkkinen. And Michael Schumacher. And Ayrton Senna.
:yawn:

[daydream]

Originally posted by Gemini


What's your point, daydream?

Contracting the right drivers, the right technical stuff, getting engine deal and ... most important: organizing money to pay for it all, is EXACTLY what team manager is credited for.

what i am trying to say is that the brilliance of these guys (prost, senna, newey) more than make up the lousy management of Ron Dennis with their performance of track.

You need good workforce to get the job done. Most of successful organizations have **** people sitting on top of the organization chart, but they do have great workforce working for them

[The_Z_Man]

Originally posted by daydream
You need good workforce to get the job done.

Agreed.

Most of successful organizations have **** people sitting on top of the organization chart, but they do have great workforce working for them

He isn't just sitting on top, he built said organization.

The_Z_Man

[JayWay]

Yeah horrible team managment.

[baddog]

suggesting ron dennis is not a superb team manager is farcical in the extreme. he has his faults (mostly connected with his mouth!) but as a manager he is second only to jean todt in ability in my opinion (this only because ron would not have the calmness and patience to have turned the ferrari situation round as jean did)

comparing him to flavio is.. well what can I say.

Shaun

[BuzzingHornet]

Flavio Bratore is an ex- fluffy jumper salesman who fancies his hand at managing an F1 team

[Sphinx]

Originally posted by The_Z_Man
Am I the only one whose irony meter pegged when he read this !?

The_Z_Man

No, you are not alone.

[Finntastic]

Because what he did to JJ Lehto, I will always, not only hate him but moreover, despise him.

He is a sad, sad old man!

[se7en_24]

Originally posted by daydream
Ron Dennis owes all the world championships to Alain Prost, the great Senna and Adrian Newey.

Ron Dennis as little to do with all the world titles.

Ron Dennis is just a lucky guy at the right place and right time

You're so right. I mean the lazy bastard, he should not only run the team, but also design and drive the cars!

[Rainbowtrout]

Originally posted by baddog
this is a family forum and so I am unable to contribute my thoughts on flavio briatore to the thread. sorry ;)

Shaun

Chicken.

[Rainbowtrout]

Originally posted by Max Torque


Did you, perhaps, also notice how people like to knock a certain Ron Dennis??

As far as anyone can see, RD has won countless more championships.

RD also built up all the McLaren bussiness worldwide. And this is quite more impressive.

So, what is your point Rainbowtrout?

-Just because a man is capable in his job, he is also a good person?
The answer is NO.

-Just because a man is capable in his job, he deserves respect?
The answer is YES.

Start respecting Ron Dennis first and then we can talk about Flavio.

[gray_cat]

Originally posted by BuzzingHornet
Flavio Bratore is an ex- fluffy jumper salesman who fancies his hand at managing an F1 team

And actually doing pretty good job at that. Certainly much better than Ken 'Old Cheat' Tyrell

[BuzzingHornet]

Yeah maybe but Ken never took him on in the cutthroat world of fluffy jumper selling, he would have kicked his arse there.

[MP4/?]

Briatore is a cheater as Ross Brawn is.... The started with maFIA in their days at Benetton... Both are the dark side of F1

[gray_cat]

Originally posted by BuzzingHornet
Yeah maybe but Ken never took him on in the cutthroat world of fluffy jumper selling, he would have kicked his arse there.

Selling fluffy jumper did not prevent Flav from kicking few arses in 'gentle' bussines of Formula 1 - the bussines in which Ken worked all his life

[Rainbowtrout]

Originally posted by MP4/?
Briatore is a cheater as Ross Brawn is.... The started with maFIA in their days at Benetton... Both are the dark side of F1

So where does that put Ron Dennis?

The deep end!

[BuzzingHornet]

Gray_cat, seriously I think FB did a great job of getting the right people in the right places in his team. He seems to be trying to reserrect the glory days with Renault... it all depends on them getting a world class designer and Renault fixing the engine. FB himself is a character but I wouldn't like to have him as my boss, put it like that ;)

[gray_cat]

Originally posted by MP4/?
Briatore is a cheater as Ross Brawn is.... The started with maFIA in their days at Benetton... Both are the dark side of F1

Was/Is Tom Walkinshaw "the dark side of F1", MP4/? ?

In case you didn't know, it was he, not Flav, who controlled all the engineering in Benetton and hired Tad Czapski and Ross Brawn

Brawn joined TWR in 1989 and after establishing a design center, he produced the XJR-14, the first sportscar to have state-of-the-art F1 technology. The Brawn-designed Jaguars won the 1991 Sportscar World Championship. In July 1991 Walkinshaw bought into the Benetton F1 team and in the autumn Brawn was appointed technical director of Benetton Formula

Tad Czapski, hired by current Arrows's boss Tom Walkinshaw back in 1992 to work on Benetton's advanced electronics systems, was responsible for control systems in the Benetton-Ford B193 transmission as well as the "launch control" featured in the Benetton 194.

[gray_cat]

Originally posted by BuzzingHornet
Gray_cat, seriously I think FB did a great job of getting the right people in the right places in his team. He seems to be trying to reserrect the glory days with Renault... it all depends on them getting a world class designer and Renault fixing the engine. FB himself is a character but I wouldn't like to have him as my boss, put it like that ;)

I quite agree with that - from his own interviews and tales by people who worked with him, Flav stands as one obnoxious bastard, but he is damn effective non the less

[Rainbowtrout]

Originally posted by gray_cat

Was/Is Tom Walkinshaw "the dark side of F1", MP4/? ?

In case you didn't know, it was he, not Flav, who controlled all the engineering in Benetton and hired Tad Czapski and Ross Brawn

Who hired Tom?

Flavio did.

Who let Tom do his job? Flav did.

Good enough for me.

Renault could have the pick of anybody they want, who did they hire? Flavio.

Even Ms. Campbell hired Flav and she looks pretty satisfied with the job he's doing. From what I've heard of her she can be a pretty demanding boss.

[gray_cat]

The perception of the relative roles of Walkinshaw and Flavio in 91-95 Benetton is often distorted, primarily among people whose only information hole into the real world is British tabloid media. Check this out :

Tom Walkinshaw, Benetton's Engineering Director, had previously run the Jaguar sports car team and knew all about Schumacher's mesmeric talents in the rival Mercedes. They scrutinized Michael's contract, found that Jordan hadn't managed to pin him down totally - and immediately whisked him away from under their nose. It was an acrimonious moment, but Michael Schumacher has driven for Benetton ever since.