1069 replies to this topic

[Marklar]

The decline continues....

 

 

Official figures from Formula One Management indicate television audiences fell to above 400 million last year, further illustrating the sport’s declining popularity.

The new data means F1 has lost one-third of its worldwide audience since 2008 – around 200 million viewers. How many of those are now watching the sport via other means, legal or not, is unclear. The sport has drawn criticism for moving away from free-to-air broadcasts in favour of television deals.

http://www.f1fanatic...nce-since-2008/

 

2008: 600 m

2009: 520 m

2010: 527 m

2011: 515 m

2012: 500 m

2013: 450 m

2014: 425 m

2015: 400 m

[Disgrace]

Yeah, but how are Rolex sales?

[noikeee]

All they need to do now is add reverse grids and people will all flock back to buy the paychannels F1's on.

[LuckyStrike1]

We need to change qualifying!!!! 

 

Or something ... 

[Jimisgod]

So in 14 years the last person will switch off?

[Prost1997T]

Those figures are based on the "15 minutes of F1 = 1 viewer" methodology which is flawed. I'm more interested to know how many actual viewers each GP had throughout the broadcast. The UK number already dropped below 1 million for Sky broadcasts. In the US it's about the same (500,000 on NBCSN at best).

 

There must have been significant growth in Asia for the 400 million number to be anywhere close to accurate.

[SophieB]

I'm happy we have this thread because, sure, we have the UK TV coverage thread and we have the German TV viewing figures thread but this seems distinct enough to merit its own space.

 

I just ask can we keep the focus on tv viewing figures and not just turn it into yet another thread to kick about 'Where has it all gone wrong for F1' again.

[Lotus53B]

A comment here:-

 

http://www.theguardi...-ceo-governs-eu

 

reckons that it's not shown in China - if that is the case, then it's rather silly.  India lost its race, so I can't see many viewers there..and between them they're about 30% of the world population.

 

I agree with Prost1997T that the sampling is flawed, however, I think that hte same technique was used for all figures, so the ratios should be roughly equivalent.

[LuckyStrike1]

Those figures are based on the "15 minutes of F1 = 1 viewer" methodology which is flawed. I'm more interested to know how many actual viewers each GP had throughout the broadcast. The UK number already dropped below 1 million for Sky broadcasts. In the US it's about the same (500,000 on NBCSN at best).

 

There must have been significant growth in Asia for the 400 million number to be anywhere close to accurate.

 

 

I think Bernie bought 200 million TV-sets that he keeps running during the GP-weekends. 

[Ross Stonefeld]

I have never ever understood what that '400million' figure meant. And I've read a few of those annual documents. It's not even X viewers x Y Races. 

[Clatter]

A comment here:-

http://www.theguardi...-ceo-governs-eu

reckons that it's not shown in China - if that is the case, then it's rather silly. India lost its race, so I can't see many viewers there..and between them they're about 30% of the world population.

I agree with Prost1997T that the sampling is flawed, however, I think that hte same technique was used for all figures, so the ratios should be roughly equivalent.

I didn't see any comment saying China doesn't show the race.

[Lotus53B]

Page 2 of comments...

 

valdez

7 Apr 2016 23:56

 

15 16

Bernie has killed F1 by taking it off terrestrial TV. You can't watch it in China, despite the fact that they have their own race - that's the worlds largest population surrendered to NBA. Soon you won't be able to watch it in the UK free to air.

I used to watch every race, now I don't bother, not because the spectacle is any worse, simply because I can't.

[Fatgadget]

When was the peak - anyone?

[Jimisgod]

 

Page 2 of comments...

 

valdez

7 Apr 2016 23:56

 

15 16

Bernie has killed F1 by taking it off terrestrial TV. You can't watch it in China, despite the fact that they have their own race - that's the worlds largest population surrendered to NBA. Soon you won't be able to watch it in the UK free to air.

I used to watch every race, now I don't bother, not because the spectacle is any worse, simply because I can't.

 

 

The interesting thing is that on (pay) Star Sports or whatever carries it in SE Asia, you don't get any commentary except Alex Yoong in the ad breaks. You pay for service and still can't follow the race.

[Timantti]

I think the decline doesn't only concern F1 but racing in general. Younger generation just doesn't find it interesting and motor racing is slowly transforming into an "old man's sport". Many here are old geezers who rant about how everything was better in the 70's and 80's. Same thing is happening with baseball in the States.

 

It's not like F1 viewers jump ship and watch an alternative series. No, they just stop watching racing all together.

Edited by Timantti, 20 April 2016 - 12:19.

[pdac]

This is what you get when you chase money and not viewers. F1 is now too big and greedy to change, so the numbers will just keep dropping until they reach the level of people where F1 is all and money is no barrier.

[RPM40]

Its not just that the coverage is being paywalled. The coverage we're paying for isn't that fantastic. The Sky coverage somehow feels very impersonal, but despite also not having that 'flair' the BBC (and now Channel 5) have, I think it also lacks any real insightful commentary. The presenters often just parrot social media as opposed to setting the viewers straight, they're too scared to actually take a stance on anything and their insight is often just reading the finishing order.

 

I think people watch to not only enjoy, but to learn about the sport and how it works. I don't feel like I get that to the same extent I did with the BBC. Of course, elements of Sky's presentation (Brundle) remain excellent. But Herbert and Crofty really need to go. They drag down the whole gang.

[Marklar]

When was the peak - anyone?

2004 was 800 m apparentely. I reckon this wasn't even the peak

http://www.mediaweek...one-stalls-2004

Edit: actually I don't know if it is compareable though. I think just the numbers since 2008 are measured in an compareable way

Edited by Marklar, 20 April 2016 - 12:30.

[Lotus53B]

This is what you get when you chase money and not viewers.

I think that's the fundamental problem.  Bernie and the sport want money, the number of viewers is mainly irrelevant, as long as the balance sheets show increased income.

Until they don't.  Advertisers will stop paying if the eyeballs don't add up.

[Nemo1965]

Its not just that the coverage is being paywalled. The coverage we're paying for isn't that fantastic. The Sky coverage somehow feels very impersonal, but despite also not having that 'flair' the BBC (and now Channel 5) have, I think it also lacks any real insightful commentary. The presenters often just parrot social media as opposed to setting the viewers straight, they're too scared to actually take a stance on anything and their insight is often just reading the finishing order.

 

I think people watch to not only enjoy, but to learn about the sport and how it works. I don't feel like I get that to the same extent I did with the BBC. Of course, elements of Sky's presentation (Brundle) remain excellent. But Herbert and Crofty really need to go. They drag down the whole gang.

 

The question is: do Herbert and Crofty or whomever have ANY influence on the number of people watching?

 

No.

[RPM40]

The question is: do Herbert and Crofty or whomever have ANY influence on the number of people watching?

 

No.

 

Its not like they're going to go "Crofty is terrible i'm switching off!" but boring coverage does tend to long term turn viewers away. The BBC presented the sport in a special way, its hard exactly to put your finger on it but it had a certain 'weight' to it. The coverage now feels like fluff. I almost never watch the pre show anymore, one of my favorite parts of the BBC.

Edited by RPM40, 20 April 2016 - 12:26.

[Nonesuch]

It's surprising that it took this long to count them this time, usually these numbers are published in February.

 

I have never ever understood what that '400million' figure meant. And I've read a few of those annual documents. It's not even X viewers x Y Races.

 

Last season F1’s annual global media report said it measured unique viewers who watched at least 15 non-consecutive minutes of F1.

 

The question is: do Herbert and Crofty or whomever have ANY influence on the number of people watching?

 

Of course. In many countries the viewers have been subjected to the same two or three shouting men for the better part of the last two decades.

 

I watch Alpine Skiing with the English Eurosport commentary because the Dutch guy is a total bore. For F1 I switch between the BBC, RTBF and RTL all the time, but most people don't have that option. As always, variety is the spice of life.

Edited by Nonesuch, 20 April 2016 - 12:33.

[ConsiderAndGo]

Gosh, that's some decline. Such a shame to see, but it really isn't surprising.

[goingthedistance]

Its not like they're going to go "Crofty is terrible i'm switching off!" but boring coverage does tend to long term turn viewers away. The BBC presented the sport in a special way, its hard exactly to put your finger on it but it had a certain 'weight' to it. The coverage now feels like fluff. I almost never watch the pre show anymore, one of my favorite parts of the BBC.

 

Actually I personally find Crofty so bad that I have been switching off. Fast forwarding, no longer watching practice sessions, choosing C4 if it's available instead. In the last race I started doing other things in the second half of it, just to limit my Croft dose. I accept that I have a particularly high aversion to him and Herbert, but I think there are some of us out there being turned off the whole sport by the choices made in coverage. 

[johnmhinds]

Last season F1’s annual global media report said it measured unique viewers who watched at least 15 non-consecutive minutes of F1

Yeah it's not 15 minutes per race, it's only 15 minutes per year.

The actual figures for viewers who watch all of the races is probably down to a few million at this point.

[RainyAfterlifeDaylight]

Something we need to consider is that lots of people watch Formula1 on live streams. I don't think those figures are very representative. Live streams all in all gets better and better, so there is no need for pay TV. Most of us belong to the era of free Formula1 on TV, so it remains to be hard and unacceptable to pay for it, even a little.

 

Free is free. Some say even free beating does worth it because it is FREE 

Edited by RYARLE, 20 April 2016 - 12:43.

[RedBaron]

Didn't you guys get the memo FOM sent out?

 

Revenue from selling TV rights to subscription channels > Audience figures

 

Revenue from selling TV rights to subscription channels > Entertainment

 

Revenue from selling TV rights to subscription channels > The Long term future of Formula 1

Edited by RedBaron, 20 April 2016 - 12:44.

[secessionman]

 

Last season F1’s annual global media report said it measured unique viewers who watched at least 15 non-consecutive minutes of F1.

 

 

 

It would be interesting to see the viewing figures for News at Ten over the same period.

 

The recent figures also appear too uniform to suggest anything other than guesswork (500,450,425,400).

[Ross Stonefeld]

Didn't you guys get the memo FOM sent out?

 

Revenue from selling TV rights to subscription channels > Audience figures

 

Revenue from selling TV rights to subscription channels > Entertainment

 

Revenue from selling TV rights to subscription channels > The Long term future of Formula 1

 

Revenue from selling TV rights to subscription channels > Money earned from sponsorship gained via free-to-air TV.

[SpeedRacer`]

The interesting thing is that on (pay) Star Sports or whatever carries it in SE Asia, you don't get any commentary except Alex Yoong in the ad breaks. You pay for service and still can't follow the race.

 

I know in Taiwan, they use Fox Sports and take Sky's coverage but talk over it 

[RPM40]

Actually I personally find Crofty so bad that I have been switching off. Fast forwarding, no longer watching practice sessions, choosing C4 if it's available instead. In the last race I started doing other things in the second half of it, just to limit my Croft dose. I accept that I have a particularly high aversion to him and Herbert, but I think there are some of us out there being turned off the whole sport by the choices made in coverage.

I just want them to stop parroting nonsense. It frustrates the hell out of me when they say "X driver had a great race" when they lucked into it. Or when they read points lists without taking into account reliability and bad luck.

I understand Croftys job is to make sure there is no radio silence, but the team around him aren't necessarily better.

[superden]

I think the decline doesn't only concern F1 but racing in general. Younger generation just doesn't find it interesting and motor racing is slowly transforming into an "old man's sport". Many here are old geezers who rant about how everything was better in the 70's and 80's. Same thing is happening with baseball in the States.

It's not like F1 viewers jump ship and watch an alternative series. No, they just stop watching racing all together.

A mobile phone is now considered more of a status symbol than a car in the under-21 demographic. The mind boggles and the soul weeps ...

[Imperial]

Has there ever been a published total global audience figure for a single race broadcast?

It surely can't be that difficult, as each local broadcaster appears to publish their own figures anyway.

[FullThrottleF1]

I'm sad.

[Tardis40]

People won't pay because they used to get it for free.  Now many of them are getting it from other sources.  Also there hasn't been an iconic and charismatic driver since Michael Schumacher retired.  And there has been too much change, in the rules, the teams, and the drivers.  Hard to get behind a team when they only last a year or three.  How many of the current teams were here 10 years ago?  Ferrari, McLaren, Sauber, Williams, Red Bull. and Sauber isn't looking too healthy at the moment.

[johnmhinds]

Has there ever been a published total global audience figure for a single race broadcast?

It surely can't be that difficult, as each local broadcaster appears to publish their own figures anyway.

 

If that real viewing figure was ever published I think the sponsors would run for the hills.

[noikeee]

Revenue from selling TV rights to subscription channels > Money earned from sponsorship gained via free-to-air TV.

I think that's a legitimate argument that's certainly true for now, but does it lead to more money on the long term?

 

Here in Portugal SportTV had F1 for the past 7 years, now after F1 has been hidden from the public for 7 years its popularity is down, and it no longer made business sense for them to renew the deal. So it's now gone back to Eurosport on open air. I don't know the figures so have no idea if Eurosport are now paying more or less than SportTV did, and they do have a plan to put it behind their own paywall. But it seems a dodgy path to me, and only reminds me of WRC over the last few years being passed on from channel to channel, into progressively more obscure broadcasters as public interest fizzles out. Surely that's a terrible idea, not merely from an emotional POV from the fanbase, but also from a financial POV? I mean, there's only so much FOM will be able to ask for from the TV companies in the future, if nobody wants to watch anymore.

 

And teams might be able to hold on to their sponsors for now, so for now it looks like a huge income of TV money with a minor hit to sponsorship, but sooner or later they're going to ask what return are they getting for their investment when nobody is watching their logos being paraded anymore.

Edited by noikeee, 20 April 2016 - 13:27.

[7MGTEsup]

A mobile phone is now considered more of a status symbol than a car in the under-21 demographic. The mind boggles and the soul weeps ...

 

 

Wow I would be really cool if I was 21 as I own both.

[Ross Stonefeld]

 

I think that's a legitimate argument that's certainly true for now, but does it lead to more money on the long term?

 

 

 

That's the big issue. Short-term revenue vs long term health. 

 

btw on Per Race figures, A few years ago the average race broadcast was like 50m(because India was a big chunk of the TV audience, just through population size) minimum, and championship deciders were 70-80m(but those figures were without India). That's sort of fuzzy off the top of my head memories though. 

 

MotoGP was 20m-ish mil most of the time. Lot less once they dropped that All Eurosport deal they used to have. Theyd basically match F1 in Spain and Italy, were nowhere in places like UK and Germany, and pretty big in South East Asia. 

[superden]

'F1 has lost one-third of its TV audience'

 

'Ecclestone wants 6 USA races, a 25 race calendar and hints at dropping the German Grand Prix'

 

I cant help but feel there is a link here ... what could it be ...

[RedBaron]

Revenue from selling TV rights to subscription channels > Money earned from sponsorship gained via free-to-air TV.

 

But that money goes into teams pockets not Bernies.

 

You're confusing the aim of the FOM. It's to line their own pockets not Formula 1 as a whole.

[Ross Stonefeld]

Well even more so, FOM gets half the TV money none of the sponsorship money.

 

Over the past few years, except for the absolute front running teams, most of them have probably gained more as their % of the Sky F1 deal and etc than they have from signing new sponsorship deals. 

[Clatter]

I know in Taiwan, they use Fox Sports and take Sky's coverage but talk over it

Do you mean they take the world feed and add their own commentary, or actually talk over the sky commentary?

[SenorSjon]

Yeah it's not 15 minutes per race, it's only 15 minutes per year.

The actual figures for viewers who watch all of the races is probably down to a few million at this point.

 

And we have had more and more races each year, so it mounts to less than a minute.

15*60=900 seconds of F1/year

15 races = 60 seconds/race

16: 56s

17: 53s

18: 50s

19: 47s

20: 45s

21: 43s

25: 36s/race. Or an evening journal broadcast with the results is usually enough to count. And that makes these figures more horrid than they already are.

[Ross Stonefeld]

Well, it kind of depends. If the basic Average Audience Per Race is unchanged, that's not such a big deal. You may just be losing the extra hundred million that were basically Bullshit Viewers because they caught a glimpse of the highlights on the news while at the gym. 

[Nathan]

This is happening in professional golf NASCAR, tennis and probably most other sports.  Why is it not just F1?  What sports are seeing TV rating growth?   Why are nearly all forms of professional motor racing seeing TV rating declines?  Why are many major sport leagues also moving to the PPV model?

Edited by Nathan, 20 April 2016 - 15:07.

[KWSN - DSM]

I am not smart enough to have ever understood how viewing figures are even remotely measurable. Accepting that they somehow are, and taking the released numbers as correct, then something is obviously amiss, the deal signed with Ecclestone is deal signed with the Devil so to speak, a promoter for +100 years who more and more do not promote. How can FOM not be in default on the contract?

 

There is little doubt in my mind that a lower number of views are factual, percentage of how many I have zero idea about.

 

[7MGTEsup]

This is happening in professional golf NASCAR, tennis and probably most other sports.  Why is it not just F1?  What sports are seeing TV rating growth?   Why are nearly all forms of professional motor racing seeing TV rating declines?  Why are many major sport leagues also moving to the PPV model?

 

Maybe the youth of today are so entrenched in their mobile phones they don't watch any sport on TV anymore? Hmmmmm the first smart phones started to appear in about 2007 maybe there is a correlation?

Edited by 7MGTEsup, 20 April 2016 - 15:10.

[RedBaron]

Well even more so, FOM gets half the TV money none of the sponsorship money.

 

Over the past few years, except for the absolute front running teams, most of them have probably gained more as their % of the Sky F1 deal and etc than they have from signing new sponsorship deals. 

 

I just realised I misinterpreted your original post. 

[Option1]

I have never ever understood what that '400million' figure meant. And I've read a few of those annual documents. It's not even X viewers x Y Races. 

I always laughed when areas like F1, the Olympics, the Oscars, etc. essentially claimed viewing figures that were in excess of the entire world population.  Seem to see a little less of that now days, but I always treat figures for these types of events as being grossly inflated.

 

Neil