92 replies to this topic

[Graveltrappen]

After this outburst today from Gutierrez that his Haas is making him look bad and that it's hiding the '****ing' amazing job he's doing... In the car that Grosjean is making Haas look outstanding in...

Can you think of any examples of F1 drivers complaining about their cars so vocally? Especially those in decent or half-decent teams...

If it wasn't for Grosjean, Hass would look like yet another flop new team scraping around at the back... Surprised to see Gutierrez being so vocal when his f1 career could easily have been over based on what we've seen so far

http://www.motorspor...ery-bad-736141/

[Jvr]

After this outburst today from Gutierrez that his Haas is making him look bad and that it's hiding the '****ing' amazing job he's doing... In the car that Grosjean is making Haas look outstanding in...

Can you think of any examples of F1 drivers complaining about their cars so vocally? Especially those in decent or half-decent teams...

If it wasn't for Grosjean, Hass would look like yet another flop new team scraping around at the back... Surprised to see Gutierrez being so vocal when his f1 career could easily have been over based on what we've seen so far

http://www.motorspor...ery-bad-736141/

Easy:

 

Alonso at Ferrari.

[Marklar]

Can you think of any examples of F1 drivers complaining about their cars so vocally? Especially those in decent or half-decent teams...

Maldonado

[Collombin]

Hubert Hahne at Hockenheim?

Ouch.

[as65p]

Easy:

 

Alonso at Ferrari.

Should be so easy for you to grace us with but one example of Alonso making a similar statement to Gutierrez latest, shouldn't it?

[Jimisgod]

Easy:

 

Alonso at Ferrari.

 

What a troll post. Was Massa singing the praises of the car?

[HeadFirst]

I think there are more complaints about management decisions .... pit calls, tire strategy, team orders etc.

[Jvr]

Should be so easy for you to grace us with but one example of Alonso making a similar statement to Gutierrez latest, shouldn't it?

 

 

What a troll post. Was Massa singing the praises of the car?

http://www.bbc.com/s...rmula1/23495111

[Jimisgod]

http://www.bbc.com/s...rmula1/23495111

 

Don't see Massa's opinion there, just a guy who never drove the car.

[senna da silva]

Prost at Ferrari.

[AustinF1]

...and Ferrari has done sooooo much better since Alonso left. Right?

[AustinF1]

BTW, when I saw the thread title, the first thing I thought of was Grosjean's complaints about the car during practice today, not Gutierrez. Grosjean says this same type of thing almost every week. Car is a disaster. Car is undriveable, etc, etc.

Edited by AustinF1, 13 May 2016 - 18:31.

[Kev00]

BTW, when I saw the thread title, the first thing I thought of was Grosjean's complaints about the car during practice today, not Gutierrez. Grosjean says this same type of thing almost every week. Car is a disaster. Car is undriveable, etc, etc.

Does he? On team radio maybe but you won't find any press interviews where he critics the team.

[AustinF1]

Does he? On team radio maybe but you won't find any press interviews where he critics the team.

Radio.

[FrontWing]

Button about Brawn 2009, during the second half of the year when Barrichello looked competitive and won a couple of races.

[LeClerc]

GP2 engine aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! 

[krea]

...and Ferrari has done sooooo much better since Alonso left. Right?

 

Yes, they improved quite alot based on the last year results.

Edited by krea, 13 May 2016 - 18:54.

[AustinF1]

Yes, they improved quite alot based on the last year results.

Really? They were 2nd last year, too, right?

[Kobasmashi]

[Archer]

Alonso in basically all his career, even when he was winning, I still can remember him paranoid in 2006 believing that his team didn't wanted him to win because he would get with him the number 1 to McLaren in 2007.

[krea]

Really? They were 2nd last year, too, right?

 

You should be able to use the internet

[AustinF1]

You should be able to use the internet

I can. Very well at that. And?

[Riverside]

 

 

 Hence my avatar.  Merci la marde ..... 

[king_crud]

Nigel Mansell - had the best car for a lot of 1991 and all of 1992, but he still had to show he overcame obstacles that didn't even occur, such as being stuck in gear when he won the British GP, even though that never happened etc. The biggest moaner ever

[Caboose]

Alonso in basically all his career, even when he was winning, I still can remember him paranoid in 2006 believing that his team didn't wanted him to win because he would get with him the number 1 to McLaren in 2007.

That wasn't that at all, it was that Renault would be trying to playing it too safe to win the constructor championship rather than go all out for both championships. That they should focus on both championships as winning the driver championship also helped beat Ferrari in the constructor championship. Renault ended up agreeing with him in the end.

[Graveltrappen]

Nigel Mansell - had the best car for a lot of 1991 and all of 1992, but he still had to show he overcame obstacles that didn't even occur, such as being stuck in gear when he won the British GP, even though that never happened etc. The biggest moaner ever

Mansell constantly reminds me of the 'Four Yorkshiremen' sketch...


https://youtu.be/Xe1a1wHxTyo

Edited by Graveltrappen, 13 May 2016 - 20:09.

[as65p]

http://www.bbc.com/s...rmula1/23495111

I asked for something similar to Gutierrez words. Not for some random Alonso story.

[as65p]

Yes, they improved quite alot based on the last year results.

 Into empty air, so to speak. Should they win titles in the next 2 to 3 years, then it would mean something, and only then.

[George Costanza]

Easy:

Alonso at Ferrari.

At least Fred drove the car where it really should not have been. 2011 and 2012, especially 2012 and 2014... 2010 was a one off for Fred. 2015? That horrible Mac Honda was by far the worst car he has ever drove, except for 2001 season.

Edited by George Costanza, 13 May 2016 - 20:24.

[Radion]

At least Fred drove the car where it really should not have been. 2011 and 2012, especially 2012, and in 2013.

Don't forget 2010. Also 2014. 

[George Costanza]

Don't forget 2010. Also 2014.

2010 was actually a little bit lackluster in the end. He should have won the title.

[HP]

...and Ferrari has done sooooo much better since Alonso left. Right?

You can do better that that. With the management reshuffle in the wake, did anyone think Ferrari would be out ahead on top in a short time? Especially when it became plain that the Mercedes power plant is out of reach. Ferrari's main deficit was the engine. And that was designed under the old guard.

 

Alonso himself, with all his skills did a lot of good. However I maintain, ultimately it was him who showed that the old Ferrari guards way of doing things didn't work any more. His skills basically masked the shortcomings of the Ferrari in his tenure with them. For the record, recently the same things starts to show at Mclaren.

 

A great driver himself simply doesn't make a great, winning team these days.

[Marklar]

I think we need to draw a fine line here. Drivers are always complaining about the car/team. Often in the team radio, sometimes even to the press and always internally (btw, I'm yet to see direct quotes of Alonso crititzising Ferrari, yet this topic seems to be all about him  ). So the answer to the OP question is in the end 'everyone'.
 
However, I admit that it doesn't irk me if drivers are critizising their teams, especially if they really gave them a car which they don't deserve based on their ability (which applies to Alonso most of the times in his Ferrari days btw) or if they were massively let down (which is in Gutierrez case partially true). It irks me more if drivers are doing that who aren't on merrit there and who owe their team more in reality. This wouldn't even irk me a lot without the self-praise (like Gutierrez 'I'm doing an f**** amazing job' or some stuff Maldonado used to say during his Williams days). This is going too far for me.
 
'A bad workman always blames his tools' is the perfect description for these kind of drivers.

Edited by Marklar, 13 May 2016 - 20:45.

[David Lightman]

The words Gutierrez and tool go well together.

[HP]

Alonso did criticise the team after he was fed up. Gutierrez however seems to be under pressure for his own failings. Did he show anything good at Sauber? Compared to his teammate in 2013? Did he get any better since?

 

2010 was actually a little bit lackluster in the end. He should have won the title.

Yup he had the opportunity to win it on merit, but then the team blew it too.

[Jvr]

I asked for something similar to Gutierrez words. Not for some random Alonso story.

 

Random? The rest of the world including LdM seem to have understood it differently than you.

 

On top of that he called his team idiots when the towing effect after Massa during qualifying was not successful (and Massa posted a better qualifying time)....

[AustinF1]

You can do better that that. With the management reshuffle in the wake, did anyone think Ferrari would be out ahead on top in a short time? Especially when it became plain that the Mercedes power plant is out of reach. Ferrari's main deficit was the engine. And that was designed under the old guard.

 

Alonso himself, with all his skills did a lot of good. However I maintain, ultimately it was him who showed that the old Ferrari guards way of doing things didn't work any more. His skills basically masked the shortcomings of the Ferrari in his tenure with them. For the record, recently the same things starts to show at Mclaren.

 

A great driver himself simply doesn't make a great, winning team these days.

I dunno. Did anyone think RBR would completely drop off the map and out of Ferrari's way?

 

But anyway, what has any of that to do with Alonso blaming his car?

[DampMongoose]

Lauda at Ferrari. Not how it appeared in Rush but it happened nonetheless.

[as65p]

 

Random? The rest of the world including LdM seem to have understood it differently than you.

 

On top of that he called his team idiots when the towing effect after Massa during qualifying was not successful (and Massa posted a better qualifying time)....

 

Not going into detail re: your twisted views, but anyway none of it is hyping himself and telling the world what a great job he is doing in a difficult car, like EG did in those quotes and to which similar examples were asked by the OP.

 

I mean, I can imagine why Alonso is always on your mind, but sorry, once again you missed the mark here.

[autosportfan]

This English idiom ( the workman blames ...) is one if the most stupid ones there is... Invented by people who have never done a thing ..
Try using metric tools on an American car!!!

Not an ALO fan but winning with a GP2 engine is unlikely (ALO clearly - for the benefit of the team and the fans does not "get it".. Pushing even when success is impossible!).

Good for him - I wouldn't even try. Better to direct the energy to development.

Edited by autosportfan, 13 May 2016 - 21:49.

[HeadFirst]

 

Random? The rest of the world including LdM seem to have understood it differently than you.

 

On top of that he called his team idiots when the towing effect after Massa during qualifying was not successful (and Massa posted a better qualifying time)....

 

Calling his team idiots is not blaming the tool. You want to get into drivers calling out management, mechanics, engineers and so on, this thread will be pages long in no time, based on this year alone.

[autosportfan]

After this outburst today from Gutierrez that his Haas is making him look bad and that it's hiding the '****ing' amazing job he's doing... In the car that Grosjean is making Haas look outstanding in...
Can you think of any examples of F1 drivers complaining about their cars so vocally? Especially those in decent or half-decent teams...
If it wasn't for Grosjean, Hass would look like yet another flop new team scraping around at the back... Surprised to see Gutierrez being so vocal when his f1 career could easily have been over based on what we've seen so far
http://www.motorspor...ery-bad-736141/

Mika Salo once returned to the pits in his Tyrell and said "Vitun Mopo!"

Could be translated as F******* Moped! :-)

Edited by autosportfan, 13 May 2016 - 21:31.

[MLC]

Easy:

 

Alonso at Ferrari.

 

 

Prost at Ferrari.

 

 

I took the opening post to mean drivers complaining about the car, even tough their teammate is successful. Both Alonso and Prost were consistently faster than Massa/Raikkonen and Alesi, respectively. In fact, Raikkonen at Ferrari would be a better example than Alonso. 

[warp]

I think we need to draw a fine line here. Drivers are always complaining about the car/team. Often in the team radio, sometimes even to the press and always internally (btw, I'm yet to see direct quotes of Alonso crititzising Ferrari, yet this topic seems to be all about him  ). So the answer to the OP question is in the end 'everyone'.
 
However, I admit that it doesn't irk me if drivers are critizising their teams, especially if they really gave them a car which they don't deserve based on their ability (which applies to Alonso most of the times in his Ferrari days btw) or if they were massively let down (which is in Gutierrez case partially true). It irks me more if drivers are doing that who aren't on merrit there and who owe their team more in reality. This wouldn't even irk me a lot without the self-praise (like Gutierrez 'I'm doing an f**** amazing job' or some stuff Maldonado used to say during his Williams days). This is going too far for me.
 
'A bad workman always blames his tools' is the perfect description for these kind of drivers.

 

 

I took the opening post to mean drivers complaining about the car, even tough their teammate is successful. Both Alonso and Prost were consistently faster than Massa/Raikkonen and Alesi, respectively. In fact, Raikkonen at Ferrari would be a better example than Alonso. 

 

 

This.... 

 

 

Kimi at Ferrari 2014 was a better example, but Alonso always gets a bad rap...

 

http://www.gpupdate....rari-front-end/

 

 

 

In any case, neither driver was in the wrong (Alonso or Kimi). Gutierrez should STFU and take one for the team. To just be happy he still is in F1.

Edited by warp, 13 May 2016 - 21:54.

[KnucklesAgain]

Easy:

 

Alonso at Ferrari.

 

You should be required to provide quotes for this because it was actually not that much given the long time he was there and the disappointing cars they gave him year after year.

 

Edit: I see you came up with one thing, and you had to dig deep for sure.
 

Edited by KnucklesAgain, 13 May 2016 - 22:25.

[HP]

I dunno. Did anyone think RBR would completely drop off the map and out of Ferrari's way?

 

But anyway, what has any of that to do with Alonso blaming his car?

Read your post that I responded to. What had that to do with Alonso blaming his car either?

 

But then, didn't Alonso last year declare the Honda being a GP2 engine? If you have access to Autosport plus, and read the interview with Ron Dennis, then it should be obvious that at least in his eyes Alonso did blame the car then.

Edited by HP, 14 May 2016 - 00:23.

[Fisico54]

Merhi last season

[Fisico54]

Prost at Ferrari.

Either you don't understand the thread or don't know what your talking about

[Jvr]

You should be required to provide quotes for this because it was actually not that much given the long time he was there and the disappointing cars they gave him year after year.

 

Edit: I see you came up with one thing, and you had to dig deep for sure.
 

 

The whole world that has been following the F1 at least with half an eye knows about ear tweaking. So to put it in another words, I only needed to scratch the surface...

 

And he called his team idiots over the radio.

Edited by Jvr, 14 May 2016 - 00:56.

[Jvr]

Calling his team idiots is not blaming the tool. You want to get into drivers calling out management, mechanics, engineers and so on, this thread will be pages long in no time, based on this year alone.

You are absolutely correct, it is not blaming the car: it is even worse since it gets personal.

Edited by Jvr, 14 May 2016 - 01:05.