36 replies to this topic

[jcbc3]

http://www.carmagazi...b-001-hypercar/

 

She's not a look'er, IMHO

Naturally aspirated V12. A bit behind the times.

 

hmmmm, consider me underwhelmed.

[saudoso]

Make believe hybrid fuel efficiency in million dollars gas guzzlers is the pinnacle of hypocrisy.

Well done AM & RB.

[jcbc3]

I don't think LaFerrari Ferrari or McLaren P-1 hybrid systems are peddled for fuel economy?

[saudoso]

Green washing, go with the hype, rest assured.

Edited by saudoso, 05 July 2016 - 14:20.

[JHSingo]

Great. Just one question: what's the point of it?

[Nonesuch]

Great. Just one question: what's the point of it?

 
Its shape is such that the reflection of the Burj Khalifa will look stunning in the afternoon sun.

 

The article does mention a track-spec though with such a low number of cars being made it's unlikely to see any proper racing action.

[Ross Stonefeld]

"track spec" is a vague term. 

[Canuck]

I rather like the shape. Its outrageous like a hypercar should be, I has a V12 like a hypercar should and it looks neither like a Ferrari or a Lambo. Of course it's £2-3M - have you looked at the gap between the 99.5 and the .5 lately? They have a shitload of money to get rid of.

[Canuck]

Hyper - not hybrid. Nothing I read in there says anything about green or hybrid or economy or anything of that ilk. Its a "new" V12 of unknown spec.

[MatsNorway]

Looks way cooler than a 918 at least. But surely it will not look like that when it is done? It has allmost no space for the engine with that massive tunnel.

 

My favorite front from AM is this one tho: http://cdn.wp.sunmot...t/2014/07/9.jpg

Concept sketch: http://cdntbs.astonm.../img/dp1003.jpg

Edited by MatsNorway, 05 July 2016 - 16:50.

[saudoso]

Great. Just one question: what's the point of it?

It's a toy.

[jcbc3]

Hyper - not hybrid. Nothing I read in there says anything about green or hybrid or economy or anything of that ilk. Its a "new" V12 of unknown spec.

 

Which is what Saudoso and I agreed on. So, now we all agree.

 

However, I think it would be nice if a new hyper car utilized the latest and best power generating technology. Which Saudoso disagreed with.

[Ross Stonefeld]

It's going to be pretty lightweight? If so, you can just put a 'basic' V12 in it and have a very stout car. You can do a medium amount of horsepower rather than a stupidly high level that requires fancy engines, petrol or otherwise. 

[MatsNorway]

The LaFerrari is nearly 800hp NA engine right? seems good enough to me. I do not have a problem with simpler and louder cars.

 

What i found odd however is the 918.. it has all the gagethry stuff. but it is a NA V8.. I just found that compromise strange. A crazy boxer 6 turbo or just V8 turbo would have made more sense to me.

 

Then again.. Porsche high end cars have never made sense..Carrera GT was NA V10 RWD meanwhile the 911 had fancy turboes, 4wd++... it is as if they are not even trying to make a supercar..

Edited by MatsNorway, 05 July 2016 - 18:51.

[saudoso]

Which is what Saudoso and I agreed on. So, now we all agree.

 

However, I think it would be nice if a new hyper car utilized the latest and best power generating technology. Which Saudoso disagreed with.

So nice to disagree in a civilised manner for a change. 

 

They want it setting really low lap times in street legal configuration, or so I've read. Like beating F1 times. 

 

It's most bang for the kg they need. And that's going to be achieved with simpler solutions, IMO.

 

And that they'll rock the greenish supercar boat will be a bonus.

Edited by saudoso, 05 July 2016 - 20:52.

[JHSingo]

It's a toy.

I mean, I understand that, but I still don't really get the point of it.

I said a similar thing about the Bugatti Chiron, when there was news about its top speed etc. I don't understand the obsession with crazy performance figures. Like they say this will be similar in performance to LMP1s, and the Bugatti's stupid top speed. Well, great. But so what? There are very few places on earth where you are capable of really exploiting what cars like those can do, and I doubt many (if any) of the owners would be willing to try. You've got a more realistic chance of thrashing one on a sim racer like Assetto Corsa or whatever, than you have in real life. It's just numbers for numbers' sake.

And let's be honest, these cars aren't going to be thrashed. They're going to be driven carefully, perhaps making an appearance at a car show somewhere, and spending the rest of the time under a sheet in some rich guy's garage.

I say this as a keen petrol head, but cars like these may well be technically fascinating, but I genuinely don't get why they need to exist beyond the concept car stage. Why design a car that is so beyond anything else that it is essentially utterly pointless? Or is it just a case that there's so many rich people out there willing to buy such a thing, and because they can?

Thinking about it, this might have been better for the "what grinds your gears" topic in paddock club.

[BRG]

Those aren't real pictures are they?  They look like CG images.  Have they actually made any of these cars?  I suspect not yet, otherwise, they might have pushed one outside into the real world and photographed it.

[Canuck]

Well...good of me to read the article 3 times before posting, but not the posts that prompted the response

Which is what Saudoso and I agreed on. So, now we all agree.

However, I think it would be nice if a new hyper car utilized the latest and best power generating technology. Which Saudoso disagreed with.

[gruntguru]

- Looks OK to me. No doubt they will set up some billionaire focus groups to evaluate the styling.

- The "point" is to be the best at something (acceleration, top speed, track performance, wank-factor etc)

- Any hybridization would be performance oriented eg to simplify AWD, torque vectoring, peak power etc

[Canuck]

Thousands (millions?) of new sport bikes are sold every spring based on a couple more horsepower, a few less pounds, a tenth quicker acceleration and a hundredth faster lap time. I would guess that far less than 1% can use even 60% of their bike's performance, but they'll plunk another chunk of change down for next year's version to maintain bragging rights.

Hypercars are just hyper-rich-boys (and girls) toys of the same fashion. They're also a statement about their economic status. Win-win I suppose.

[Victor_RO]

Those aren't real pictures are they?  They look like CG images.  Have they actually made any of these cars?  I suspect not yet, otherwise, they might have pushed one outside into the real world and photographed it.

 

A non-running model was on display for journos at the Aston Martin factory next to a RB9, and the pictures look like that model was photographed and then photoshopped into various locations at the RB factory.

 

Car isn't even close to production spec yet, but it sounds like they've finalized how it's going to look like and the main aero spec.

[thegforcemaybewithyou]

I read that the hybrid part is onboard as the car does not have a reverse gear installed!

[jcbc3]

It's a toy.

 

Well, here's one hyper car owner that doesn't treat his as a toy (solely)

 

[werks prototype]

Well, great. But so what?

 

Art for art's sake. Engineering for engineering's sake. No justification needed. I think it is great. Particularly the colour.

[werks prototype]

Those aren't real pictures are they?  They look like CG images.  Have they actually made any of these cars?  I suspect not yet, otherwise, they might have pushed one outside into the real world and photographed it.

 

http://www.telegraph...ehind-the-hype/

 

I don't know if it is a 'running' though.

[bigleagueslider]

For $3M+ you can buy a Cessna Mustang that seats 4 passengers and 2 pilots, and cruises at over 390mph.

[Peter0Scandlyn]

http://www.telegraph...ehind-the-hype/

 

I don't know if it is a 'running' though.

 

That picture should give you a clue?

It's standing still.........

[thegforcemaybewithyou]

Nice bit from Newey from the Telegraph article.

 

Despite claims that the unit will be naturally-aspirated, Newey doesn't turn down some sort of hybridisation.

 

"I haven't commented on the rest of it [the engine]," he says, though he claims that the AM-RB 001 will start

with an advantage compared with the McLaren P1 and La Ferrari, because their hybrid systems add another 50 per cent in weight.

[Greg Locock]

As it happens I was at the Gaydon museum yesterday, in the collection they have many styling and show cars,of which maybe 5% could ever have been driven around a car park.

[Nathan]

So...will it trump the MacF1?

 

I think this is an awesome project.  Wish I had the money...

[desmo]

They want it setting really low lap times in street legal configuration, or so I've read. Like beating F1 times.

Any supercar in "track spec" billing itself as such should be able to lap faster than an F1, there so are few restraints on aero or powertrain. In reality I don't think any of the so-called supercars can lap anywhere near an F1's times, so I'd rate them as mostly poseur props or--yes--toys than serious. As they stand supercars are surely among the least technically impressive of all road vehicles. Look at how many tiny outfits produce them with limited resources. I am way more impressed by a significantly above average econobox than a significantly above average supercar; the former is probably 1000x harder to do.

[Ross Stonefeld]

They'd have to have an insane amount of aero on that thing to do F1 times, it doesn't weigh much less than a DTM car I think.

 

And that's assuming it will have the tire for it. 

[gruntguru]

One problem is tyres. A supercar has to be tuned to run street-legal tyres. Sure it can be re-tuned for sticky slicks but you are still stuck with suspension that was originally designed for street tyres, some bump absorption capability and sufficient durability to be road driven without breaking frequently.

 

Next problem is aero - measured in down-force per unit vehicle mass. This requires a lot of plan area plus venturis plus near-zero ride height and/or a lot of wing area and/or very low curb weight (which obviously conflicts with many road-car requirements (safety, comfort, noise abatement, emissions, lighting etc etc))

[Greg Locock]

I did preliminary work on a road car that in simulations would have achieved F1 times on the track. However it would have needed tires that didn't exist although the spec was not outside of an achievable envelope. It was a fan car, the ducts for which consumed vast amounts of the interior space in the car.

[saudoso]

I was just parroting what I'd read: http://www.motorspor...f1-cars-680099/

[gruntguru]

Useful article thanks Saudoso.

 

The use of "extreme ground effect" is of some interest to me. I am constantly surprised by the absence of skirts on a variety of road and race cars where they are not prohibited. Colin Chapman showed the way with the Lotus 88. Connect the skirts (and optionally the entire underbody) to the suspension to maintain a small clearance between the skirt and the ground. Current technology would allow a further step - electronic control of skirt height to maintain minimum ground clearance while avoiding contact with obstacles.

[BRG]

Like that would work on the roads here in Surrey....