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#4451 D28

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Posted 19 December 2018 - 21:30

OK.  When Tambay stepped in at Ferrari for Villeneuve in 1982, Ferrari wanted to change something, but FISA refused permission.

 

What was it they wanted to change, and how?

Did Ferrari seek to retire the #27 perhaps?


Edited by D28, 19 December 2018 - 21:31.


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#4452 ensign14

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Posted 19 December 2018 - 23:23

They did indeed - what number did they want instead?



#4453 JtP2

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Posted 19 December 2018 - 23:25

Ferrari wanted 37. Tambay told the FIA, any number but 27



#4454 Ray Bell

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Posted 19 December 2018 - 23:30

I wouldn't have thought Tambay had anything against Alan...



#4455 ensign14

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Posted 19 December 2018 - 23:38

Ferrari wanted 37. Tambay told the FIA, any number but 27

 

Yes, that's the answer.  Ludicrous from FISA not to give way on that.  But that's Balestre for you.



#4456 john winfield

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Posted 20 December 2018 - 14:09

Did someone mention the Stutz Black Hawk earlier in this thread?  Anyway, here's a quick question while JtP2 gathers his thoughts:

 

What do Frank Lockhart, Stirling Moss and Gerry Marshall have in common?



#4457 john winfield

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 08:34

To help a little, what do Frank Lockhart, Stirling Moss, Pat Moss and Gerry Marshall have in common?



#4458 Ray Bell

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 13:03

American parentage/heritage?



#4459 john winfield

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 13:32

Not as far as I know Ray, but I did throw in a bit of a red herring. Not THAT Frank Lockhart.....more Rover Special than Stutz Black Hawk.



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#4460 Ray Bell

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 13:35

Another Lockhart, eh?

 

John Medley might know...



#4461 john winfield

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 13:40

And just as an afterthought I could also add recent F1 driver Mark Webber to the list. But not quite.



#4462 D-Type

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 13:46

They also rode horses.



#4463 john winfield

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 13:48

They probably did Duncan, but that's not what I'm looking for! 

 

Where might they have ridden their horses?



#4464 john winfield

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 15:12

If I told you where they once all lived would it ring any bells..........?



#4465 Tim Murray

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 15:21

As in Tring Tring?

#4466 Allan Lupton

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 15:21

If I told you where they once all lived would it ring any bells..........?

Buckinghamshire perhaps?

ETA but perhaps Tim has a better answer. . .


Edited by Allan Lupton, 21 December 2018 - 15:23.


#4467 john winfield

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 15:36

You're right, Allan, he does!  Well done Tim.

 

I think Frank Lockhart had a business in Dunstable, but lived in Tring. He drove his Rover Special at vintage meetings for years and years and years.

 

Stirling and Pat Moss moved with their parents to White Cloud Farm (I forget its original name) on the back lane that runs from the Aylesbury end of the town to the Natural History Museum.

 

Gerry Marshall and John Wingfield had the garage in Tring, and I'm pretty sure Gerry lived in the town. 'Thespian's Orchard'? Gregor will know where.

 

And Mark Webber lived (lives?) two miles down the road in Aston Clinton.

 

Over to you Mr. Murray.



#4468 Tim Murray

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 15:48

Thanks John. I’m currently on a train, and will be away from all my books and magazines until after Christmas. I’ll try to come up with something in the meantime, but please anyone, fire away if you’ve got a question ready to roll.

#4469 D28

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 16:08

OK this is connected to question 4450.

 

Where and when did Gilles Villeneuve and Didier Pironi first race each other?


Edited by D28, 21 December 2018 - 18:43.


#4470 Michael Ferner

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 18:44

San Félicien, Quebec, August 1977? Gilles won, Didier was 7th.

#4471 D28

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Posted 21 December 2018 - 19:05

San Félicien, Quebec, August 1977? Gilles won, Didier was 7th.

Make that St Félicien and it is absolutely correct. Very well done, was a surprise to me to read it that a few days back. Seems he was brought in to partner Rosberg but only for the one race. Over to you, or maybe JtP2 is waiting a turn.

#4472 Michael Ferner

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 09:10

Saint Félicien, of course - I was tired.

Of those who finished between Gilles and Didier, four have much in common. Who's the one who sticks out?

#4473 ReWind

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 10:31

David Oxton (because he is not an American as Gloy, Mead, Cogan and Holmes are)


Edited by ReWind, 22 December 2018 - 10:31.


#4474 Gregor Marshall

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 15:37

If I was answering John's original question I would have said Jewish heritage, as Dad was born Gerald Moses in 1941, with the Marshall did not come until the '50s and it was always a standing joke between Dad and Stirling that they were probably related with Moses and Moss, as the original word/surname would probably have been Moshe (Hebrew for Moses). 

 

I'm not sure on the Tring link though, as I know Frank's business was in Berkhamsted, but I must admit I don't know where he lived. He used to drive his Team Bentley 3 litre to meet up with Dad (and a few other local racers) every Friday at The Half Moon in Wilstone (next to Tring), so would've looked locally.

 

Dad never lived in Tring, he did own a house there, but that had belonged to race mechanic Don Abrahams who was a great friend and Dad bought it after he died and it was opposite Marshall Wingfield, which had moved there after John's death. Whilst the garage was in Tring, Dad lived in Aston Clinton, Berkhamsted and Pitstone, with Thespians Orchard being in Pitstone, 3 miles from Tring.

 

Good luck for the next question!!


Edited by Gregor Marshall, 22 December 2018 - 15:37.


#4475 Michael Ferner

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 15:48

Reinhard is right with David Oxton, who also never competed at IMS. Over to you, ReWind!

#4476 ReWind

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 16:02

Which racing driver gave his four sons names of famous scientists?

At least two of them also raced, one crashing fatally.

Question has nothing to do with Formula One and goes well back in time.



#4477 ensign14

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 18:28

If I was answering John's original question I would have said Jewish heritage, as Dad was born Gerald Moses in 1941, with the Marshall did not come until the '50s and it was always a standing joke between Dad and Stirling that they were probably related with Moses and Moss, as the original word/surname would probably have been Moshe (Hebrew for Moses). 

 

Indeed, the Moss family surname was Moses a generation or two before Alfred...



#4478 john winfield

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Posted 22 December 2018 - 23:25

If I was answering John's original question I would have said Jewish heritage, as Dad was born Gerald Moses in 1941, with the Marshall did not come until the '50s and it was always a standing joke between Dad and Stirling that they were probably related with Moses and Moss, as the original word/surname would probably have been Moshe (Hebrew for Moses). 

 

I'm not sure on the Tring link though, as I know Frank's business was in Berkhamsted, but I must admit I don't know where he lived. He used to drive his Team Bentley 3 litre to meet up with Dad (and a few other local racers) every Friday at The Half Moon in Wilstone (next to Tring), so would've looked locally.

 

Dad never lived in Tring, he did own a house there, but that had belonged to race mechanic Don Abrahams who was a great friend and Dad bought it after he died and it was opposite Marshall Wingfield, which had moved there after John's death. Whilst the garage was in Tring, Dad lived in Aston Clinton, Berkhamsted and Pitstone, with Thespians Orchard being in Pitstone, 3 miles from Tring.

 

Good luck for the next question!!

 

Thanks Gregor!

 

There you are, I've never been one to let real facts get in the way of an interesting but woefully inaccurate question.... :)

 

I never realised your Dad lived in Aston Clinton, Berko and Pitstone! With the garage in Tring, and your football in Potten End, you must have the complete set!  While we're at it, I think top speedway rider Tommy Price used to live in Wigginton (a village just outside Tring).



#4479 ReWind

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Posted 29 December 2018 - 16:03

Which racing driver gave his four sons names of famous scientists?

At least two of them also raced, one crashing fatally.

Question has nothing to do with Formula One and goes well back in time.

Just a gentle reminder.

If nobody comes up with a suggestion I will give the answer next year   ;) and someone else can ask another question.



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#4480 ReWind

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 16:17

The sons of Argentinian Cástulo Hortal (1894 – 1980) were Edisón, Darwin, Nóbel & Franklin Hortal.

Edisón crashed fatally in 1947.

Whoever has a good riddle can take over.



#4481 D-Type

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 16:36

A quick and easy one while people think of a difficult one.

Apart from winning Le Mans what do the following drivers have in common:  Duncan Hamilton, Lorenzo Bandini, and Paul Frere?



#4482 D28

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 19:54

A quick and easy one while people think of a difficult one.

Apart from winning Le Mans what do the following drivers have in common:  Duncan Hamilton, Lorenzo Bandini, and Paul Frere?

Probably not what you have in mind, but all had a career in motor sport outside the cockpit. A car dealer, mechanic and journalist respectively.


Edited by D28, 03 January 2019 - 19:55.


#4483 D-Type

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 20:15

Probably not what you have in mind, but all had a career in motor sport outside the cockpit. A car dealer, mechanic and journalist respectively.

No, not what I had in mind.  What these three have in common is more unusual than having a day job.



#4484 2F-001

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 06:54

They all died in countries other than the ones from which they took their nationalities?



#4485 Tim Murray

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 09:11

That doesn’t work for Hamilton, I believe. He was born and died in the UK, which at the time of his birth included all of the island of Ireland.

#4486 Bloggsworth

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 09:57

Just had a quiz question sent from Canada by my brother - A photo of a car which may have been taken in, or around, the Hong Kong area post war. It came from the collection of a member of VARAC's father-in-law.

 

Unknown-car-Hong-Kong.jpg



#4487 2F-001

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 10:32

That doesn’t work for Hamilton, I believe. He was born and died in the UK, which at the time of his birth included all of the island of Ireland.

Ah, yes, I didn't think that through thoroughly enough, did I?

(Although, to be honest, I thought my 'answer' was somewhat 'clutching at straws' anyway...)



#4488 Tim Murray

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 11:50

We were both thinking along the same lines, Tony. I was looking at all three being born outside the countries from which they took their nationalities, as Frère was born in France and Bandini in the (then) Italian colony of Libya, but knocked that theory on the head when I realised that Hamilton had been born in the UK. Back to the drawing board ...

#4489 D-Type

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 13:29

We were both thinking along the same lines, Tony. I was looking at all three being born outside the countries from which they took their nationalities, as Frère was born in France and Bandini in the (then) Italian colony of Libya, but knocked that theory on the head when I realised that Hamilton had been born in the UK. Back to the drawing board ...

That's what I had in mind.  Libya and Ireland are now separate from Italy or the UK.


Edited by D-Type, 04 January 2019 - 14:11.


#4490 Arjan de Roos

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 16:46

D-Type, you then forgot to mention Bertrand Gachot, born in Luxemburg, yet French nationality. Won LM in 1991.  ;)



#4491 D28

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 17:26

I believe Luigi Chinetti was an American citizen in 1949, so could belong on the list as well.



#4492 nexfast

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 19:28

And many others. Andretti, Rudi Fischer, Beuttler,  Cannon, Archie Baring, Ian Ashley, Rindt,  Ceccoto Jr., John Duff,  just to name a few.



#4493 D-Type

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 20:17

If you put too many names in the list it makes it too easy.   :smoking:

 

But now we should be onto that Hong Kong car


Edited by D-Type, 04 January 2019 - 20:19.


#4494 Arjan de Roos

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Posted 07 January 2019 - 08:05

And many others. Andretti, Rudi Fischer, Beuttler,  Cannon, Archie Baring, Ian Ashley, Rindt,  Ceccoto Jr., John Duff,  just to name a few.

Who won Le Mans? Rindt kept his German nationality, despite growing up as and feeling an Austrian, he of course raced under Austrian licence. 



#4495 nexfast

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Posted 07 January 2019 - 20:38

True, I forgot  the original question indicated LeMans. On nationalities this would be a never ending discussion about place of birth, country of licence, double nationality or more (to take your example above wasn't Gachot also Belgian? ) or even the more subjective feeling of each driver. In my files I use the most common nationality with an indication of other link with a different country (say Jochen Rindt (A) , born in Germany). Things become more complicated when changes occur in the middle of a career (N. Rosberg that goes from SF to D, Mortara that goes from I to CH or Grosjean who went from CH to F, for instance). Not to mention colonial territories like South Rodhesia (shall we call John Love British since independence was never recognised?), Algeria (not independent when Guy Moll was born) or Macao which nationality does not exist (people there is either Chinese or Portuguese). Perhaps food for thought for another thread but again most probably inconclusive.



#4496 D-Type

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Posted 07 January 2019 - 20:43

Who won Le Mans? Rindt kept his German nationality, despite growing up as and feeling an Austrian, he of course raced under Austrian licence. 

I left Rindt out because of his German nationality.  He didn't fit the "Born in one country but raced as another nationality" criterion too well.
 

But we are forgetting Bloggsworth's Hong Kong Canadian car.  Was it based on a Japanese military vehicle?



#4497 Arjan de Roos

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Posted 08 January 2019 - 06:43

..... wasn't Gachot also Belgian? 

He was born in Luxemburg, his father being French and mother German. He was raised in Belgium (due to his fathers job at the EU) and raced under Belgian and later French licence, but as far as I know always had a French passport/nationality. 



#4498 Arjan de Roos

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Posted 08 January 2019 - 06:46

.....
 

But we are forgetting Bloggsworth's Hong Kong Canadian car.  Was it based on a Japanese military vehicle?

 

Maybe moving away from that area I have one: name the Dutch speaking racing driver who could start up his race car from his private garage and proceed directly on the racetrack? 



#4499 Michael Ferner

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Posted 08 January 2019 - 14:08

Well, Teddy Yip spoke many languages. And yes, Dutch too.

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#4500 Arjan de Roos

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Posted 08 January 2019 - 14:25

Over to you Michael!