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McLaren Honda MCL32


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#51 mclarensmps

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 20:40

Best keep that discussion away from here. People don't know how to behave on the internet.



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#52 Marklar

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 21:09

I always wonder how many female members are in this forum tbh and once I tempted to make a poll but I gave up doing that.

I'm sure you can do that if it's done in a similar way like here (replace first language with gender perhaps  :p )

 

Otherwise you can use the search function of this forum. Of those who are stating the gender

 

Male 4589 (92.67 %)

Female 363 (7.33 %)

 

Think it looks different if you are doing a poll though. Many are not stating their gender.


Edited by Marklar, 18 January 2017 - 21:11.


#53 bermuditas

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 03:11

Where's the orange on this one?

yeah my bad, on my phone looked orangy, my lack of sleep is playing me games  :drunk:



#54 Craven Morehead

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 06:39

Macca going orange for 2017?



#55 Sebastien007

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 10:11

Let's hope that Owen have some good inside information to share with us.



#56 RainyAfterlifeDaylight

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 10:27

Let's hope that Owen have some good inside information to share with us.

Based on the information I received, he couldn't get out and the orange guys have imprisoned him in the basement alongside Patrick. They have even tortured him by showing him earth dreams livery three times since.  :D


Edited by RainyAfterlifeDaylight, 19 January 2017 - 10:31.


#57 Lotus53B

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 10:36

I'm having terrible nightmares of Fred and Stoffel OD'ing on spray tan for the launch.



#58 Owen

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 14:04

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I'm back. Having been lucky enough to go MTC and chat with the team, I'll share my thoughts below. Something like 25 people got an invite, some had travelled from Spain to experience it. I will endeavour not to stray too far from the topic - which is the MP4-32. 

I had an incredible day. We got a tour of the MTC including the (new) SAP mission control simulator which features a huge holographic display with motion control - not kidding! - think Minority Report... We got to drive on a demo F1 simulator which looked great. And finally we got to meet Stoffel Vandoorne and get photographs with him. He sat in the sim and immediately beat our best time by over 8 seconds(!). Our host was Matt Bishop - a lovely guy who put us at our ease. He was very complimentary about the role fans play in keeping the team spirits up. We met with Zak who hosted a Q&A just with us, I was the nearest to him! He's such a passionate guy - his influence is very different to Ron's but now very visible. The way he says 'Proast' is very special. The place feels different. We kept on seeing Zak, Eric and Stoffel in the corridors as we went around the place. Zak does things quite differently to Ron and can often been seen taking calls while wondering around and doing business. Ron (in his day) was often at his desk, from what I can gather. So I think a quiet culture change has manifested itself.

Regarding expectations; I think it's more progress they are looking for. Nobody had anything but praise for Honda - they reckon a stride has been made over the winter by Honda and they also acknowledged they had room for improvement on the chassis. Podiums seem to be the goal but nobody said that. Stoffel was very focused and quite intense at times. He looks extremely trim - zero fat on him! He talked very well but you could tell he was media trained. I was impressed by him. We saw him at the gym and we saw him getting photographed with the new team kit on (we weren't meant to see either of those lol). We saw the new caps for next year. Some of us even saw the new car - just a tub for now. There is nothing to see of it guys. I was lucky enough to meet with some of the aero team who gave me a signed picture - I was very honoured. They said the car will not be completed until the final hours before the launch and all the parts are being manufactured so there is no 'car' to see as such yet. They sounded reasonably confident but they are worried by Newey - they always are. All key employees have seen x2 renders of the new livery. And it is new. Is it Orange? I don't know. I suspect it has orange in it, as the team wear appeared to. Saw Fernando's media person (Sylvia) but not him, he's currently training far away. Absolute 100% conviction from the team that they will be back at the top. You got that across the board. Pics of the day are on my facebook. Here's a couple. Massive thanks to McLaren for this day. Was unforgettable. 

 

Owen.jpg

 

Stoff.jpg



#59 noikeee

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 14:22

 


What did you do to poor Stoffel, he looks traumatized.
 

Thanks for the write-up!



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#60 f1rules

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 14:22

thanks Owen  :up:  great stuff  :up:



#61 f1rules

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 14:23

any new sponsors on the team kit apart from castrol 



#62 Owen

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 14:33

What did you do to poor Stoffel, he looks traumatized.

Thanks for the write-up!

He needs to work on his corporate smile, he was like that in all the photos from the day lol.

#63 Owen

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 14:34

any new sponsors on the team kit apart from castrol

None that I saw but Zak has said he wants to make an impact with new sponsors this year so you never know.

#64 aportinga

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 14:36

welcome to the good side......but don't let Conosur or The Eau Rouger hear another Ferrari fan has left the building.

 

 

The drunked artist who make miracles happen on canvas knows. Is Eau Rouger still alive? I figured he would have been it in some bar fight out in Queens after finally giving the finger to the wrong person!



#65 Mc_Silver

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 14:47

You're such a lucky bastard Owen! How I wish I was there. Such a great place and cool environment. It seems there is a great spirit and culture change within the team with Zak coming onboard. Please can you tell us how the new caps looks? What color is it?



#66 Owen

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 14:54

You're such a lucky bastard Owen! How I wish I was there. Such a great place and cool environment. It seems there is a great spirit and culture change within the team with Zak coming onboard. Please can you tell us how the new caps looks? What color is it?

Light grey - with red.

Edited by Owen, 19 January 2017 - 14:55.


#67 Braai52

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 15:25

Hi Guys,

Firstly, This the best thread by a long margin!

Secondly, Owen you are luckiest guy on this thread I believe! Thanx for the great info.

Thirdly, Does anyone know, or know how close Honda's 2017 PU is ( as far as Dyno numbers are concerned) compared to our competition???

I don't post much, but I'm a good listener and reader, but have pick up zero so far!

Anyone! :kiss: 



#68 Sebastien007

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 15:32

Many many thanks to Owen.



#69 Maustinsj

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 16:07

Nice one Owen  :up:  it's a little while since I was there (2014 I think), but there were NO cameras/phones allowed out on that particular occasion so it's great that you were able to get some good photos.  :cool:

 

Did they show you the Specialized bike?



#70 Owen

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 16:13

Nice one Owen  :up:  it's a little while since I was there (2014 I think), but there were NO cameras/phones allowed out on that particular occasion so it's great that you were able to get some good photos.  :cool:

 

Did they show you the Specialized bike?

Yeh, we got a guided tour of all boulevard exhibits (of which the bike was one). Shell stickers back on the 80s McLarens now that the ExxonMobil contract is complete. 



#71 RainyAfterlifeDaylight

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 16:18

Renault: Honda F1 engine made great progress in 2016

 

 

"Honda's progress has been very impressive," Bell told Autosport. "They've done a great job and it's great to see them up there.

 

http://www.autosport...n-2016--renault


Edited by RainyAfterlifeDaylight, 19 January 2017 - 16:26.


#72 bill p

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 16:22

Am I the only one that wouldn't like an orange McLaren? I know it's a iconic in its own way, but the victorious and iconic McLaren isn't remembered in orange...


Tell that to a CaAm fan, championship winners 1967-71 in papaya orange cars.........

#73 Mc_Silver

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 16:38

Light grey - with red.

 

3a79f074-12b4-4174-bb1e-b2add38e7b36.jpg



#74 mclarensmps

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 16:53

Yeh, we got a guided tour of all boulevard exhibits (of which the bike was one). Shell stickers back on the 80s McLarens now that the ExxonMobil contract is complete. 

 

But did you get a guided tour of Rob, Rom and Patrick's offices?



#75 Owen

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 18:58

But did you get a guided tour of Rob, Rom and Patrick's offices?

Didn't have the necessary security pass.

#76 Quickshifter

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 20:24

@ Owen. You are one lucky fecker. Great post. Thanks. You must have had a blast out there. Can't help being envious of you..

#77 CPR

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 21:02

More about graphene:
http://www.mclaren.c...aphene-1322254/
 

“In Formula 1, our carbon-fibre construction techniques mean we could significantly increase the stiffness and strength of the monocoque, but that would substantially increase the loadings on the driver, which we want to avoid. And that’s why every Formula 1 car is mandated to incorporate deformable crash-proof structures around the car; they’re designed to progressively deform to best protect the driver.



But are we actually going to see it on a F1 car? I guess if the FIA don't allow it then we'll see it on a McLaren road car first... (if it's all it's cracked up to be)
 



#78 Lotus53B

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 21:26

If things deform, they disappate energy.  If they are stiff enough to survive themselves, they pass the energy on to the occupant - that's why folk used to get more injured when bits of the car intruded into the cockpit - now they curl up and die and leave the survival cell intact.

If I'm right, graphene sounds like a solution to a different problem.



#79 Owen

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 22:07

The graphene watch is 1$m - so clearly there is a cost issue. But it was discovered here. And I note that there is a official tie up between Richard Mille and the University of Manchester.

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#80 Lotus53B

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Posted 19 January 2017 - 22:10

$1M?  For that thing?

 

It looks awful, imo.

 

Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months. ..



#81 Owen

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Posted 20 January 2017 - 07:56

The guys from Liberty have visited McLaren at Woking recently. Zak mentioned that in his Q & A.

#82 RainyAfterlifeDaylight

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Posted 20 January 2017 - 09:41

The guys from Liberty have visited McLaren at Woking recently. Zak mentioned that in his Q & A.

Black and White livery will be nice  :)

 

1024px-Liberty_Media.svg.png



#83 tbones

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Posted 20 January 2017 - 18:28

The drunked artist who make miracles happen on canvas knows. Is Eau Rouger still alive? I figured he would have been it in some bar fight out in Queens after finally giving the finger to the wrong person!

yeah, alive and kicking.....made his way all the way out to washington state last september for visit.  Other than being critical of the red guys strategy and poor other performace, it's the same ol anger Eau Rouger like always.



#84 smr

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Posted 20 January 2017 - 20:40

Great write up Owen... so with the new team wear having orange in - I'd take that to mean the car will definitely have orange in...

 

I don't think it'll be as much orange as some of the mock ups have though - I'm thinking more flashes and trims of orange, and quite subtle/deft touches of it - pretty much like how much red there was on last year's car - I'm thinking the same amount but orange, maybe slightly more.

 

Did the team wear look decent? Not garish ?

 

Hope the MP4-32 is a fast car, can't wait for the launch and testing now :)



#85 Owen

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Posted 20 January 2017 - 22:30

Team wear seems more conservative yes.

#86 ermo

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Posted 21 January 2017 - 00:18

The livery will be ugly, the chassis will have an overabundance of "unlocked potential" and the PU will be down on power and blow up willy nilly.

Oh and I'll be wrong as usual. :wave:

 

 

(great writeup Owen! :up: )


Edited by ermo, 21 January 2017 - 00:18.


#87 muramasa

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Posted 21 January 2017 - 14:43

 

Hasegawa interview articles
 
looking at the contents it's obviously from the same interview session on 21 Dec 2016
http://forums.autosp...rt-v/?p=7806901
http://forums.autosp...rt-v/?p=7808015
http://forums.autosp...rt-v/?p=7809444
 
 

==============================

1 of 2
http://www.as-web.jp/f1/82001?all
 2017.01.12

 

----- In 2015 which was the first year of participation, you were plagued with lack of reliability, but 2016 saw significant improvement in reliability. How did you improve the reliability?
it wasn't just a single issue that plagued us in 2015, so we examined all of items thoroughly and reconstructed the reliability. For example, altered the procedure of confirming reliability, reorganized the method for the process of introducing pu to the race. In 2015 we had no choice but to make shift with/in the shortage of time, so we couldn't afford to work on such details. As a result of that, trifling problems occurred, then we got driven to tackle with it, so we had to compete in such state of being on the limit as if on a shoestring.
So for 2016 we created the baseline where you can at least finish the race as starters. Then, we started the season with an idea that we may sacrifice performance to some degree for that. In the winter testing on Feb 2016 which was my first task after being appointed to the leader role, I confirmed with the staffs that, "it wont be too late to make performance update even after confirming the reliability properly first". That's why we didn't introduce new stuffs blindly during the season as well.
 
-------- Regarding the reliability, how was the reaction of Mclaren like?
For McLaren, it was prerequisite that Honda would improve reliability, so in addition to that, they would've wanted us to increase performance as well. Therefore, in 2016 I had quite a lot of argument/quarrel/etc with Ron-san. For instance, at China GP upon the outcome that deficit in engine performance got manifested/highlighted, Ron-san told us "Stop being cautious about reliability, increase the performance more". But you could make such demand only because Honda's reliability improved, so if we had been having troubles in 2016 the same way as 2015, he wouldn't have asked for sth like that, I think.
 
-------- "had a lot of argument" means you had anything else?
At British GP we introduced token upgrade in intake, but there were some twists and turns regarding the case. New intake was a work of collaboration development with mclaren, so mclaren side as well was aware of how and on what schedule it would be introduced to the race. I cannot disclosed the specific date, but when Ron-san knew that, I got yelled by him like "why on earth does it take long time like that, introduce it earlier!". I explained to him like "there are this many things in the list to be cleared in order to be able to introduce it, so we can only introduce at Silverstone at the earliest", but Ron-san responded like "you can't be serious!". But it's not that Honda were working on it lazily, and regarding the decision of introducing at Silverstone too, we were actually trying to introduce one race earlier than the original/initial schedule. Not only that, we were making effort to introduce it even 2 races earlier at Austria. But due to various issues we couldn't make it in time for Austria, so we introduced at GBGP eventually. It's not like we were doing nothing. Even then, Ron-san was making phone calls each and every race, "ready for next race?" (laughs).

----- So how did you deal with it?
To take reg of 5 PU/season into consideration, you need reliability worth 4 races for 2016, so normally we do not introduce anything unless you confirm it on dyno first, but at that time we intended to introduce it  (the new, token-upgraded intake at Siliverstone) as long as it could last just one race. (intake is not a sealed component restricted by 5PU/season rule, same as exhaust manifold etc so it's free to exchange anytime)
Especially after China GP, we had to achieve performance gain as soon as possible, so we were thinking to introduce it even if it can last for only one race. But at that time, there was good chance that it wouldnt have survived even one race. We cannot race properly that way. We as Honda did not intend to introduce something that we cannot be sure will complete the race. We were competing the 2016 season under the promise/conviction that we must not end the race by blowing the engine, so
 
----- After all you could make Dennis understand it?
Of course he understood it. But Ron-san is very pure person, so he has an aspect that he wouldn't hesitate at all if in order to win. I've worked with Ross Brawn in Honda's 00s F1 activity as well and he also had such aspect.

---------- You've managed to improve reliability for 2016 by going through such hardships.
In 2015 we used 12 engines each for 2 drivers in 2015, but in 2016 it was 6 for Jenson, 8 for Fernando. Even then, if not for all those irregular occurrences like the crash in the opening race, we would have had durability enough to go through the season with 5 units in terms of basic quality. Therefore we'd like to give passing mark to us regarding the reliability. But it's merely a self assessment, so compared with rivals we are still behind by quite a margin in reliability side as well. Considering the fact that we still suffered from kind of troubles that stopped session and caused race retirement, we must aim for higher target one more step in 2017. Moreover, we must catch up with rivals in terms of horse power too.
 
 

=====================
2 of 2
http://www.as-web.jp/f1/82011?all
2017.01.16

------- Honda in 2016 has not only improved reliability but also gained performance of deployment and power. What has changed from 2015 PU?
I think we were able to achieve improvement of reliability and ERS at quite high level. As a result of that, we were able to achieve going through to Q3, ie the target we couldn't achieve in 2015, which lead to more point scoring results. In terms of improving deployment, we modified turbo first. Then at Belgium GP we updated compressor too. Regarding turbo, we changed the design of blade specifically. In 2015, we had no choice but to make it small in order to house it inside V, but for 2016 we increased the size of the scroll. However, it has got small not because told to do so by mclaren. It's just that we did so because we thought by ourselves it would be better to make it as compact as possible. Therefore we hadn't abandoned the concept of size zero for 2016, and in fact as a comprehensive package, 2016's has got more compact as well as lighter than 2015's. We are going to continue that approach/direction for 2017 too.

------- How about ICE itself?
Regarding engine too, we changed a lot from 2015 to 2016, and stepped up the performance. But compared to the improvement of deployment, we were not able to make satisfactory achievement, that's our honest feeling.

----- What was the issue?
 Regarding the technical aspect of improving horse power, we were actually able to make an improvement as expected. For example to put it in lap time, we gained about -0.5sec/lap. We upped the power by that amount (about half a second) from 2015 to 2016, then achieved roughly the same amount of gain throughout 2016 as well. Such an improvement would be impossible in NA era. Annual gain in NA era was like -0.1sec, so.

------ So, what were you not satisfied with?
Because rivals achieved even more power gain than Honda. For instance, quali times of Honda at Melbourne 2016 was faster than Lewis Hamilton's 2015 pole time of 1:26.327, with 1:26.125 by Fernando and 1:26.304 by Jenson. But both cars were unable to make it into Q3... That's the reason why we couldn't get satisfactory outcome.

------- The prospect you had was too optimistic?
At the start of winter testing, while we didn't think we could be champion, we thought we would be able to be bit more competitive. We thought we would be able to obtain decent result as long as you don't retire due to reliability issue. Perhaps even podium. Going to Q3 as well, we thought we would achieve that earlier, but we had to wait until Spain. But unfortunately that was our capability.
 
----- How about the prospect for 2017?
Towards 2017, we intend to accelerate what we've been doing during 2016 further, rather than change something from 2016,  that's the direction.  In 2015 which was the first year of challenge, each and every thing was new, so we were in a situation where we'd better keep calm and concentrate on our own task, but in 2016 the level of our staff has been rising, so I'd like to strengthen/extend that aspect.

----- Token system will be abolished in 2017.
In 2017 token system will be removed so that development wont be restricted by token, but token system was not the only reason why Honda is behind rivals. It was also limited by resource and time restrictions. Besides, the number of PU per season will be reduced to 4 in 2017, so even if development will be freed up, the timing of introducing update will be limited to 3 times. That means, I am not thinking we'd simply be able to make more development than 2016 just because it will be token-free. In fact in 2016 we were not able to use all of the tokens available but left it unused.

---- looking forward to 2017 Honda performance
Thank you v much


Edited by muramasa, 21 January 2017 - 17:51.


#88 Mc_Silver

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Posted 21 January 2017 - 17:16

He says they are going in the same direction as in 2015 and 2016.I thought they decided to change lay out and use split Turbo like Mercedes?

#89 restless

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Posted 21 January 2017 - 17:43

IMO, same direction means make engine lighter and smaller

In the end, what matters is the result, not how its achieved, but if they'll be on same lvl with Ferrari and Mercedes



#90 Owen

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Posted 21 January 2017 - 17:58

Be at the launch; maybe
http://www.mclaren.c...veaway-3155521/

#91 muramasa

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Posted 21 January 2017 - 19:08

He says they are going in the same direction as in 2015 and 2016.I thought they decided to change lay out and use split Turbo like Mercedes?

nah, that's just pure guess by Piola and omnicorse or whatever it's called nowadays.

Giorgio Piola is good for drawings and analysis of actual cars but that's it. Speculative things are just speculative.

 

Look at what Piola described 2015 Ferrari nose would be 

B8XSIxeCMAA1EBU.png

 

 

 

and what 2012 Ferrari car would be

a7fde12562ebbfbef9cc576ff8d7a09726b99477

 

 

 

not sure who made this (another 2015 ferrari nose) but looks like Piola touch....at least it's by ominicorse or autosprint

45507_la-ferrari-2015-con-il-muso-a-bulb

 

 

 

 

Those (often hilarious) speculation stuff in winter is kind of annual event like ritual or festival by italian media...they are just guessing.

 

Honda may indeed be making split turbo as they guess but even then that doesnt make them right, because they are just guessing, one in 5 or 10 attempts they may get it or look like "right".


Edited by muramasa, 21 January 2017 - 19:45.


#92 kevinracefan

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Posted 21 January 2017 - 19:16

what's the story on the red emirates' ?



#93 CPR

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Posted 21 January 2017 - 20:40

He says they are going in the same direction as in 2015 and 2016.I thought they decided to change lay out and use split Turbo like Mercedes?

 

I'd say this is a "strategy" vs "implementation" type of thing - "size zero" is a strategy (or approach) to making higher level design decisions or setting goals. A more Merc-like layout (meaning having the turbine and compressor outside the V of the engine as well as being split, since the Honda PU already has a split turbo, just inside the V) is more of an implementation detail.

 

The turbine and compressor were made bigger in 2016 over 2015. Looks like same again this year compared to 2016, though it might be more dramatic.



#94 blacky

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Posted 22 January 2017 - 08:19

I don't know what some guys expect. Hasegawa can't go into details in interviews for a new season, he has to speak in general terms, like "more compact" or "we need better combustion". I guess Honda and also McLaren bosses would not be very happy if Hasegawa told the planned changes for 2017 months before season start to a magazine... :D

 

However the interviews are very interesting because he tells some good details why things didn't work in the past.


Edited by blacky, 22 January 2017 - 08:20.


#95 Owen

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Posted 22 January 2017 - 22:13

Interview with Zak;
http://www.autocar.c...e-changer-brand

#96 Joseki

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Posted 22 January 2017 - 22:54

I like Zak but I miss Ron at the same time.

#97 Mc_Silver

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Posted 23 January 2017 - 08:17

I like Zak but I miss Ron at the same time.


Ron is a legend and nobody can change that. We will all remember and miss him for his great attention to the detail, ruthlessness for successs and great love towards McLaren brand.

#98 danmills

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Posted 23 January 2017 - 10:37

Mclaren Honda team trucks spotted northbound M25 Hertfordshire this morning.

Silvery Light Grey and White. No sponsors besides big MCLAREN HONDA text in dark grey / black. No changes to 2016 lorries I think.


Edited by danmills, 23 January 2017 - 13:03.


#99 FullThrottleF1

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Posted 23 January 2017 - 10:43

Fmclaren Honda team trucks spotted northbound m25 Hertfordshire this morning.

Silver and White. No changes.

Lovely, nice and corporate.



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#100 muramasa

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Posted 23 January 2017 - 10:48

 

 

where are they going?

 

change to M1 and go to Milton Keynes?

?!?!

 

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