103 replies to this topic

[martinskive]

Having searched the web i cant Seem to find the on track spectator attendance for the F1 races. IT could be exciting to see the development in on track spectators vs the development in streaming / flow TV spectators

Are these numbers not publicly available .... A Bernie decision Perhaps?

Edited by martinskive, 15 April 2017 - 18:07.

[superden]

Bahrain looked empty for qualifying.

[Silverstone96]

Interestingly Baku have said they hope to get 36,000 this year which would be double last year's attendance - pathetic, especially when you know tracks like Nurburgring, magny cours and imola with the right ticket pricing could easily get 75,000 through the gate

[jjcale]

Interestingly Baku have said they hope to get 36,000 this year which would be double last year's attendance - pathetic, especially when you know tracks like Nurburgring, magny cours and imola with the right ticket pricing could easily get 75,000 through the gate

 

I would have thought the Dear Leader there would have just given away the tickets to the citizens .... is all public money anyway.... and its not like they are short of a few quid. 

[Louis Mr. F1]

even if the circuit/organizer discloses the attendance numbers, some of these numbers could be inflated to make it look better .....

[uffen]

Sometimes you have to buy three-day tickets, even if you don't, or can't, attend Friday or Saturday or both. So, even if seats are empty they can claim seats sold. Then you have to know if they've closed or removed or added stands from earlier years. Have they allowed general admission to grow? It is not a straight forward thing.

[Fastcake]

even if the circuit/organizer discloses the attendance numbers, some of these numbers could be inflated to make it look better .....

 

It seems a lot of organisers inflate the numbers. I've watched a lot of sporting events with sparsely populated stands, with attendance figures reported to be far higher than what your eyes are telling you. Never quite get the point - they surely can't think we believe the blatant lie.

[Marklar]

Having searched the web i cant Seem to find the on track spectator attendance for the F1 races. IT could be exciting to see the development in on track spectators vs the development in streaming / flow TV spectators
Are these numbers not publicly available .... A Bernie decision Perhaps?

Some are publishing them, some not. And many of those who are publishing them are screwing them in their favour. I've collected a few last year
 

(Figures for race sundays)
 
Australia
2004: 122.000
2005: 118.000
2006: 103.000
2007: 105.000
2008: 108.000
2010: 109.000
2011: 111.000
2012: 115.000
2013: 103.000
2014: 101.000
2015: 101.000
 
Malaysia
2012: 85.000
2014: 87.000
 
Germany
2010: 65.000
2011: 68.000
2012: 59.000
2013: 44.000
2014: 52.000
 
British
2013: 120.000
2014: 122.000
2015: 140.000 (might be a bit scewed)
 
Austria
2014: 77.000 (first race)
2015: 55.000
 
Italy (as you can see it depends here purely what Ferrari is doing in each year )
2005: 60.000
2006: 80.000
2007: 95,000
2008: 90.000
2009: 75.000
2010: 85.000
2011: 90.000
2012: 90.000
2013: 90.000
2014: 80.000
2015: Promoter confirmed that the demand was higher than in 2014
 
Singapore
2015: 87.000 (third best attendance, best was in 2008 and 2013)
 
USA (very constant drop...., though I've heared that they are apparentely not telling the enitre truth here.....)
2012: 118.000
2013: 113.000
2014: 108.000
2015: 102.000
 

F1 fanatic had also a story last year as well

 

http://www.f1fanatic...tracks-in-2016/

[TennisUK]

The Malaysian numbers in there are very exaggerated...

[martinskive]

Some are publishing them, some not. And many of those who are publishing them are screwing them in their favour. I've collected a few last year
 

F1 fanatic had also a story last year as well

 

http://www.f1fanatic...tracks-in-2016/

 

Wow..... There Are some real low numbers there. Sad that some tracks cant sell more tickets than a football match in England.... 

Would hate to see an other european track disappear because of low attendence

Edited by martinskive, 15 April 2017 - 21:13.

[Docc]

The weather at some..like at COTA monsoon race last year..also effects race day attendance..

[martinskive]

The weather at some..like at COTA monsoon race last year..also effects race day attendance..

 

To some extend... However I believe many buy in Advance 

[savvy2210]

It seems a lot of organisers inflate the numbers. I've watched a lot of sporting events with sparsely populated stands, with attendance figures reported to be far higher than what your eyes are telling you. Never quite get the point - they surely can't think we believe the blatant lie.

A lot of sports count the tickets sold, not the actual attendance. I am also sure they tell some porky pies on attendance, Who would know?

[martinskive]

One might argue that with VR experiences in the rise, they really need to boost the on track experiences for spectators. If they dont maximise the Bang for the buck on site, Soon there Will be very little live spectators.

Could the liberty Media ownership be a blessing in disguise?

At first bringing more viewers to the screens, and later the numbers of live spectators Will drop as VR experiences etc Will emerge

Edited by martinskive, 17 April 2017 - 08:16.

[Clatter]

It seems a lot of organisers inflate the numbers. I've watched a lot of sporting events with sparsely populated stands, with attendance figures reported to be far higher than what your eyes are telling you. Never quite get the point - they surely can't think we believe the blatant lie.

If they can make things seem rosier than they are, then it might help attract sponsors in subsequent events? But if your sitting at the circuit looking st empty stands it just looks like blatent lying.

[AustinF1]

If they can make things seem rosier than they are, then it might help attract sponsors in subsequent events?

...or it might help justify government money.

 

 

 

But if your sitting at the circuit looking st empty stands it just looks like blatent lying.

It is.

[Clatter]

...or it might help justify government money.

It is.

That won't happen in the UK and Silverstone are just as guilty of fudging the figures.

[AustinF1]

That won't happen in the UK and Silverstone are just as guilty of fudging the figures.

Yep. It's a common practice at big events all over. It just takes on a particularly sinister, unethical, even criminal, nature if the lies help procure taxpayer funds.

[Tsarwash]

China had entire stands 100% empty even for the race. If you cannot get equal attendance for a F1 race that a UK second division football club can get, then you really oughtn't be holding that race.

[TennisUK]

WEC are the masters of inventing attendance numbers, Le Mans excluded.

[Clatter]

China had entire stands 100% empty even for the race. If you cannot get equal attendance for a F1 race that a UK second division football club can get, then you really oughtn't be holding that race.

At the end of the day the number of spectators isn't the deciding factor. Liberty get the same money if there is a full stadium or an empty one.

[johnmhinds]

China had entire stands 100% empty even for the race. If you cannot get equal attendance for a F1 race that a UK second division football club can get, then you really oughtn't be holding that race.

 

China over built their stands, that is why some of them are empty.

 

They built seating for something like 250,000 people and the attendance has never reached those kinds of levels.

 

The attendance in China is remarkably high really given that we've never had a Chinese driver or team for them to support, and I don't think F1 is even broadcasted on any national TV channels there anymore.

Edited by johnmhinds, 17 April 2017 - 13:19.

[Clatter]

China over built their stands, that is why some of them are empty.

They built seating for something like 250,000 people and the attendance has never reached those kinds of levels.

The attendance in China is remarkably high really given that we've never had a Chinese driver or team for them to support, and I don't think F1 is even broadcasted on any national TV channels there anymore.

What is the attendance?

[scheivlak]

What is the attendance?

Last year around 160.000 according to http://www.shanghaid...t/shdaily.shtml

I think about the same this year. The massive grandstands on the S/F line seemed quite packed.

[Clatter]

Last year around 160.000 according to http://www.shanghaid...t/shdaily.shtml
I think about the same this year. The massive grandstands on the S/F line seemed quite packed.

Not that bad then. Must admit I thought it was a lot lower than that.

[uffen]

Last year around 160.000 according to http://www.shanghaid...t/shdaily.shtml

I think about the same this year. The massive grandstands on the S/F line seemed quite packed.

Rumour has it that fans are "brought" to the race by the government/organizers.

[Clatter]

Rumour has it that fans are "brought" to the race by the government/organizers.

That's fair enough. They paid for it out of their taxes.

I know that happened the first year, but is it really still happening? Those empty stands stand out like a sore thumb on TV, so if they were bussing people in you think they would fill the more visible places.

[anbeck]

That's fair enough. They paid for it out of their taxes.
 

 

 

Except they didn't. AFAIK there's no income or sales tax in Bahrain  (EDIT: Sorry, misread this as referring to Bahrain)

 

I don't mind to have 1-2 races that are essentially without fans. Bahrain lives from its desert setting (it's the Indiana Jones among the GPs). Monza and Imola, however, were always based on the fan culture there. I worry about those races - and as the German GP has shown (anybody remember the late 1990s motodrom fans?), if fans don't show up, the race dies.

But Bahrain, I'm ok with the way it is.  

Edited by anbeck, 17 April 2017 - 18:23.

[retrogeezer]

China had entire stands 100% empty even for the race. If you cannot get equal attendance for a F1 race that a UK second division football club can get, then you really oughtn't be holding that race.

 

Just re-watched the China race and DC was interviewing that Chase fella and he said 'sell out crowd'!! Only because 90% of the stands are closed! 

[johnmhinds]

Just re-watched the China race and DC was interviewing that Chase fella and he said 'sell out crowd'!! Only because 90% of the stands are closed! 

 

90% closed? Might want to check your math on that.

 

The main grandstand and grandstands at the hairpin looked as full as they have always been and they can hold 60,000+ people between them.

 

The big closed grandstand around turn 13 that has never been used might gives the impression that nobody turns up, but Shanghai has always been one of the higher attended events on the calendar because the other grandstands they use are just huge.

[Marklar]

2016/2017 numbers

 

https://www.gpupdate...017-attendance/

[johnmhinds]

If those total figures are correct isn't that an 8.76% increase not 8.06%?

 

Edit: all the percentage calculations for the races that have seen an increase on that list seem to have been done backwards.

Edited by johnmhinds, 08 December 2017 - 15:50.

[P123]

I wonder what they are counting in Malaysia and AD 

[SenorSjon]

Malaysia was the last ever GP. In AD they are counting flags, crickets, anything.

[Kalmake]

If those total figures are correct isn't that an 8.76% increase not 8.06%?

The sum is off too if the total figures are correct.

[johnmhinds]

The sum is off too if the total figures are correct.

Yeah they couldn't even get that right.

 

Whoever made the chart screwed the pooch and could have made things look even better for the sport, Azerbaijan should say a 138% increase not 58%.

[Kalmake]

For piece of mind I popped it in a spreadsheet.

 

[pdac]

The nice round figures for most tracks makes me wonder whether there's been a bit of guess work/creativity going on.

[johnmhinds]

And they're the combined attendances over 3 days, so if you bought a weekend ticket you were counted 3 times, that pumps up the figures a bit

Edited by johnmhinds, 08 December 2017 - 18:56.

[BRG]

What were those 30,000 people watching in Azerbaijan in 2016?

[PiperPa42]

What were those 30,000 people watching in Azerbaijan in 2016?

The European Grand Prix

[BRG]

Oops, getting my years confused.  After a while one year starts to look like another.

[AustinF1]

For piece of mind I popped it in a spreadsheet.

 

Mexico City is just killing it. Crazy numbers 3 years in a row. Kudos to those guys...

[Graveltrappen]

Austria would be my ‘go to’ race in Europe next I think. Done Spa, but Austria is such a small track with so many laps that it’s almost the opposite of Spa in terms of how much you can see and how many times the cars come by.

[Fastcake]

You cannot possibly convince me 93000 people turned up in Bahrain, even as a cumulative three-day figure. I could't even accept a tenth of that number turned up for the race.

[NixxxoN]

I think tickets are too expensive even for the die hard fan.

Look at MotoGP prices. Sure bikes are far cheaper compared to F1 cars, but people don't care about that, they just want reasonably priced tickets.

[Raikkinen]

I think tickets are too expensive even for the die hard fan.
Look at MotoGP prices. Sure bikes are far cheaper compared to F1 cars, but people don't care about that, they just want reasonably priced tickets.

If you can get, let's say 200.000 people, visit your event for $200 each. Which in many places already makes the place crowded with long walks and waiting lines. Why would you try to attract -maybe- 350.000 people for $75 while it gives you less income and gives more stress on your facilities?
When me and my friends go to F1 weekend we not only pay for the tickets, but also spend around $600-700 for a spot on the campingsite + some foods and drinks at the track.
I also expect the hosting fees for MotoGP are much lower than the F1 fees.

Edited by Raikkinen, 10 December 2017 - 04:56.

[F1matt]

There were loads of empty seats at Abu Dhabi, me thinks those figures ain't verified.

[NixxxoN]

If you can get, let's say 200.000 people, visit your event for $200 each. Which in many places already makes the place crowded with long walks and waiting lines. Why would you try to attract -maybe- 350.000 people for $75 while it gives you less income and gives more stress on your facilities?
When me and my friends go to F1 weekend we not only pay for the tickets, but also spend around $600-700 for a spot on the campingsite + some foods and drinks at the track.
I also expect the hosting fees for MotoGP are much lower than the F1 fees.

 

Why you care about the POV of the promoters and their revenue? I look at it from a fan's POV, because I'm a fan.

[chunder27]

To be fair if you are spending 6 or 700 hundred Euros

 

You are the reason why tickets are so high, and people like you as you are prepared to pay well over the odds for this.

 

I get it, I understand the need to be there, but the precedent you are setting is simply going to  make things worse. Same as pay tv and lots of things, concerts etc. The desperation for people to be there regardless of cost is what is driving this pathetic revolution in event pricing.

 

I find it almost worrying that you would spend that much on watching F1, fair play to you you must be easily pleased or have a great group that make the awful racing tolerable!!

 

That is a family holiday for a week in the UK somewhere nice. Or a fair holiday abroad including flights.

 

In NO WAY EVER should a weekend at a 2 or 3 day F1 event cost as much as a weeks holiday. That is plainly ridiculous