13 replies to this topic

[Hati]

I know that nobody liked F1 cars in last season, or couple of seasons before it but I think that the big problem wasn't the cars but the performance difference, it became boring when you knew before race weekend that there were two driver who had chances to win. This season there are still big differences but there are four cars that are pretty close to each other. I know that without big changes in rules this would probably not have happened but I still have to wonder, what if?

 

With this years cars it's very hard to overtake because of aero and durable tires mean that there will be no problem keeping the speed up all the way to finish line. Last year it was pretty much save, save save in front but that was because no one was coming behind. If Mercedes tried same amount of saving this year with Ferrari so evenly matched it would probably end in overtaking so they had to keep speed up which could lead to premature tire degration which would again lead to overtaking. It could even lead to scenarios where Vettel and Hamilton battle their tires out and Kimi or Bottas thanks and takes the victory. Later in the season perhaps even races where Red Bull collects the pot with one less pit stop behind battling Ferraris and Mercs.

 

So what am I saying? I think that previous rules could have been better in long run than current if they had allowed free enough development but we will never know. Yes, this years cars are faster but where it shows? Nowhere.

 

What do you think?

[realracer200]

The last race wasn't exactly boring in fact it was one of the best ever races at Barcelona.

[V8 Fireworks]

 

With this years cars it's very hard to overtake because of aero

 

Yes, this years cars are faster but where it shows? Nowhere.

 

Yes, closer competition would have helped on old regs for entertainment but otherwise I must disagree.

 

1. It should be hard to overtake, else we would not have enjoy blocking battles... they would breeze past in one lap... boring.  It's a   Characteristic of F1.  Catalunya had the  perfect blend of not too easy, not too hard to overtake.

 

2.  The drivers are actually breathing heavily and working hard... they are probably having more fun pushing them to the limit too, which rubs off on the audience watching.  They are supposed to be the "best" right?  F1 is no longer easier to drive than GP2.  That's a good change IMO.

[Hati]

1. It should be hard to overtake,

 

I don't think we had overtaking festivals with previous rules either. Yes, there were easy overtakes when someone had new tires compared to old but with evenly matched cars that would be part of strategy, will you be first in finish line with fewer pitstops  and older tires or with extra pitstop and faster speed.

[Slowersofterdumber]

I am amazed by the lack of progress in terms of performance considering the new regulations.

From 2003 to 2004 they made massive gains with exactly the same regulations. This year with wider cars and tyres, better aero etc than last year they are sort of matching that rate of progress.

[GrumpyYoungMan]

Not enough power to cope with drag?

[917k]

According to Brundle, who has driven these cars, they have power and torque like no other race car he has driven - so I would say it's definitely not a power deficit.

[pingu666]

the lmp1 hybrids accelorate faster, but probably helped by being 4 wheel drive

the cars look better just running around, but still not as good as the early 2000's cars

[Kalmake]

I am amazed by the lack of progress in terms of performance considering the new regulations.

From 2003 to 2004 they made massive gains with exactly the same regulations. This year with wider cars and tyres, better aero etc than last year they are sort of matching that rate of progress.

Then tire war, now cheap spec tires.

 

It will take a while for the cheap spec tire supplier to unlock the potential of the bigger tires. For one the compounds are too hard and we have to wait until next year to fix that.

Edited by Kalmake, 21 May 2017 - 06:52.

[Slowersofterdumber]

Then tire war, now cheap spec tires.

It will take a while for the cheap spec tire supplier to unlock the potential of the bigger tires. For one the compounds are too hard and we have to wait until next year to fix that.

Still, from 2003 to 2004 the regulations for tyres like size didin't change. And this time we went from narrow control tyres to wide control tyres. The progress should have been bigger.

[917k]

the lmp1 hybrids accelorate faster, but probably helped by being 4 wheel drive

the cars look better just running around, but still not as good as the early 2000's cars

 

This seems implausible - what's your source?

[Clatter]

Then tire war, now cheap spec tires.

It will take a while for the cheap spec tire supplier to unlock the potential of the bigger tires. For one the compounds are too hard and we have to wait until next year to fix that.

I agree. The compounds are too close in overall performance too early other. The softer compounds seem to have the same longevity of the harder, which makes trying to use the different compounds tactically non-existent. It's only the rules that forces them to use the wrong compound.

[Slowersofterdumber]

This seems implausible - what's your source?

Does it? More traction, very high peak power, less drag. I bet that at some speed ranges it's true. I also bet that at most speeds the F1 prevails tho.

[Wes350]

Yes, closer competition would have helped on old regs for entertainment but otherwise I must disagree.

 

1. It should be hard to overtake, else we would not have enjoy blocking battles... they would breeze past in one lap... boring.  It's a   Characteristic of F1.  Catalunya had the  perfect blend of not too easy, not too hard to overtake.

 

2.  The drivers are actually breathing heavily and working hard... they are probably having more fun pushing them to the limit too, which rubs off on the audience watching.  They are supposed to be the "best" right?  F1 is no longer easier to drive than GP2.  That's a good change IMO.

 

 

It's just Back to Big Aero - the 2014-2016 cars just did not have the same aero levels. The cars do not need to be wider with  dragster clown tires...  

 

Most of the track records were set with narrow cars on grooved tires.  F1 Could have gotten the same result with slightly different tweaks to the rules. 

 

I am sure I'm in the minority here in that I don't like the look of the wider cars/tires. Still have the ugly nose! But I came to the sport in the Narrow car era, and my favorite classic F1 cars are from the mid 1960's cars before they went wing crazy.

 

 

 

According to Brundle, who has driven these cars, they have power and torque like no other race car he has driven - so I would say it's definitely not a power deficit.

 

 The hybrid engines make just as much power as the 1100+ turbo engines of the late 1980's.

 

The problem is that the cars weight a few hundred kilos shy of an LMP1 car now. So, yes they have all this power, but they are a good 100+ kilos heavier than they need to be.

 

All the hybrid motors and battery systems add a lot of weight. They are longer and wider than LMP1 cars as well: just let that sink in...

 

The size and weight go against the ethos of F1 IMHO. Just look how the cars exploded ever since the introduction of KERS and the move to the hybrid engine formula.

 

Todt is doing to F1 what Bernie did to group C back in the day.

Edited by Wes350, 22 May 2017 - 21:04.