4028 replies to this topic

[KnucklesAgain]

I get the impression you think you have it right too - that being the case, the name would apply to you too.

 

What I am saying is that I believe that the Honda engineers know more than you do, even if they may be lacking compared to others in F1.

Edited by KnucklesAgain, 24 June 2017 - 13:40.

[currupipi]

reading in this thread the word progress borders an insult to any rational human being

[KrlBrmmn]

 It would be a miracle if both cars just finished the race( after being lapped a few times).

[KnucklesAgain]

where was it mentioned ??  first of all unless its reported it is just an assumption,  their plan before this weekend was to test on friday n revert to old spec for race so there has been no change in that plan, there is also assumption that new gearbox will not be able take overreving if any vs fact that it is high mileage gearbox, so lots of assumptions vs facts, i tend to give credence to latter.

 

Several posts on the past pages, I forgot if they had proper sources, that's why I said that I don't know if true

[pdac]

What I am saying is that I believe that the Honda engineers know more than you do, even if they may be lacking compared to others in F1.

 

I'm not disagreeing with you there. In fact, I'm sure the Honda engineers know more than I do. That does not discount the possibility that what they have chosen to do and not do may not be the best approach.

[McLobby]

Disgrace... embarrassment all over... 

[rodlamas]

Whilst it's disappointing, we do know that Honda have still not brought the big update, so nothing has changed from previous races. Why then are people surprised by the performance? Was you really expecting more given what we know?

After 3 years from the ridicullous showing of the MP4-29H (2 laps in 2 days on an engine that had been suposedly fired a year before) the situation is still tbe same.

Does anyone think that this "big upgrade" really exist? It seems more #FakeNews than the 2010 US F1 team.

I can bet 100 bucks the decision for a switch to Mercedes has already been taken, signed and what Ojeh, Zak and EB are deciding now is if they can put the Mercedes engine at the back of the car in Spa or just in 2018.

But everyone is allowed to have their own opinion.

[KnucklesAgain]

I'm not disagreeing with you there. In fact, I'm sure the Honda engineers know more than I do. That does not discount the possibility that what they have chosen to do and not do may not be the best approach.

 

Don't know what to say. Yes, possible

[pdac]

Don't know what to say. Yes, possible

 

I'm sure there are other factors at play - not just what's the best action to take to improve the development process. Clearly McLaren and Honda are still thinking about the season and every race result, whereas I say they should be looking at forgetting trying to get crumbs of success now and work towards getting the PU powerful and then reliable in time for when it really matters (next season).

[KnucklesAgain]

I'm sure there are other factors at play - not just what's the best action to take to improve the development process. Clearly McLaren and Honda are still thinking about the season and every race result, whereas I say they should be looking at forgetting trying to get crumbs of success now and work towards getting the PU powerful and then reliable in time for when it really matters (next season).

 

It's not clear at all, though you may be right anyway, but this is a different discussion in the first place.

[pdac]

It's not clear at all, though you may be right anyway, but this is a different discussion in the first place.

 

You're right - not clear. I should have said "I suspect".

[Talisman]

I'm sure there are other factors at play - not just what's the best action to take to improve the development process. Clearly McLaren and Honda are still thinking about the season and every race result, whereas I say they should be looking at forgetting trying to get crumbs of success now and work towards getting the PU powerful and then reliable in time for when it really matters (next season).

 

It sounds like you want them to test the engine in Baku as opposed to revert to the old spec.  The problem with that idea is that for testing you need to reduce the confounding factors as much as you can, a pretty big one would be if the PU was possibly damaged by the gearbox failure yesterday.  Frustrating though it is I can understand the logic.

[Disgrace]

Disgrace... embarrassment all over... 

 

Agreed.

[Maustinsj]

Agreed.

Don't be too hard on yourself!

[statman]

https://twitter.com/...610993441640449

 

Alonso on Ricciardo in Q1: "I think in Red Bull they thought I was going to pit, but that's my normal speed on the straight"

[kosmos]

https://twitter.com/...610993441640449

 

Alonso on Ricciardo in Q1: "I think in Red Bull they thought I was going to pit, but that's my normal speed on the straight"

 

 

[rodlamas]

https://twitter.com/...610993441640449

Alonso on Ricciardo in Q1: "I think in Red Bull they thought I was going to pit, but that's my normal speed on the straight"

Progress...

[Sestre]

FIA have to ban Honda for creating of dangerous situation on the track.

[Alonsofan007]

FIA have to ban Honda for creating of dangerous situation on the track.

what dangerous situation ??? what are you even talking about??

[Treads]

Wow. Just... wow.

[MirNyet]

Honda's situation has gotten beyond the point where it is doing the sport harm. They are certainly doing McLaren harm. The FIA needs to step in and impose some special case rules for Honda with an effort to promote PU parity. Honda needs to be removed from the PU penalty system for the remainder of the season, and be given special permission to perform track testing of their PU with a 2015 McLaren chassis in Japan for the rest of the year.

[jwill189]

Honda's situation has gotten beyond the point where it is doing the sport harm. They are certainly doing McLaren harm. The FIA needs to step in and impose some special case rules for Honda with an effort to promote PU parity. Honda needs to be removed from the PU penalty system for the remainder of the season, and be given special permission to perform track testing of their PU with a 2015 McLaren chassis in Japan for the rest of the year.

 

I think the other teams would have to agree to that, and I don't see Williams or Force India wanting to give up the only thing keeping their drivers in front.

[DeKnyff]

I don't see Mercedes bringing engine upgrades to track, running them for twenty laps and hen taking them away. When they bring an update it just works. Because they've tested it. But apparently in 4 years of development work, Honda haven't worked out how to reliably test these engines.

 

Yeah, I doesn't make much sense.

 

Well, it seems clear that McLaren has raised its pressure on Honda in the last couple of months and specially after failing to deliver the upgrade in Canada. Maybe, just maybe, Honda is desperate to show some progress, no matter how small and gain some extra time before McLaren makes "the decision".

[pdac]

It sounds like you want them to test the engine in Baku as opposed to revert to the old spec.  The problem with that idea is that for testing you need to reduce the confounding factors as much as you can, a pretty big one would be if the PU was possibly damaged by the gearbox failure yesterday.  Frustrating though it is I can understand the logic.

 

This is true. Perhaps if it were me, I would have either replaced it with another new-spec unit, put a new-spec unit in Stoffel's car or even put new-spec units in both cars. The reasons being that there's no substitute for real-life testing. The caveat to that, though, is that you don't do real-life testing if you already know of problems that will likely affect the results. I wonder whether this is the true reason - that they know the new spec is still not ready and they only introduced it in response to the demands of McLaren and the media.

[PedroDiCasttro]

This is true. Perhaps if it were me, I would have either replaced it with another new-spec unit, put a new-spec unit in Stoffel's car or even put new-spec units in both cars. The reasons being that there's no substitute for real-life testing. The caveat to that, though, is that you don't do real-life testing if you already know of problems that will likely affect the results. I wonder whether this is the true reason - that they know the new spec is still not ready and they only introduced it in response to the demands of McLaren and the media.

It true, Honda should just give up. This is just ridiculous, they're ruining both theirs and McLaren's reputation.

[Quickshifter]

Qualifying report

 

http://www.mclaren.c...rix-qualifying/

[RainyAfterlifeDaylight]

I wonder who is interested to give McLaren a PU.

 

Edited by RainyAfterlifeDaylight, 24 June 2017 - 16:07.

[MirNyet]

I think the other teams would have to agree to that, and I don't see Williams or Force India wanting to give up the only thing keeping their drivers in front.

 

Honda obviously failed the percentage test supposedly done by the FIA, so the FIA should be able to give permission without the agreement of the other teams.

[Risil]

Part 5 this way...