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Fernando Alonso vs Stoffel Vandoorne 2018


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#51 Nicktendo86

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Posted 27 March 2018 - 06:13

When has Lando looked strong in F2? They haven't raced yet!


Think he has been quickest in pretty much every testing session. Coming off the back of his attention grabbing performance in Daytona he seems to be in great form, Stoff needs to pick things up a bit. If the car looks competitive come year end I would expect Alonso to stay another year.

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#52 Borko

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Posted 27 March 2018 - 07:47

Think he has been quickest in pretty much every testing session. Coming off the back of his attention grabbing performance in Daytona he seems to be in great form, Stoff needs to pick things up a bit. If the car looks competitive come year end I would expect Alonso to stay another year.

He should stay regardless of what happens :D After the end of this season, he'll only need 14 entries to get the record for the most entries, and just 10 starts to get the records for the most starts. It is a very unique record that will probably stand for a long time IMO.



#53 Quickshifter

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Posted 27 March 2018 - 08:02

From seeing Alonso's body language in and out of the car he does not look like a man who is in a hurry to quit.



#54 Borko

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Posted 27 March 2018 - 08:08

From seeing Alonso's body language in and out of the car he does not look like a man who is in a hurry to quit.

Yeah. And next year, he'll still be a year younger than Raikkonen is now (and is doing a pretty good job at the moment).



#55 Waggy

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Posted 27 March 2018 - 10:50

I think he will stay in his peak for another few years easily. Motivation seems to be a issue once drivers get to their mid 30's, but Alonso is hungrier than ever.

He could even stay in F1 longer than Hamilton who is pushing his mid 30's now too, with Hamilton winning everything his motivation might slip.



#56 MastaKink

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Posted 27 March 2018 - 11:47

Alonso watched Schumacher get as close to Nico in 2012 as he had been at any point when he was 43. He's not going anywhere while he has the hunger,motivation and teams that could launch a title bid in the right circumstances interested in his services and in Woking and probably but not definitely Enstone, he has them for the next 2-3 seasons at least.

 

And then we're in the new Liberty/Brawn era F1 regulations which could make winning at these types of teams easier depending on what happens and he'll still be 4 years younger than Michael was in 2012.

 

I really don't see him going anywhere for a while.



#57 Waggy

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Posted 28 March 2018 - 15:44

I think as long as he doesnt take a sabbatical year off his level will remain the same for the rest of his career (39+). I think drivers are never the same after taking a break. It took MSC 3 years back to start peforming again.


Edited by Waggy, 28 March 2018 - 15:46.


#58 sopa

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Posted 29 March 2018 - 11:49

In terms of time-gaps Vandoorne actually wasn't a long way behind Alonso in the opening race. Some 7 seconds at the chequered flag, while Alonso had a train of cars behind him. So a solid job by Stoffel.

 

But the problem for Vandoorne is that Alonso is great at maximizing points in tight midfield and he is good at getting car(s) inbetween himself and his team-mate. So either way it could be a difficult season for the Belgian, because even if he performs 'fine', his points score may not look close to Alonso.



#59 AlcidioG

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 13:58

I've been following testing and Carlin looks like a strong contender for the title.

 


Apparently Zak Brown has promised de Vries a drive in F1 for 2019 if he can beat out Lando in F2 this year. So looks like its going to be an important year for both.

Edited by AlcidioG, 31 March 2018 - 13:58.


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#60 Bliman

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 14:05

Apparently Zak Brown has promised de Vries a drive in F1 for 2019 if he can beat out Lando in F2 this year. So looks like its going to be an important year for both.

I would highly doubt it that Zak Brown would promise something like that.

How could he promise something like that, or he knows Alonso would quit (which is highly questionable) or Stoffel would be set aside no matter how he drives(a possibility but only if he doesn't deliver this year).

Apparently de Vries has told that, but I would be higly careful to say something like that.



#61 AlcidioG

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 14:21

I would highly doubt it that Zak Brown would promise something like that.

How could he promise something like that, or he knows Alonso would quit (which is highly questionable) or Stoffel would be set aside no matter how he drives(a possibility but only if he doesn't deliver this year).

Apparently de Vries has told that, but I would be higly careful to say something like that.

 


He claims to have it in black and white... I haven't seen it so I don't know, but would seem very stupid and counterproductive to claim that if it isn't true if you're de Vries

#62 trickle

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 14:26

He claims to have it in black and white... I haven't seen it so I don't know, but would seem very stupid and counterproductive to claim that if it isn't true if you're de Vries

If McLaren would really consider de Vries as an option, they would have give him at least one test so far. Norris already did 2-3 for them and is doing the young driver test this year. So, its very clear to me, that they focus on Norris not de Vries.


Edited by trickle, 31 March 2018 - 14:27.


#63 AlcidioG

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 14:38

If McLaren would really consider de Vries as an option, they would have give him at least one test so far. Norris already did 2-3 for them and is doing the young driver test this year. So, its very clear to me, that they focus on Norris not de Vries.

 


I don't know... Was just repeating what de Vries said. But lets drop this as this is the Alonso vs Vandoorne thread

#64 V10Benjamin

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 15:03

Apparently Zak Brown has promised de Vries a drive in F1 for 2019 if he can beat out Lando in F2 this year. So looks like its going to be an important year for both.

I believe it's a bit more nuanced. In the Dutch articles I read about this, De Vries never stated he was promised a racing seat in F1. Brown promised him a job in F1, so this could also be as a test- or development driver I guess?



#65 Ragnar668

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 15:26

I believe it's a bit more nuanced. In the Dutch articles I read about this, De Vries never stated he was promised a racing seat in F1. Brown promised him a job in F1, so this could also be as a test- or development driver I guess?

posted this in the 2019-formula-one-silly-season thread

 

Just watched the replay.

First they we're talking about the Young Driver test (this year)
De Vries: "I guess Lando will be doing that one" 

Host:"you're not allowed to drive for another team, FI for example"?
De Vries:"McLaren is the right team for me" 

Some talk about de Vries/Ron Dennis vs Norris/Zak Brown
De Vries" If we live up to the expectations, than I'm in next year"

Doornbos:"Did Zak say the one (Norris or de Vries) who wins the title, that's the one who gets a chance with my F1-team"?
De Vries:"That is the case" 

Later on he said he has this written on paper

Don' know, seems a bit premature to say the least



#66 GoranF1

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 15:30

Maybe both of them as Alonso might join Renault in 2019.

#67 Quickshifter

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 15:37

Maybe both of them as Alonso might join Renault in 2019.

 

I am confident he will retire from F1 with Mclaren. Hopefully i might not have to eat my words. He may do other series after retiring from F1 but i am confident as long as he stays in F1 he will be with Mclaren.


Edited by Quickshifter, 31 March 2018 - 15:38.


#68 PistolPete

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 16:00

Maybe both of them as Alonso might join Renault in 2019.

 

Based on Renaults progression, I find it unlikely that he would take such a chance. 



#69 Button4life

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 21:12

I believe it's a bit more nuanced. In the Dutch articles I read about this, De Vries never stated he was promised a racing seat in F1. Brown promised him a job in F1, so this could also be as a test- or development driver I guess?


https://www.ad.nl/fo...ule-1~a650a687/



Voor Nyck de Vries gloort een plekje in de Formule 1. Als de Fries komend seizoen kampioen wordt in de Formule 2 heeft hij de toezegging dat er in 2019 een stoeltje bij McLaren voor hem wordt gereserveerd. Dat heeft De Vries gezegd in het Ziggo Sport-programma Formule 1 Café.


Here is said De Vries will get the seat if he wins Formula 2. Various Dutch articles say different things though and the rest of this article isn't very clear. I think it's safe to assume Stoffel and Alonso will be the drivers for McLaren in 2019 even if Nando/De Vries wins Formula 2.

Edited by Button4life, 31 March 2018 - 21:17.


#70 alphanumeric

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 22:13

Vandoorne is a super-nice guy, he's very quick and I'd love to see him up his game, though I believe (IMO) he's been given long enough to show his best by now, and that 'best' is not 'top tier'.  Unfortunately it's not (barring a miracle) going to happen; he's not another Senna/Alonso/Prost/Hamilton/Verstappen, and with these you just know 'magic just happened' - that's the game he's playing in, the game McLaren need and want, especially in view of Alonso's estimated time remaining there.

 

Stoff has the raw speed of Magnussen (though thankfully, with more spacial awareness!) but has no future there, I hope McLaren are as ruthless as possible to get the very best, which I have a feeling Nando will be within 6 months.  He's got 'it'. 

 

Piranha club must rule :p



#71 Bliman

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Posted 31 March 2018 - 22:33

Vandoorne is a super-nice guy, he's very quick and I'd love to see him up his game, though I believe (IMO) he's been given long enough to show his best by now, and that 'best' is not 'top tier'.  Unfortunately it's not (barring a miracle) going to happen; he's not another Senna/Alonso/Prost/Hamilton/Verstappen, and with these you just know 'magic just happened' - that's the game he's playing in, the game McLaren need and want, especially in view of Alonso's estimated time remaining there.

 

Stoff has the raw speed of Magnussen (though thankfully, with more spacial awareness!) but has no future there, I hope McLaren are as ruthless as possible to get the very best, which I have a feeling Nando will be within 6 months.  He's got 'it'. 

 

Piranha club must rule :p

Stoffel has to grab his chance this year that's for sure.

I find it odd that he (Nyck) already has got a guarantee to drive in the F1 next year if he becomes world champion.

So basically they are saying that either Stoffel has to go or that Alonso quits.

That's going to be interesting.

I haven't seen Lando Norris drive and he has a good resumé.

But now it will be interesting in F2 what will happen, Leclerc has said the bar high.

If he is so special as some of you say then we will see soon enough.

Beginning next week.



#72 kosmos

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 15:20

I doubt anyone in the team, including the drivers know what they will be doing next year, is too soon to know. If Zak promised something probably is something like he will be part of the team in some capacity.



#73 IamFasterthanU

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Posted 01 April 2018 - 16:30

If McLaren continues to have a similar pace as Renault throughout the year, imo Alonso will move to Renault next year. McLaren will go only downwards as Renault apparently already has a larger budget. It would be mutual I think as even McLaren wouldn't be able to afford his salary for too long if they continue to be mediocre. In fact I think Alonso already has taken a cut this year with his salary being artificially boosted  via Kimoa branding. 



#74 kosmos

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Posted 06 April 2018 - 14:51

Apparently Zak Brown has promised de Vries a drive in F1 for 2019 if he can beat out Lando in F2 this year. So looks like its going to be an important year for both.

 

 

Denied by Brown in the PC.



#75 Seanspeed

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Posted 06 April 2018 - 14:57

I am confident he will retire from F1 with Mclaren. Hopefully i might not have to eat my words. He may do other series after retiring from F1 but i am confident as long as he stays in F1 he will be with Mclaren.

I have no idea why you're confident of that.  Alonso has no care for loyalty to anybody and it's not like Mclaren has been some nostalgiacally important team to him. :/  

 

If he sense his chances are better elsewhere and he's still hungry, he *will* leave.  



#76 Bliman

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 16:30

Alonso was very lucky he got out of q1. I hope the ctitics of Stoffel see that he is very close to Alonso. Stoffel is very fast and definetely deserves his place, I will be interested to see the difference in qualifying time. But I think Alonso stops after this year. I have the feeling there is no hope anymore in the team. Alonso has tried everything but it didn't made a difference.

#77 blacky

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 17:41

However, at the end Q2 matters and the difference was the usual 3 tenths. I don't expect VAN to match ALO all the time, but he should be a little bit closer. He is ok, but I miss a bit. Especially at tracks like Bahrain, one of his better tracks (at least it seems so).

 

What I notice is that both drivers seems to struggle this year to put in a "perfect" lap, obviously, what we also see on the time table, the car isn't good enough.



#78 Bliman

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 17:57

That's not fair. In Australia the story was that Alonso was so much faster then Stoffel and how slow Stoffel was, even when Stoffel was right at his tail in quali. Now Stoffel beats Alonso in q1, and 9 times out of ten Alonso doesn't make it to q2. Now Stoffel makes a mistake in q2 and is only a couple of tenth's behind and suddenly the narrative changes. I think they are very close together. And that Stoffel get's hardly judged because he is not a hard spoken men.

#79 Eruobodo

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 18:28

Alonso got to Q2 on merit, he set a time that got him there. Stoffel is fairly close to Alonso, but, he needs to start beating him in qualis, Lando is lurking.



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#80 blacky

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 18:46

That's not fair. In Australia the story was that Alonso was so much faster then Stoffel and how slow Stoffel was, even when Stoffel was right at his tail in quali. Now Stoffel beats Alonso in q1, and 9 times out of ten Alonso doesn't make it to q2. Now Stoffel makes a mistake in q2 and is only a couple of tenth's behind and suddenly the narrative changes. I think they are very close together. And that Stoffel get's hardly judged because he is not a hard spoken men.

 

Did he make a mistake in Q2? i didn't notice.

What I wanted to say: when VAN has ALO's pace, he must transfer that into results. There will be weeks like Australia, where he will not have ALO's pace, okay, he, his fans and everybody else has to accept that, but he HAS TO be there on occasions like today. That's my point. 



#81 Muppetmad

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 18:50

Race day is where it counts. They're starting line astern - let's see what tomorrow holds.



#82 Kev00

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 18:56

However, at the end Q2 matters and the difference was the usual 3 tenths. I don't expect VAN to match ALO all the time, but he should be a little bit closer. He is ok, but I miss a bit. Especially at tracks like Bahrain, one of his better tracks (at least it seems so).

What I notice is that both drivers seems to struggle this year to put in a "perfect" lap, obviously, what we also see on the time table, the car isn't good enough.


Something I noticed last year in practice and everything is that when Vandoorne switches to the softer compound he just doesn’t gain enough time, like he should. And yes, I’m these first two qualifications he just hasn’t put his best sectors together on that one lap.

#83 Bliman

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 18:58

Yeah he made a mistake in q2. All I am saying is that Alonso was super lucky there. Normally Grosjean is through. By that I am saying they are very close. All the time it is Alonso 6 tenth's etc... Therefore I am interested how much the difference in the end of quali this year will be. And to have a reference to see if Stoffel is good enough. And I would love for Stoffel to beat Alonso and imo that's the only thing he has to focus on.

#84 Bliman

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 19:00

Something I noticed last year in practice and everything is that when Vandoorne switches to the softer compound he just doesn’t gain enough time, like he should. And yes, I’m these first two qualifications he just hasn’t put his best sectors together on that one lap.

I agree with you there. It still feels like he hasn't figured that one yet. And time is ticking.

#85 Joseki

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Posted 08 April 2018 - 18:31

Alonso had a better weekend when it counted.



#86 Bliman

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Posted 08 April 2018 - 18:49

Yeah Alonso is rock solid. I was very disapointed when I saw the start of Stoffel. But in the end , discarding the start he had a great race. I hope he can have a faultless weekend next week. If he can do that he will be even closer to Alonso. Who basically doesn't make mistakes and will always be the benchmark or as close to perfection as one can get. You basically can't win against Alonso. So to be a teammate of him must be one of the hardest things. Especially if he feels he can fight. Darn that's enough praise of Alonso(lol)

#87 Skalvand

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Posted 08 April 2018 - 21:45

Not happy with what Stoffel showed in Australia an Bahrain. Too slow in general. ****ed up his race with that bad start. Let's hope those 11 overtakes will give him some confidence.

On the other hand, I don't think the drivers are the most concerning thing at the moment for McLaren.


Edited by Skalvand, 08 April 2018 - 21:46.


#88 Borko

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Posted 08 April 2018 - 21:54

Stoffel was excellent today. 8th was the best he could do and he delivered it.

Edited by Borko, 08 April 2018 - 21:54.


#89 Skalvand

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Posted 08 April 2018 - 22:53

Stoffel was excellent today. 8th was the best he could do and he delivered it.

 

Maybe I am too harsh on him.

Overtaking 11 cars is definitely class, but his start and pace on the softs were horrible.



#90 Alonsofan007

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Posted 08 April 2018 - 23:35

good recovery by stoff today after pretty bad start.



#91 Bliman

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Posted 08 April 2018 - 23:42

I don't know that his pace was terrible.

These days there is so much going on (like conserving the tires, where he is conserving fuel so he could push later on, etc...).

The thing is that he is racing against Alonso, and that's who you are fighting with.

There is basically no driver who has beaten him (don't want to start any Hamilton thing here).

So your reputation will always be connected to how you fare against Alonso (the same is true offcourse for the other star drivers).

But I don't know a driver who is so complete and has so little offdays (and there we go again with the praise, lol).

Stoffel has to nail perfect weekends (no horrible starts, no 0.5sec of Alonso in quali and taking every opportunity thrown at you).

When he can do that he will be more then fine, if he can do that we will see.

Today he made a great recovery race but it could have been so much more.



#92 Eruobodo

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Posted 09 April 2018 - 00:04

I don't know that his pace was terrible.

These days there is so much going on (like conserving the tires, where he is conserving fuel so he could push later on, etc...).

The thing is that he is racing against Alonso, and that's who you are fighting with.

There is basically no driver who has beaten him (don't want to start any Hamilton thing here).

So your reputation will always be connected to how you fare against Alonso (the same is true offcourse for the other star drivers).

But I don't know a driver who is so complete and has so little offdays (and there we go again with the praise, lol).

Stoffel has to nail perfect weekends (no horrible starts, no 0.5sec of Alonso in quali and taking every opportunity thrown at you).

When he can do that he will be more then fine, if he can do that we will see.

Today he made a great recovery race but it could have been so much more.

I think Stoff recovered well, he actually had a decent strategy, but he executed it brilliantly. I am sure there are races where he will beat Alonso and they will be well deserved.



#93 kosmos

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Posted 09 April 2018 - 03:48

Fantastic race by both, at some point I thought there was a chance to get a 5th again, not sure what happen with the strategy with Fernando. Stoffel needs to improve his starts, he had some problems last year too, from last to 8th, that's something that happen from time to time, next he could end up outside the points.

Taking into consideration how bad qualy went, the race result is almost a win.

Edited by kosmos, 09 April 2018 - 23:47.


#94 igoru

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Posted 09 April 2018 - 18:22

I don't know that his pace was terrible.

These days there is so much going on (like conserving the tires, where he is conserving fuel so he could push later on, etc...).

The thing is that he is racing against Alonso, and that's who you are fighting with.

There is basically no driver who has beaten him (don't want to start any Hamilton thing here).

So your reputation will always be connected to how you fare against Alonso (the same is true offcourse for the other star drivers).

But I don't know a driver who is so complete and has so little offdays (and there we go again with the praise, lol).

Stoffel has to nail perfect weekends (no horrible starts, no 0.5sec of Alonso in quali and taking every opportunity thrown at you).

When he can do that he will be more then fine, if he can do that we will see.

Today he made a great recovery race but it could have been so much more.

Stofel is very good driver....and yes as you said do not forget he race against Alonso. I wish him once to be WDC. And nice to see this two have a lot of fun...



#95 engineblock1

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Posted 09 April 2018 - 20:36

Considering how Alonso totally overshadowed Raikkonen in last year in Ferrari, Vandoorne is doing a pretty awesome job by staying near to Alonso in terms of points, position and performance on track.



#96 Loosenut

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Posted 10 April 2018 - 02:05

I think as long as he doesnt take a sabbatical year off his level will remain the same for the rest of his career (39+). I think drivers are never the same after taking a break. It took MSC 3 years back to start peforming again.

I often thought that the new formula just didn't suit Michael. He was king of the sprinters, which was how F1 was for most of his carrer. He returned to a much more endurance style F1. Maybe not THE reason he wasn't at his best, but maybe part of the reason?

 

I can't see any good reason for Fernando to want to stay at Mclaren to be honest, unless they really do pull something spectacular out of the bag this year. With the Renault engine, they're not gonna beat Redbulls and Renault will always do what's best for their works team first.
Thing is, if he were to jump ship, where can he go? Plus Alonso's Law says that's after he leaves McLaren, he will go and drive a pig, just as McLaren build a fantastic car.. :drunk:



#97 kosmos

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Posted 10 April 2018 - 02:51


I can't see any good reason for Fernando to want to stay at Mclaren to be honest,:



I do, as long as they let him do f1 plus something else he will stay, get a f1 fat check, promote Kimoa, stay relevant in the most important motorsports competition, and you never know, maybe someday he will enjoy some podiums.

#98 IamFasterthanU

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Posted 10 April 2018 - 04:00

I do, as long as they let him do f1 plus something else he will stay, get a f1 fat check, promote Kimoa, stay relevant in the most important motorsports competition, and you never know, maybe someday he will enjoy some podiums.

 

I doubt this part, McLaren won't be in a position to do so imo if they are not within Top 4 or Top 5 with a very strong year end. 



#99 kosmos

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Posted 10 April 2018 - 04:37

I doubt this part, McLaren won't be in a position to do so imo if they are not within Top 4 or Top 5 with a very strong year end. 

 

 

No matter how large is the check is always going to be fatter than nothing, which is what he is going to get if he stops racing in F1. Not saying he cares about money but is always an added bonus.


Edited by kosmos, 10 April 2018 - 04:38.


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#100 IamFasterthanU

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Posted 10 April 2018 - 05:35

Agreed but I think Renault would be willing to pay him more than McLaren (along with a better car)