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The Halo is here - reactions and developments 2018 [split topic]


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#51 Clatter

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:23

some use(d) a lower camera position and in that case the halo was indeed blocking most of the track.

29391575_1915360528488641_881064215_o.pn

And I think the camera positioning is down to the FOM, not the team.

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#52 sopa

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:23

 

 

Haven't seen a worse camera angle before... You can't even see the road up ahead.

 

Be positive. At least you can see the halo. The most beautiful bit of art ever designed in Formula One.  :lol:



#53 Spillage

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:24

We definitely need some new onboard camera angles. I'm amazed that they haven't addressed this before now.



#54 Tenmantaylor

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:25

Liberty are all about the fans!



#55 TomNokoe

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:27

If the T-Cam position was even 10cm higher I would make a huge difference. Still garbage though. Can't polish a turd, etc.

You can't have helmet or halo cams because you would need a supporting graphic to instantly recognise the driver. And Liberty and graphics aren't a good mixture.

It's a joke.

Edited by TomNokoe, 23 March 2018 - 12:31.


#56 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:27

My god!!!  I thought it would be bad but.. not that bad! :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

 

It's pretty hilarious.  :lol:

 

dUzOAFr.jpg

 

"Oh... gawd" as they say.



#57 FLB

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:28

They need to have in-helmet cameras. like IndyCar or have them on the nose of the car. This is unbelivably bad considering the lead-in time they've had.



#58 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:29

If the T-Cam position was even 10cm higher I would make a huge difference.
 

 

 

 

leadf2.jpg

 

 

Why not just use stereoscopic (two) cameras and stitch them together to eliminate the halo from view?  Surely FOM has thought of that!


Edited by V8 Fireworks, 23 March 2018 - 12:30.


#59 FLB

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:30

Actually, this is bad enough that the conspiracy theorist in my thinks this is Liberty trying to sabotage the halo.



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#60 Spillage

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:31

It's amazing, really. At the start of every single season there's something they haven't thought through - the timing never works, there's some ridiculously unpopular rule change (knockout qualifying, I'm looking at you) or they haven't bothered to consider how the onboard cameras are ruined by the halo. How can these people be this useless?



#61 Kalmake

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:32

Indy helmet cams would be terrible with the halo as they are above eye level and the middle pillar blocks cameras very well.



#62 JHSingo

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:32

With the Halo, they've tried to prevent a very unlikely occurrence, ad just created a whole load of problems in other areas. Totally F1 thinking.



#63 ch103

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:33

Compare the opening event of F1 to the opening event of MotoGP.  Not even a comparison...  It really is a shame that F1 as we used to know it is gone...



#64 andrewf1

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:34

Actually, this is bad enough that the conspiracy theorist in my thinks this is Liberty trying to sabotage the halo.

 

You may be onto something there. But the Halo is Jean Todt's brainchild, his legacy. Any criticism to the Halo he takes personally. As long as he's head of the FIA, the halo will stay.



#65 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:36

Not wanting to be over-dramatic, but that Mercedes onboard should never have seen the light of day. Same old FOM.

 

They are similar to the on boards they used on halo-equipped cars during free practice last year.  I think the McLaren camera angle is far more comical,  :lol:

 

T4lUFzZ.jpg


Edited by V8 Fireworks, 23 March 2018 - 12:38.


#66 ANF

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:40

Some pictures from the T-cams:

image.jpg
image.jpg
image.jpg

#67 Atreiu

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:41

It is horrible and has no redeeming quality. Many people will mock and ridicule it and a lot will be turned off to the point of losing much of their interest in F1. It ruins every camera view in which it appears.

#68 sopa

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:42

Like somebody asked - why are they sitting in a basketball ring?



#69 ANF

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:43

Like somebody asked - why are they sitting in a basketball ring?

Because the Halo is round. :p

#70 DS27

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:45

Halo is pretty terrible but there will come a day when it will save a life.

 

 

Full race preview here.

 

 

Will there? Perhap's once in the 50 years it could do just that; who knows.

 

But the issue facing F1 is can it survive long enough for that life to be saved, because right now, compared to everything else I follow, it's looking pathetic. 



#71 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:48

It is horrible and has no redeeming quality. Many people will mock and ridicule it and a lot will be turned off to the point of losing much of their interest in F1. It ruins every camera view in which it appears.

 

Even in the pits, the halos are goofy looking.  :drunk:

 

f1-australian-gp-2018-stoffel-vandoorne-



#72 dau

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:49

You may be onto something there. But the Halo is Jean Todt's brainchild, his legacy. Any criticism to the Halo he takes personally. As long as he's head of the FIA, the halo will stay.

 

 

It's not his brainchild. The halo was Mercedes' suggestion for a cockpit protection device that was brought up when FIA asked the teams for ideas after being pressured by the drivers to introduce measures to prevent fatal consequences in case of accidents like the Wilson, Bianchi or Surtees ones. The other serious suggestions were a roll cage (don't know by whom) and Red Bull's aeroscreen that failed the initial tests, after which Red Bull stopped development. 

 

Todt is getting increasingly irate because the same people who first demanded "action" and those who actually invented this abomination are now talking about how it's a shame and how they want to saw it off with a chainsaw. Can't blame them, though, i wouldn't want to take responsibility either. And the fans are buying it anyway.



#73 hogstar

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:51

It's dreadful and has nothing to do with safety, all about avoiding litigation. 

 

Todt is a weak man. 



#74 sopa

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:51

Even in the pits, the halos are goofy looking.  :drunk:

 

f1-australian-gp-2018-stoffel-vandoorne-

 

Here is another one, which makes me laugh. :lol:  Can't help it any more.  :stoned:



#75 Slackbladder

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:51

The T-cam positions are a little better but that hoop completly ruins the look of the car, covering all the suspension and the tyres. You get no idea about what the car is actually doing.



#76 Nonesuch

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:51

"It'll be integrated into the car design!"

 

"You barely notice it at all!"

 

"People will get used to it very quickly!"

 

:rotfl:

 

 

Little+Coxy+coupe+Car.jpg



#77 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:52

It's dreadful and has nothing to do with safety, all about avoiding litigation. 

 

 

Agreed.

 

The benefits are marginal if any IMO.


Edited by V8 Fireworks, 23 March 2018 - 12:53.


#78 Nonesuch

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:54

It's not his brainchild. (...) Todt is getting increasingly irate because the same people who first demanded "action" and those who actually invented this abomination are now talking about how it's a shame and how they want to saw it off with a chainsaw.

 

There's no point. Some are intent to blame every misplaced piece of gravel on Jean Todt.

 

It's been years since this farcical contraption was first shown to the public. Mercedes, Renault, Ferrari and McLaren-Honda have spent billions on their F1 project in these years.

 

If they couldn't be bothered to make something better, they're hardly the ones to be moaning about it now. It was, after all, their own idea to improve cockpit safety.



#79 manmower

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:54

Welp. At least with the cam higher up you can see the road ahead.



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#80 Spillage

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:55

You can at least see both wheels, the steering wheel and the apex with the T-cam. The other angles need to be binned immediately.



#81 WOT

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 12:57

Don't know if anyone is willing to sit down and count the number of flying wheels in the first 40 seconds of this clip, but the halo wasn't required....
 
 
A lot of work has been done on wheel tethers since then....
 
The testing for the strength of the halo was a 25kg wheel fired at an angle of 15 degrees at 225kph. Most of the wheels flying around in that video clip look like they are going to come down vertically on the drivers head - halo would have been useless.
 
Let's do some more work on wheel tethers......
 
But this is only my opinion.....


#82 fer312t

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:10

Yyaaawn..The Halo is here to stay. Deal with it..quietly please.

 

Yea, not going to happen. I will deal with LOUDLY and OFTEN...

If only to spite you specifically! :p

Every opportunity in fact. So should everyone.

Done accepting 'getting used to' bad things re: F1.



#83 ANF

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:16

There's no point. Some are intent to blame every misplaced piece of gravel on Jean Todt.
 
It's been years since this farcical contraption was first shown to the public. Mercedes, Renault, Ferrari and McLaren-Honda have spent billions on their F1 project in these years.
 
If they couldn't be bothered to make something better, they're hardly the ones to be moaning about it now. It was, after all, their own idea to improve cockpit safety.

There were many calls for improved cockpit safety in July 2009 when Henry Surtees was killed and Felipe Massa was injured.

For instance, here's Martin Brundle:

"A new step forward is needed with an elegant solution. It's well within their ability for F1 designers to create something but it will take a while to research, develop and implement."
http://news.bbc.co.u...one/8170736.stm

#84 Fatgadget

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:17

I don't really mind the halo in terms of aesthetics but it has completely killed the onboard cam. 

Just deploy split cameras then. Hardly an insurmountable problem :rolleyes:



#85 bargeboard

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:20

The onboard camera angle is awful. Some of the cars with dark halos look ok on track, the Williams and Sauber white halos look like ass.

#86 Fatgadget

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:22

Agreed.

 

The benefits are marginal if any IMO.

How do you know that exactly? :confused:



#87 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:24

How do you know that exactly? :confused:

 

It's my opinion, hence the "IMO". :) I do not have any scientifically rigorous evidence to support my assertion and I may be completely wrong. 



#88 WOT

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:24

There were many calls for improved cockpit safety in July 2009 when Henry Surtees was killed and Felipe Massa was injured.

For instance, here's Martin Brundle:

"A new step forward is needed with an elegant solution. It's well within their ability for F1 designers to create something but it will take a while to research, develop and implement."
http://news.bbc.co.u...one/8170736.stm

 

 

And here's Martin Brundle again with another quote, - this one that I picked up from the Daily Telegraph, but he's been vocal on Sky Sports as well....

 

 
"One area of contention is the introduction of the halo and I have mixed feelings about that. It’s not just the aesthetics, it’s the whole ethos of it.
 
I don’t like what the halo stands for and I think if you sanitise things too much people will lose interest."


#89 Jamiednm

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:31

I've always thought that halo has as much chance of causing injury (or worse) as preventing it. I just imagine it obstructing a driver who has crashed and flipped with the engine on fire.



#90 Fatgadget

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:31

Yea, not going to happen. I will deal with LOUDLY and OFTEN...

If only to spite you specifically! :p

Every opportunity in fact. So should everyone.

Done accepting 'getting used to' bad things re: F1

Go ahead and waste your breath! :D



#91 ANF

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:32

And here's Martin Brundle again with another quote, - this one that I picked up from the Daily Telegraph, but he's been vocal on Sky Sports as well....
 
 
"One area of contention is the introduction of the halo and I have mixed feelings about that. It’s not just the aesthetics, it’s the whole ethos of it.
 
I don’t like what the halo stands for and I think if you sanitise things too much people will lose interest."

I know. María de Villota died, Jules Bianchi died, Justin Wilson died, but Martin Brundle must have changed his mind. Thanks for pointing that out.

#92 Fatgadget

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:34

With the Halo, they've tried to prevent a very unlikely occurrence, ad just created a whole load of problems in other areas. Totally F1 thinking.

Created loads of problems  -such as?



#93 WOT

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:41

I know. María de Villota died, Jules Bianchi died, Justin Wilson died, but Martin Brundle must have changed his mind. Thanks for pointing that out.

 

 

No problems. Racing is dangerous.



#94 Pete_f1

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:47

Even in the pits, the halos are goofy looking. :drunk:

f1-australian-gp-2018-stoffel-vandoorne-


WTF is that?

#95 Fatgadget

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:47

It's dreadful and has nothing to do with safety, all about avoiding litigation. 

 

Todt is a weak man. 

Yes.Litigation is no laughing matter. A very litigious world we live in these days. And not taking pre-emptive measures is folliness personified.... Wasn't it the late Mark Donahue (sp) estate that sued Bell Helmets or some such? And Williams still in the coals over Aryton Sennas death?



#96 JoeDede

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:49

A sad day for F1 imo  :cry:



#97 totgate

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:53

Is Formula 1 really worth saving????? I think it's a bloody joke..... :o  :confused:  :rolleyes:



#98 Mart280

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:55

My  opinion is the Halo is an over reaction to Jules Bianchis accident, If Whiting messes up again as he did at Suzuka 2014 then the Halo will save him and the driver, why is it always F1 that screws up, step noses, penis noses, horrible sounding V6 engines and now this nasty looking Halo, what was wrong  with a windshield like Indy cars ? was it just because vettel felt a bit sick or something, was he the only one that tested a windshield ? the sound has gone from F1, no more screaming V8's or V10's and now the cars look ridiculous and the incar tv shots are laughable, there are other ways of protecting the driver but in my opinion the halo should have been a non starter.


Edited by Mart280, 27 March 2018 - 14:35.


#99 Nonesuch

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:58

Created loads of problems  -such as?

 
If you haven't noticed by now, pointing it out would seem a bit cruel.
 
But it may or may not have something to do with that enormous contraption bolted unto the cars around the cockpit area.
 

There were many calls for improved cockpit safety in July 2009 when Henry Surtees was killed and Felipe Massa was injured.

For instance, here's Martin Brundle:

"A new step forward is needed with an elegant solution. It's well within their ability for F1 designers to create something but it will take a while to research, develop and implement."
http://news.bbc.co.u...one/8170736.stm

 
Indeed, and he's still right. The exposed helmets are one of the last remaining points on the car where drivers are at very high risk.
 
That doesn't mean an incident is likely, but that an incident that does take place has the potential to be very serious indeed.

Edited by Nonesuch, 23 March 2018 - 13:58.


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#100 JHSingo

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Posted 23 March 2018 - 13:58

Created loads of problems  -such as?

 

Getting in and out of the car

Visibility through uphill corners

Ruined onboard camera views

Resulted in them having to change the position of the starting lights

Generally resulted in the sport being a laughing stock, again...