219 replies to this topic

[SophieB]

I will put the footage and reactions in afterwards, but in the meanwhile, do you think that the stewards gave the appropriate punishment to Perez making context with Sirotkin during the 2018 Singapore GP.

[noikeee]

Yes, that was a very bad move. Particularly in the context of that being the 2nd driver he pushed today.

 

You could maybe argue for even harsher punishment (ex. DQ for dangerous driving) but I guess you could argue he didn't see these cars... it's pushing it though.

[Diablobb81]

Two incidents in one race.

He is either blind or stupid.

So : too lenient.

[Jordan44]

Stewards bottled it as usual.

If Seb got a stop and go for an incident at low speed then he should have got a harsher penalty for doing it at racing speed.

Edited by Jordan44, 16 September 2018 - 13:44.

[Fastcake]

The fact that this was the second time in a race Perez apparently “didn’t see” another car removes any benefit of the doubt for me.

A harsher penalty would have been deserved.

Edited by Fastcake, 16 September 2018 - 13:48.

[registered]

You could see in the replay Perez looking to the left before hitting Sirotking.
For me such intentionally ramming another driver should not be allowed in racing at least black flag.

Edited by registered, 16 September 2018 - 13:51.

[LeClerc]

He learned from the master

 

[johnmhinds]

There was no reason for him to be turning to the left at that point, the pass had already been made.

[SophieB]

In this, the tenth anniversary of Crashgate, in which it was deemed that a deliberate crash at this circuit that didn’t involve another car was so heinous that it merited life bans, its interesting to reflect on where we are now.

Should have been a black flag then a race ban.

[Laster]

I don’t think Perez intended to take a swipe at him, frustrated though he was I’ve never seen Perez as the sort to use his car as a weapon. I think more likely Perez wanted to squeeze Sirotkin to the inside like you see the drivers often do to compromise their line and make them brake earlier, but stupidly Perez moved far too sharply and ended up clattering in to him. I think the penalty is totally justified and the correct one if viewed through that lens.

[LeClerc]

I don’t think Perez intended to take a swipe at him, frustrated though he was I’ve never seen Perez as the sort to use his car as a weapon. I think more likely Perez wanted to squeeze Sirotkin to the inside like you see the drivers often do to compromise their line and make them brake earlier, but stupidly Perez moved far too sharply and ended up clattering in to him. I think the penalty is totally justified and the correct one if viewed through that lens.

 

[LeClerc]

In this, the tenth anniversary of Crashgate, in which it was deemed that a deliberate crash at this circuit that didn’t involve another car was so heinous that it merited life bans, its interesting to reflect on where we are now.

Should have been a black flag then a race ban.

 

Crashgate should have resulted in a lot more bans than it did, AND they should have been upheld.

 

Perez should be cooling his heels racing shopping carts for at least one full season.

[maximilian]

Should be a black flag and race ban, at the least.

[jcbc3]

TomK argued that it was already harsher than the usual 5 and 10 second penalties dished out for contact, so he was satisfied.

 

Not saying I agree, but that was an officials view.

[Mila]

It was below professional standards. The team hasn't had a grip on its drivers for a while . . .

Edited by Mila, 16 September 2018 - 14:22.

[LeClerc]

TomK argued that it was already harsher than the usual 5 and 10 second penalties dished out for contact, so he was satisfied.

 

Not saying I agree, but that was an officials view.

 

If viewed in isolation yes, but Perez (and indeed Ocon) have history. 

 

Grosjean did not get a ban solely on the basis of his Spa adventure, so past deeds matter.

[GiorgioF1]

[SenorSjon]

If Verstappen could generate 22 pages with a small tire brush, I wonder where this goes. But Perez screwed his teammate first and later his team. He was so frustrated with Sirotkin he swiped him.

[PedroDiCasttro]

He also sent his teammate into the wall.

[jcbc3]

If viewed in isolation yes, but Perez (and indeed Ocon) have history. 

 

Grosjean did not get a ban solely on the basis of his Spa adventure, so past deeds matter.

 

They reviewed the first lap incident with Ocon, and made a no penalty decision, So they couldn't (and shouldn't) bring that into the discussion of the Sirotkin contact.

[SenorSjon]

They reviewed the first lap incident with Ocon, and made a no penalty decision, So they couldn't (and shouldn't) bring that into the discussion of the Sirotkin contact.

 

Charlie notoriously doesn't meddle with intrateam affairs like this.

[LeClerc]

They reviewed the first lap incident with Ocon, and made a no penalty decision, So they couldn't (and shouldn't) bring that into the discussion of the Sirotkin contact.

 

I wasn't talking about history in the race, but rather over their whole career.

[quaint]

Stewards bottled it as usual.

If Seb got a stop and go for an incident at low speed then he should have got a harsher penalty for doing it at racing speed.

 

These incidents are not really comparable, because while Seb wanted to bang wheels, Perez probably wanted to just intimidate and probably expected Sirotkin to yield. I can't believe he actually wanted any contact, otherwise even he would have placed his more suitably for that; however, he moved so swiftly he should have realized contact was almost inevitable.

 

Anyway, the penalty was too lenient.

[Muppetmad]

If the stewards were at all interested in driving standards, they would have issued the black flag immediately and then dished out a race ban afterwards. Incidentally, this is what interested stewards would have also done at Baku last year...

[Viryfan]

They reviewed the first lap incident with Ocon, and made a no penalty decision, So they couldn't (and shouldn't) bring that into the discussion of the Sirotkin contact.

 

Whiting never gets into intra team incidents.

[LeClerc]

The way steward selection is done, you might as well pick two random people from the streets and some retiree who fancies a flight to the race.

[jcbc3]

Whiting report incidents to the stewards that then make a decision. Since they made a decision, Charlie must have referred the incident.

[P123]

The stewards should have parked him.

[ANF]

TomK argued that it was already harsher than the usual 5 and 10 second penalties dished out for contact, so he was satisfied.
 
Not saying I agree, but that was an officials view.

Yeah, a drive-through is a harsh penalty nowadays, so I think it was appropriate.

[jcbc3]

They calculated it as a 23 second penalty so more than twice as hard as usual.

 

BTW, Nicholas Kiesa just agreed with you guys on Danish TV, that it should have been a black flag. 

[Francesc]

Should have been a race ban. Not the first time this guy does this and won't be the last with this stupid penalty.

[ANF]

There was no reason for him to be turning to the left at that point, the pass had already been made.

Sirotkin was still on his left (obviously), so I think he wanted to scare him into backing off before they approached the next left-hander. He was clearly frustrated after having tried to pass him for like 30 minutes.

[maximilian]

Deliberately crashing into another car should be an automatic race ban.  This kind of thing needs to stop.

[PedroDiCasttro]

Should have been a race ban. Not the first time this guy does this and won't be the last with this stupid penalty.

If he does that with his teammate next year, it'll be the team principal who'll give him a race ban.

 

Mr. Strulovitch won't be happy.

Edited by PedroDiCasttro, 16 September 2018 - 14:44.

[f1paul]

What do you have to do to get a race ban these days?

[SophieB]

Webber half suggesting a “knuckle sandwich” for sorting things out with Perez, making his co-presenters recoil a bit so backtracking. DC saying it is unacceptable to use a car as a weapon so clear what his view is.

Perez giving it the full I see no ships thing in his pen interview.

[Whatisvalis]

Did Vet, at Baku 17, set a precedent?

 

Looks like Perez deliberately drove into two cars this race.

[Spillage]

I'm not sure. It looked like a proper red mist moment. If it was, then his penalty was very lenient. If it was a simple misjudgement - and we shouldn't rule that out - then the penalty was probably appropriate.

I'm always a bit sceptical about the narrative that is built from the bits of team radio and footage that we get to see. We didn't see exactly why he was angry with Sirotkin. We don't know how long before the collision he made that message. So while it doesn't look good, I'm not sure whether it was a 'road rage' incident or just a stupid and reckless mistake.

Edited by Spillage, 16 September 2018 - 14:49.

[NateF]

What did Maldonado get in 2011 after qualifying ended?

[Laster]

What do you have to do to get a race ban these days?

Exceed 12 points on their license.

[LeClerc]

If he does that with his teammate next year, it'll be the team principal who'll give him a race ban.

 

Mr. Strulovitch won't be happy.

 

IF he is even in the team next year. 

 

I'm getting vibes, I'm telling you.

[LeClerc]

What did Maldonado get in 2011 after qualifying ended?

 

I think he had a ham sandwich and a coke.

[Maustinsj]

Webber half suggesting a “knuckle sandwich” for sorting things out with Perez, making his co-presenters recoil a bit so backtracking. DC saying it is unacceptable to use a car as a weapon so clear what his view is.

Perez giving it the full I see no ships thing in his pen interview.

Seemed like he blamed the other guy to me. “He was moving around in the braking.”

[LH44Fan]

Voted too lenient also - he had lost control at that point (bit like Max in Monza), was driving angry devoid of senses and there was only going to be one outcome - he deserved a tad more imo...

[Oho]

Did Vet, at Baku 17, set a precedent?

 

Looks like Perez deliberately drove into two cars this race.

 

I don't think the incident at start was malicious like the red mist moment with Sirotkin.....

[DutchQuicksilver]

Comparable to what Vettel did to Hamilton in Baku last year. I believe he got a 25s penalty, a drive through penalty is about the same.

Though, both should have a gotten a black flag, but they never give that in F1 anymore.

[MikeV1987]

I thought it would be a 10 second stop and go penalty at the very least. I can understand his frustration but ffs man.

[BuddyHolly]

Two incidents in one race.

He is either blind or stupid.

So : too lenient.

 

^This.

 

I know it won't happen but if I was the team boss I'd turf him out for 2019, the guy never learns.

[Oho]

What did Maldonado get in 2011 after qualifying ended?

 

https://www.dailymot...om/video/xkrtpi

[Whatisvalis]

I don't think the incident at start was malicious like the red mist moment with Sirotkin.....

 

Definitely - the Sirotkin moment was pure reckless and nasty.

 

The Perez onboard at the start sure looks like he deliberately punted Occon into the wall - but it's risky to start throwing accusations around from one angle like that.