53 replies to this topic

[FirstnameLastname]

All these mechanics who travel to the races across the globe, seems like a great lifestyle to be part of the race team but what’s the reality?

Long hours I’m guessing and tight deadlines. Too many airports. They travel cattle-class?

And what sort of hotel arrangements do they end up with? I’m guessing they don’t spend long at the hotel anyway... i picture the lower budget teams having mechanics bunking up together to save on the costs. Or billing the mechanics for their own accommodation.

[LBDN]

Steve Matchett book life in the fast lane gives a good insight

[Fondmetal]

F1 personnel salaries are crap. Google what they are paying and it is rather shocking. Unless you are a Newey or a top designer/Engineer pay starts at 20k for a technican, mechanics £30-40k and £35k -60k for regular aerodynamists. Long hours. I guess the bonus is you get to travel the circus.

[GrumpyYoungMan]

I bet it isn’t as good as you think it would be!

I much doubt the mechanics pay for there own accommodation! Unless they upgrade to a different hotel!

Edited by GrumpyYoungMan, 01 October 2018 - 05:33.

[teejay]

I'd say for most of them it is more about a love of the sport. 

 

I would assume assume Force India don't pay what Mercedes do, so there would be some variance over the sport. 

[Erwin123]

Mmm I assume the teams want to hire the best of the best, and they need some loyalty since experience can't be bought.

So I can't imagine it will all be that bad since they would need personnel every two years.

I imagine 'travelling the globe' and being away from home gets old real quick...

Edited by Erwin123, 01 October 2018 - 05:55.

[beute]

I so hope this isn't going to turn into a politics thread.

Whatever they are paid, keep in mind that they are there out of their own free choice, and if they wanted to they could find better paying jobs given their credentials.

No they are not being exploited, oppressed or anything like it.
How could they be called that if they do it out of their own free choice?
This sadly didn't stop the feminists from getting rid of grid girls...

[GrumpyYoungMan]

Mmm I assume the teams want to hire the best of the best, and they need some loyalty since experience can't be bought.
So I can't imagine it will all be that bad since they would need personnel every two years.
I imagine 'travelling the globe' and being away from home gets old real quick...

I once was talking to a Mechanic from Radical who spent some time with Radical in Dubai and then moved on to the US, he said all you see is inside the circuit - as you are either working or sleeping... he said it wasnt glamous at all - and it’s more a singletons life style due to being away from home so much!

Edited by GrumpyYoungMan, 01 October 2018 - 06:12.

[jimjimjeroo]

Doubt they have to spend much whilst they're away, food and hotels paid for.

[jimjimjeroo]

Doubt they have to spend much whilst they're away, food and hotels paid for.

[WilliamsF1Fan]

Given there used to be a mechanic who dabbled in buying/selling 1/43 scale replica F1 cars (he bought a few from me, I was quite excited to post off a few I sold to the actual factory of the team), I cannot imagine the salaries are great unless you are one of the very top people in your particular field.  I imagine for the younger guys and girls though it is the excitement of being part of that world, although it must wear out after a while?  Maybe that's when they go on to factory based jobs.  

[Huffer]

Doubt they have to spend much whilst they're away, food and hotels paid for.

 

There is that, which if you're single, can help a lot. Your daily commute for much of the year is probably covered by the team (bus, expenses claim etc,) and you probably end up with a couple of days off after a race weekend, either in exotic place or immediately flow back home. 

 

Up until recently. I did a fair bit of business travel (I averaged something like three days every week during 2015 to 2017) and I was entitled to a daily allowance for lunch, which was often quite generous depending on the location I was travelling to. I never spent all of it, so it was basically cash in pocket not to mention that, under EU rules, required travel time was counted as paid work-time. So I tended to end up with quite a bit of extra pay as I was entitled to have overtime payout even though I was salaried.
 

I know from experience that constant international travel is not as fun or glamorous as people like to think (unless you travel first-class or have your own jet) and it extracts quite a physical toll on you. I still remember the times when I did Frankfurt->USA->Frankfurt->Japan->Frankfurt->Australia in the space of three weeks on a bi-annual basis, and I felt absolutely fatigued for about two weeks - never mind the jet lag!

 

But even though the base pay is not spectacular, the various perks and savings mean that if you';re not supporting a family, you can probably save quite a bit even if your body ends up on the verge of collapse.
 

[FirstnameLastname]

All those airports would drive me absolutely insane. I think I’d kill someone

[superdelphinus]

They must of it for the love of the sport. A lot, of not most, of these people are oxbridge types who could likely command much higher salaries in other settings. I’d imagine it’s quite a good thing to have on your CV too though.

[king_crud]

I know someone at Red Bull, he stays in the factory. But he said the hierachy was team bosses flew first, engineers flew business, grunts flew economy. No idea about time off or anything but I doubt they're putting their hand in their pocket for anything.

I also know someone who works for Sky F1 in production. He goes to 8 races each year and on back to back races they have Mon - Wed to do what they like, they can choose when they fly to the next race, so he will go sit on a beach in Bahrain for a couple of days for example before moving to next venue.

[David Lightman]

Don't bother reading Marc Priestley's book, it's just a collection of tales of him and his mates getting p1ssed and vandalising stuff like teenagers.

[KWSN - DSM]

There are mechanics at all team who have been there more than 20 seasons, as someone wrote above they are doing this for love of the sport, they are in the game some will stay longer than others, but that is how it works out for us grunts in our daily work.

 

[Fastcake]

I did speak with someone who used to do the full calendar for a couple of years, and it is very much a job that can burn people out. It’s a lot of travel, compressed into 7/8 months with little space to recuperate before the constant work back at the factory, with the winter saving you from the travel but creating a new pressure as the teams rush to get the new cars ready. It’s tough, and not everybody is physically cut out for it, and even the most passionate may find it’s a lifestyle they don’t want. It’s why we have a summer break - an attempt to give everyone involved a bit of rest.

Separately, I have read that it’s become increasingly harder for some teams to attract people to the race teams. The gradual expansion of the race calendar, and Bernie’s willingness to play games with the race dates at no concern to the personal and financial cost of the travel, has pushed teams to the edge. There has been talk of teams moving to two teams again, as they did with the race and testing teams in previous years, but that would obviously significantly increase costs.

[kumo7]

you can always quit, says the boss, for sure.

[SenorSjon]

I did speak with someone who used to do the full calendar for a couple of years, and it is very much a job that can burn people out. It’s a lot of travel, compressed into 7/8 months with little space to recuperate before the constant work back at the factory, with the winter saving you from the travel but creating a new pressure as the teams rush to get the new cars ready. It’s tough, and not everybody is physically cut out for it, and even the most passionate may find it’s a lifestyle they don’t want. It’s why we have a summer break - an attempt to give everyone involved a bit of rest.

Separately, I have read that it’s become increasingly harder for some teams to attract people to the race teams. The gradual expansion of the race calendar, and Bernie’s willingness to play games with the race dates at no concern to the personal and financial cost of the travel, has pushed teams to the edge. There has been talk of teams moving to two teams again, as they did with the race and testing teams in previous years, but that would obviously significantly increase costs.

 

Not to mention the increased workforce. There was a Jordan figure floating about that they had 40ish staff when they started the F1 team. That is almost the whole company at a pitstop. 

[pdac]

There are mechanics at all team who have been there more than 20 seasons, as someone wrote above they are doing this for love of the sport, they are in the game some will stay longer than others, but that is how it works out for us grunts in our daily work.

 

 

I suspected this. It's one of the reasons why I don't think the well-paid people in F1 need to receive anything like the remuneration that they do. Drivers will drive for nothing (especially for a team that has a championship winning car) - because that's what they love.

 

I wish they'd pay the mechanics a bit more and the drivers a lot less.

[Blundle]

I so hope this isn't going to turn into a politics thread.

Whatever they are paid, keep in mind that they are there out of their own free choice, and if they wanted to they could find better paying jobs given their credentials.

No they are not being exploited, oppressed or anything like it.
How could they be called that if they do it out of their own free choice?
This sadly didn't stop the feminists from getting rid of grid girls...

The only person turning this into a politics thread is you with your bizarre right wing ramblings.  

[LucaP]

This topic would make for a great blog

[KWSN - DSM]

Why are you guys saying the mechanics are paid low? Do we know what they make?

 

[goldenboy]

Yeah, I'd think their salaries are a bit higher than the numbers bandied around at the top of this page.

[goldenboy]

This topic would make for a great blog

It really would, and I'm surprised there isn't more content about this subject.

There is almost certainly some kind of NDA though.

[KWSN - DSM]

If you are an employee of a company registered in the UK, you surely are employed under the employment rules governing the UK, as well as the EU.

 

How many hours you work each month.

Scheduled overtime.

Unscheduled overtime.

Accelerator for working on weekends and on holidays.

Everything paid for when traveling on behalf of the company, if not paid then you can deduct on your tax return.

'x' weeks of vacation in Denmark that would  weeks, plus some funky other types they have come up with the past 20 years, so essentially 6 weeks.

 

I do not know what average pay for an auto mechanic is in the UK, sake of argument say it is GPD30.000, then I would expect the above to end up actually paying them GPD60.000 - but as said I do not think high wages is why they do it.

 

[Myrvold]

If you are an employee of a company registered in the UK, you surely are employed under the employment rules governing the UK, as well as the EU.

 

How many hours you work each month.

Scheduled overtime.

Unscheduled overtime.

Accelerator for working on weekends and on holidays.

Everything paid for when traveling on behalf of the company, if not paid then you can deduct on your tax return.

'x' weeks of vacation in Denmark that would  weeks, plus some funky other types they have come up with the past 20 years, so essentially 6 weeks.

 

I do not know what average pay for an auto mechanic is in the UK, sake of argument say it is GPD30.000, then I would expect the above to end up actually paying them GPD60.000 - but as said I do not think high wages is why they do it.

 

 

All nice and dandy, until you come across a position with "extra here and extra there". There is always waivers for all rules and regulations.
We've got pretty much the same rules as you guys have in Denmark, and trust me, both me and my way better half, doesn't follow many of those rules,and it's all legal.

[stewie]

If you are an employee of a company registered in the UK, you surely are employed under the employment rules governing the UK, as well as the EU.

The UK had an easement for workers to opt out of the EU working time directive which can, and does, complicate matters.

[Afterburner]

Steve Matchett book life in the fast lane gives a good insight

This is a really, really great read.

[derstatic]

Matchett's book is great but it's getting very old now. Perhaps things haven't changed much, perhaps they have. Would be great if someone were to write a similar book today.

[king_crud]

All nice and dandy, until you come across a position with "extra here and extra there". There is always waivers for all rules and regulations.
We've got pretty much the same rules as you guys have in Denmark, and trust me, both me and my way better half, doesn't follow many of those rules,and it's all legal.

My Paris colleagues have much more generous work benefits than us in London. The UK does not follow the same conditions as our friends on the continent

[KWSN - DSM]

I see the same mechanics working the cars year after year, it can not be that bad. If I had any abilities a F1 team could use, I would jump at the chance and not care one bit about what the paycheck was, and that I think is how most F1 mechanics are as well.

 

And totally unrelated I love that there is a female mechanic on the Force India car.

 

[absinthedude]

OK so I know one of the FOM TV directors and I've had conversations with someone who was an F1 mechanic in the 90s and early 2000s.

 

It's not glamarous. It's hard work. They don't get to stay on in the glamorous locations after a race (except maybe once a year) as they're packing everything up and then on the first feasible flight back home to check everything over at the factory. The mechanics sometimes have to pull all nighters to fix damaged cars or trace faults. When not at the circuit (where they see less of the action than we TV viewers do) they are at the factory. Their spouses put up with them being away most of the time during the F1 season. Really it's a single man's game ideally. Pay isn't great, it's done for the love of the sport. I've witnessed the RBR guys landing at Luton airport after the European races and they look crucking shattered. 

 

As for the FOM director (still in his post), he also doesn't get to do any sight seeing. He's whisked into his big trailer where he views all the action on screens. Yes, he's one of the guys who decides what we all see. No I won't be contacting him to complain. He's heard it all before. 

 

Years ago I was in touch with someone who was engineer for Stephen South in 1979/80 and he said in those days there was a lot of camaraderie....mechanics were young guys who travelled the world in cars or vans, driving through the night to reach some European circuit and maybe pick up a local girl. It's not like that now. Hard work, long hours, gruelling schedule. 

 

Hats off to the mechanics. 

[7MGTEsup]

Why are you guys saying the mechanics are paid low? Do we know what they make?

 

 

I knew a few Williams mechanics back in 2012-13 and their salary looked good (between 40 and 45K) but once you divided it into the hours worked they were on less than minimum wage. They both enjoyed doing the work but said it took it out of you as you got older and a family.

[w1Y]

Great CV builder.

Off topic but Although not great detaik I loved Ted following the crew peice which was on Sky during the live build up.

[jcbc3]

...
And totally unrelated I love that there is a female mechanic on the Force India car.
 

She's Danish. Her name is Emilie Rath.

[Fonzey]

It amazes me that we see so many familiar/persistent faces in the garages over the years. It seems to be that it's a job which a motorsport fanatic would find absolutely perfect for a short stint of time - maybe a season or two, then family/social commitments start to draw you back home for a "duller" existence. I've travelled with my work, and it's all very grand travelling around on expenses but the novelty of airports, hotels and transfers quickly wear off.

 

But then again, if you study motorsport engineering (or similar), surely this is the pinnacle of what you'd ever dreamt of doing regardless of how modest the salary opportunity is. If you could earn a modest salary and still see the world, and be close to motorsport then perhaps it's perfect.

 

I would love the idea of applying my trade to an F1 team for a season or two - to really get a feel for how these teams work on the inside but I'd struggle to do it longer term I think.

[Tsarwash]

I so hope this isn't going to turn into a politics thread.

Whatever they are paid, keep in mind that they are there out of their own free choice, and if they wanted to they could find better paying jobs given their credentials.

No they are not being exploited, oppressed or anything like it.
How could they be called that if they do it out of their own free choice?
This sadly didn't stop the feminists from getting rid of grid girls...

I did find this post ironic. Literally the only person who went down the political route was yourself. 

[Tsarwash]

I knew a few Williams mechanics back in 2012-13 and their salary looked good (between 40 and 45K) but once you divided it into the hours worked they were on less than minimum wage. They both enjoyed doing the work but said it took it out of you as you got older and a family.

 

If you are talking 45K in British money, you would struggle to do so many hours that you were actually on less than minimum wage, which is £8 an hour ish. That would be 108 hours per week, in very simple calculations. 

[FirstnameLastname]

I did find this post ironic. Literally the only person who went down the political route was yourself.

Indeed. I’ve read that post a couple times and came to the conclusion he’s read Something different to everyone else. Baffling.

[Afterburner]

As for the FOM director (still in his post), he also doesn't get to do any sight seeing. He's whisked into his big trailer where he views all the action on screens. Yes, he's one of the guys who decides what we all see. No I won't be contacting him to complain. He's heard it all before.

LOL, love it!

Edited by Afterburner, 02 October 2018 - 14:52.

[7MGTEsup]

If you are talking 45K in British money, you would struggle to do so many hours that you were actually on less than minimum wage, which is £8 an hour ish. That would be 108 hours per week, in very simple calculations. 

 

Ok maybe not minimum wage but it doesn't look so handsome when you're working/traveling for 70+ hours a week. Most of these guys had been doing it for a while and before the curfew came in so 14+ hour days were not uncommon.

[Tsarwash]

Ok maybe not minimum wage but it doesn't look so handsome when you're working/traveling for 70+ hours a week. Most of these guys had been doing it for a while and before the curfew came in so 14+ hour days were not uncommon.

I admit I was being a little bit picky there. But talk of regular 100+ hour weeks is a bit silly. I have genuinely done a job where I was doing 85 - 90 hours a week, and it is difficult to squeeze that many working hours into a week, because you do need to sleep, eat and stuff. 90 hours a week is 13 hours seven days a week. Assuming 8 hours sleep, that leaves 3 hours every day to do essential human things. I did that for 18 months, but your life is literally just work and sleep. 

[7MGTEsup]

I admit I was being a little bit picky there. But talk of regular 100+ hour weeks is a bit silly. I have genuinely done a job where I was doing 85 - 90 hours a week, and it is difficult to squeeze that many working hours into a week, because you do need to sleep, eat and stuff. 90 hours a week is 13 hours seven days a week. Assuming 8 hours sleep, that leaves 3 hours every day to do essential human things. I did that for 18 months, but your life is literally just work and sleep. 

 

I'm pretty sure a lot of these guys don't get the recommended 8 hours a day, I have worked days before where I have only got a few hours sleep before being back at it again thankfully not for extended periods of time though. When I go away with work it is pretty much get up, work, food, bed, repeat.....

[KWSN - DSM]

She's Danish. Her name is Emilie Rath.

 

Even better.

 

[ThadGreen]

What is meant by "mechanic"? Are the 20 or so individuals who perform the wheel changes during pit stops all considered mechanics? Do all of them work on the cars in addition to working the pit stop? I would doubt it and I would also doubt that the team would let any important member of the team participate in the wheel changing during pit stops. My guess is that the individuals you see changing wheels do that and load and unload equipment and really don't work on the cars at the factory or at races. They may practice wheel changing at the factory and the team probably looks upon them as unskilled labourers and other than race weekends they do very little for the team.

[KWSN - DSM]

They do work on the cars as well, they also unload trucks, line up equipment in the pit, and for the European races on occasion drive the trucks.

 

[YoungGun]

What is meant by "mechanic"? Are the 20 or so individuals who perform the wheel changes during pit stops all considered mechanics? Do all of them work on the cars in addition to working the pit stop? I would doubt it and I would also doubt that the team would let any important member of the team participate in the wheel changing during pit stops. My guess is that the individuals you see changing wheels do that and load and unload equipment and really don't work on the cars at the factory or at races. They may practice wheel changing at the factory and the team probably looks upon them as unskilled labourers and other than race weekends they do very little for the team.

 

1.923 second pit stop says you're deluded. 

[KWSN - DSM]

Couple of years old, but still relevant I think.

 

https://www.motorspo...echanic/636930/

 

And he  spend +20 years in F1, retired in 2017,.