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British Grand Prix - How would you feel if it left Silverstone?


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#1 F1 Mike

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 18:10

Still no new deal with the circuit and F1 bosses seem to be keen for a race in London.
Silverstone has such rich history with F1 and is consistently one of the best attended races on the schedule.

It seems crazy to think it could go anywhere else. A race in the capital seems unnecessary in the UK as it's already a well attended event and wouldn't get the benefit of some other locations like Singapore where it's trying to grow the sport and pull in new fans.

What about infrastructure... Could London really handle the additional capacity required on the underground etc?

Thoughts?

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#2 Andy35

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 18:24

Why have it in the UK at all?  I live in England but it could be anywhere considering I am looking at a small screen in my room.

 

Post Brexit it should be moved to Belgium  :cool:

 

Monsieur Andy



#3 Pete_f1

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 18:28

Depends where it goes. I'm glad Brands Hatch wasn't butchered for it.

We still have some nice overseas territories...

#4 tomjol

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 18:32

Stupid "city" race in London: no.

 

Other proper circuit: There aren't any up to F1 standard, are there?

 

Preference: Leave it alone.



#5 Luca Pacchiarini

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 18:35

Lydden Hill

#6 Nonesuch

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 18:42

There doesn't seem to be a proper circuit that could replace Silverstone, so any move away from there would mean either a street circuit or no English GP.

 

I wouldn't mind F1 be a bit less English, but it'd be silly to go from there to no race. That's a massive swing in the other way, and not a good one. There has to be an English F1 race.

 

Street circuits are almost all bad for F1 cars. I don't get the appeal of designing cars that come alive in Spa's legendary corners, only to see them muck around in 2nd gear around a half-baked 90-degree kink. Seems dumb.

 

So, I guess, leave Silverstone alone. Even this Silverstone. :p

 


#7 Laster

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 19:03

No other circuit in the UK is up to standard, and despite Liberty wanting to race in London, that’s just not going to happen. The government hasn’t been willing to stump up funds to back silverstone, they sure aren’t going to throw £200 million to roll out a circuit once a year around London. It’s either Silverstone or no British Grand Prix, I do not see any other options.

#8 jonpollak

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 19:05

Grand Prix of Reigate.
Party in my front garden.

Jp

#9 Sterzo

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 19:17

Grand Prix of Reigate.
Party in my front garden.

Jp

I'd vote for that. How about a triangular circuit from Reigate to Horley, up to Dorking and then back along the A25 to Reigate? Possibly nobody has had the idea of a triangular road circuit for a Grand Prix before.

 

As it happens, I love London and I love motor racing, but a London GP would foul up both of them.



#10 F1matt

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 19:20

We have a Labour mayor of London who could never endorse an F1 race, we might even have a Labour PM who's constituency might be part of the track, there is a better chance of him laying on the track in protest. 

 

 

yet another thing Liberty are f&&king up on. 


Edited by F1matt, 07 November 2018 - 19:20.


#11 absinthedude

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 19:40

I feel there are certain grands prix which should always be on the calendar. Britain, Italy, Moncao are the obvious ones. I'm not so attached to the British GP being at Silverstone. It's lovely that the venue which hosted the first World Championship grand prix is still on the calendar but it's not a deal breaker to hold it elsewhere. After all it's been held at Brands and Aintree. Pre-World Championship at Donington.

 

But where? Brands Hatch was thankfully not castrated to keep up with F1 after 1986. I don't feel it would do Brands any good to do the necessaries to bring it up to F1 standards. Donington did wrest the GP away from Silverstone a decade or so ago and started the work, which would have utterly ruined that track truth be told. A street circuit? Possible....but London? I really don't think that the people of London would like it. Bringing parts of London to a standstill (when it's already overcrowded and gridlocked) would not go down well. It's a historic and sometimes beautiful city but....a race on public roads?

 

Now....here's a curve ball....Hyde Park? The roads on the perimiter and perhaps some of the road through? Bridge over the Serpentine? Speakers Corner Corner? It might just work. And wouldn't require closing many roads....Hyde Park already hosts 60,000 fans for concerts so the ability to deal with large crowds is there. 



#12 Anja

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 19:41

I like Silverstone, but in theory wouldn't mind the British GP moving elsewhere. Provided it's moving to a decent track of course, and that's the problem - there isn't one that matches modern F1 standards or even could be easily upgraded. And having no race in the UK would simply be a disgrace. 



#13 noriaki

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 19:42

"F1 threatening to leave Silverstone"? Exciting! So what's gonna rock our world next? Maybe "VAG rumoured to enter F1" or "Ferrari threatening to leave F1"?

 

:o



#14 cpbell

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 19:47

No other circuit in the UK is up to standard, and despite Liberty wanting to race in London, that’s just not going to happen. The government hasn’t been willing to stump up funds to back silverstone, they sure aren’t going to throw £200 million to roll out a circuit once a year around London. It’s either Silverstone or no British Grand Prix, I do not see any other options.

Absolutely - this is, IMO an indication that next year will be the last British Grand Prix.



#15 Albaforever

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 20:12

 

There doesn't seem to be a proper circuit that could replace Silverstone, so any move away from there would mean either a street circuit or no English GP.

 

I wouldn't mind F1 be a bit less English, but it'd be silly to go from there to no race. That's a massive swing in the other way, and not a good one. There has to be an English F1 race.

 

Street circuits are almost all bad for F1 cars. I don't get the appeal of designing cars that come alive in Spa's legendary corners, only to see them muck around in 2nd gear around a half-baked 90-degree kink. Seems dumb.

 

So, I guess, leave Silverstone alone. Even this Silverstone. :p

 

 

 

I think there should be an English Grand Prix in time, but lets try and save the British Grand Prix first. :)  


Edited by Albaforever, 07 November 2018 - 20:21.


#16 RacingGreen

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 20:15

If Silverstone can't make money with the crowds they get - and Liberty won't change the funding model - then bye bye British GP.  Liberty are a business, sure they say things like "it would be nice to keep historic races" but it means nothing, they are about making money.

 

You can only have so many races a year. If you add two then you probably need to subtract one.  Now we know which one.



#17 RacingGreen

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 20:22

I'd vote for that. How about a triangular circuit from Reigate to Horley, up to Dorking and then back along the A25 to Reigate? Possibly nobody has had the idea of a triangular road circuit for a Grand Prix before.

 

As it happens, I love London and I love motor racing, but a London GP would foul up both of them.

 

The French had it it 1926, it's called the circuit Reims-Gueux and hosted a number of world championship Grand Prix there.

 

800px-Circuit-Reims-Gueux-1926-%28openst


Edited by RacingGreen, 07 November 2018 - 20:30.


#18 Vitesse2

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 20:40

I do believe that Sterzo was employing the rhetorical device commonly known as 'irony'  ;) There are many examples of triangular road circuits. This one is a particular favourite of mine - a 'double triangle'. Athy, 1903.

 

http://www.silhouet....racks/athy.html

 

Hyde Park has regularly been floated as a possibility. The first problem to overcome would be that it actually belongs to Her Maj ...



#19 Murdoch

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 20:45

"F1 threatening to leave Silverstone"? Exciting! So what's gonna rock our world next? Maybe "VAG rumoured to enter F1" or "Ferrari threatening to leave F1"?

 

:o

 

Indeed, the public negotiations have started....



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#20 josdevries

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 20:55

I would be quite happy if the race left the UK entirely.

 

Silverstone could perhaps then become what it ought to be, instead of a venue that spends its entire year worrying about money to pay for F1.  It is a soulless place, devoid of atmosphere, awful to watch at, if they lost MotoGP and F1, they might work a bit harder lol!

 

I get why F1 goes there, but really of most F1 tracks around now, it is perhaps the worst to watch at, other than Monaco. But the industry strusture round the venue is growing all the time, that is good, the uni thing is good and maybe the hotel might be too, despite it being an odd place to have a 24 hour a day 7 day a week hotel. So maybe the future looks brighter with or without the F1 date. I hope they are thinking ahead with the potential of losing it anyway instead of banking on it always being there.

 

And regarding Brands, in my eyes the GP ;loop has been butchered fine without f1 ever going near it.


Edited by josdevries, 07 November 2018 - 20:58.


#21 djparky

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 21:23

It would be a shame to see it go, but I'm a bit indifferent as I've no plans to go again

However silverstone can't go on losing money without endangering the existence of the circuit. There is no other track capable of hosting a GP, and never in a million years will they get a street circuit in the UK

#22 Clatter

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 21:26

We have a Labour mayor of London who could never endorse an F1 race, we might even have a Labour PM who's constituency might be part of the track, there is a better chance of him laying on the track in protest. 

 

 

yet another thing Liberty are f&&king up on. 

 


To be fair the current problem is something they have inherited. If there is no race in 2020, then we can say they have f***ed up. Until then there is plenty of negotiating time.

#23 PayasYouRace

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 21:43

It’s bad enough that we lost the French Grand Prix for the best part of a decade, and the German has been on and off for far too long. Losing the British would be disgusting.

It doesn’t have to be at Silverstone, but unless Donington Park has the upgrade that would have been alcarried out back in 2010, Silverstone is the only option. That’s no bad thing. I think Silverstone is still one of the best circuits on the calendar and I don’t understand why it’s so maligned nowadays.

#24 Jerem

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 21:43

"F1 threatening to leave Silverstone"? Exciting! So what's gonna rock our world next? Maybe "VAG rumoured to enter F1" or "Ferrari threatening to leave F1"?

 

:o

Yes, I like these periodic rumours too. 2020 F1 race in Donington with Porsches and no Ferraris, you read it here first.



#25 jonpollak

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 21:52

I'd vote for that. How about a triangular circuit from Reigate to Horley, up to Dorking and then back along the A25 to Reigate?


That’s the spirit!!

AND..My wife would definitely leave town so I can entertain each and every one of you here... Hell, I’ll ever go out and buy an new barbecue.

#26 Beri

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 22:01

The French had it it 1926, it's called the circuit Reims-Gueux and hosted a number of world championship Grand Prix there.

800px-Circuit-Reims-Gueux-1926-%28openst

Last year I've been to Reims just to see this track. Amazing. The pit buildings and main grandstands are still there. Pretty much a time travel when you wander around in the old complex.

Edited by Beri, 07 November 2018 - 22:01.


#27 AlexFone

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 22:14

In truth it is very sad if F1 and Silverstone part ways. I am only guessing here but I would imagine Silverstone are not making any money and probably losing some, amazing when you think that the track is packed from the Thursday and as we all know tickets are not cheap. There are a lot of countries who’s governments subside F1 but there is no way the UK government will do this and to add insult a lot of those circuits are never sold out.

This has all led to Silverstone activating the break clause with the hope of renegotiation, Liberty have called their bluff so both parties are now at a stalemate. There is no circuit in the UK that is upto F1 standard. Silverstone is still a great circuit despite all of the changes.

Very sad state of affairs when you consider the heritage, the fans and that 6 of the 10 teams are based in the UK. Add in the fact that the UK has produced so many world champions.

Silverstone, Monza, Spa and Suzuka are the true great F1 circuits and should never be lost. Funnily enough I’m sure they are the best attended circuits as well.

#28 FNG

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 22:20

I started watching F1 in 1995 and I can always remember the British Grand Prix "in jeopardy"

 

It's not going anywhere.



#29 F127

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 22:44

I would love to see it altnernate with Donington and the circuit upgraded (it was already ruined 10 years ago by that awful attempt so there is nothing to lose).

However, it isn't going to happen and Silverstone is genuinely fine. They just need to sort out the spectator issues.

 

At least everyone in the country can get to Silverstone, London doesn't need the Grand Prix and the rest of the country doesn't need it there.



#30 Clatter

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 23:05

In truth it is very sad if F1 and Silverstone part ways. I am only guessing here but I would imagine Silverstone are not making any money and probably losing some, amazing when you think that the track is packed from the Thursday and as we all know tickets are not cheap. There are a lot of countries who’s governments subside F1 but there is no way the UK government will do this and to add insult a lot of those circuits are never sold out.

This has all led to Silverstone activating the break clause with the hope of renegotiation, Liberty have called their bluff so both parties are now at a stalemate. There is no circuit in the UK that is upto F1 standard. Silverstone is still a great circuit despite all of the changes.

Very sad state of affairs when you consider the heritage, the fans and that 6 of the 10 teams are based in the UK. Add in the fact that the UK has produced so many world champions.

Silverstone, Monza, Spa and Suzuka are the true great F1 circuits and should never be lost. Funnily enough I’m sure they are the best attended circuits as well.

Called what bluff? There is still a race in 2019, so plenty of time for negotiating.

#31 Clatter

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 23:06

I would love to see it altnernate with Donington and the circuit upgraded (it was already ruined 10 years ago by that awful attempt so there is nothing to lose).
However, it isn't going to happen and Silverstone is genuinely fine. They just need to sort out the spectator issues.

At least everyone in the country can get to Silverstone, London doesn't need the Grand Prix and the rest of the country doesn't need it there.

What are the spectator issues?

#32 robefc

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 23:15

It is a soulless place, devoid of atmosphere, awful to watch at, if they lost MotoGP and F1, they might work a bit harder lol!
 
I get why F1 goes there, but really of most F1 tracks around now, it is perhaps the worst to watch at, other than Monaco..



Is it just me that completely disagrees with this?

#33 F1 Mike

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 23:16

It's a great atmosphere, oozing with passion. Especially the campsites

#34 alframsey

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 23:28

Imo Silverstone needs to stay on the calendar and it is a track I love and the drivers seem to love. As has already been said where else could it possibly go? Not really a fan of street races as such and no other track to race at. Silverstone it is and Silverstone it always will be.



#35 pdac

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 23:32

There is nowhere else. It'll end up being a stand-off between Liberty and Silverstone, because neither will want there not to be a British Grand Prix. But, of course, that might be the final outcome (but I think Liberty will offer a tiny discount and Silverstone will take it).



#36 RacingGreen

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Posted 07 November 2018 - 23:54

The BRDC organisers only have themselves to blame for their poor decisions.

 

1) they signed a contact to get the GP "cheap" in the short term, but with a 5% escalator - effectively dooming the race in the long term. 

2) then they spent all their cash and borrowed heavily to build a new pit complex and update the circuit at the same time so now they have no reserves left to pay the escalator fees out of. To clear this debt they have had to sell their other assets (nearby land) and thus lost their rental income too. 

3) could have still saved the race however selling to Lawrence Tomlinson, MSV or Land Rover (and maybe others I can't remember now) but apparently are happier to let the British GP fail than relinquish ownership of the circuit.

4) They then gave notice to try and force Liberty to renegotiate, something they can't afford to do because then 20 other races would do the same and they'd have no financial stability and potentially no F1 series. So don't blame Liberty for acting in good faith and asking the organisers to honour a signed contract.


Edited by RacingGreen, 07 November 2018 - 23:56.


#37 RacingGreen

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 00:20

Other proper circuit: There aren't any up to F1 standard, are there?

 

 

 

No other circuit in the UK is up to standard, ......., I do not see any other options.

 

 

 

There doesn't seem to be a proper circuit that could replace Silverstone...

 

 

 

Both Donnington and Brands Hatch (the best circuit in UK) are both in a lot better condition and easier to upgrade than Zandvoort, so if a race there is being planned I don't see why not.

 

Although personally I'd like to leave Brands alone, have the idiots who own Silverstone sell it to someone who knows what they are doing, and then maybe Liberty may renegotiate with a new owner.



#38 Garndell

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 00:34

Croydon GP has a nice ring to it...

 

If liberty don't have a British GP in 2020 I guess we'll have to Chase Mr Carey out of F1.  London just won't work, it would cost too much to do and it would be a financial loser for the city & it's businesses.



#39 tomjol

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 01:05

Both Donnington and Brands Hatch (the best circuit in UK) are both in a lot better condition and easier to upgrade than Zandvoort, so if a race there is being planned I don't see why not.

Although personally I'd like to leave Brands alone, have the idiots who own Silverstone sell it to someone who knows what they are doing, and then maybe Liberty may renegotiate with a new owner.


Sure, and the money to do those upgrades is coming from...?

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#40 loki

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 02:47

yet another thing Liberty are f&&king up on. 

 

So it's FOM's fault the track agreed to a long term deal then executed the escape clause at the last minute it was available?  It's the track that's taking the gamble in getting a better deal by executing the break clause.  The decision belongs to Silverstone.  If it doesn't happen it's because they backed out of it.



#41 baddog

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 03:44

I don't care much for the Track, and the owners can climb up their own bottoms, but I would inf act greatly regret it leaving.

 

I would be outright appalled were there no British Grand Prix, it IS the home of the sport in many ways, though it shares that with Italy, Germany and France. (and the US when talking about motorsport as a whole). The series should aim always to have events in these countries, and the rest all over the world.



#42 Loosenut

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 04:54

Well, Luton airport is considered a "London" airport, so I guess if they run it somewhere near that, it might be possible and they could call it a London Grand Prix.

I find it enough of a struggle getting my knackered old Mondeo into the west end at much more than jogging speed of an evening to do a gig!

 

If they do somehow squeeze 20 F1 cars onto the streets of the west end, just a few things to consider..

 

*Stationary anywhere on the circuit between the hours of 0930-1730 will land you a £110 fine (£65 if paid in full within 14 days).

*20mph zones in operation in ever increasing parts of the speed camera capital of the world.

*Uber drivers in a Toyota Prius WILL get in front of you somewhere during your journey and behave like a lost & stoned learner.

*If your car isn't one of the most expensive on the grid, a snotty security guy from a posh night club will advise you that you can't leave it anywhere near his club, cos someone might vandalise it..

*£11.50 congestion charge + If your vehicle doesn't meet the emissions standards, the Low Emission Zone (LEZ) daily charge is £100 for larger vans, minibuses and other specialist vehicles, and £200 for lorries, buses, coaches and other specialist heavy vehicles.

*No, you won't meet the bloody queen!



#43 RacingGreen

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 05:16

Sure, and the money to do those upgrades is coming from...?

 

Well looking at the ridiculous business plan Silverstone had before signing on for the escalator fees they were never going to be able to fund I guess the Tooth Fairy is an option.
 
Seriously though if the Government won't help at a national level maybe they could at a local level if the race was in a municipality with a large enough rates base like Birmingham or London. 
 
Also I don't understand why the British Government won't find a few million a year to subsidise a sporting event called "The British GP" but could find GBP11.3 Billion for the one off Olympics of which the public sector contributed around GBP9.3 Billion ( including central funding from the Department for Culture, Media and Sport of about GBP6.25 billion. )  
 
I really don't understand how that one off event in 2012 is still bringing any value to tax payers - but an annual and comparatively extremely cheap showcase like the Grand Prix is considered such a no no for a grant.
 
Another quick comparison - Covent Garden Opera House gets Arts Council (Government) Funding of about GBP 26 Million a year - they have an annual theatre attendance of 670,000 - a subsidy of nearly GBP39 per seat. I'm pretty sure that even Silverstone could balance their books with an additional Government grant of GBP39 per Grand Prix attendee.

Edited by RacingGreen, 08 November 2018 - 05:19.


#44 absinthedude

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 06:13

How times change....25 years ago the gate receipts for the grand prix pretty much funded Silverstone's entire yearly calendar....now the grand prix (and BRDC's badly thought out plan) are crushing it.

 

Bring back Brooklands, I say. 



#45 GrumpyYoungMan

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 07:18

No other circuit in the UK is up to standard, and despite Liberty wanting to race in London, that’s just not going to happen. The government hasn’t been willing to stump up funds to back silverstone, they sure aren’t going to throw £200 million to roll out a circuit once a year around London. It’s either Silverstone or no British Grand Prix, I do not see any other options.

And watch F1 leave the UK.

It doesn’t make sense for it to be based here if there was no UK race. But having said that with the lack of testing no a days they could be based anywhere in the world...

F1 too English? What country set it up? :/ Ffs

Edited by GrumpyYoungMan, 08 November 2018 - 07:19.


#46 GrumpyYoungMan

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 07:21

How times change....25 years ago the gate receipts for the grand prix pretty much funded Silverstone's entire yearly calendar....now the grand prix (and BRDC's badly thought out plan) are crushing it.

Bring back Brooklands, I say.


BERNIE? Annual hosting price increase...

Drop in ticket sales?

#47 A3

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 07:50

Stupid "city" race in London: no.

 

Other proper circuit: There aren't any up to F1 standard, are there?

 

Preference: Leave it alone.

 

We had the European GP once when there were 2 races in Germany. Can't we move the British GP to Turkey?



#48 PayasYouRace

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 08:01

Croydon GP has a nice ring to it...
 
If liberty don't have a British GP in 2020 I guess we'll have to Chase Mr Carey out of F1.  London just won't work, it would cost too much to do and it would be a financial loser for the city & it's businesses.

 

Funnily enough, it’s walking distance from the now defunct circuit at Crystal Palace.

 

Well, Luton airport is considered a "London" airport, so I guess if they run it somewhere near that, it might be possible and they could call it a London Grand Prix.

 

Champcar called their Brands Hatch race the London Trophy or somesuch.

 

And watch F1 leave the UK.
It doesn’t make sense for it to be based here if there was no UK race. But having said that with the lack of testing no a days they could be based anywhere in the world...
F1 too English? What country set it up? :/ Ffs


France.

#49 Spillage

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 08:48

Silverstone is the best track in the UK, so it'd be a shame.

That said, Donington and Brands are also nice circuits with a lot of history, so I don't think it'd be an absolute tragedy if the GP went to one of those. The most important thing is that it stays on the calendar in one form or another.

I'm not mad keen on a race in London. What would be the point? We have loads of nice tracks here already.

Edited by Spillage, 08 November 2018 - 08:49.


#50 CoolBreeze

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Posted 08 November 2018 - 08:54

Call clarkson, and head off to the Eboladrome...