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McLaren Technical Thread (MCL34)


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#701 SarbaV

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 09:16

Didn't Zak say it's a 10 plan?

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#702 f1rules

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 09:36

theyve released car specs :-) not that we learn a lot :-)

 

https://www.mclaren....-specification/


Edited by f1rules, 13 February 2019 - 09:36.


#703 sgtkate

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 10:07

I'm laughing at the idea that BAT would think a gentlemen's agreement among tobacco companies would be any more successful than a gentlemen's agreement among F1 teams.  Having said that, it's still not clear to me how effective PMI's 'subliminal' sponsorship of Ferrari has been.  I've just never seen how the color red and a bar code translates to "I want to buy some cigarettes".  But I guess BAT must suspect some success or they wouldn't be back.  Perhaps they have a different trick up their sleeve.

 

mclaren-mcl33-aleron-trasero-f1-soymotor

 

Works everywhere but Hungary.

This deserves so many more likes. Well done!  :clap:

 

My hovercraft is full of eels!



#704 Oblivion

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 10:35

Any info on shakedown prior to testing? Cannot find any so far.



#705 f1rules

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 11:09

us mclaren fans are for the moment resigned to reaching for straws or how its called, and i think we can find a bit of proud in another mclaren aero detail seem to be copied this year, both merc and renault have attached the front bargeboard to the chassis, like mclaren has done for years :-)



#706 f1rules

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 11:41

no alonso test it seems, in my opinion the right move

https://www.thebestf...test-barcelona/



#707 Clatter

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 11:47

no alonso test it seems, in my opinion the right move
https://www.thebestf...test-barcelona/

Definitly the right move, but sounds like the team were forced into it rather than making the right choice.

#708 Christophe77

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 13:51

What are our expectations for the season? For me it's hard to see Mclaren scoring better than 6th... I mean, would you place them above Alfa(Sauber)? And even 6th might be a big ask... might as well be 9th. For me the top 4 is reasonably sure...  but after the 'works' teams?

 

1. Merc

2. Ferrari

3. RB

4. Renault

5. Alfa

6. Mclaren

7. Haas

8. RP

9. TR

10. Williams



#709 Dennista

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 13:55

What are our expectations for the season? For me it's hard to see Mclaren scoring better than 6th... I mean, would you place them above Alfa(Sauber)? And even 6th might be a big ask... might as well be 9th. For me the top 4 is reasonably sure...  but after the 'works' teams?

 

1. Merc

2. Ferrari

3. RB

4. Renault

5. Alfa

6. Mclaren

7. Haas

8. RP

9. TR

10. Williams

 

1. Merc
 
2. Ferrari
 
3. McLaren
 
4. Renault
 
5. RB


#710 Oblivion

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:04

What are our expectations for the season? For me it's hard to see Mclaren scoring better than 6th... I mean, would you place them above Alfa(Sauber)? And even 6th might be a big ask... might as well be 9th. For me the top 4 is reasonably sure...  but after the 'works' teams?

 

1. Merc

2. Ferrari

3. RB

4. Renault

5. Alfa

6. Mclaren

7. Haas

8. RP

9. TR

10. Williams

 

Changing the name from Sauber to Alfa Romeo cannot make them any faster. I don't see them fighting with Mclaren as well as with Haas.



#711 Oblivion

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:04

 

1. Merc
 
2. Ferrari
 
3. McLaren
 
4. Renault
 
5. RB

 

I second that.



#712 Maustinsj

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:10

That would be quite an achievement given the last few years, but a welcome one, of course.

#713 f1rules

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:15

seing the rb and merc i hope McLaren have something special in preparation, but will be truely difficult to match those in design.

 

for me

 

1. Merc

2. Ferrari

3. RB

4+5 Renault & Mclaren



#714 MirNyet

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:15

 

1. Merc
 
2. Ferrari
 
3. McLaren
 
4. Renault
 
5. RB

 

 

Given the level of reliability the Honda has had, unless they've performed miracles over the winter, then it's safe to assume Red Bull going backwards in the results, for this year at least.  McLaren 3rd?  More likely to be Renault, however 4th behind Renault with Haas or Alfa a close 5th isn't terrible, and if Red Bull have a difficult season, possible.



#715 MirNyet

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:17

seing the rb and merc i hope McLaren have something special in preparation, but will be truely difficult to match those in design.

 

for me

 

1. Merc

2. Ferrari

3. RB

4+5 Renault & Mclaren

 

The Red Bull is a beautiful car, but then so were the McLarens with the Honda PU.  It's a small unit, so allows for good packaging - needs however to work perfectly for Red Bull to keep 3rd (or better), and history suggests that not going to happen.  I'm expecting Renault in 3rd and McLaren having a shot at 4th.


Edited by MirNyet, 13 February 2019 - 15:35.


#716 f1rules

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:18

i dont think the honda pu will be that bad, that it will move rb back, its the 3rd year with same layout for Honda, and rbs car advantage is so big, that they will easily stay 3rd i think


Edited by f1rules, 13 February 2019 - 14:20.


#717 loki0420

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:19

I will be glad if we are mixing it with Renault and even loss in the end most probably would be because of less experienced line up. What i really hope for is we don't look back at Haas/Force India/Alfa/Williams. First tests can't come soon enough.



#718 Christophe77

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:29

I think Mclaren in 3th or 4th is hugely optimistic.... Why would they make such a jump?



#719 FullOppositeLock

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:36

Considering how far Red Bull is ahead of Renault and McLaren in the aero/chassis department you guys must really have very little confidence in Honda or very high confidence in Renault, neither of which is entirely justified. I mean, it's not beyond the reals of possibility that Renault will have a small PU advantage over Honda, but enough to make up for a >1s average lap time deficit..?



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#720 Rinehart

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:41

I think Mclaren in 3th or 4th is hugely optimistic.... Why would they make such a jump?

I agree. I think the order will be (1) the manufacturer teams, then (2) the B teams then (3) the traditional constructors with engine deals. Unfortunately McLaren are in the third division. 



#721 Oblivion

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:41

I think Mclaren in 3th or 4th is hugely optimistic.... Why would they make such a jump?

 

It's perfect time to unlock the potential, you know...



#722 Burai

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:48

It's so tight in the midfield, I wouldn't want to predict positions.

 

It's worth bearing in mind that Haas had the fourth quickest car last year, but they lost out to Renault because their trackside operations weren't up to scratch and their drivers kept making silly errors.

 

Similarly with McLaren, that sixth place wasn't at all representative of the ninth best car on the grid, but they maximised the chances they got when the car was working due to PU reliability, a solid trackside operation and Alonso's driving whilst Force India imploded and Toro Rosso drowned in engine penalties.

 

So it's not just a case of how good McLaren's car will be but how well the team works as a whole and how well all the other teams around them operate. McLaren could have a vastly better car than last year, perform far better on average but still finish sixth or worse. That's how tight the margins are.



#723 MirNyet

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:49

i dont think the honda pu will be that bad, that it will move rb back, its the 3rd year with same layout for Honda, and rbs car advantage is so big, that they will easily stay 3rd i think

 

Also quite possible if we use the 'they've got to get it right at some point' mindset.  To date however, everyone who's used a Honda PU fell down the championship tables.  I'd rather McLaren took a fight to Red Bull than Red Bull got hobbled, so let's see what happens.  I certainly don't wish ill on Red Bull, they do make beautiful cars, and it's hard not to be a fan of Newey.  We'll know soon enough where everyone stands.



#724 FullOppositeLock

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:50

I feel the MCL34 will be a crucial car for McLaren though. It's fair to assume the MCL33 was a massive disappointment considering where it stood compared to the other teams using the same power unit, but for now we can still assume with some credibility they took a wrong turn in the design process and suffered the consequences of it all season long. That excuse won't wash this year. McLaren still have a massive budget and great facilities. Their aim for 2019 must be to be on a par or beat the Renault team who are still building up their Enstone base after years of lack of funding. Anything less must be considered a failure and will see McLaren slip to the status of a former great that has lost its touch. Pressure is on as far as I am concerned. I hope you guys deliver and have a good year.


Edited by FullOppositeLock, 13 February 2019 - 14:54.


#725 SenorSjon

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:54

Considering how far Red Bull is ahead of Renault and McLaren in the aero/chassis department you guys must really have very little confidence in Honda or very high confidence in Renault, neither of which is entirely justified. I mean, it's not beyond the reals of possibility that Renault will have a small PU advantage over Honda, but enough to make up for a >1s average lap time deficit..?

 

Don't forget the drivers. Sainz vs Verstappen? Verstappen wins. Gasly vs Norris? Gasly wins.



#726 Oblivion

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:56

Gasly vs Norris? Gasly wins.

 

Not sure. I'd even say the opposite.



#727 FullOppositeLock

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:56

Don't forget the drivers. Sainz vs Verstappen? Verstappen wins. Gasly vs Norris? Gasly wins.

 

For me Norris beats Gasly. Maybe not in his debut season, but ultimately he's the more talented driver of those two. Anyway, there is just too much in it for me to suggest Red Bull will slip behind Renault and McLaren in 2019's picking order. If that happens the boys and girls at Milton Keys need to hang their collective heads in shame.



#728 MirNyet

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 14:59

I agree. I think the order will be (1) the manufacturer teams, then (2) the B teams then (3) the traditional constructors with engine deals. Unfortunately McLaren are in the third division. 

 

Surely, Red Bull with a customer Renault engine also fell into that third division?  How does that work?  The chassis isn't irrelevant, so McLaren should be doing a lot better than they have been, and certainly not staying in your third division.  



#729 CPR

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 15:04

What are our expectations for the season? For me it's hard to see Mclaren scoring better than 6th... I mean, would you place them above Alfa(Sauber)? And even 6th might be a big ask... might as well be 9th. For me the top 4 is reasonably sure...  but after the 'works' teams?

 

1. Merc

2. Ferrari

3. RB

4. Renault

5. Alfa

6. Mclaren

7. Haas

8. RP

9. TR

10. Williams

 

In general, the safest starting assumption would be "more of the same" (ie a repeat of the previous year), so something like the above is not too bad from that point of view.

 

FI/RP is an obvious case where the actual constructors championship is unfair (since their final points score doesn't reflect their actual points earned). What about McLaren though, is more of the same a safe assumption?

 

Well, we can only wait and see but I think there's a reasonable amount of evidence to suggest that 2018 was more of an outlier. If they were losing around 1s due to the front tyre wake issue then that's a huge amount of low hanging fruit, assuming that they can pick it efficiently. Given that they talked about doing a B-spec due to that issue, I don't think it's that unreasonable. These are just "reasonable" numbers with no justification though and there's no guarantee that they'll achieve something like that. In addition, we have no idea what gains the other teams will make.

 

It's also worth remembering that the gap from where McLaren were to the front of the midfield was quite short and very competitive. So even 0.5s would make a huge difference. Particularly if the Renault PU can deliver a big boost in quali performance, as rumoured.

 

Ultimately, we have no actual 2019 performance data at all and can only guess. There's lots of variables and who knows how they'll all work out. Generally, we've seen the smaller teams take a few races to get up to speed so McLaren might start the year well, fall back a bit after a few races, but then start coming on strong as the development war kicks in - I suspect McLaren will do well in that regard. Of course, we also have two new drivers and who knows how that'll work out.

 

There is reasonable room for optimism but with all the changes there's also reasonable room for downside. I'm trying to stay fairly relaxed about the whole thing, really.



#730 aray

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 15:13

5th is my expectation , no matter how good their winter testing may turn out to be.



#731 Dennista

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 16:03

Don't forget the drivers. Sainz vs Verstappen? Verstappen wins. Gasly vs Norris? Gasly wins.

 

Doesn't matter who is driving the car. Driver ability accounts for 1 tenth at the most. Unless if you are Alonzo then its 6 tenths.



#732 Clrnc

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 16:39

Every year I am most excited by McLaren's launch, not because I expect them to win again, but simply because they have the most potential to improve out of all teams. They can easily go from the slowest car last year to the best of the rest, which would be a huge jump already IMO. 

 

And then the livery...



#733 Mc_Silver

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 16:47

Every year I am most excited by McLaren's launch, not because I expect them to win again, but simply because they have the most potential to improve out of all teams. They can easily go from the slowest car last year to the best of the rest, which would be a huge jump already IMO.

And then the livery...


Yeah, I'm really excited to see the new car. I think we'll see some interesting aero stuff on the car. This should be the year of recovery. I don't think we will be able to match first three teams this year but we should be able to fight with rest of the grid for the 4th place. Don't forget we are still in the rebuilding phase like Renault. They are looking to fight for wins from 2021 onwards. Until then it will be all about Mercedes winning everything. Red bull may have produced the best chassis out there but with such a dud engine they cannot do anything against Mercedes and Ferrari.

#734 Fatgadget

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 16:49

Definitly the right move, but sounds like the team were forced into it rather than making the right choice.

Forced by who? :confused:



#735 GiorgioF1

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 16:57

Every year I am most excited by McLaren's launch, not because I expect them to win again, but simply because they have the most potential to improve out of all teams. They can easily go from the slowest car last year to the best of the rest, which would be a huge jump already IMO. 

 

And then the livery...

 

If we would be talking about ~2010 era McLaren then I would agree, but it isnt the same team anymore. No Ron, no rich title sponsor, no best engine, Prodromou seems to be overhyped - heck, they dont even have a World Champion driver anymore. To be honest even Williams have bigger potential than them to bounce back - they got Paddy, they got the Mercedes engine, they seem to got the funds this year and historically at Williams after a disastrous season follows a good one.



#736 Christophe77

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 17:17

Apparently the launch will be live broadcasted on Sky Sports?!

Seems a bit OTT... unless they have something very intersting to tell like, oh I don't know, a titel sponsorship with Coca-Cola? 



#737 Nicktendo86

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 17:19

Apparently the launch will be live broadcasted on Sky Sports?!

Seems a bit OTT... unless they have something very intersting to tell like, oh I don't know, a titel sponsorship with Coca-Cola? 

 


I think they did the same last year if memory serves, plus extended interviews/footage of shakedown with Sky?

#738 aray

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 17:21

If we would be talking about ~2010 era McLaren then I would agree, but it isnt the same team anymore. No Ron, no rich title sponsor, no best engine, Prodromou seems to be overhyped - heck, they dont even have a World Champion driver anymore. To be honest even Williams have bigger potential than them to bounce back - they got Paddy, they got the Mercedes engine, they seem to got the funds this year and historically at Williams after a disastrous season follows a good one.

In terms of people McLaren too have fantastic bunch of engineers( including soon joining James Key). Also Prodromou was hyped but never overhyped; i don't think people at Macca expected him to be new Newey. He is aero guy only and has limited input in chassis. I think the real disaster was Honda. Without proper power and reliability they got limited datas over a season and fell behind other teams rapidly in knowledge. At the end of the day it was sheer bad luck, since going for a work deal was right step taken by Ron. It simply didn't work out and damage was done in first 2 years .That's why i also believe until 2021, this team has zero chance to get back it's winning ways. Being the best of the midfield is what is achievable at most .

Just look at RB now and then at Macca when they launch their car, i bet the difference between detailing will be pretty apparent even to a amateurish eye....


Edited by aray, 13 February 2019 - 17:26.


#739 Nicktendo86

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 17:23

I don't think aero has been the problem has it? Surely the chassis is the issue and Pat Fry has been helping with that so I'd expect a better start than last year. I'm not expecting miracles but certainly regular Q3 should be a minimum.

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#740 Clatter

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 17:31

Forced by who? :confused:

Circumstances. If you read the article it says they were still trying to get him in the car, but his timetable prevented it.

#741 Christophe77

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 17:31

I think they did the same last year if memory serves, plus extended interviews/footage of shakedown with Sky?

 

Possibly. Don't know don't get Sky here in Belgium. Even if I wanted to. Which is unfortunate cause the local F1 coverage is only in French.

But ok, so maybe no dramatic unveiling tomorrow then. Damn. Still hoping this means something (available feb 25th, which coincides nicely with the F1 launch...  ;)

 

9569992-6683695-image-a-36_1549648647647


Edited by Christophe77, 13 February 2019 - 17:32.


#742 mclarensmps

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 17:32

historically at Williams after a disastrous season follows a good one.

 

 

:confused:  :confused:  :confused:

EDIT: I LOST MY BEAUTIFUL TABLE  :mad:

Here's the link instead: 

https://en.wikipedia...rix_Engineering

See: Formula 1 Results


Edited by mclarensmps, 13 February 2019 - 17:33.


#743 f1rules

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 17:49

do we think this is from today, or last year, they posted on twitter

https://pbs.twimg.co...AWBzR.jpg:large


Edited by f1rules, 13 February 2019 - 17:49.


#744 f1rules

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 17:53

come on owen send us a leaked picture :-)



#745 statman

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 18:35



& Tobacco money (let's be honest, have there ever been richer sponsors in F1 then the Tobacco brands?)

 

EU: Ferrari & McLaren tobacco deals require close examination



#746 Fatgadget

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 18:38

 

1. Merc
 
2. Ferrari
 
3. McLaren
 
4. Renault
 
5. RB

 

:rotfl:



#747 Hamm

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 19:04

Well, so we've seen now a few #F1 car launches, renders and stuff. Here's a bold comment - hold my beer.
https://twitter.com/...1851866119?s=19

#748 djr900

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 19:09

If we would be talking about ~2010 era McLaren then I would agree, but it isnt the same team anymore. No Ron, no rich title sponsor, no best engine, Prodromou seems to be overhyped - heck, they dont even have a World Champion driver anymore. To be honest even Williams have bigger potential than them to bounce back - they got Paddy, they got the Mercedes engine, they seem to got the funds this year and historically at Williams after a disastrous season follows a good one.

To be honest I am not sure if  Prodromou or Paddy Lowe is the most over hyped person in F1 . 

Its pretty close between those two



#749 Hamm

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 19:30

Owen:
It’s fricking incredible !! 😱 #MCL34
https://twitter.com/...8954961920?s=19

I’m still shaking to be honest can’t believe it #mcl34
https://twitter.com/...3342083072?s=19

Edited by Hamm, 13 February 2019 - 19:48.


#750 TomNokoe

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Posted 13 February 2019 - 19:53

Context: a select group of McLaren fans were invited to a pre-launch event this evening, and have seen the new car.

https://twitter.com/...7723654144?s=19