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2019 Rallying thread (WRC, ERC, other series)


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#451 BRG

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Posted 28 October 2019 - 20:12

Good to see that the Real Sebastian - Monsieur Loeb - can still rock up and lead the rally. 

 

I like the way that Tanak blanks that idiot Colin Clark at stage finishes when Clark asks one of his more asinine questions.  So congrats to Tanak on that and on his WRC..



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#452 Yamamoto

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Posted 29 October 2019 - 22:50

Congrats to Tanak. And Ogier has been a great champion; that must surely make Tanak's triumph so much more meaningful.



#453 messy

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Posted 29 October 2019 - 23:05

Ogier has been an incredible champion, but it’s SO good to see him knocked off his perch. 
 

it’s about time.



#454 Jvr

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 09:06

Now also Finnish papers claim based on their own independent sources from Autosport that Tänak will leave Toyota and move to Hyundai.



#455 messy

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 09:41

They’ll be all over that because it’ll surely mean a reprieve for Latvala.

 

unless.....



#456 ceesvdelst

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 13:27

Am reading reports that one of our most beloved drivers has passed away, Russell Brookes.

 

He had not been a well man for some time, but this seems as good a place as any to offer remembrance.

 

A fighter through and through, a demon driver in many cars, a consummate professional who always did his best for rallying at any level, and a relationship with a sponsor that has bought us one of rallying's most iconic liveries.

 

RIP little fella. 



#457 Jvr

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 15:45

They’ll be all over that because it’ll surely mean a reprieve for Latvala.

 

unless.....

They also report Ogier possible move to Toyota at the same time and the reports have been very balanced not hoping a miracle for Latvala.

My only point was that beyond Autosport, it seems there are other sources confirming Tänak to Hyundai move already as a fact.

 

But, we will see...


Edited by Jvr, 30 October 2019 - 15:48.


#458 BRG

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 17:37

Am reading reports that one of our most beloved drivers has passed away, Russell Brookes.

Oh, that is really sad news.  One of the real characters of the 'golden years' of British rallying, in Mini, Escort. Sunbeam, Manta or whatever.  Those toe to toe combats with Jimmy McRae in Mantas.  One of the lost generation of British drivers who were overlooked by the big teams because they weren't Finnish, along with Clark, Pond &  McRae Sr, yet they could, and did, beat the very best at times.

 

I recall that back when the 1000 Lakes Rally was dominated by Finns and the occasional Swede and no-one else could get a look in, Russell trucked off with his private team, slept in a tent, and finished 6th overall.  What could he have done with a genuine factory drive?  But bless Andrews Heat For Hire who must be the most faithful sponsor ever.  And got full value from their lad.

 

Rally In Peace, Russell!



#459 ArnageWRC

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 17:53

Just before this years RallyGB, I watched highlights of the 1986 RAC Rally on YouTube; and a fabulous interview with Russell; he was incensed at the changes made to that years route, which he felt had made the event 'soft'. I shudder to think what he thought of modern sprint events. 

 

An icon of 70's/80s British Rallying, who if he'd been called Brookesenen, may have got a proper World drive.

 

RIP Russell



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#460 JacnGille

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 18:47

Sad news



#461 ceesvdelst

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 18:47

For me Russell did get good drives, he had decent Escorts, Chevette, Sunbeam and Manta, just maybe never quite made it at world level, but if you check his stats out on ewrc he did a hello of a lot of rallies abroad, Germany, Belgium etc.

 

I think in the old days before internet we all forget that, Jimmy was a master in Ypres for instance as was Pondy.

 

A lot of these guys rallied a lot, but it was not as well covered as it is now. 

 

I love the fact there are so many of Russell's cars about, Talbots, Mantas and Chevette's, even a Cossie I think?

 

That livery was genuinely memorable



#462 tormave

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 19:28

If Ogier ditches Citroen I'm afraid they might just pull out. Just running two cars this season and not bothering with super rally more times than one tells me the budget is pretty tight...



#463 Myhinpaa

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 20:53

Just before this years RallyGB, I watched highlights of the 1986 RAC Rally on YouTube; and a fabulous interview with Russell; he was incensed at the changes made to that years route, which he felt had made the event 'soft'. I shudder to think what he thought of modern sprint events. 

 

An icon of 70's/80s British Rallying, who if he'd been called Brookesenen, may have got a proper World drive.

 

RIP Russell

 

The interview : https://youtu.be/LFmO_8KGAHA?t=695



#464 messy

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 21:05

If Ogier ditches Citroen I'm afraid they might just pull out. Just running two cars this season and not bothering with super rally more times than one tells me the budget is pretty tight...

yeah. For the good of Ogier, I can see why he’ll want to go to Toyota and I can see why Toyota might want him (although they didn’t in 2017, did they? Or was that Hyundai?). But for the good of the WRC both in terms of competitiveness and ensuring Citroen stay on, I really hope he stays where he is.

 

in fact I don’t want to see Tanak in a Hyundai as Neuville’s team-mate, either. It’s fine as it is. Tanak and Neuville joining forces has knock on effects for other drivers too and looks like everyone jumping on the Hyundai side and potentially leaving Toyota/Citroen (whoever Ogier doesn’t drive for, in other words) to join Ford in struggling to find an inspiring team leader. At the moment, Toyota, Citroen and Hyundai each have their star driver and so often we see the three battling at th3 sharp end all in their different cars. I just want more of that. 


Edited by messy, 30 October 2019 - 21:06.


#465 ceesvdelst

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Posted 30 October 2019 - 23:51

Let's be frank here, I would think Toyota would do what Wilson did and stretch every bit of budget to get Ogier.  I would hope so anyway.

 

I know a lot of people don't like him and he doesn't help himself.

 

But he is the class of the field, and has at least driven numerous different cars to win series and rallies. 

 

I admire that part of him, if not the moaning about things.

 

Ford simply cant afford a top man without huge sponsorship, which is odd when you see the size of the bloody place and how many people they employ to just build rally cars and a few Bentleys!



#466 Silberpfeil

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 08:08

If Ogier ditches Citroen I'm afraid they might just pull out. Just running two cars this season and not bothering with super rally more times than one tells me the budget is pretty tight...

 


I read the very same rumour about Citroën pulling out in the German press, actually (although where they got their information from remained unclear). One must also ask the question: Who would they get to replace Ogier? Breen seems to once again be out of options, but would he really go back to Citroën, even if it was his only realistic shot at remaining in WRC? Mads would be the obvious choice, but he, like Breen, was already found lacking once. Mikkelsen also appears to be on the market. Let’s just say that they have plenty of options, but none of them are particularly appealing when compared to what they have right now.

Edited by Silberpfeil, 31 October 2019 - 08:09.


#467 mikeC

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 08:47

RIP Russell

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#468 Branislav

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 09:56

If Ogier ditches Citroen I'm afraid they might just pull out. Just running two cars this season and not bothering with super rally more times than one tells me the budget is pretty tight...

Ogier has one more year in Citroen contracted

 

And you forgot this https://www.motorspo...itroen/4505098/

 

And Citroen said they will pull out if WRC don't bring hybrid engines from 2021.

 

I'm shocked Toyota let Tanak because no one available is better or at the same level as Estonian.

 

It's possible that both Citroen and Toyota pull out.



#469 messy

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 10:35

Ogier has one more year in Citroen contracted

 

And you forgot this https://www.motorspo...itroen/4505098/

 

And Citroen said they will pull out if WRC don't bring hybrid engines from 2021.

 

I'm shocked Toyota let Tanak because no one available is better or at the same level as Estonian.

 

It's possible that both Citroen and Toyota pull out.

Me too. 
 

in fact I really can’t work out what’s going on at Toyota. Last year it was Lappi who wanted out, now it’s Tanak. Those two, a little over twelve months ago, looked like the future of that team, the perfect fit. What’s the problem there? Is somebody in the team hard to work with, or is it the drivers themselves? Is reliability really the sticking point because it hasn’t been that bad, has it? 



#470 ceesvdelst

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 13:47

The thing is Wilson managed to get Ogier did he not even though he was under contract at VW, in fact I am fairly sure Red Bul and VW paid the wage bill first year.

 

But Ogier's demands would be very high.

 

Hardly like Toyota are skint though is it, Tanak's retainer would probably double in 2020 if he is champ, and they do look a team that are happy to spend, unlike Ford who just can't afford anyone.



#471 Jvr

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 14:34

More rumours from the Finnish media:
 

1. Insiders tell Citroen pulling out is unlikely because e.g. in VW case the situation was known within the team months before and that is not now the case with Citroen.

2. Amount of simple pay as a driver was not the problem for Tänak continuing with Toyota from Toyota side.  

3. Tänak and Märtin were trying to get a slice of coming Toyota R5 business as a part of the deal :eek:  Toyota rejected this request.

4. Additional not detailed demands from Tänak & Märtin that were not negotiable from Toyota side.

 

Just wondering what Hyundai has then promised to Tänak?


Edited by Jvr, 31 October 2019 - 14:56.


#472 Stephane

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 15:01

When Peugeot retired from Le Mans racing, cars were already testing at Sebring, or en route for.

 

That doesn't mean anything that no one knows within the team.



#473 Silberpfeil

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 15:12

More rumours from the Finnish media:
 

1. Insiders tell Citroen pulling out is unlikely because e.g. in VW case the situation was known within the team months before and that is not now the case with Citroen.

2. Amount of simple pay as a driver was not the problem for Tänak continuing with Toyota from Toyota side.  

3. Tänak and Märtin were trying to get a slice of coming Toyota R5 business as a part of the deal :eek:  Toyota rejected this request.

4. Additional not detailed demands from Tänak & Märtin that were not negotiable from Toyota side.

 

Just wondering what Hyundai has then promised to Tänak?

 


The German article I mentioned above also stated that Tänak and Mäkinen’s girlfriend, who apparently is highly involved in the running of the team, are not on the best of terms.

#474 Jvr

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 15:19

The German article I mentioned above also stated that Tänak and Mäkinen’s girlfriend, who apparently is highly involved in the running of the team, are not on the best of terms.

That's interesting but not quite tantamount of trying to get a slice of future business of selling Toyota R5's to privateers, I think.



#475 Stephane

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 15:20

That was a real tweet, i saw  it before it was deleted

 

https://pbs.twimg.co...SarXYAAIQ4C.jpg



#476 Jvr

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 15:23

That was a real tweet, i saw  it before it was deleted

 

https://pbs.twimg.co...SarXYAAIQ4C.jpg

WHAT!

Are you suggesting Neuville and Tänak could be switching the teams?

 



#477 Stephane

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 15:47

Or someone trolled too much

#478 Jvr

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 17:08

Official: Tänak to Hyundai for a two year deal and Neuville to stay also for the 2020. Loeb & Sordo to share third car rides.

 

https://motorsport.h...-for-two-years/


Edited by Jvr, 31 October 2019 - 17:12.


#479 anyeis

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 18:07

I dont think there is any way for Ogier to get to Toyota unless Citroen quits. The option has surely been taken already

They will have to hope Rovanperä will just be instantly mega. Surely he will crash a lot probably

Edited by anyeis, 31 October 2019 - 18:08.


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#480 ezequiel

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 18:08

Toyora Gazoo Racing Argentina is working to have José María López run the 2020 Argentine round in a Yaris WRC. López was previously rumoured to enter rally Argentina during his time at Citroen in WTCC and may have even tested a DS3 WRC alongside Loeb at the time, but the calendars of both WRC and WTCC weren't compatible.



#481 noikeee

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 18:21

yeah. For the good of Ogier, I can see why he’ll want to go to Toyota and I can see why Toyota might want him (although they didn’t in 2017, did they? Or was that Hyundai?). But for the good of the WRC both in terms of competitiveness and ensuring Citroen stay on, I really hope he stays where he is.

in fact I don’t want to see Tanak in a Hyundai as Neuville’s team-mate, either. It’s fine as it is. Tanak and Neuville joining forces has knock on effects for other drivers too and looks like everyone jumping on the Hyundai side and potentially leaving Toyota/Citroen (whoever Ogier doesn’t drive for, in other words) to join Ford in struggling to find an inspiring team leader. At the moment, Toyota, Citroen and Hyundai each have their star driver and so often we see the three battling at th3 sharp end all in their different cars. I just want more of that.


Looks like Tanak and Neuville will be teammates. Although I get what you're saying, it's also nice that we get a head-to-head on these two, at their peak, on the same car.

Not sure who the hell will lead Toyota's line-up now, provided Ogier is contracted and can't move. Latvala?

#482 Myrvold

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Posted 31 October 2019 - 22:53

The German article I mentioned above also stated that Tänak and Mäkinen’s girlfriend, who apparently is highly involved in the running of the team, are not on the best of terms.

 

I read this as Tänak and Mäkinen had the same girlfriend. "Of course that is trouble" I was thinking  :cat:



#483 Stephane

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 10:45

Breen in place of Mikkelsen for the third Hyundai in Australia.



#484 Myrvold

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Posted 01 November 2019 - 12:37

Breen in place of Mikkelsen for the third Hyundai in Australia.

 

That seemed a bit unfair, but I guess - both are out for 2020, so it doesn't really matter.

Interesting is from Sardinia to Wales, Mikkelsen scored the most points for Hyundai. One more than Neuville, and 10 or 11 more than the 3rd car combined.



#485 Silberpfeil

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Posted 05 November 2019 - 17:50

Evans to Toyota? https://www.autospor...er-toyota-visit Not going to lie, I’d really like that. I’m obviously spitballing here, but this would be a move that might just open the door for Latvala or Paddon as well – Latvala in particular might work well as a mentor for Sunninen, while Paddon would (probably) have to get out of his Hyundai NZ deal if he were to make a full-time return..

Edited by Silberpfeil, 05 November 2019 - 17:51.


#486 Jvr

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Posted 05 November 2019 - 18:21

Not sure if Evans would be an upgrade to Meeke or Latvala at Toyota.



#487 BRG

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Posted 05 November 2019 - 19:05

Not sure if Evans would be an upgrade to Meeke or Latvala at Toyota.

I have rather given up with Meeke who is just a crash addict.  Whereas Latvala, a former crashaholic has now slowed down so much that he is almost invisible on rallies.  So maybe Evans would be an improvement.   



#488 messy

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Posted 05 November 2019 - 20:04

Beneath Ogier, Tanak and Neuville there is a massive void. That’s the problem. 



#489 masa90

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Posted 05 November 2019 - 20:10

I believe Evans is one of the next big things. His improvement has been slow but steady from year to year.



#490 messy

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Posted 05 November 2019 - 20:52

Evans did as well with the DMACK Fiesta as Tanak did the previous season - probably better - I just don’t think he’s kicked on from there. Tanak was promoted to Ogier’s full team-mate the following year and outpaced him, Evans was promoted to Ogier’s full team-mate the year after, and was blown away by him. I don’t think he’s recovered from that yet.



#491 ceesvdelst

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Posted 05 November 2019 - 21:31

Evans did well coz it was home and he had a tyre advantage, you still have to drive the thing, but I agree he shows promise, more than anyone like Mikkelsen, Suninen or Lappi anyway. 



#492 TF110

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Posted 05 November 2019 - 22:41

Toyota needs Ogier. Latvala aint gonna cut it, and neither is Meeke. I don't know if Evans will be much faster than either of them. Maybe the two left over will improve with a car that might focus more on them but I don't have high hopes and I think Toyota might be 3rd in the constructors next year.



#493 tormave

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 15:43

Evans has impressed me the past couple of years. I used to think he was in the Ford just for being from UK, but he’s won me over. I think he’s at least on par with Meeke pace-wise, but is less likely to thoroughly off the car. Seems to get faster every year, too. Neuville - Evans - Rovanperä at Toyota would definitely be interesting.



#494 TauriJ

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 22:27

Thank god that drivers title was already decided in Spain. Because we might not get Rally Australia.



#495 Myrvold

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 10:45

I think it is idiotic. The area is in a state of emergency now, its only gonna get worse the next 7 days and they are preparing for the worst week in Aussie history i regards to forest fires.

To then occupy safety workers, equipment etc. do to a rally is not something I like to see. Not to mention the possibility of a car catching fire and setting fire to yet another area.

Cancel the rally, and let everyone direct their efforts towards the locals!

#496 ArnageWRC

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 12:05

Be proactive and pull the event; it's not important in the grand scheme of things. The emergency services have their hands full fighting fires, etc  

 

Can you imagine a car going off and going up in flames - a PR nightmare for the event and sport........To run the event seems extremely selfish.

 

 

 

In other news, Chris Ingram & Ross Whittock have won the ERC after a dramatic final stage. Well done; a fabulous achievement after struggling to raise a budget to finish the championship. Rallying is a tough sell here in the UK - so to win the Title is majorly impressive.



#497 BRG

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 19:55

Agree about Australia, it would be monumentally irresponsible to run the event in these conditions.

 

On the ERC, kudos to Chris Ingram, but it wasn't a very impressive championship campaign.  He was never the best driver and basically inherited the win through others misfortune.  Although the finale, with a puncture ruining his slim championship lead, only for his remaining competitor to suffer a worse puncture.  Pure Hollywood!   Lukyanuk is far and away the better driver though.

 

The ERC really needs a boost.  IT seems to be the Outer Edges of Europe Rally Championship.  Where are the rounds in Finland, Belgium, Ireland, Germany and France?  You know, the countries with flourishing rally scenes?  All comes down the money, probably, and some FIA desire to develop the sport in these obscure locations.  Which is why the international championship contender entry is so poor.  Mind you, the ERC has traditionally been pretty naff, for those who remember the old days of coefficient 1, 2, e etc rallies which meant that two crews could contest the ERC without ever being on the same rally together.



#498 LiftAndCoast

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 00:33

Organisers have bowed to the inevitable and cancelled Rally Australia -

 

https://www.autospor...es-in-australia



#499 ARTGP

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 02:32

Hyundai has won the manufacturers championship....which is....amusing..... in light of everything.



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#500 Muppetmad

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 05:48

It's the correct decision - nobody ever wants to see a rally cancelled, but in light of the circumstances, there really is no alternative.