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2019 Rallying thread (WRC, ERC, other series)


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#101 Stephane

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 13:04

The Citroen is not that bad, apparently. We'll see on a more loose surface.



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#102 OvDrone

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 13:04

Gotta give it to Ogier, that was one of the best stages I've ever seen from him. Congratulations.

 

Hoping for more of this quality from all drivers the remaining year, and I know we'll get it.



#103 Muppetmad

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 13:51

It was a cracking showdown. As much as Ogier rubs me up the wrong way sometimes, I can't begrudge him this win: he delivered when it counted. I'm looking forward to seeing the Ogier/Neuville/Tanak battle develop in the coming rallies.



#104 Silberpfeil

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 14:16

I understood that. But Toyota, Citroën, M-Sport had all virtually the same tyre choice. As had Neuville on the first loop (SS3-5). Mikkelsen went with 3-3 when it comes to studded, non-studded, and Loeb with 2-4, studded, non-studded. All other cars had 4 studded and 2 non-studded.
The Mäkinen-Toyota blow-up yesterday were idiotic, as with two exceptions (which, in practice, was only one - Loeb), it was the same for every competitor in the whole rally.
So I don't understand what's a "shame" about Toyota and their tires.
[/quote]

They had enough trouble that they fell behind the leaders, even before they hit their other problems with the punctures. What I was referring to was that the rally was essentially reduced to a two-horse race at the very front and everyone else was left to squabble over the final podium spot. Still good entertainment, but not quite as nice as it arguably could have been, especially with the volatility of the Monte.

Hope that’s cleared up now.

Anyways, if I didn’t know any better, I’d say that Ogier was rather good at driving the Monte. He’s clearly very, very good at it. Good to see that Meeke got the power stage points, though. He showed some nice pace after his early misfortune.

Edited by Silberpfeil, 27 January 2019 - 14:16.


#105 Wingcommander

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 14:57

Doesn't matter what car he drives he still wins. 



#106 messy

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 15:16

Ogier is so tedious, his constant winning. Just at the moment where it looks like someone else is going to get a look in, Ogier steps back in and takes the glory. It drives me mad, I hate him. I'm sick of him. His tedious brilliance has been poisoning the WRC for years.

And of course that's all b*llocks. The guy is amazing. I mean, I'd certainly RATHER someone else took over after all this time, but they've thrown everything at Ogier - the starting order rule, for one, and he still does it. He's moved team twice, and won first time out in a brand new car twice. I dunno how much more any driver can do to prove categorically that they are one of the all-time greats. Ogier's CV has no holes anywhere, he's incredible.

God. I was almost cheering him on this weekend. What's wrong with me?

#107 Chmielinski

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 15:31

Ogier is so tedious, his constant winning. Just at the moment where it looks like someone else is going to get a look in, Ogier steps back in and takes the glory. It drives me mad, I hate him. I'm sick of him. His tedious brilliance has been poisoning the WRC for years.

And of course that's all b*llocks. The guy is amazing. I mean, I'd certainly RATHER someone else took over after all this time, but they've thrown everything at Ogier - the starting order rule, for one, and he still does it. He's moved team twice, and won first time out in a brand new car twice. I dunno how much more any driver can do to prove categorically that they are one of the all-time greats. Ogier's CV has no holes anywhere, he's incredible.

God. I was almost cheering him on this weekend. What's wrong with me?

 

The past 2 years have been the best since before the Loeb era. From the outside it might look boring, because the same guy keeps winning, but I see more and more people getting into rally. Maybe  it's partially to do with great quality rally videogames, which have been pretty much absent in the Loeb and early Ogier eras, maybe it's the amazing new cars. Either way, the WRC is in a good place right now.



#108 messy

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 15:56

I think it's been probably the best WRC since the McRae/Burns/Sainz era myself. Too much of the Loeb era was marked by like two manufacturers and a bunch of privateers. Since 2017 it's been superb.

And none of the 'pretenders' have any divine right to beat Ogier after all. If he's still the best, he's still the best.

#109 Danyy

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 16:09

Ogier is so tedious, his constant winning. Just at the moment where it looks like someone else is going to get a look in, Ogier steps back in and takes the glory. It drives me mad, I hate him. I'm sick of him. His tedious brilliance has been poisoning the WRC for years.
And of course that's all b*llocks. The guy is amazing. I mean, I'd certainly RATHER someone else took over after all this time, but they've thrown everything at Ogier - the starting order rule, for one, and he still does it. He's moved team twice, and won first time out in a brand new car twice. I dunno how much more any driver can do to prove categorically that they are one of the all-time greats. Ogier's CV has no holes anywhere, he's incredible.
God. I was almost cheering him on this weekend. What's wrong with me?

You recognise greatness, ain’t nothing wrong with that ;)

Edited by Danyy, 27 January 2019 - 16:13.


#110 tormave

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 16:58

Fantastic finish to the rally, shame about all the crews who hit issues. Looks like it’ll be a tough year for M-Sport, but the other three teams are fully on it from the start. Can’t wait for Sweden! I don’t mind Ogier winning - he was pushed all the way, and didn’t complain about the start order once... Tanäk looks like a beast, hope he doesn’t need to overtake someone again in Sweden!

#111 messy

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 17:40

Sorry to say it, but M-Sport need better than Elfyn to lead the team. He was nowhere near Ogier last year, so it wasn't going to happen that he was suddenly a key protagonist in 2018. He's the Bradley Smith of the WRC.

They've obviously still got a car more or less on a par with the others, but all the driving talent is elsewhere.

Maybe Suninen can spring a surprise.

#112 Amz964

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 17:53

Great rally and man that was a great battle with ogier and Neuville. I am really starting to love WRC again during 2017 and it's getting better and better and after years of not being to bothered by it I am getting hooked like I did back in 2003 when I first watched it. Can see Tanak and Toyota being the team to be beat however.

#113 Myrvold

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 19:09

The Citroen is not that bad, apparently. We'll see on a more loose surface.

 
It's never been bad on not too bumpy tarmac, even back in 2017 Mikkelsen got 2nd in Germany with the car.
 

They had enough trouble that they fell behind the leaders, even before they hit their other problems with the punctures. What I was referring to was that the rally was essentially reduced to a two-horse race at the very front and everyone else was left to squabble over the final podium spot. Still good entertainment, but not quite as nice as it arguably could have been, especially with the volatility of the Monte.

Hope that’s cleared up now.

 
Ye, but - they fell back a bit due to a general lack of pace, and then punctures, most likely down to excessively cutting corners. It's all their own fault. It's got extremely little to do with SS3 as both Citroëns and all M-Sports were in the same situation. As was Neuville.
 

Sorry to say it, but M-Sport need better than Elfyn to lead the team. He was nowhere near Ogier last year, so it wasn't going to happen that he was suddenly a key protagonist in 2018. He's the Bradley Smith of the WRC.

They've obviously still got a car more or less on a par with the others, but all the driving talent is elsewhere.

Maybe Suninen can spring a surprise.


M-Sport 2019 is a rebuilding-financing year, which is why they only have 2 cars unless someone forks out money enough to finance the third one (just like Citroën). At the moment M-Sport have 3 cars in 3 rallies, with a possible addition of 1-2 rallies. Evans and Suninen does both bring in money afaik.
 

Ogier is so tedious, his constant winning. Just at the moment where it looks like someone else is going to get a look in, Ogier steps back in and takes the glory. It drives me mad, I hate him. I'm sick of him. His tedious brilliance has been poisoning the WRC for years.

And of course that's all b*llocks. The guy is amazing. I mean, I'd certainly RATHER someone else took over after all this time, but they've thrown everything at Ogier - the starting order rule, for one, and he still does it. He's moved team twice, and won first time out in a brand new car twice. I dunno how much more any driver can do to prove categorically that they are one of the all-time greats. Ogier's CV has no holes anywhere, he's incredible.

God. I was almost cheering him on this weekend. What's wrong with me?


Haha! I feel you!
I think a bit of the reason is that he shows that he is a pretty damn good driver, and not just a product of VW dominance.

And I am sure it helps that Neuville comes across as miserable at times. I personally want Latvala back to his old speed, and getting Østberg in a full-time seat again as well. As they bring some good answers, honesty and life in to interviews!



#114 messy

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 21:00

I find it amazing to think that Østberg is only the same age as Neuville and Tanak. It feels like he's the perennial nearly man, yesterday's nearly man. But then he went out and took that C3 to second place in Finland last year and you remember what he's capable of.

His rep was hurt big time by his two seasons in 2013 and 2016 as M-Sport 'team leader' I think. Both seasons he was anonymous. But the first of them if I remember right he was struggling with his eyesight all year and ended up needing surgery after the year, the second was a transitional 'holding year' for M-Sport with a hopelessly outdated Fiesta and a rookie team-mate.

I'd be interested to see what Novikov is up to. He was crazy fast, but just disappeared completely.

Would love to see Latvala at his best and competing for the title too.

#115 noikeee

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 23:46

Eh, I don't quite think Ostberg's in the same class as Neuville and Tanak. Good on his day, sure. A safe pair of hands, yeah that too. But is he on the front row of the drivers that could challenge Ogier? Don't really think so.

 

---

 

On Neuville, he's having a career path that is most unusual, he's finished 2nd in the championship 4 times (!) and seems to have the speed and consistencyof a top driver no question, having asserted himself over a series of renowned Hyundai team-mates, but always seems to buckle under the pressure against the ultimately better driver (Ogier)?

 

I'm struggling to think of many other drivers in motorsport with a similar fate to this. Hirvonen seems the closest thing with a similar record of coming 2nd 4 times to a Sebastian, but Gronholm was quicker than him - don't think I've seen Neuville be slower than a team-mate. It also reminds me a bit of some Valentino Rossi challengers in MotoGP: Max Biaggi and Sete Gibernau. On F1 I can't think of a fitting parallel though. Maybe Carlos Reutemann? Only came 2nd once though.

 

Of course, Neuville still has lots of years ahead of him and can still break this fate...



#116 noikeee

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Posted 27 January 2019 - 23:52

On the Monte, that was ace! Always one of the highlights of the season, it's so thrilling and fun to follow it almost feels like the season goes downhill from here onwards tbh! (well that and the sheer amount of other things that then come up throughout the season like F1 etc). And this year with the crazy close finish it was even better.



#117 Myrvold

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 03:44

On the Monte, that was ace! Always one of the highlights of the season, it's so thrilling and fun to follow it almost feels like the season goes downhill from here onwards tbh! (well that and the sheer amount of other things that then come up throughout the season like F1 etc). And this year with the crazy close finish it was even better.

One thing I like about Monte is that it is a perfect build-up for Sweden, where I'll be going yet again! After Sweden though, I wish we still had Safari to make things spicy before going to more "normal" rallies. I kinda feel WRC need one more "outlier" at the start of the year before getting to the rallies that really shows what cars and drivers will be dominant.



#118 messy

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 08:04

Got no doubt that Neuville is as fast as Ogier on his day, but it's the pressure - he has absolutely crumbled two years in a row, or at least that's what it looks like. 

 

Sure, there are some question marks - in 2017 he was poised to take a clear championship lead but that chance happened to present itself in Finland, where Hyundai (and not just Neuvile) are invariably useless, and last year he retired from the lead in Turkey which seemed to knock the stuffing out of him. But really, I think he should have won the title both years. I struggle with him a bit - but he's really fast

 

Don't think anyone's saying Ostberg is in the same bracket either, but he's a good solid driver and the field still needs a bit more strength in depth so it would be nice to see him getting a regular drive. Ditto for Craig Breen and Hayden Paddon. World beaters? Nah, but worthy of a drive.



#119 Peat

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 08:23

Right, highlights. 

I want a half-hour roundup of the whole event. Does such a thing exist?

I got fed up of the bitty WRC youtube clips or the bloated Red Bull coverage last year and just drifted away. 



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#120 Lennat

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 09:23

Is the official WRC coverage worth the 100 euros or whatever it costs?



#121 Stephane

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 09:34

If you can spend your week-end in front of your computer to follow everything, i think it can be worth it.



#122 Lennat

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 10:27

Realistically I will probably have the time to watch something like a daily summary (is there one included?) and the power stage for most rallies, and nerd out completely only on occasion.



#123 TheGoldenStoffel

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 10:38

Is the official WRC coverage worth the 100 euros or whatever it costs?

 

If it works, yes.



#124 tormave

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 15:49

Is the official WRC coverage worth the 100 euros or whatever it costs?

 

Yes, it is. No question. There's no need for the formulaic highlight shows, when you can watch every stage either live, or pre-recorded. I do mostly the latter as morning stages are middle of the night in my timezone. Alternatively, go read results first e.g. on Twitter, and watch the special stages where something pivotal happened.

 

The only complaint I have so far, is that the in-car camera which shows the crew from the back is a bit too high on some cars, so there's too little road ahead visible. Otherwise it's bang on perfect.



#125 tormave

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 15:52

If you can spend your week-end in front of your computer to follow everything, i think it can be worth it.

 

Even through it's live, you don't need to watch all of it live. You can watch e.g. the morning loop of stages in one go, and skip through the early runners, who are already out of it. Then repeat later for the afternoon loop.



#126 Stephane

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 16:33

I never really enjoy seeing sport events tape-delayed, but that's me. 



#127 BRG

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 16:43

Right, highlights. 

I want a half-hour roundup of the whole event. Does such a thing exist?

I got fed up of the bitty WRC youtube clips or the bloated Red Bull coverage last year and just drifted away. 

We have nothing in the UK.  No Eurosport evening reports. no highlights show on CH4 or 5, zilch.  Own goal by WRC, ball in the back of the net!  Hide that sport behind a paywall where nobody except the real enthusiasts will see it and just watch thise sponsors and teams melt away.

 

Do these people have even half a brain between them?? :rolleyes:



#128 Stephane

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 16:44

The redbull.tv thing is free

 

You might notlike it but this is available to everyone.



#129 BRG

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 17:21

The redbull.tv thing is free

 

You might notlike it but this is available to everyone.

That is provided by one of the sponsors, not by WRC and its products are pretty dire.  It isn't regular TV either, it is tucked away on-line where only the real enthusiasts know it even exists.  How will that attract more fans to WRC? 



#130 Stephane

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 19:08

Isn't Red-Bull the rights holder now ?

 

Anyway, you are absolutely right, it won't attract a lot of people. Maybe those following something else there. 



#131 Myrvold

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 20:24

Red Bull is the promoter I think? I seem to remember that's why they started with the free coverage.



#132 ArnageWRC

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 21:31

https://f1broadcasti...el-5-deal-ends/

 

As ever, it seems the viewing figures weren't great - and even dropped the last two years, when the WRC had seemingly turned a corner with the new cars. I'm not sure what the answer is.

If you take this forum as guide (even if it's a small sample size); both Daytona 24 & Formula E had far more comments than the Monte did, which is a shame as it's the Flagship event for the WRC. There's no doubt, that over the last 5-10-15 years in the UK, the popularity of the sport has taken a hit - which is probably why the highlights keep getting moved from station to station. BBC, Ch4, ITV, ITV4, Dave, ITV4, Ch5....



#133 tormave

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Posted 28 January 2019 - 21:41

The redbull.tv thing is free

 

You might notlike it but this is available to everyone.

 

Many modern TV sets can also run the WRC+ app, which has highlights without the WRC+ subscription: https://www.wrc.com/...3382-4174-.html

 

I just wish they would port that to the AppleTV.



#134 Yamamoto

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Posted 29 January 2019 - 17:36

Got no doubt that Neuville is as fast as Ogier on his day, but it's the pressure - he has absolutely crumbled two years in a row, or at least that's what it looks like. 

 

Sure, there are some question marks - in 2017 he was poised to take a clear championship lead but that chance happened to present itself in Finland, where Hyundai (and not just Neuvile) are invariably useless, and last year he retired from the lead in Turkey which seemed to knock the stuffing out of him. But really, I think he should have won the title both years. I struggle with him a bit - but he's really fast

 

Don't think anyone's saying Ostberg is in the same bracket either, but he's a good solid driver and the field still needs a bit more strength in depth so it would be nice to see him getting a regular drive. Ditto for Craig Breen and Hayden Paddon. World beaters? Nah, but worthy of a drive.

 

I don't think 2017 was too bad. It represented a significant step forward for him as a driver, and I think he was a little unlucky with some of his retirements that season. Last year was disappointing though. Being serious for a moment, he is one of the three we can expect to battle for the title. He is the only one of the three I would probably be a little surprised if you told me he was actually going to win it. More than the other two, I think he needs to take a couple of good early wins this year to cement his status as a contender.



#135 GenJackRipper

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Posted 30 January 2019 - 17:04

Why wasn't there any start in Monte Carlo? Seems odd to have everything based in Gap.

Also, why Gap? There are some tremendous mountain roads above Monaco; around Sospeil, up to the winter resorts of Auron & Isola, the corniches along the coast. etc.
Seems odd to have it on much more flat roads so far from Monaco.

Looks like I'm not alone in my criticism. :)

https://www.autospor...eturn-to-monaco



#136 paulstevens56

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Posted 31 January 2019 - 00:48

As a Belgian it gives me great joy to see Neuville doing what Loix and a few otehrs did not manage back in the day in a top car.

 

Ogier really is top drawer, although I reserve judgement a bit until he has shown us what he can do with the car on gravel, as that was it's bugbear before compared to the hard stuff.

 

Ford, what can you say, hero to zero.



#137 Myrvold

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Posted 31 January 2019 - 16:09

Because I see no reason to make a stand-alone RX thread for the different RX championships.

Hayden Paddon will do GRC Europe in 2019
50905741_2008230105879435_57723028932478



#138 Ben1445

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Posted 07 February 2019 - 21:46

FIA plans electric or hybrid WRC rules for 2022

https://www.motorspo...2-todt/4332167/

 

Todt: “But now, finally the manufacturers say we need some hybridisation. The technical people at the FIA, with the input of the manufacturers, [are] working to implement it in 2022. The reason this didn’t happen earlier is because they did not want it.”


Edited by Ben1445, 07 February 2019 - 21:46.


#139 messy

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Posted 07 February 2019 - 22:48

As a Belgian it gives me great joy to see Neuville doing what Loix and a few otehrs did not manage back in the day in a top car.
 
Ogier really is top drawer, although I reserve judgement a bit until he has shown us what he can do with the car on gravel, as that was it's bugbear before compared to the hard stuff.
 
Ford, what can you say, hero to zero.


I always thought Freddy Loix was far, FAR better a driver than he was ever able to show when he got his 'big chance' with Mitsubishi.

Wasn't all it seemed, that.

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#140 paulstevens56

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Posted 08 February 2019 - 00:12

Loix was a little unlucky in my eyes.  Took a drive with Mitsubishi when he as superb in the Corolla in 98. The lancer was heavily biased to Tommi's style and while Burns could adapt, Freddy found it tough, but by the time his time was done, so were the Marlboro millions that got him there and he didn't do a lot else.

 

Won Lord knows how many Belgian rallies and titles though and drive in France quickly too.

 

Always amazed me how many quality drivers our little country produces, Thiry, Neuville, Loix, Snijers, de Mevius and my fave Marc Duez.



#141 Henri Greuter

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Posted 08 February 2019 - 10:10

We have nothing in the UK.  No Eurosport evening reports. no highlights show on CH4 or 5, zilch.  Own goal by WRC, ball in the back of the net!  Hide that sport behind a paywall where nobody except the real enthusiasts will see it and just watch thise sponsors and teams melt away.
 
Do these people have even half a brain between them?? :rolleyes:




Oh, the days of Sky Channel's International Motor Sports, even it was only once a week .....

(And how popular that program made Gp B Rallying and Gp C endurance racing.....)

#142 BRG

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Posted 08 February 2019 - 18:20

Always amazed me how many quality drivers our little country produces, Thiry, Neuville, Loix, Snijers, de Mevius and my fave Marc Duez.

Of course it helps when every second person in the country seems to be a rally competitor!  Belgium seems to have more rallies and more competitors per head of population than almost anywhere except maybe Finland.  Why it doesn't ever have a WRC round is a ongoing scandal. 

 

Nice to see a mentionof Marc Duez.  I met him when he was just racing in F. Ford and came over to watch the RAC Rally with his mentor (whose name I forget).  We met them in a pub in Wales and took them deep into Dyfi forest.  They then tagged on to our group the next day and we were able to show them some great spectating places that they wouldn't have found otherwise.  After that, Marc started rallying seriously and I have always followed his career wth interest.  One of the great all-rounders of the sport, as much at home on tarmac or gravel stages or at Le Mans. 



#143 Stephane

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Posted 08 February 2019 - 18:42

We met them in a pub. 

 

Does not surprise me.  :stoned:



#144 paulstevens56

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Posted 08 February 2019 - 23:05

The thing with Duez is the car control, one of those men who just had an innate feel for throttle steering and how to do things better, maybe not always the fastest, but certainly a fans fave.

 

The thing that amazes me about Neuville is his gravel speed, considering most events in Belgium are on roads, and some sand.  Loix was not that great on dirt and neither was Thiry, though on his day Snijers was OK



#145 ArnageWRC

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Posted 14 February 2019 - 19:06

https://cambrianrall...age-information

 

https://cambrianrall...Information.pdf

 

https://www.britishr...pionship.co.uk/

 

First round of the 2019 MSA BRC.

 

Info for anybody who is planning to attend the event. Should be good, looks a pretty decent entry. Probably off to Alwen for both runs, and then possibly the 2nd run of Gwydyr in the evening.



#146 Myrvold

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Posted 14 February 2019 - 21:26

Ready for Sweden. Mild weather but still nice roads here!
Hg4asek.jpg

#147 OSX

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Posted 15 February 2019 - 07:21

Swedish DIY catering...

 

tSfz5Mq.jpg



#148 OSX

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Posted 15 February 2019 - 08:03

Rally Sweden WRC: Neuville Heads Ogier On First Stage
14 February 2019

XeEJX57.jpg

 

Hyundai's Thierry Neuville posted the fastest time on Rally Sweden's opening superspecial, edging out World Rally Championship rival Sebastien Ogier by 0.8 seconds. Andreas Mikkelsen holds the final podium place after the short opening test, 1.1s off team-mate Neuville's pace and 0.8s up on Ott Tanak. Jari-Matti Latvala confirmed his status as the most experienced WRC driver of all time by starting his 197th rally, and was fifth on the superspecial - only 0.1s off Toyota team-mate Tanak.

 

Marcus Gronholm, making a WRC return nine years after his last start on Rally Sweden, was eighth fastest, beating long-time rival Sebastien Loeb in a head-to-head contest.
 

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#149 Myrvold

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Posted 15 February 2019 - 12:36

Rovanperä corner(and 3 other cars).
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Road is holding up quite good here. Looks good for loop 2 :-)

Edited by Myrvold, 15 February 2019 - 12:37.


#150 OSX

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Posted 15 February 2019 - 13:01

For those not in the know or too drunk already you can listen to the Rally Sweden live on the Official WRC Live Radio channel. :wave:

 

WRC Live Radio