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Mercedes-AMG Technical Thread (W10 EQ Power+)


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#3701 OO7

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 19:24

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#3702 jesee

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 19:42

I think tomorrow will be about tire management and it seeems to me Mercedes are in a better position. They were still able to keep tires in the window in the final sector better than Ferrari. However tomorrow is gonna be cooler so who knows.

#3703 beachdrifter

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 20:27

However tomorrow is gonna be cooler so who knows.


Nobody knows! And I love it! It's the way it's supposed to be!

#3704 beachdrifter

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 23:07

Bottas: 

 

"We did have some improvements this weekend and they have definitely been working."

 

 

:up:



#3705 beachdrifter

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 00:06

So for a guess these cooling issues are also limiting them from running the high performance mode in certain periods of the race?

 

Found some more here (in German): 

 

https://www.motorspo...uper-partymode/

 

The suggestion is that Ferrari's advantage on the straights could grow again in the race. Will be interesting to watch! 



#3706 OO7

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 01:26

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#3707 rodlamas

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 03:38

That's what I'm wondering. They can only use max power for 2 laps per weekend, and they do that in Q3. That in a sense is not unusual. Nobody uses the party mode in the race (there are higher power modes they can use for a few laps, but they are not quite the same mode used in quali).

We haven't really heard that they are limited on the engine side during the race in any way. Bottas was allowed to go for the fastest lap using strat mode 10 (?), and nobody kept him from pushing despite being miles ahead.

So we are seeing the full potential of the engine in Q, higher power modes are available in the race if needed... hard to tell if we're missing out on anything significant because of this. Maybe it only affects the quali simulations during free practice.


Bottas used Strat 3 (2nd highest mode) for Q1, Strat 2 (party mode) for Q2 and Q3. So it is not just 2 laps.

Just listen to his full radio on youtube.

#3708 Paco

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 06:35

Well.. Lewis starts on the dirty line haven't done him any favours so perhaps p2 here on the clean side will give him the traction he didn't have the last couple of starts :-)  We'll see if Bottas gets some wheel spin and Lewis not.  I'm more concerned about Max and Vettel to be frank of jumping them and their being a wheel touch between 2 of the top 5..

 

Yup :-)



#3709 Jordan44

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 07:22

Found some more here (in German):

https://www.motorspo...uper-partymode/

The suggestion is that Ferrari's advantage on the straights could grow again in the race. Will be interesting to watch!


Suggestion seemingly debunked.

#3710 sabjit

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 07:52

I think its time we all stopped the doomsaying. This car is a rocket ship. 



#3711 rog

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 07:55

What a wonderful start into the new season for Mercedes, almost perfect.



#3712 AmonGods

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:00

Well.. this was easy. Didnt see it coming like this, but the season is long and I wouldn't say for sure that Merc is gonna win in Baku. Anyway, well done to the guys.. they're running like a swiss watch  :p



#3713 Marklar

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:02

And this, kids, is why 10.000 kilometres of testing and corresponding analysis is a lot more meaningful than a one-off weekend at an unrepresentative circuit, as I kept pointing out.

 

The single lap pace gap here is exactly what Merc engineers thought it was on the last day of testing - shared by amus:

This aged well  :drunk:



#3714 Synkro89

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:05

Pretty much. This car is delivering atm and doesn't really have any weaknesses. The team are so clinical in there performance wether its pitwall or back at the factory. They won't be beaten this year. They will still develop this car to its full potential. Ferrari will have there days but overall this team is operating on a level that i haven't seen in Motorsport. Well deserved 1-2. All the bullshit about Ferrari having the quickest car has to stop now because its getting silly. Lewis,Toto, Horner and these apparent pundits are part of the narrative . I don't want to here that bullshit again until Ferrari display dominant pace with a series of 1-2 .



#3715 w1Y

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:05

Toto "we have some good stuff coming to the car"

#3716 NateF

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:05

Will this stop the “amus said this and said that” or will it continue at the next race when track specific characteristics allow Ferrari to be in front?

#3717 MortenF1

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:05

Sweet pace today, and better than I atleast expected. I didn’t think they’d have the same three tenths they had in Q3, in the race but they did.
When they tried for fastest lap on mediums, Vettel was faster though.
Three 1-2’s from three races. 👍

#3718 rodlamas

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:06

Mercedes owned S3 today. Both on the big corner (where Ferrari suffered the most) and on the big straight.

As I have been saying for more than year. Ferrari has a better qualifying PU. The Mercedes is still the best racing PU.

Edited by rodlamas, 14 April 2019 - 08:07.


#3719 CountDooku

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:12

Will this stop the “amus said this and said that” or will it continue at the next race when track specific characteristics allow Ferrari to be in front?


For that to sop we would need to see some self awareness. Good luck with that!

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#3720 rog

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:12

Sweet pace today, and better than I atleast expected. I didn’t think they’d have the same three tenths they had in Q3, in the race but they did.
When they tried for fastest lap on mediums, Vettel was faster though.
Three 1-2’s from three races. 👍

 

Hamilton was on used mediums and Bottas was stuck behind Leclerc on new mediums the first 2-3 laps.
 



#3721 Unicast

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:20

Pretty much. This car is delivering atm and doesn't really have any weaknesses. The team are so clinical in there performance wether its pitwall or back at the factory. They won't be beaten this year. They will still develop this car to its full potential. Ferrari will have there days but overall this team is operating on a level that i haven't seen in Motorsport. Well deserved 1-2. All the bullshit about Ferrari having the quickest car has to stop now because its getting silly. Lewis,Toto, Horner and these apparent pundits are part of the narrative . I don't want to here that bullshit again until Ferrari display dominant pace with a series of 1-2 .

 

Thanks, I hope they'll listen  :rotfl:

This is becoming a much more dominant display than 2017/2018 ever was, so I have a hard time thinking anyone will dare to claim Ferrari being faster and not risk being instantly embarrassed.

It's obvious that Merc is the benchmark at the moment.



#3722 NateF

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:21

For that to sop we would need to see some self awareness. Good luck with that!


The car thread used to be interesting but the endless doom and gloom and infrequent comments from insightful forumers makes it a dreary read.

#3723 GrumpyYoungMan

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:22

Bottas used Strat 3 (2nd highest mode) for Q1, Strat 2 (party mode) for Q2 and Q3. So it is not just 2 laps.

Just listen to his full radio on youtube.

Over 2 consecutive laps maybe?

#3724 w1Y

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:23

Thanks, I hope they'll listen :rotfl:
This is becoming a much more dominant display than 2017/2018 ever was, so I have a hard time thinking anyone will dare to claim Ferrari being faster and not risk being instantly embarrassed.
It's obvious that Merc is the benchmark at the moment.


You guys just ignore Bahrain then and look through to results only?

#3725 P123

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:24

Great job by Merc. A bit of fortune in Bahrain, but they really are just too good for the Reds so far.

#3726 RedBaron966

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:24

Dieter Zetsche should attend all the races if he wants his team to win all the remaining races. Every race he attends Merc wins.



#3727 P123

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:25

You guys just ignore Bahrain then and look through to results only?


Ferrari reliability is suspect. Regardless, Merc have a bit of a cushion already.

#3728 AmonGods

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:26

Thanks, I hope they'll listen  :rotfl:

This is becoming a much more dominant display than 2017/2018 ever was, so I have a hard time thinking anyone will dare to claim Ferrari being faster and not risk being instantly embarrassed.

It's obvious that Merc is the benchmark at the moment.

 

Would you say this same thing if Ferrari would've finished 1-2 2 weeks ago, or at least if Charles won? Truth is, it's kind of early to call a Merc domination when Ferrari was clearly faster in Bahrain and could very well win in Baku.



#3729 GoldenColt

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:30

This aged well  :drunk:

But... mechanic's faces... red car looks planted.... Gary Anderson.... happy faces at Ferrari....



#3730 Synkro89

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:32

Speaking of which wheres kernel anyway, hes been quiet all weekend .



#3731 rodlamas

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:33

Over 2 consecutive laps maybe?

I have seen them racing om Strat 3 over and over the years. It's the 3 o'clock position on the yellow rotary on Lewis steering wheel. Since mid-2018 they changed the shape of the rotary so that one cannot easily see it.

So on Strat 3 they can keep on using, over and over, so they do not fully deploy the battery. On Strat 2 is full beans and they drain the battery so you simply cannot run on it continuously as you will run out of electrical power.

But there is one curious thing: they have been racing lower strat modes since Australia (when we get the team radios on YouTube later today we will be able to draw a clearer picture). They simply haven't run Strat 3 at all on races this year just like they did from 2014 until 2018.

So I guess when they solve whatever calibration, cooling, mapping problems they have (or hardware - that would have to wait until Canada), I think the supposed PU advantage Ferrari has will suddenly disappear.

Edited by rodlamas, 14 April 2019 - 08:34.


#3732 Unicast

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:33

Would you say this same thing if Ferrari would've finished 1-2 2 weeks ago, or at least if Charles won? Truth is, it's kind of early to call a Merc domination when Ferrari was clearly faster in Bahrain and could very well win in Baku.

 

Could doesn't equate did, Ferrari in fact finished 3/5 in Bahrain while Merc comfortably sits on 3 1-2's.

What will happen in Baku? We'll see but even if Ferrari mange to win there (which is not at all a given) they will still struggle massively once you hit tracks where downforce is required.

You can't win championships only by having the best engine, you need good chassis & good aero as well and Ferrari is obviously lacking on both departments.



#3733 ArrowsLivery

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:35

I think most of the corners in Baku are of the type where Ferrari seems to suck at and Merc gains time, so it should be a close race even if the straights are a lost cause.

#3734 Blackoutjulian

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:36

Speaking of which wheres kernel anyway, hes been quiet all weekend .

He has been snaped by Thanos

#3735 popolonx

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:39

I think most of the corners in Baku are of the type where Ferrari seems to suck at and Merc gains time, so it should be a close race even if the straights are a lost cause.

In what universe is ferrari going win 2s on straights?



#3736 kernel

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:39

He has been snaped by Thanos


Try... hiking in the Grand Canyon, which made today’s race very difficult to even try to watch.

Delighted at the win. How was tyre wear and straight line speed vs Ferrari?

#3737 CountDooku

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:41

Dieter Zetsche should attend all the races if he wants his team to win all the remaining races. Every race he attends Merc wins.


Meanwhile Ferrari imploded in Bahrain when their CEO came...

#3738 MaxisOne

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:43

I'm sorry but for the past three years it seems like there's some pissing contest between Merc and Ferrari fans about who has the fastest car. Like there are EXTRA POINTS being given for someone dragging a crapbox over the line first. I don't care who started it but can we just focus on our own teams cars? I get that comparisons are inevitable but some people are taking this overboard. 

F1 doesn't give pity points. If the car is slow over 1 race or 1 season or a damn rocketship if the team isn't converting it into points on a Sunday evening its not worth a damn.



#3739 CountDooku

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:43

I have seen them racing om Strat 3 over and over the years. It's the 3 o'clock position on the yellow rotary on Lewis steering wheel. Since mid-2018 they changed the shape of the rotary so that one cannot easily see it.

So on Strat 3 they can keep on using, over and over, so they do not fully deploy the battery. On Strat 2 is full beans and they drain the battery so you simply cannot run on it continuously as you will run out of electrical power.

But there is one curious thing: they have been racing lower strat modes since Australia (when we get the team radios on YouTube later today we will be able to draw a clearer picture). They simply haven't run Strat 3 at all on races this year just like they did from 2014 until 2018.

So I guess when they solve whatever calibration, cooling, mapping problems they have (or hardware - that would have to wait until Canada), I think the supposed PU advantage Ferrari has will suddenly disappear.


Interesting. There were rumours that Merc had cooling issues no? Perhaps in their chase for aero efficiency they are really pushing the engine side.

Is there a strat 1???

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#3740 CountDooku

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:45

Try... hiking in the Grand Canyon, which made today’s race very difficult to even try to watch.

Delighted at the win. How was tyre wear and straight line speed vs Ferrari?


Jealous. Enjoy the hike!
Tyre wear was excellent, especially on Lewis. Both on mediums and yards.
Wasn’t paying much attention on speeds but Merc were dominant in s3.

#3741 AmonGods

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:46

Could doesn't equate did, Ferrari in fact finished 3/5 in Bahrain while Merc comfortably sits on 3 1-2's.

What will happen in Baku? We'll see but even if Ferrari mange to win there (which is not at all a given) they will still struggle massively once you hit tracks where downforce is required.

You can't win championships only by having the best engine, you need good chassis & good aero as well and Ferrari is obviously lacking on both departments.

 

For a casual fan who's watching just a few races per season and looks only at the results yeah Merc won 3 1-2's, but in reality Ferrari was faster in Bahrain and you can't deny that. You're right that we dont know what will happen in Baku but there have been some swings till now so I'll not be surprised if Ferrari is again faster there. And if they can translate that into a win is another discusion.



#3742 rodlamas

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:46

Interesting. There were rumours that Merc had cooling issues no? Perhaps in their chase for aero efficiency they are really pushing the engine side.

Is there a strat 1???


Strat 1 is SC/in-lap mode.

#3743 NateF

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:47

I'm sorry but for the past three years it seems like there's some pissing contest between Merc and Ferrari fans about who has the fastest car. Like there are EXTRA POINTS being given for someone dragging a crapbox over the line first. I don't care who started it but can we just focus on our own teams cars? I get that comparisons are inevitable but some people are taking this overboard.
F1 doesn't give pity points. If the car is slow over 1 race or 1 season or a damn rocketship if the team isn't converting it into points on a Sunday evening its not worth a damn.


“Your fast” “nope your fast” “noooo your the fastest” “you are delirious your fastestest ever ever” ad nauseam

#3744 Timstr11

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:48

Safe to say now that the low-outboard-load wing is not the game changer people feared it to be.

Quite the contrary. The more conventional profile Mercedes went for is starting to look like the right direction.


Edited by Timstr11, 14 April 2019 - 08:48.


#3745 CountDooku

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:48

Strat 1 is SC/in-lap mode.


Like peak power and energy use? Why wouldn’t they use that for qualifying?

#3746 SonGoku

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 08:50

Great start, but the Bahrain result makes it look a bit better than it should be, that should have been a Ferrari 1-2 and then the world looks a little bit different after 3 races. Still, you have to finish to win.



#3747 TheGoldenStoffel

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 09:01

Interesting. There were rumours that Merc had cooling issues no? Perhaps in their chase for aero efficiency they are really pushing the engine side.

Is there a strat 1???

 

Was watching Lewis' onboard during the race. Even tough he wasn't in any traffic he was told a few times to lift and coast to get the temps down.



#3748 rodlamas

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 09:02

Like peak power and energy use? Why wouldn’t they use that for qualifying?


They use. Check the link for the picture.

http://collectorstud...steering-wheel/

Strat 1 -> Save everything mode. Used on SCs and in-laps.

Strat 2 -> Peak PU mode. Normally used for Q2 and Q3. Maximum ICE performance and maximum ERS performance. Drains all the batter, so continuous us is not possible.

Strat 3 -> Maximum racing mode. The battery doesn't drain as much as on Strat 2 so the mode can be used countinously. High ICE performance though I don't know if it's the same ICE performance as on Start 2. From 2014 til 2018 it was heavily used. On 2019 it hasn't been. It is also used on Q1.

In addition to all this there is the HPP cyan rotary on the steering wheel. This controls a bunch of stuff on the PU and each of the positions has 14 modes. So it is like 200 settings solely on this rotary. On full team radios you normally hear the engineers: "HPP 3 position 3. HPP 7 position 10." On this one maximum mode is HPP 1 position 1, I guess.

#3749 Jordan44

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 09:21

Safe to say now that the low-outboard-load wing is not the game changer people feared it to be.

Quite the contrary. The more conventional profile Mercedes went for is starting to look like the right direction.

 

Both Red Bull & Mercedes tried the Ferrari wing and said no. To me that was already enough proof it was not the silver bullet and probably even a step in the wrong direction. The media love grasping at straws to push an agenda though.



#3750 beachdrifter

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 11:30

Suggestion seemingly debunked.

 

Yep!