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Ferrari Technical Thread (SF90)


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#6051 geralt

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Posted 04 December 2019 - 18:09

Goodbye SF 90. No one will remember you piece of trash.

Tell that to all the tifosi who saw Charles winning in Monza. That was probably the best Ferrari moment in almost a decade!



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#6052 Unicast

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Posted 07 December 2019 - 08:38

Tell that to all the tifosi who saw Charles winning in Monza. That was probably the best Ferrari moment in almost a decade!

Monza victory was sweet but ultimately irelevant. Irelevant because it's clear that Ferrari's most ardous desire is winning the titles. Monza was a nice consolation prize but I would swap the Monza win for an overall more competitive car capable of fighting for the title and so would Ferrari.

The win in Monza was more of a consequence of the overall car concept, which was bound to do well on a low DF track.

But wait! Even in Monza we were not the quickest. Without Leclerc's tenacious and on the limit defense, Merc would have won and they had the best car even in those circumstances... Quite scary when you think on it.

Overall the SF90H was born bad and ended up being a failure, it was less competitive than the car of the previous year and it represented a step back when we needed a big step forward.

Let's hope 2020 will be the year when we start making that big step forward.

Edited by Unicast, 07 December 2019 - 08:39.


#6053 ferrarista

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Posted 09 December 2019 - 20:18

https://translate.go...WsSshSumjrK52Ig
massively proud of the achievement on the engine, I still remember Bahrain 2014 as it was yesterday

Edited by ferrarista, 09 December 2019 - 20:26.


#6054 FortiFord

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Posted 11 December 2019 - 13:51

Binotto says that the championship was lost once the car was designed.  (https://www.formula1...2dpODZd05W.html). 

 

To me the great mystery is what happened in pre-season testing; were Ferrari running on fumes?

 

Contrast the above article to Vettel's reaction on day 1 of testing ("very close to perfection"). 

 

https://www.formula1...W7v4QldmfF.html



#6055 dissident

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Posted 11 December 2019 - 15:34

Binotto says that the championship was lost once the car was designed.  (https://www.formula1...2dpODZd05W.html). 

 

To me the great mystery is what happened in pre-season testing; were Ferrari running on fumes?

 

Contrast the above article to Vettel's reaction on day 1 of testing ("very close to perfection"). 

 

https://www.formula1...W7v4QldmfF.html

 

Mercedes being late with their full developments made us look better, I think.

 

By the end of the second week of testing their were already on our pace.



#6056 Marklar

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Posted 11 December 2019 - 16:26

Binotto says that the championship was lost once the car was designed. (https://www.formula1...2dpODZd05W.html).

To me the great mystery is what happened in pre-season testing; were Ferrari running on fumes?

Contrast the above article to Vettel's reaction on day 1 of testing ("very close to perfection").

https://www.formula1...W7v4QldmfF.html

Binotto said earlier this year that they were aware in winter testing of the tyre issues, but their speed made them believe that it wont affect them too much.

A bit like Mercedes having tyre issues in the early hybrid era were always sugarcoated by their speed.

#6057 Unicast

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Posted 11 December 2019 - 16:59

Binotto said earlier this year that they were aware in winter testing of the tyre issues, but their speed made them believe that it wont affect them too much.

A bit like Mercedes having tyre issues in the early hybrid era were always sugarcoated by their speed.

 

But what made them think Mercedes is unable to go even faster?

They seemed really fooled by Mercedes and slipped into a false sense of security.

What a rude awakening was Melbourne  :p


Edited by Unicast, 11 December 2019 - 18:53.


#6058 RedRabbit

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Posted 12 December 2019 - 09:25

Wow, the negativity towards the car here is crazy. 9 Pole positions and I think 4 front row lockouts, and the car is a piece of trash? That's 9 golden opportunities to win the race, yet only 3 were converted. Ferrari have bigger problems than the car.



#6059 grunf77

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Posted 12 December 2019 - 10:45

Wow, the negativity towards the car here is crazy. 9 Pole positions and I think 4 front row lockouts, and the car is a piece of trash? That's 9 golden opportunities to win the race, yet only 3 were converted. Ferrari have bigger problems than the car.

Yeah, operation and tactics should be better.

 

 

 

 

Troll.



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#6060 Unicast

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Posted 12 December 2019 - 12:22

Wow, the negativity towards the car here is crazy. 9 Pole positions and I think 4 front row lockouts, and the car is a piece of trash? That's 9 golden opportunities to win the race, yet only 3 were converted. Ferrari have bigger problems than the car.

 

The car was too inconsistent and peaky over the race distance, and we were always going through the tires faster than Mercedes & RedBull.

Getting pole positions is nice but they don't mean anything if you cannot translate them into good results, points are allocated on Sunday, and Sunday was when Mercedes rocked the boat, they had a very consistent and predictable car and they manage to keep their tires in much better shape than the competition.

Mercedes and RedBull will start next year as favorites, first we must prove we can match them and recover the aero load which we were missing this year and than we can think of getting in front, but this won't be easy.

Hopefully the teams has learned something from this year's fiasco and they will be more analytical and scrupulous in assessing and evaluating next year's car and also a bit more ambitious regarding the performance targets.

We should try to put as much DF on the car as possible but in a clean and smart way to also keep our aero efficiency advantage.

Also I have big expectations on the PU front, where we have seen the biggest gains ever since the hybrid era began... but hopefully we won't have to use the PU to mask our aero issues and we can also find a good aero platform and match the best.


Edited by Unicast, 12 December 2019 - 12:26.


#6061 Baddoer

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Posted 12 December 2019 - 13:01

Wow, the negativity towards the car here is crazy. 9 Pole positions and I think 4 front row lockouts, and the car is a piece of trash? That's 9 golden opportunities to win the race, yet only 3 were converted. Ferrari have bigger problems than the car.

It also scored 1-2 where everyone expected to Mercedes or Verstappen walk away. :wave:



#6062 Diablobb81

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Posted 12 December 2019 - 13:18

Wow, the negativity towards the car here is crazy. 9 Pole positions and I think 4 front row lockouts, and the car is a piece of trash? That's 9 golden opportunities to win the race, yet only 3 were converted. Ferrari have bigger problems than the car.

There were no 9 golden opportunities to win. The car was simply to slow and too bad on the tires.



#6063 ferrarista

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Posted 12 December 2019 - 15:13

https://translate.go...bNeKdJO3-iUU_vQ

#6064 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 12 December 2019 - 18:49

The car was certainly looking better than it was because of a great power unit. The concept was flawed, and the direction Ferrari picked was wrong.

it was by no means a piece of **** though



#6065 ferrarista

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Posted 12 December 2019 - 20:31

Binotto says that the championship was lost once the car was designed. (https://www.formula1...2dpODZd05W.html).

To me the great mystery is what happened in pre-season testing; were Ferrari running on fumes?

Contrast the above article to Vettel's reaction on day 1 of testing ("very close to perfection").

https://www.formula1...W7v4QldmfF.html


https://translate.go...kr7p4WcLxW7KJxg

#6066 ferrarista

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Posted 12 December 2019 - 20:54

https://translate.go...CNuz59A-RjilYDA

#6067 Unicast

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Posted 13 December 2019 - 10:27

From Binotto:

 

F1's four engine manufacturers have converged in the V6 turbo-hybrid era's fifth season but despite aerodynamic and engine regulations remaining stable for 2020, Ferrari has opted for an overhaul because it believes there is more potential to exploit.

"We have changed, by quite a lot, our power unit, in terms of architecture, the cylinder," said team principal Mattia Binotto.

"It's quite a big review just to show that here again, there is much that can be done.

"The change we are looking for next year is quite significant changes on the engine itself."



#6068 ferrarista

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Posted 13 December 2019 - 17:00

The job they are doing on the engine is impressive, if they improve chassis and aero everything is possible.

#6069 Unicast

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Posted 13 December 2019 - 18:19

Binotto also said something along the lines that... yes we did finish the championship with an increasing performance deficit to Merc, but that Merc brought a very efficient upgrade package after Russia while Ferrari did not add any updates after Singapore.

Tough I must admit that I don't know if Merc really had a major update or not.


Edited by Unicast, 13 December 2019 - 18:19.


#6070 Marklar

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Posted 13 December 2019 - 19:16

They had a minor upgrade in Japan, nothing significant.

#6071 PlayboyRacer

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Posted 14 December 2019 - 03:11

Wow, the negativity towards the car here is crazy. 9 Pole positions and I think 4 front row lockouts, and the car is a piece of trash? That's 9 golden opportunities to win the race, yet only 3 were converted. Ferrari have bigger problems than the car.

The car was trash in race trim. The only place it looked unbeatable, in Leclercs hands anyway, was Bahrain. And unreliability robbed that.

#6072 ferrarista

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Posted 14 December 2019 - 09:18

https://translate.go...I67Na4vPzsQHKwg

https://translate.go...J8mDRId3STMr-eQ

#6073 ferrarista

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Posted 15 December 2019 - 09:12

https://www.formula1...3GFrQ6Zusd.html

https://translate.go...mNPZuC_YrGMKSGw

#6074 ARTGP

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Posted 15 December 2019 - 13:15

Seb look at the camera!  :rotfl:

 

image.JPG



#6075 F1 Mike

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Posted 15 December 2019 - 20:13

That photo sums up Vettel's year, taking his eye off the ball

#6076 ferrarista

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Posted 19 December 2019 - 13:24

https://mobile.twitt...645394416623618

https://mobile.twitt...645491695144968

#6077 IceSpeed

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Posted 19 December 2019 - 20:07

https://mobile.twitt...645394416623618

https://mobile.twitt...645491695144968


LOL 😂 Thanks for sharing!

#6078 ferrarista

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Posted 21 December 2019 - 09:37

https://mobile.twitt...307676100399104

https://mobile.twitt...307746761785344

#6079 CoolBreeze

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Posted 21 December 2019 - 11:42

That photo sums up Vettel's year, taking his eye off the ball

 

What nonsense are you talking? The whole team took it's eye off the ball. 



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#6080 CoolBreeze

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Posted 21 December 2019 - 11:43

The car was trash in race trim. The only place it looked unbeatable, in Leclercs hands anyway, was Bahrain. And unreliability robbed that.

 

I think it's bad, but definitely not as bad as the F2005, or the 2009 car...whatever it's name was.. or that 2017 car. 



#6081 thefinalapex

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Posted 21 December 2019 - 16:01

I think it's bad, but definitely not as bad as the F2005, or the 2009 car...whatever it's name was.. or that 2017 car.


Wasn’t f2005 only hampered by the tyres that year? I remember to read somewhere that the car itself was quite good?

#6082 Unicast

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Posted 23 December 2019 - 11:42

I think it's bad, but definitely not as bad as the F2005, or the 2009 car...whatever it's name was.. or that 2017 car. 

 

The 2017 car was actually quite good, it had the most down-force but it was held up by an immature engine.

With a good PU, the 2017 car was actually one (if not the best cars), Ferrari had, since 2008... and would have definitely have had a decent shot at the title.

The 2017 car was also less peaky and capricious than the 2018 car.



#6083 CoolBreeze

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Posted 24 December 2019 - 05:09

Wasn’t f2005 only hampered by the tyres that year? I remember to read somewhere that the car itself was quite good?

 

Let's put it this way....how many wins did the F2005 have vs the SF90?

 

The F2005, in theory, had 0 wins. The only 'win' came was from that Indy tyre debacle. The car, besides the tyre, was completely useless. 



#6084 baddog

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Posted 24 December 2019 - 07:19

I dont think we will ever know just how bad the 2005 car was, just that it was a free championship for everyone else to pick up whatever Ferrari did with the car.

 

It just seems that so far, Ferrari can not make a car that has consistency over a year, not for 10 years. If they ever do then the others will be in a lot of trouble.



#6085 Shade

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Posted 24 December 2019 - 09:43

Ferrari need to start with a good car, and develop it during the season. The ONE time Ferrari had decent development (2019), their car was a dog from the start.



#6086 Astandahl

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Posted 24 December 2019 - 13:20

Let's put it this way....how many wins did the F2005 have vs the SF90?

 

The F2005, in theory, had 0 wins. The only 'win' came was from that Indy tyre debacle. The car, besides the tyre, was completely useless. 

The F 2005 is one of the worst (top) car ever made. In some tracks the Renault MIchelin combination was  2s faster.



#6087 CoolBreeze

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Posted 24 December 2019 - 14:03

I dont think we will ever know just how bad the 2005 car was, just that it was a free championship for everyone else to pick up whatever Ferrari did with the car.

 

 

 

The F 2005 is one of the worst (top) car ever made. In some tracks the Renault MIchelin combination was  2s faster.

^what he said...



#6088 ferrarista

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 16:19

https://www.quotidia...del-2020-5.6105

So we have the first rumors from Turrini, the new PU won’t be a problem, not good numbers from the simulator and the wind tunnel, Ferrari will win in 2021 (maybe), Leclerc fully concentrated on Hamilton for 2020 and also 2021...

Edited by ferrarista, 30 December 2019 - 16:20.


#6089 MortenF1

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 17:05

Binotto says that the championship was lost once the car was designed. (https://www.formula1...2dpODZd05W.html).

To me the great mystery is what happened in pre-season testing; were Ferrari running on fumes?

Contrast the above article to Vettel's reaction on day 1 of testing ("very close to perfection").

https://www.formula1...W7v4QldmfF.html


Many times this year did I think back to that, to Vettel (and others) being almost in awe about the car.

#6090 thefinalapex

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Posted 30 December 2019 - 22:22

https://www.quotidia...del-2020-5.6105

So we have the first rumors from Turrini, the new PU won’t be a problem, not good numbers from the simulator and the wind tunnel, Ferrari will win in 2021 (maybe), Leclerc fully concentrated on Hamilton for 2020 and also 2021...


Sounds promising...

#6091 sourav1480

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Posted 31 December 2019 - 16:23

https://www.quotidia...del-2020-5.6105

So we have the first rumors from Turrini, the new PU won’t be a problem, not good numbers from the simulator and the wind tunnel, Ferrari will win in 2021 (maybe), Leclerc fully concentrated on Hamilton for 2020 and also 2021...


So 2020 car concept is already bad in the simulator??...hope it turns out to be the exact opposite.

#6092 ferrarista

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Posted 31 December 2019 - 18:15

So 2020 car concept is already bad in the simulator??...hope it turns out to be the exact opposite.

the results of their simulator are usually the opposite of the reality, so there is still hope 😁

#6093 1Devil1

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Posted 31 December 2019 - 18:23

The F 2005 is one of the worst (top) car ever made. In some tracks the Renault MIchelin combination was  2s faster.

 

How do you know that? Ferrari was easily the best car on Bridgestone. A lot was down to the tires. If you give Mercedes a bad tire in comparison to all the other competitor they would be nowhere as well. The performance swing was massive sometimes if you look back at races like Monza were Ferrari had the pace. You will tell me they were one year really bad to bounce back the next year? People forget the tires rule for the whole race was in place. As package with the Bridgestone tires it was one of the worst years for Ferrari, I agree. 



#6094 Danyy

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Posted 31 December 2019 - 20:07

https://www.quotidia...del-2020-5.6105
So we have the first rumors from Turrini, the new PU won’t be a problem, not good numbers from the simulator and the wind tunnel, Ferrari will win in 2021 (maybe), Leclerc fully concentrated on Hamilton for 2020 and also 2021...

Of course they feel good about 2021 since they will be spending crazy money for both 2020 but especially 2021 while Mercedes is trying to cut costs slashing 10,000 jobs (not F1 related jobs but still).

Edited by Danyy, 31 December 2019 - 20:09.


#6095 Astandahl

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Posted 31 December 2019 - 20:47

How do you know that? Ferrari was easily the best car on Bridgestone. A lot was down to the tires. If you give Mercedes a bad tire in comparison to all the other competitor they would be nowhere as well. The performance swing was massive sometimes if you look back at races like Monza were Ferrari had the pace. You will tell me they were one year really bad to bounce back the next year? People forget the tires rule for the whole race was in place. As package with the Bridgestone tires it was one of the worst years for Ferrari, I agree. 

When i talk about pre 2007 cars i always include the tyres ( because as you said there were different tyres ) . The combination of the two was awful.


Edited by Astandahl, 31 December 2019 - 20:48.


#6096 OO7

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Posted 31 December 2019 - 20:55

https://www.quotidia...del-2020-5.6105

So we have the first rumors from Turrini, the new PU won’t be a problem, not good numbers from the simulator and the wind tunnel, Ferrari will win in 2021 (maybe), Leclerc fully concentrated on Hamilton for 2020 and also 2021...

What about his team mate...........?  ;)  :lol:



#6097 ViMaMo

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Posted 01 January 2020 - 12:08

The F 2005 is one of the worst (top) car ever made. In some tracks the Renault MIchelin combination was 2s faster.


Whaat? The only Ferrari to not win a single race for a long time was the 2014 Ferrari, only two podiums.

#6098 as65p

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Posted 01 January 2020 - 20:11

What about his team mate...........?  ;)  :lol:

 

Or what about it being useless, counter-productive even, to "concentrate" on other drivers?

 

Maybe it's just a translation thing, or Turrini talking out of some dark place.  ;)



#6099 as65p

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Posted 01 January 2020 - 20:25

I dont think we will ever know just how bad the 2005 car was, just that it was a free championship for everyone else to pick up whatever Ferrari did with the car.

 

If Schumacher hadn't qualified so low in Imola (don't remember why), the car would have won the race on merit. It was all down to the tyres, which by some miracle worked well in Imola, but never again for the rest of the season.

 

It's the tyre issue that will mask the 2005 cars performance forever. Which also makes more logical sense than to assume in that era of constantly building dominant or at worst very competitive cars from 2000 to 2008, they forgot how to do it for a single season.


Edited by as65p, 01 January 2020 - 20:25.


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#6100 baddog

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Posted 01 January 2020 - 21:24

If Schumacher hadn't qualified so low in Imola (don't remember why), the car would have won the race on merit. It was all down to the tyres, which by some miracle worked well in Imola, but never again for the rest of the season.

 

It's the tyre issue that will mask the 2005 cars performance forever. Which also makes more logical sense than to assume in that era of constantly building dominant or at worst very competitive cars from 2000 to 2008, they forgot how to do it for a single season.

 

Yes that was the whole of my point, thanks. The tyres mask the performance completely, no way to know if it was good, bad or indifferent really.