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McLaren in 2019: Sainz and Norris, sponsors, management, rumour and scuttlebutt from the MTC


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#251 kumo7

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 08:39

Now that the Indy has failed, Ian not sure what would be Alonso's next project.

Could be going for beating the Indy with or without McLaren, or coming back to F1, or ...

 

 

 

In terms of McLaren team, I am more eager to know what is going on in the development front, around Key.



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#252 SparkPlug86

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 09:01

I wouldn't want Alonso back in the F1 team - they've settled nicely with Lando and Sainz (who are both really good drivers, Lando has the makings of a WDC imo). 



#253 kosmos

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 09:12

Lando has the makings of a WDC imo). 

 

 

But not Sainz?. I don't think Lando is doing anything that screams "future champion". So far he is a solid driver, nothing more.



#254 Lights

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 09:14

Sainz had a bad/unfortunate start to the year and is now climbing back up there in terms of results. I've always thought he was solid: he was close to Max and matched Hulkenberg, so how bad can he be.

Sainz's early season struggles might have made Norris look better than he really was. So I'm not entirely sure about Norris yet, but he has plenty more time to prove himself.

Right now I don't see any reason to replace this duo. I do think Alonso could've done better in this car, but he's simply in the past now.

Edited by Lights, 28 May 2019 - 09:16.


#255 Muz Bee

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 10:27

But why will Alonso come back to drive a car that is only 4th in WCC. What benefit will it be to him? He is after wins/wdc not just finishing up high in the order

I'm sure that when the McLaren team is starting to put the pieces together and getting consistently improving results he believes he can make a real difference. Of course that's all speculation but we should see at Canada if with the up spec engine McLaren are closing the gap to the leaders. If Monaco is a track ill-suiting to the MCL34's characteristics then a tactical sixth is a good indication that on the right tracks it can be within a couple of tenths of Red Bull, or is that too hopeful?



#256 baddog

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 10:50

Dont see anyone doing more on Sunday.



#257 Owen

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 11:02

I think this driver pairing is one of the most pleasant surprises about this year.



#258 jstrains

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 11:03

When is Alonso going to return?



#259 ForzaFormula

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 11:21

Sainz had a bad/unfortunate start to the year and is now climbing back up there in terms of results. I've always thought he was solid: he was close to Max and matched Hulkenberg, so how bad can he be.

Sainz's early season struggles might have made Norris look better than he really was. So I'm not entirely sure about Norris yet, but he has plenty more time to prove himself.

Right now I don't see any reason to replace this duo. I do think Alonso could've done better in this car, but he's simply in the past now.

 

He was close to Hulk, but Hulk had the edge over him overall, so he's a bit behind him. I'd expect Norris to start beating him more convincingly with more experience if he's to full-fill his promising potential and hype around him. Not that Sainz is a bad driver he's solid and good but Alonso, Daniel etc surely would be getting much more out of the car than both drivers are based on past team mate performances against each other and pure talent, even Hulkenberg would be getting more based on their time as team mates. 

 

I think it's probably more the drivers are being underwhelming and the car has allot more potentially than it's showing, they just don't have a top of the line star driver anymore to show it, like with Alonso, so there hopes are surely on Norris to step up his performance and full-fill his potential sooner rather than later.


Edited by ForzaFormula, 28 May 2019 - 11:24.


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#260 pacificquay

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 11:24

I think this driver pairing is one of the most pleasant surprises about this year.

 

They're doing well but I don't think there's any surprise in that



#261 CPR

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 11:30

I'm very happy with Carlos and Lando. While I'm sure there'll be continuous speculation about Fernando returning, he pretty much said he wouldn't come back without having a pretty good shot at the championship, which isn't going to happen any time soon with McLaren.

 

I think Carlos is a bit like Jenson - frequently underrated.

 

It feels a bit too soon to see how Lando will develop but he's certainly contributing to the overall results, one way or another. While it would be good if he could get better race starts, at least he's not doing the "drive it like you stole it" that a lot of other midfield drivers seem to do. I think he could develop quite nicely as he builds up experience.



#262 jstrains

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 11:38

The last time Fernando said that contending for podiums on a regular basis would be enough...



#263 lixlax

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 11:55

Generally I'm still quite optimistic.

 

The team seems to know the car (behavior, where the weakpoints and strongpoints are), track operations, pit stops, strategies etc have been almost flawless. I'm sure the raw car perfomce will follow sooner or later.

 

That all is in a pretty big contrast to the 2012 season when the big downfall started in my opinion. They had excellent (the fastest) car, but continuosly screwed up off and on the track- setup, strategy, pitstops etc. I even remeber them saying at some point that they don't know why the car is so fast because the data was showing it shouldn't be, then the suspension fiasco at 2013 preseason testing...and from then on they've been a midfield team.

 

I hope 2019 is the year when the real recory towards being a top team really starts (or rather has already started).  


Edited by lixlax, 28 May 2019 - 11:56.


#264 Pete_f1

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 11:55

When is Alonso going to return?


I dont see that happening!

#265 NixxxoN

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 12:17

He was close to Hulk, but Hulk had the edge over him overall, so he's a bit behind him. I'd expect Norris to start beating him more convincingly with more experience if he's to full-fill his promising potential and hype around him. Not that Sainz is a bad driver he's solid and good but Alonso, Daniel etc surely would be getting much more out of the car than both drivers are based on past team mate performances against each other and pure talent, even Hulkenberg would be getting more based on their time as team mates. 
 
I think it's probably more the drivers are being underwhelming and the car has allot more potentially than it's showing, they just don't have a top of the line star driver anymore to show it, like with Alonso, so there hopes are surely on Norris to step up his performance and full-fill his potential sooner rather than later.

Hulk only had the edge on Sainz in the first half of the season, but in the second half, if anything it was more like the opposite.

#266 TomNokoe

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 13:24

I agree about possible Norris worries. I was quite shocked to hear him openly admit to confidence issues, and for that to be compounded by the team order on Sunday.

It's only 2 poor races Spain-Monaco, so hopefully just a blip.

He's super likeable and I really hope he can do well.

#267 Rinehart

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 13:33

Fernando isn't getting any younger and with at least a year out... lets just say that at some point in the not too distant he's not even going to be the quicker option...

 

Norris will come good. His Bahrain performance was easily as good as Sainz in Monaco and yesterday he took one for the team. 

 

To the future and beyond, McLaren. 



#268 Joseki

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 13:38

Fernando is going to come back to McLaren F1 eventually.

In a managerial role.

#269 prty

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 13:51

I don't think it would be good for Alonso to come back, after one year out, being one year older, and not having anything to prove. He can only lose.

And regarding Indy, I always felt it is a lottery, comes down to who finds the super optimal set up for those specific conditions, and having enough luck to be in the leaders pack during the last 20 laps. Doesn't compensate the huge risk.



#270 ARTGP

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 14:21

What if Mclaren finally build a Le Mans car? Alonso has all the experience from Toyota. That would be a great position for him.



#271 CPR

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 14:28

What if Mclaren finally build a Le Mans car? Alonso has all the experience from Toyota. That would be a great position for him.


McLaren have indicated that they're interested in running under the 2020+ WEC rules but won't join until 2021 at earliest (priority is the F1 team)

#272 Lights

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 17:20

He was close to Hulk, but Hulk had the edge over him overall, so he's a bit behind him. I'd expect Norris to start beating him more convincingly with more experience if he's to full-fill his promising potential and hype around him. Not that Sainz is a bad driver he's solid and good but Alonso, Daniel etc surely would be getting much more out of the car than both drivers are based on past team mate performances against each other and pure talent, even Hulkenberg would be getting more based on their time as team mates. 

 

If Hulkenberg hadn't crashed in Baku, Spa, and Abu Dhabi, then I'd have probably agreed with you. But he did, and coupled with a lot of strong performances from Sainz they seemed evenly matched to me over the season. I don't agree Hulkenberg would be getting more out of this McLaren. Ricciardo, maybe, he seems to have a pace advantage on Hulkenberg more often than not this year.



#273 TomNokoe

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 17:21

Totally forgot that Sainz missed FP1. Even more kudos!

#274 ForzaFormula

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 18:48

Hulk only had the edge on Sainz in the first half of the season, but in the second half, if anything it was more like the opposite.

 

That's not quite how it was though, some facts. Unless your talking "just" about the last 2 races...which would not be an accurate compare between any team mates over a season.

1ZgSuBf.png

 

Based on how the season went, and how both driver's compared as team mates,Hulkenberg would surely be getting more out of the McLaren than Sainz, never-mind even higher tier driver's such as Alonso. The pressure will be on Norris to step up and show his full potential, I hope he comes good for the team and can extract the maximum out of this year's car as he progresses throughout the season.


Edited by ForzaFormula, 28 May 2019 - 19:28.


#275 NixxxoN

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 19:34

That's not quite how it was though, some facts. Unless your talking "just" about the last 2 races...which would not be an accurate compare between any team mates over a season.
1ZgSuBf.png
 
Based on how the season went, and how both driver's compared as team mates,Hulkenberg would surely be getting more out of the McLaren than Sainz, never-mind even higher tier driver's such as Alonso. The pressure will be on Norris to step up and show his full potential, I hope he comes good for the team and can extract the maximum out of this year's car as he progresses throughout the season.

I was talking about performance. Sainz started below Hulk but mid season they adjusted the car more to their likings and he went on an upwards curve and he more than matched hulk in the end

#276 ARTGP

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Posted 28 May 2019 - 19:36

 

Based on how the season went, and how both driver's compared as team mates,Hulkenberg would surely be getting more out of the McLaren than Sainz.

 

I don't understand this kind of logic...These are human beings. They grow and improve or decline. Why do you treat them like they are robots that are unable to software update.

 

Would you say that you are the same person now, as the first day on the first job you ever had?....

 

Who knows how that battle would evolve this year as drivers are either improving or declining year on year particularly with the winter offseason.  I mean look at Valterri Bottas!! He was nobody last season. And then he grew a beard. It's crazy to speculate one would do better than another in the Mclaren this year.


Edited by ARTGP, 28 May 2019 - 19:41.


#277 Kao18

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 08:16

Norris learning from Max: https://www.motorspo...-games/4398421/

#278 sopa

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Posted 30 May 2019 - 08:24

Both drivers are solid, but nothing spectacular. As for Hulk - Sainz, I got the impression that Hulk has higher peaks, and thus he slightly edged the team-mate battle.

 

What concerns 2019 midfield battle, then I have to say Renault has the best driver line-up there, but their car is a let-down, so they are struggling to score points. What concerns other midfield teams, no driver line-up has an obvious edge. McLaren, Toro Rosso, Haas... well, whoever has the best performing car in this bunch, has an edge in terms of results. And all three teams have been looking good at various points this year. Racing Point and Alfa Romeo have a good lead driver in Perez and Raikkonen respectively, but they are let down by the second driver. And the cars of both teams haven't been performing well in recent races.

 

I think the image of McLaren and Toro Rosso drivers (and Magnussen) has recently been boosted by having a car, which is at the top of midfield. So they look good there.



#279 CPR

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 11:02

Comments from Carlos:
https://www.formula1...r_results'.html

And Lando:
https://www.formula1...ts_McLaren.html

It won't happen with all drivers, but I rather like it that the two get along well. For now, better to be fighting the other teams, not each other.

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#280 Dennista

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 14:15

If all goes well this season we finish 4th. Then we make a push top break into the top 3 and topple Red Bull. 2021 with new regulations we will become the McLaren of 1998 again. Hopefully by then Hamilton comes back for his final swansong to bring the title back to Woking. Verstappen in the other seat ready to take over when Hamilton retires.


Edited by Dennista, 07 June 2019 - 14:16.


#281 mclarensmps

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 15:14

^ No thanks...



#282 mp4x

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 15:19

^ No thanks...

Amen

#283 aray

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 16:11

Norris is fine. If he develops, he can easily become better than contemporary midfield bunch.

Sainz is fine too. Alonso has nothing to gain in returning to this McLaren..........



#284 BertoC

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 16:11

1998 levels of domination in 2021? Yes please xD

#285 Pete_f1

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 17:15

I expect there will be. But not by McLaren

#286 Marklar

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 17:16

^ No thanks...

You dont want the McLaren of 1998?  :p



#287 Eruobodo

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 17:55

Norris is fine. If he develops, he can easily become better than contemporary midfield bunch.

Sainz is fine too. Alonso has nothing to gain in returning to this McLaren..........

I will want Alonso to return if the car can challenge, just for one year, win the third title and get into management.



#288 PayasYouRace

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 18:26

You dont want the McLaren of 1998?  :p

 

Why want 1998 when you can want 1988?



#289 BertoC

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Posted 07 June 2019 - 18:28

Why want 1998 when you can want 1988?

Cause you can also get 2018 xD

Edited by BertoC, 07 June 2019 - 18:29.


#290 TomNokoe

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Posted 08 June 2019 - 09:01

Norris very self-critical after practice, again...

"There's potential in the car, the car's quick enough to do what Carlos did," said Norris.

"I'm just not driving well, that's basically it, and I need to do a better job - especially when it gets to qualifying.

"I got to grips with the track reasonably quickly but I pretty much haven't moved on since my first run in FP1. A bit frustrating because there's a lot more speed in the car than what I'm bringing out of it."

Asked what he felt he needed to improve for Saturday, Norris replied: "Everything".

#291 Lights

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Posted 08 June 2019 - 09:34

Lando's honesty is refreshing, relatable and likable. But I wonder if it won't damage him on the long run, mentally as well as his image.

 

Especially as I think Sainz is generally underrated and McLaren won't hesitate to use their slower car to help their faster car get more points.



#292 TomNokoe

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Posted 08 June 2019 - 09:39

His first year in F1, a track he’s never raced at before, sky high temperatures... I hope he has a good Saturday for his own sake!

#293 Mc_Silver

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Posted 08 June 2019 - 10:20

I like Lando's approach which shows he has high expectation from himself and he is usually improving a lot from Friday to Saturday. I don't think he will be far away from Sainz in qualifying today.

#294 numberten

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Posted 08 June 2019 - 14:19

If it wasn't for Sainz's misfortune at the start of the season he'd be well out in front as best of the rest. Great start to his Mclaren career so far - hoping for another positive result here!

 

Norris I'm sure will get there and will learn a lot from this season - he's already shown some glimpses of raw talent in some of the previous races. Bit of work for him to do still this weekend but no concerns for me looking long term.

 

Feels strange to feel positive about Mclaren after the past few years... sure we'll come crashing back down to Earth soon enough   :lol:



#295 geralt

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Posted 08 June 2019 - 14:48

Honestly, it won't be the end of the world if Norris doesn't make it to Q3. In fact, I reckon starting 11th with free choice of tyre may be the best strategy on sunday with the higher temperatures



#296 mclarensmps

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Posted 08 June 2019 - 15:02

You dont want the McLaren of 1998?  :p

 

Comparing Verstappen to Hakkinen is like the biggest insult to my favourite driver  :cry:  :cry:  :cry:



#297 pup

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Posted 22 June 2019 - 12:25

Watched Murder Mystery on Netflix last night.  Terrible movie, but it was nice seeing McLaren win a race again.  Good exposure for the sponsors.



#298 kumo7

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Posted 23 June 2019 - 17:18

Is McLaren doing something to punish RIC's last move? He obviously put all his wheel off the track twice and gained advantage.

He dangerously returned to the track, used Norris off the track as well.

Is there any clause saying that all those who gained advantage from this Mal doing too be punished in one way or the other.

 

I like RIC, but this is way too much in three corners and users of position he gained was,... 



#299 TheMessiah

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Posted 23 June 2019 - 20:20

Norris out in a great drive today in an ailing car, probably the best drive I have seen from a McLaren driver in recent years. Shame he lost out at the end but thats racing. I am not sure if he would have lost out had it not been for the VSC but thats racing.

 

Sainz was strong, good start, I think we knew well before the race we weren't racing Vest and Vet so let them go and do what they wanted. It's pleasing to see us beating the factory team on the track and I think we likely had a little margin in hand, not much but we will have done just as much as we needed to do to keep ahead of them. We picked our battles well and that was wise of the team.



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#300 prty

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Posted 23 June 2019 - 20:26

Norris out in a great drive today in an ailing car, probably the best drive I have seen from a McLaren driver in recent years.


Nah, you don't have to go very far to find a better drive by a McLaren driver, just today Sainz started behind and was in front before Norris car problems, despite an undercut attempt.

And if you want to go further, you still don't have to go far, Alonso drove better races almost every race. Was pretty rare for him to lose places at the start and being beaten by his teammate in the same race.