Jump to content


Photo
* * * * * 5 votes

McLaren Technical Thread (MCL34) Part 2


  • Please log in to reply
5635 replies to this topic

#5501 Disgrace

Disgrace
  • Member

  • 21,545 posts
  • Joined: January 10

Posted 18 November 2019 - 16:03

Kevin was in the podium, it was Jenson that was awarded P3 after the cerimony.

 

Quite right, thanks for the correction peeps. That teaches me for posting in the early hours.



Advertisement

#5502 BertoC

BertoC
  • Member

  • 632 posts
  • Joined: August 17

Posted 18 November 2019 - 16:57

Ok, now that the podium taboo is behind us, I want more! :D I really hope next year we can be in a position where these lucky podiums (it's almost impossible to make gains that would put us in regular contention without luck and DNFs) might be as frequent as P5 and P6's were this year. It's so important to keep the momentum going, if the team stagnates a year it will loose the train to the front once again and the motivation. And that is a fear I have, that this is a kind of plateau for the team and we are hopelessly stuck in this midfield desert forever, like what happened with Renault this year that was unable to make that leap.



#5503 Quickshifter

Quickshifter
  • Member

  • 4,405 posts
  • Joined: April 15

Posted 18 November 2019 - 17:09

And to think Mclaren threw away so many points from unfortunate incidents. Could have easily hit 200 points this season. 

 

Great bounce back from the team. 

 

Am i right to say if Norris wasn't pitted he would have been odds on for the podium instead??

 

Norris was struggling to make the hard tyre work. He by his own admission did not have the pace Carlos had.



#5504 ExEd

ExEd
  • Member

  • 875 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 18 November 2019 - 17:27

Why? They have the exact same points they had last year.

 

Savage  :rotfl:  :rotfl:  :rotfl:



#5505 Burai

Burai
  • Member

  • 1,493 posts
  • Joined: February 07

Posted 18 November 2019 - 17:47

The good thing about the podium being awarded in the stewards office is that whilst the team still get the trophy and the points, the public didn't have to see those horrendous blue overalls.



#5506 BertoC

BertoC
  • Member

  • 632 posts
  • Joined: August 17

Posted 18 November 2019 - 18:14

The good thing about the podium being awarded in the stewards office is that whilst the team still get the trophy and the points, the public didn't have to see those horrendous blue overalls.

 

They could go dressed in their pink pajamas if that meant more podiums :D



#5507 Quickshifter

Quickshifter
  • Member

  • 4,405 posts
  • Joined: April 15

Posted 18 November 2019 - 19:06

https://www.formula1..._in_Brazil.html

 

Sainz's charge


Edited by Quickshifter, 18 November 2019 - 19:06.


#5508 balmybaldwin

balmybaldwin
  • Member

  • 1,322 posts
  • Joined: January 14

Posted 18 November 2019 - 19:10

Don't all betting cos payout on the result as the cars cross the line? Sometimes appeals can change results hours after a race. Not really compatible with live betting.

 

 

It seems buried somewhere in the rules that is the case for F1 on Bet365, but not with Horse racing for example.  Any how after a twitter spat they've paid out :clap:



#5509 keshav

keshav
  • Member

  • 1,415 posts
  • Joined: November 14

Posted 19 November 2019 - 02:23

Sainz must be ahead of Gasly in the following race. We need that 6th position!

#5510 Mc_Silver

Mc_Silver
  • Member

  • 4,286 posts
  • Joined: May 09

Posted 19 November 2019 - 06:53

https://www.formula1..._in_Brazil.html

Sainz's charge


Phenomenal drive from Sainz. He definitely has learned one or two things from Fernando.:D

He's really a good reference for Lando to improve his race craft. It's all about experience.

#5511 David Lightman

David Lightman
  • Member

  • 1,355 posts
  • Joined: September 09

Posted 19 November 2019 - 07:33

Biggest surprise for me this year is Sainz becoming such a strong driver, although he was always going to be an improvement on that anonymous chap who trailed Fernando home every race for 2 years.



#5512 Synkro89

Synkro89
  • Member

  • 2,108 posts
  • Joined: October 16

Posted 19 November 2019 - 07:55

Are Mclaren going to complain about the coverage. Its been a absolute joke most of his drives have been missed by the main feed. Unacceptable

P.S Congrats on Podium. Will always have Macca in my heart since there the ones that put Lewis on the map. This new chapter for mclaren will be enticing to watch. 



#5513 shure

shure
  • Member

  • 1,573 posts
  • Joined: April 17

Posted 19 November 2019 - 08:07

Biggest surprise for me this year is Sainz becoming such a strong driver, although he was always going to be an improvement on that anonymous chap who trailed Fernando home every race for 2 years.

I think that anonymous chap was just unfortunate to be partnering Alonso and I rather suspect both current McLaren drivers may count their lucky stars neither partnered him as they may well have been in the same boat



#5514 Burai

Burai
  • Member

  • 1,493 posts
  • Joined: February 07

Posted 19 November 2019 - 09:17

Are Mclaren going to complain about the coverage. Its been a absolute joke most of his drives have been missed by the main feed. Unacceptable. 

 

Easy to say in hindsight. There was a lot happening up front to cover in Brazil.



#5515 SarbaV

SarbaV
  • Member

  • 311 posts
  • Joined: October 16

Posted 19 November 2019 - 09:32

I'm waiting for McLaren to beat red bull with car performance. Soon after Alonso can step in to get done with the unfinished business.

#5516 pacificquay

pacificquay
  • Member

  • 2,974 posts
  • Joined: March 07

Posted 19 November 2019 - 12:43

I'm waiting for McLaren to beat red bull with car performance. Soon after Alonso can step in to get done with the unfinished business.

 

I think we can let that go now. I want to see Carlos and Lando doing the winning!



#5517 rodlamas

rodlamas
  • Member

  • 10,165 posts
  • Joined: February 04

Posted 19 November 2019 - 13:55

I'm waiting for McLaren to beat red bull with car performance. Soon after Alonso can step in to get done with the unfinished business.

Alonso won't be back to F1. This is getting as boring and as stupid as people claiming back for V12 engines + manual H-gearboxes.



#5518 Lerdes

Lerdes
  • Member

  • 128 posts
  • Joined: August 19

Posted 19 November 2019 - 14:18

Alonso won't be back to F1. This is getting as boring and as stupid as people claiming back for V12 engines + manual H-gearboxes.


"Alonso coming back" will be a common saying in Formula One history. Its a kind of honor imo... He deserves it. Although it may never happen as a driver.

Edited by Lerdes, 19 November 2019 - 15:58.


#5519 Joseki

Joseki
  • Member

  • 3,316 posts
  • Joined: July 12

Posted 19 November 2019 - 14:22

Alonso was at MTC to film something for WEC by the way.

Advertisement

#5520 Dicun

Dicun
  • Member

  • 568 posts
  • Joined: March 16

Posted 19 November 2019 - 14:23

I think that anonymous chap was just unfortunate to be partnering Alonso and I rather suspect both current McLaren drivers may count their lucky stars neither partnered him as they may well have been in the same boat

 

This argument is getting so tired now. Truly capable drivers can at least show some flashes in the pan once in a while, no matter who their teammates are - a few outstanding qualifying performances, some daring moves, some wow-factor race drives etc. Vandoorne showed nothing of the sort during his 2 years - zilch, nada, zero. He was given 2 full seasons and still couldn't deliver a single memorable performance or manoeuvre. Pérez and Magnussen performed far better than he ever did, still, both got the boot after just a single season. Vandoorne shouldn't have been kept for a second season at all. 

 

Nobody expected him to beat or match Alonso (apart from his rabid fans who, I clearly remember, claimed he was the best talent of the McLaren Youth Programme since Hamilton). But getting out-qualified by 5-6 tenths constantly for 2 years and failing to show anything on race days too is just simply not good enough at this level. I mean, come on, he wasn't even able to beat Alonso in a single qualifying session last year when he wasn't even a rookie any more. Even Piquet managed to beat Alonso once in qualifying.



#5521 Dennista

Dennista
  • Member

  • 444 posts
  • Joined: February 17

Posted 19 November 2019 - 14:49

A welcome surprise. Once we beat the top 3 teams on merit without any of them retiring then we can start getting excited.



#5522 shure

shure
  • Member

  • 1,573 posts
  • Joined: April 17

Posted 19 November 2019 - 15:02

This argument is getting so tired now. Truly capable drivers can at least show some flashes in the pan once in a while, no matter who their teammates are - a few outstanding qualifying performances, some daring moves, some wow-factor race drives etc. Vandoorne showed nothing of the sort during his 2 years - zilch, nada, zero. He was given 2 full seasons and still couldn't deliver a single memorable performance or manoeuvre. Pérez and Magnussen performed far better than he ever did, still, both got the boot after just a single season. Vandoorne shouldn't have been kept for a second season at all. 

 

Nobody expected him to beat or match Alonso (apart from his rabid fans who, I clearly remember, claimed he was the best talent of the McLaren Youth Programme since Hamilton). But getting out-qualified by 5-6 tenths constantly for 2 years and failing to show anything on race days too is just simply not good enough at this level. I mean, come on, he wasn't even able to beat Alonso in a single qualifying session last year when he wasn't even a rookie any more. Even Piquet managed to beat Alonso once in qualifying.

Just because it's getting tired doesn't mean it can't be true.

 

Vandoorne showed nothing because he was in a car that couldn't show anything.  When you have a driver like Alonso who we know is very, very good indeed and who scored a mere 6 points after the summer break then you know the car's not worth that much.

 

Not trying to claim any heroics on Vandoorne's behalf.  Just that the car was a pig and it clearly affected him more than it did Alonso.  And I suspect that the current drivers wouldn't have fared significantly better, if at all



#5523 mclarensmps

mclarensmps
  • Member

  • 5,979 posts
  • Joined: February 02

Posted 19 November 2019 - 16:04

I don't understand why this thread keeps devolving into an Alonso fest :(



#5524 kosmos

kosmos
  • Member

  • 10,852 posts
  • Joined: December 06

Posted 19 November 2019 - 16:12

Ok, now that the podium taboo is behind us,

 

 

He didn't put a foot in the podium though  ;) 



#5525 alpes

alpes
  • Member

  • 310 posts
  • Joined: February 16

Posted 19 November 2019 - 16:25

https://www.formula1..._in_Brazil.html

Sainz's charge

Thanks, I was looking for that as TV coverage was poor, didn't think to look at F1.com. I guess old habits die hard because in the Bernie time it was rubish site

Edited by alpes, 19 November 2019 - 16:29.


#5526 CPR

CPR
  • Member

  • 5,165 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 19 November 2019 - 16:34

Ok, now that the podium taboo is behind us, I want more! :D I really hope next year we can be in a position where these lucky podiums (it's almost impossible to make gains that would put us in regular contention without luck and DNFs) might be as frequent as P5 and P6's were this year. It's so important to keep the momentum going, if the team stagnates a year it will loose the train to the front once again and the motivation. And that is a fear I have, that this is a kind of plateau for the team and we are hopelessly stuck in this midfield desert forever, like what happened with Renault this year that was unable to make that leap.

 

If we're pretty much always 4th best team next year, unless the absolute gap is small then it's going to be hard to get podiums since it means going from a likely 7th to 3rd. Putting it another way, say Carlos or Lando makes up 2 places on the first lap with a good start and gets up to 5th, that still requires 2 other cars to have problems (including poor pace or bad strategy) to get to the podium. That obviously can happen but it wouldn't happen very often. On the other hand, if McLaren are consistently in the position where they pretty much always qualify 7th and 8th, then they could do some things like mainly setup for race pace rather than qualy pace and go with more aggressive strategies that are likely to play out well in case of a SC, for example.

 

Even without podiums, there's two main things that could help indicate whether progress has been made - in scenarios where one of the "big 3" cars is behind us, how easily can they overtake? This year it was easy. Conversely, when Carlos or Lando are behind one of the midfield cars, can they get past reasonably easily? If the other midfield teams start treating McLaren as a team not worth fighting with then that basically puts them in a different class.



#5527 BRG

BRG
  • Member

  • 17,161 posts
  • Joined: September 99

Posted 19 November 2019 - 16:51

Just because it's getting tired doesn't mean it can't be true.

That would be the case if it wasn't for the fact that it isn't true.  Vandoorne had a wonderful opportunity where as a rookie no-one expected him to beat Alonso (unlike rookies Norris and Albon who are getting stick already for not beating their team-mate, despite stellar performances from both of them) but he frittered it away with two seasons of pathetic underperformance, with, as Dicon so rightly said, not one single memorable moment.  Not one. 

 

You can't blame the car for everything.  Stoffel spent two years picking up his pay cheque and simply going through the motions of being a racing driver.  Whilst rookie Lance Stroll, often described as the worst driver in history, wrung the neck of his equally poor Williams car and got himself a podium. 



#5528 ARTGP

ARTGP
  • Member

  • 1,789 posts
  • Joined: March 19

Posted 19 November 2019 - 17:22

That would be the case if it wasn't for the fact that it isn't true.  Vandoorne had a wonderful opportunity where as a rookie no-one expected him to beat Alonso (unlike rookies Norris and Albon who are getting stick already for not beating their team-mate, despite stellar performances from both of them) but he frittered it away with two seasons of pathetic underperformance, with, as Dicon so rightly said, not one single memorable moment.  Not one. 

 

You can't blame the car for everything.  Stoffel spent two years picking up his pay cheque and simply going through the motions of being a racing driver.  Whilst rookie Lance Stroll, often described as the worst driver in history, wrung the neck of his equally poor Williams car and got himself a podium. 

 

 

Agree, at the end of the day, Lewis jumped in the car in 2007 and went toe to toe with Alonso, and even beat him in the WDC in his rookie season with ALonso coming off two world titles.

 

Mclaren weren't looking for a Vandoorne, they were looking for a Lewis. That's why Vandoorne was dropped. He wasn't special like Lewis was.


Edited by ARTGP, 19 November 2019 - 17:23.


#5529 SparkPlug86

SparkPlug86
  • Member

  • 262 posts
  • Joined: March 18

Posted 19 November 2019 - 18:56

Next person to mention Alonso coming back should get a 24 hour ban  :rotfl:



#5530 ARTGP

ARTGP
  • Member

  • 1,789 posts
  • Joined: March 19

Posted 19 November 2019 - 19:41

Next person to mention Alonso coming back should get a 24 hour ban  :rotfl:

 

lol!!   For anyone still wondering, Alonso is confirmed by Zak Brown to Not be coming back to Mclaren!

https://www.racefans...nso-back-to-f1/



#5531 balmybaldwin

balmybaldwin
  • Member

  • 1,322 posts
  • Joined: January 14

Posted 19 November 2019 - 19:42

Easy to say in hindsight. There was a lot happening up front to cover in Brazil.

 

How about the rest of the season? There have been races where you'd be forgiven for thinking Mclaren hadn't bothered turning up



#5532 Quickshifter

Quickshifter
  • Member

  • 4,405 posts
  • Joined: April 15

Posted 20 November 2019 - 14:06

2020 will be the first time in the last 5 years that the expectations on Mclaren will be huge. People/media will expect much more from them to clearly break away from the midfield and land them somewhere closer to the front. Mclaren have to manage expectations, keep their head down and keep working hard, easier said than done.

In 2019 preseason testing Media were calling them the 9th fastest team. 2020 will be a lot different. Mclaren's actual build of MCL34 was delayed as Mclaren tried to get to the bottom of the issues plagued in 2018. Fortunately with the 2019 car having solid baseline Mclaren could devote interest towards 2020 car relatively early on.

MCL34 is far from perfect and this is a blessing in disguise. There are clear potential areas of improvement which makes it less difficult to find performance. Good aero efficiency, good braking and good high speed performance are three biggest strengths but the list of weaknesses are pretty long too. The car does not ride well and struggles for mechanical grip. The car does not perform well in medium/lower downforce trims and tire wear isn't as good as some of the midfield teams let alone the top teams. The car is not as drivable as its rivals. This is exactly why Seidl was talking about minor conceptual changes. Excited to see what James Key comes up with next season.

#5533 darenp

darenp
  • Member

  • 111 posts
  • Joined: August 15

Posted 20 November 2019 - 15:05

but he frittered it away with two seasons of pathetic underperformance, with, as Dicon so rightly said, not one single memorable moment.  Not one. 

 

 

 

Not true, his first race where he filled in for Alonso & his last race were decent drives, unfortunately everything else in between wasn't  :rotfl:


Edited by darenp, 20 November 2019 - 15:05.


#5534 BRG

BRG
  • Member

  • 17,161 posts
  • Joined: September 99

Posted 20 November 2019 - 16:49

Not true, his first race where he filled in for Alonso & his last race were decent drives, unfortunately everything else in between wasn't  :rotfl:

They might have been decent drives but they certainly WEREN'T memorable.  Except for their averageness.



#5535 argiriano

argiriano
  • Member

  • 1,649 posts
  • Joined: January 06

Posted 22 November 2019 - 05:02

The greatest things about this season were:
McLaren general steady improvement.
Carlos blossoming into a great allround racing driver.
Lando's maturity for a rookie.

No one dare to predict that at the begining of the season but half way trough it most of the F1 recognized these.

Well done to everyone in the team!!!

#5536 keshav

keshav
  • Member

  • 1,415 posts
  • Joined: November 14

Posted 22 November 2019 - 07:28

What does Carlos Sainz have to do to get that 6th position?

 

With Gasly and Albon?



#5537 sanchez854

sanchez854
  • Member

  • 96 posts
  • Joined: February 12

Posted 22 November 2019 - 08:33

What does Carlos Sainz have to do to get that 6th position?

 

With Gasly and Albon?

 For Gasly he just has to finish ahead of him.

 

For Albon, Carlos is 11 points ahead so i think it has to be something like these; 

 

 - If Albon wins, Carlos has to finish at least 3rd

 - If Albon comes 2nd, Carlos has to finish at least 6th

 - If Albon comes 3rd and Carlos finishes 8th, they will be both 99 and i am not sure who will be ahead if they have same amount of points.

 - If Albon comes 4th and Carlos finishes 10th, they will be both 96. Tie again

 - If Albon finishes 5th or below Carlos gonna end up ahead of him even without points.

 

* We also have to note that Albon is driving a RedBull so he may also try and get the Fastest lap which means +1 point for him.

 

If i made any mistake feel free to correct it :clap:



#5538 Miles749

Miles749
  • New Member

  • 11 posts
  • Joined: August 19

Posted 22 November 2019 - 09:37

In case of tie, I believe that the "best result" is a tie breaker. In your Albon 3rd and Carlos 8th, they would both have one third place finish, not sure who is better in 4th/5th place finishes (probably Albon).

 

If Albon finishes 4th and Carlos 10th (tied at 96) in that case Carlos has a third place finish and is tie breaked ahead of Albon.

 

This is why Gasly is ahead of Carlos now even though they are tied, Gasly has a 2nd place finish.

 

After all, I wouldn't get too excited about finishing 6th, it happened only because Gasly was swapped and is not a true indicator. Doesn't really mean much.



#5539 bogi

bogi
  • Member

  • 3,961 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 22 November 2019 - 10:05

The greatest things about this season were:
McLaren general steady improvement.
Carlos blossoming into a great allround racing driver.
Lando's maturity for a rookie.

No one dare to predict that at the begining of the season but half way trough it most of the F1 recognized these.

Well done to everyone in the team!!!

 

 

Lets hear visionary genius Scott Mitchell again :lol:

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=lsCC3FGVTBc


Edited by bogi, 22 November 2019 - 10:05.


Advertisement

#5540 BertoC

BertoC
  • Member

  • 632 posts
  • Joined: August 17

Posted 22 November 2019 - 10:24

 

After all, I wouldn't get too excited about finishing 6th, it happened only because Gasly was swapped and is not a true indicator. Doesn't really mean much.

 

To be fair, Carlos was only 5 points behind Gasly after 12 rounds, and he managed to finish in front of him in true pace several times. Gasly was was massivly underperforming in that RB. Still, after the summer break Carlos lost a lot of easy points, so Gasly would have probably still finish ahead of him.



#5541 Nobody

Nobody
  • Member

  • 2,048 posts
  • Joined: January 07

Posted 22 November 2019 - 12:34

Lets hear visionary genius Scott Mitchell again :lol:

https://www.youtube....h?v=lsCC3FGVTBc

Lol

weirdly if you swap everytime either of them says McLaren for Williams and vice versa, their predictions are close to right.

Edited by Nobody, 22 November 2019 - 12:35.


#5542 MirNyet

MirNyet
  • Member

  • 2,384 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 22 November 2019 - 14:10

Lets hear visionary genius Scott Mitchell again :lol:

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=lsCC3FGVTBc

 

In some ways, I'm a touch surprised they've left this video up - it's embarrassing.  These two simply don't understand the technical aspects of the sport, and are purely driven by what they see on track.  While I may not always agree with actual journalists such as Mark Hughes, you never doubt he doesn't know, and have a deep understanding of the sport as a whole.  These two by comparison are simply clueless noise machines - and smug with it.  You've only got to look at how the pair span their testing conclusions with regard to McLaren to lose what little respect they may have initially deserved.   

It's also something of a surprise that the narrative of the 2015-2017 cars being bad is still a thing, rather than 2018 being a transitional year where they were rushed into mistakes due to management decisions, an organization as large and complex as the McLaren racing team couldn't turn around that degree of rot in such a short time if the 2015-2017 narrative was accurate.


Edited by MirNyet, 22 November 2019 - 14:11.


#5543 Owen

Owen
  • Member

  • 12,964 posts
  • Joined: September 06

Posted 28 November 2019 - 09:57

Alright. Last race. Preview time: https://www.mclaren....abi-gp-preview/



#5544 chhatra

chhatra
  • Member

  • 2,085 posts
  • Joined: November 08

Posted 28 November 2019 - 17:39

Here's to the 34 going out on a high. Would love another double points finish to end the season, maybe with Lando ahead just to give him a lift after his recent struggles.

#5545 SarbaV

SarbaV
  • Member

  • 311 posts
  • Joined: October 16

Posted 29 November 2019 - 06:02

McLaren got a war to finish this race. Hope nothing goes wrong.

#5546 SarbaV

SarbaV
  • Member

  • 311 posts
  • Joined: October 16

Posted 29 November 2019 - 06:07

This is the race where sainz can prove he ain't a midfield talent and that he has improved himself as a top tier driver. All the best for the team to achieve best of the rest driver!

#5547 keshav

keshav
  • Member

  • 1,415 posts
  • Joined: November 14

Posted 29 November 2019 - 07:02

Its good to have something to play for in the last race.

All power to Sainz. Gasly races well and always finds himself in the points. Should be a good straight battle.

Will have to trust all the front runners to perform better than Albon.

It will be a good fun finish!

#5548 SparkPlug86

SparkPlug86
  • Member

  • 262 posts
  • Joined: March 18

Posted 29 November 2019 - 08:33

This is where both cars go out on the first corner...  :rotfl:

 

However, hopefully a double points finish is on the cards. I'd like to see Norris actually finish a head of Sainz, just to give him a 'boost' before the Winter... poor sod looked like he was about to cry after Brazil.  :cry:



#5549 Owen

Owen
  • Member

  • 12,964 posts
  • Joined: September 06

Posted 29 November 2019 - 22:28

Free practice report;
https://www.mclaren....-free-practice/

#5550 chhatra

chhatra
  • Member

  • 2,085 posts
  • Joined: November 08

Posted 30 November 2019 - 07:14

Maybe it's just me but I feel like McLaren are beginning to sandbag a little on Fridays. Not going all out to get the best time and then nailing it when it counts.