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Haas F1 2019: The Grosjean and Magnussen Never Ending Tour, and other stories from Kannapolis/Banbury


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#851 Nathan

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Posted 07 September 2019 - 23:54

And they ****ing hate each other. It would be an interesting match.

 

 

This is overplayed now.  It's been 2 years now since there has been animosity displayed, and it wasn't even anything major.  When was the last time one slagged the other?



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#852 KWSN - DSM

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Posted 08 September 2019 - 00:12

This is overplayed now.  It's been 2 years now since there has been animosity displayed, and it wasn't even anything major.  When was the last time one slagged the other?

 

This board if nothing else escalate the media driven drivel to even higher levels.

 

:cool:



#853 Mian30

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Posted 08 September 2019 - 19:32

Well, a race win to Grosjean..



#854 motohead

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 08:29

Well, a race win to Grosjean..


Yes indeed. But really a defeat for the whole team although with a bit more luck Magnussen could have stayed in the points. The race pace of the car didn't seem as terrible as the last many races, which I guess is the only positive from the race.

#855 Galoredk

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:56

Yes indeed. But really a defeat for the whole team although with a bit more luck Magnussen could have stayed in the points. The race pace of the car didn't seem as terrible as the last many races, which I guess is the only positive from the race.


A race win where your team m8 DNFs way ahead of you isn’t much of a win, is it?

#856 JacobRPP

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 13:31

Statement from Haas F1:

"Haas F1 Team and Rich Energy have amicably agreed to end their partnership together in the FIA Formula One World Championship with immediate effect. While enjoying substantial brand recognition and significant exposure through its title partnership of Haas F1 Team in 2019, a corporate restructuring process at Rich Energy will see the need for a revised global strategy. Subsequently, Haas F1 Team and Rich Energy concluded a termination of the existing partnership was the best way forward for both parties. Haas F1 Team would like to express its thanks and best wishes to the stakeholders at Rich Energy."

 

https://www.haasf1te...ent-rich-energy

 

Back to the fast livery and the points eating ways :p.



#857 motohead

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 13:59

A race win where your team m8 DNFs way ahead of you isn’t much of a win, is it?


No I agree Magnussen was much better, so no it wasn't much of a win for Grosjean.

#858 speedx

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Posted 10 September 2019 - 09:47

Next year Pirelli will bring different tires with bigger temp window. Possible that this problems will magicaly disappear.

#859 whitewaterMkII

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Posted 11 September 2019 - 15:57

So now the Haas dropped Rich Energy, is the paint shop working double shifts on new livery?



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#860 Widefoot2

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Posted 11 September 2019 - 16:04

So now the Haas dropped Rich Energy, is the paint shop working double shifts on new livery?

Same livery, no Whyte Bikes, sorry, Rich Energy logos.



#861 BlindZenDriver

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Posted 11 September 2019 - 16:14

Same livery, no Whyte Bikes, sorry, Rich Energy logos.

 

They should ask Whyte Bikes if they'd like their name and logo on the cars for a while, not for money just to stick it to Rich Energy for being a mess to deal with :p

 

Plus if I recall correctly then Whyte bikes launched originally with a mountain bike that had some special suspension setup, maybe the could help Haas find some speed and consistency.

 

All kidding aside. The situation sucks for Haas, my guess they are paid till the end of the season by Rich Energy only with them being less than stellar this year, then it seems finding a new main sponsor that is willing to bring real money must be difficult - best hope is KMags sponsor steps up and becomes that main sponsor.



#862 Peat

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Posted 12 September 2019 - 08:30

I have truly had enough of Grosjean. 

Saw some of the onboards/team radio from Monza and yet again the whole world is against him. 

He got lightly tagged at T1, claims he was lifted up in the air with a big hit and there was nothing he could do other than take the escape road and rejoin last. There soundeth a man who knows the Hulk is sniffing around his seat. 



#863 messy

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Posted 12 September 2019 - 09:04

It was probably time for Grosjean to go at the end of 2018 tbh so it's definitely high time now. 



#864 motohead

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 10:22

I also think it is time for Grosjean to go. Also just for Haas to have a reference on the car and what it can achieve with another driver. Imagine that say Hulkenburg comes in and smashes it or that he comes in and is destroyed by Magnussen. This would be a very good reference for how to continue moving forward for 2021. Keeping both Magnussen and Grosjean doesn't do that.

#865 BlindZenDriver

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 10:35

I also think it is time for Grosjean to go. Also just for Haas to have a reference on the car and what it can achieve with another driver. Imagine that say Hulkenburg comes in and smashes it or that he comes in and is destroyed by Magnussen. This would be a very good reference for how to continue moving forward for 2021. Keeping both Magnussen and Grosjean doesn't do that.

 

Totally agree. As a Magnussen fan I would also really like for him to have the benefit of Hulkenberg as a yardstick as I feel Grosjean has never, fair or unfair, never had the same respect in the F1 world as Hulkenberg. If Magnussen is ever to get a shot at one of the top teams he needs a well respected teammate for comparison.

I do expect Magnussen to be faster than Hulkenberg. Also a little funny Magnussen got on the podium in his first race, in fact he is still the last McLaren driver to reach the podium while Hulkenberg has the record for most Grand Prixs without a podium position.



#866 motohead

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 10:52

Totally agree. As a Magnussen fan I would also really like for him to have the benefit of Hulkenberg as a yardstick as I feel Grosjean has never, fair or unfair, never had the same respect in the F1 world as Hulkenberg. If Magnussen is ever to get a shot at one of the top teams he needs a well respected teammate for comparison.
I do expect Magnussen to be faster than Hulkenberg. Also a little funny Magnussen got on the podium in his first race, in fact he is still the last McLaren driver to reach the podium while Hulkenberg has the record for most Grand Prixs without a podium position.

Yeah it is a bit difficult for Magnussen to really show himself off atm. Even though he is out-driving, out-scoring and out-qualifying Grosjean now, people keep on saying that it is because Grosjean is on a downward sloping trajectory. Whilst Gro does make mistakes, I still think he is extremely fast and Magnussen is not getting the credit he deserves for beating him convincingly for the 2nd season in a row now. He would hlget that credit if he beat Hulkenburg convincingly as well. So very much agree.

Edited by motohead, 14 September 2019 - 10:54.


#867 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 10:57

Since when is Magnussen convincingly beating Grosjean? Points don’t tell the whole story. In my book Magnussen is only marginally beating Grosjean really. He’s not signifcantly faster.

Edited by DutchQuicksilver, 14 September 2019 - 11:00.


#868 BlindZenDriver

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 11:24

Since when is Magnussen convincingly beating Grosjean? Points don’t tell the whole story. In my book Magnussen is only marginally beating Grosjean really. He’s not signifcantly faster.

 

Really. By what metric is Magnussen not beating Grosjean?

 

As I see it Magnussen has him beat on everything, except if you call crashing and destroying the most gear a success since there Grosjean has done a lot more - even going as far as crashing in the pit lane and also doing so behind the safetycar

And btw. points while not everything they are damn important. There its currently 18 to 8 in Magnussens favor and last year it was 56 to 37 also in Magnussens favor, meaning he finished 9th in the championship five places ahead of Grosjean.


Edited by BlindZenDriver, 14 September 2019 - 11:26.


#869 motohead

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 11:25

Since when is Magnussen convincingly beating Grosjean? Points don’t tell the whole story. In my book Magnussen is only marginally beating Grosjean really. He’s not signifcantly faster.

 

Points last season very convincing. Points this season very convincing. Qualification this season 9-5 so far...



#870 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 12:31

Where in my post am I saying he isn’t beating Grosjean? I’m saying the difference between them is small and points don’t tell the whole story.

Verstappen was beating Gasly convincingly. Russell is beating Kubica convincingly.

#871 BlindZenDriver

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 14:23

Where in my post am I saying he isn’t beating Grosjean? I’m saying the difference between them is small and points don’t tell the whole story.

Verstappen was beating Gasly convincingly. Russell is beating Kubica convincingly.

 

Now you're just playing games and deflecting, but then let me spell it out for you. Where is Magnussen not beating Grosjean convincingly?



#872 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 14:27

Now you're just playing games and deflecting, but then let me spell it out for you. Where is Magnussen not beating Grosjean convincingly?

Just look up recent qualifying sessions. The difference between them is usually not more than a tenth or two. Sometimes in favour of Magnussen, and sometimes in favour of Grosjean.

#873 BlindZenDriver

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 14:49

Just look up recent qualifying sessions. The difference between them is usually not more than a tenth or two. Sometimes in favour of Magnussen, and sometimes in favour of Grosjean.

 

Magnussen is leading qualifying 9-5 so far this year, that is almost 2/3 of the Saturdays - how is that not convincing.

Being ahead is what matters, by how much is uninteresting unless it was 7-7 or we were only a couple or races in and the score was 2-1 or something - then it would make sense to look at the times behind the score.



#874 Lights

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 15:39

It was probably time for Grosjean to go at the end of 2018 tbh so it's definitely high time now. 

 

If there was a perfect moment to sack Grosjean, it should've been summer 2018. He was just driving terribly until then.

 

Instead they decided to extend his contract for 2019, which I found rather odd. Continuity or whatever.

 

Then Grosjean improved a bit though and he ended 2018 on a higher note than Magnussen.

 

Now again Magnussen is in front but I agree with DutchQuicksilver that the gap between them isn't so huge. It's not nearly as bad as Gasly or Kubica, or even Stroll or Gioviniazzi.

 

Grosjean isn't really Haas's biggest problem at the moment. Right now they should focus on building a car their drivers can race with.



#875 Claudius

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 22:54

I shudder to think what Kev will do if he gets a top seat.

The "defensive" driving against Max or Charles will ignite fireworks.



#876 messy

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Posted 14 September 2019 - 23:09

Points last season very convincing. Points this season very convincing. Qualification this season 9-5 so far...

I think Magnussen has “beaten” Grosjean pretty nicely over the past two years, but this is the first year where he’s genuinely been the faster of the two.

For me, and I’ve said this before, watching Grosjean in 2019 is like watching the final F1 days of Jarno Trulli or Giancarlo Fisichella. He’s still got pace on occasion but is generally just plodding on really, isn’t he. With Ocon coming back in meaning one of the current grid has to drop out, he’s the obvious candidate for me. No room for sentimentality when your best days were almost six years ago.

Edited by messy, 14 September 2019 - 23:10.


#877 motohead

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Posted 15 September 2019 - 21:05

Where in my post am I saying he isn’t beating Grosjean? I’m saying the difference between them is small and points don’t tell the whole story.

Verstappen was beating Gasly convincingly. Russell is beating Kubica convincingly.

 

Now you're merely talking degrees of beating someone. Honestly, a bit of a waste of time trying to quantify convincingly and discussing the definition. As mentioned, points last season massively in favour of Magnussen. Points this season massively in favour of Magnussen. Qualification this season 9-5 so far... Call that what you want..



#878 Rodaknee

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 09:54

Haas, sans the RE adverts. https://formulaspy.c...rgy-split-64496

#879 SonGoku

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 10:15

You could argue Grosjean is lucky to have a F1 seat this season. Better drivers are off to FE now because there is no room for them.

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#880 Rodaknee

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 10:20

You could argue Grosjean is lucky to have a F1 seat this season. Better drivers are off to FE now because there is no room for them.

 

I reckon it's his cooking keeping him in F1.  There's sod all else that he's good at.



#881 Galoredk

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 10:53

I love how people downplay Kevin beating Grosjean over the last two seasons, saying Grosjean is spiraling downwards. Did anyone stop to think if Grisjean is spiraling downwards, because Kmag makes him look worse that what he is. Beating Grosjean in Quali is what everyone wanted him to do last year, and he is doing it. Honestly I think Kmag is much better than what he gets credit for. Has hardly set a foot wrong in a **** car this season and even put in some stunning performances.

Beating Grosjean, a multiple podium driver, and beating him convincingly should be proof, that in the right car he could win. So now we want to measure him against Hulkenberh. If he wins, he will be beating a guy spiraling down and if he loses, it will all be proof of his lack of top team potential.

I’m not saying Kmag is Hamilton. I am saying the guy does what he can under pretty crappy conditions. I’m sure the top teams see that too.

#882 whitewaterMkII

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Posted 16 September 2019 - 18:30

Now you're merely talking degrees of beating someone. Honestly, a bit of a waste of time trying to quantify convincingly and discussing the definition. As mentioned, points last season massively in favour of Magnussen. Points this season massively in favour of Magnussen. Qualification this season 9-5 so far... Call that what you want..

There is a new semi-interview up on Autosport, where when asked about Grosjean, Gunther says it's past worrying about. One day he gets a lap from Roman and says My god, where did that come from, next time out of the pits he's in the armco so he doesn't even worry about anymore and just deals with Grosjean day to day. When that's what the TM says about you, you best be calling Williams to see about whether Kubica is staying or not...



#883 search

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Posted Yesterday, 06:55

I’m not saying Kmag is Hamilton. I am saying the guy does what he can under pretty crappy conditions. I’m sure the top teams see that too.

 

Magnussen is doing better than Grosjean when the car is poor indeed, but question is, how much the drivers are part of this lack of performance. Generally I'd tend to say both drivers struggle to (understand and) develop the car and set it up properly. In that regard, there's no progress at all over the year - and the top teams see that too.



#884 KongKurs

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Posted Yesterday, 08:55

Will this affect Haas F1's performance in 2020? https://www.motorspo...4542838/?nrt=54



#885 JacobRPP

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Posted Yesterday, 10:26

Will this affect Haas F1's performance in 2020? https://www.motorspo...4542838/?nrt=54

 

I was going to say, that will most certainly help Haas over the next couple of years. They need a bit of good news.



#886 Mark521

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Posted Yesterday, 12:54

I was going to say, that will most certainly help Haas over the next couple of years. They need a bit of good news.

 

I thought Dallara was just manufacturing the tubs for Haas so while this development couldn't hurt I'm not sure it will make much of a difference (maybe in 2021?).



#887 JacobRPP

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Posted Yesterday, 13:10

I thought Dallara was just manufacturing the tubs for Haas so while this development couldn't hurt I'm not sure it will make much of a difference (maybe in 2021?).

 

Yes, it is a long term development of Dallara, maybe they will even field a set of cars. That would be interesting.



#888 MikeTekRacing

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Posted Yesterday, 21:09

with the car moving in and out of the operating window by several seconds in the same race, I am not sure how anybody can make any claim on one driver being faster than another one. Haas need to figure out the car. One driver being faster 0.1 than the other means 0 if they start lapping 2 sec off their pace due to car being crap at some point in the race. They are nowhere. 

I like Gunther a lot, he seems an outspoken guy but he needs to get that team in shape, fast. No other team has the same level of tyre struggles. And this is not race 2 of the season



#889 KWSN - DSM

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Posted Yesterday, 23:12

with the car moving in and out of the operating window by several seconds in the same race, I am not sure how anybody can make any claim on one driver being faster than another one. Haas need to figure out the car. One driver being faster 0.1 than the other means 0 if they start lapping 2 sec off their pace due to car being crap at some point in the race. They are nowhere. 

I like Gunther a lot, he seems an outspoken guy but he needs to get that team in shape, fast. No other team has the same level of tyre struggles. And this is not race 2 of the season

 

Fairly even in fastest lap in race, Grosjean does have more though, only counting laps where both of them in the race.

                Grosjean         Magnussen
Australia					9								20
Bahrain           9								 7
China            35               20
Baku             14               24
Spain            40		  26
Monaco           43               34
Canada           56               12
France           28      	  16
Austria          23               47
Britain           4                2
Germany		 36               28
Hungary          21               28
Belgium		 21    		  21
Italy            13               30

Total		352              315

:cool:



#890 outofspace

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Posted Today, 07:09

No changes for 2020  :p 
Grosjean and Magnussen then.



#891 balage06

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Posted Today, 07:14

I thought Dallara was just manufacturing the tubs for Haas so while this development couldn't hurt I'm not sure it will make much of a difference (maybe in 2021?).

 

I once checked the "Haas development office" and their address is inside the Dallara headquarters. Full of former Ferrari employees.



#892 theflyingwheel

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Posted Today, 07:16

Haas confirms Romain Grosjean and Kevin Magnussen for their 2020 season.

http://bit.ly/2kTR0Rp

Edited by theflyingwheel, Today, 07:16.


#893 Gary Davies

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Posted Today, 07:28

Good news. Let’s hope the car’s better next year.

#894 JacobRPP

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Posted Today, 07:29

Wow

#895 Nemo1965

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Posted Today, 07:35

This is overplayed now.  It's been 2 years now since there has been animosity displayed, and it wasn't even anything major.  When was the last time one slagged the other?

 

Yeah, I am slowly beginning to believe that the team itself overplays it... I mean: Steiner is called 'The Star' of the Netflix thing about F1. The team itself is almost the token small team of F1. Are those incidents between Grosjean and Magnussen perhaps more acting than real rows? Have the social media-experts of the team advised to not mince words on the radio-transmissions... because they KNOW this will get them more attention?

 

That Haas has resigned both drivers puts a lot of the radio-outbursts (and also Steiner publicly telling his drivers off) in a different perspective.



#896 messy

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Posted Today, 07:42

AAAAAAGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH



#897 Rodaknee

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Posted Today, 07:50

Team Laughing Stock

#898 Baddoer

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Posted Today, 08:00

The shattered carbon fibre



#899 Maxioos

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Posted Today, 08:06

What a joke this team is becoming. What did bring his experience the past 2 years? No doubt, something, but for me long not enough to justify new contract with all the mistakes and lack of impressive drives.



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#900 jules153

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Posted Today, 08:06

IMO a mistake