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Racing Point 2019: Stroll, Stroll and Perez


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#51 midgrid

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Posted 04 April 2019 - 13:36

My understanding is that the team has already outgrown its facilities, and needs a new factory regardless of the budget cap being introduced.



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#52 Clatter

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Posted 04 April 2019 - 15:21

The article says expanding the workforce. Whats the expected workforce number with the cap?

#53 midgrid

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Posted 04 April 2019 - 15:54

Looking at Dieter Rencken's news and figures, it seems likely that the 2021 budget cap will be between $200-250 million, and Force India's budget for 2018 was $120 million, so plenty of room for expansion within this limit.



#54 Clatter

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Posted 04 April 2019 - 16:37

Looking at Dieter Rencken's news and figures, it seems likely that the 2021 budget cap will be between $200-250 million, and Force India's budget for 2018 was $120 million, so plenty of room for expansion within this limit.

But of a mockery really. Think the FIA should be looking at what the lower teams have been running on and setting the cap nearer to that, not 100m above which won't really help things.

#55 P123

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Posted 04 April 2019 - 16:45

But of a mockery really. Think the FIA should be looking at what the lower teams have been running on and setting the cap nearer to that, not 100m above which won't really help things.


Not if it comes hand in hand with a proper distribution of prize money, and an end to the bungs paid to the top four (including McLaren in that), especially Ferrari.

Force India seem to be upping their budget already.

#56 Kalmake

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Posted 05 April 2019 - 07:43

If we consider them the 5th best team last season, every team ahead had more staff. Renault the least with six hundred.

 

Williams had six hundred with $150M budget. I doubt the 2021 caps will force anyone to go lower than that.



#57 Paco

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Posted 05 April 2019 - 14:54

But of a mockery really. Think the FIA should be looking at what the lower teams have been running on and setting the cap nearer to that, not 100m above which won't really help things.

 

So MGP and Ferrari get to be in F1 for free...



#58 Paco

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Posted 05 April 2019 - 14:57

100m is pretty small considering they have to travel the world for what is going to be even more races.  Just that budget alone is huge.  Add in cost of engines and tires.  Leaves not a whole lot for manufacturing, R&D and design.  100m seems like a lot but in F1 its not very realistic.



#59 Paco

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Posted 05 April 2019 - 16:08

A new facility is fine - actually shows a bit of a commitment to F1.  Plus, their presser seemed to indicate the staff scattered all about due to space so probably good if they have the money and it's a tiny amount 25m... so a 1/4 to 1/6th of a team budget of mid-grid.  Seems a very very wise decision.  Hopefully it means they will invest in some new tech as well



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#60 Sterzo

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Posted 05 April 2019 - 18:09

But of a mockery really. Think the FIA should be looking at what the lower teams have been running on and setting the cap nearer to that, not 100m above which won't really help things.

It's unlikely to be a once-and-for-all change, isn't it? First step is to introduce a budget cap, at a level they can get accepted, then in the future they can tighten the purse strings.



#61 Wingcommander

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Posted 06 April 2019 - 07:44

Perez had a point in that with Hulkenberg he tended to do better in the races than Nico. It was in the days of the more fragile Pirellis, which suited Sergio quite a lot better than Nico. Hulk tended to qualify better, but in the races he just couldn't keep the tyres alive the same way that Checo could. With Ocon I didn't notice the same kind of pattern.



#62 Paco

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Posted 13 April 2019 - 22:46

This why team owners hiring their son is such a mess.. 

 

Man Perez lusting over Stroll Jr. is just so pie in your face gross.. thought the guy had more in him then to be this weak...

 

We will see in time but man alive, the guy had a hard time with Ocon and suggesting Stroll is on Ocon's level after 1 GP which didn't show that wow..  :wave:  :wave:

 

Always Liked FI.. RP is a different team and not looking like it will have the FI spirit.  Probably stop paying attention to them very soon..

 

Wonder if Perez still feels the same :rotfl:So Stroll slower qualifer then Perez who was slower then Ocon by a huge maring in 2018 ..

 

Way to go Stroll Sr..talk about setting your team back significantly.

 

Page 3 no less.. from a very liked team and well respected group that Vijay assembled to this.. wonder if Stroll Sr. will ever make the tough call and put another driver in that seat if his son keeps lacking performance.  Kid needed soo much extra work at Williams with older chassis runs and still with all that privledge can't keep up with Perez who had tonnes of struggles keeping with Ocon on Saturdays.  Thereby, making Sunday results soo much harder.  Hard to watch.   My 3yr old daughther who loves "the pink ones" even said "papa, why dont I see the pink cars too much and walked out of room"... she pretty much mic dropped me..


Edited by Paco, 13 April 2019 - 22:48.


#63 Lights

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 17:48

Stroll hasn't shown much anymore after his decent albeit rather fortuitous race in Melbourne.

 

Perez has clearly been the stronger driver since then. And to be honest I expect a lot of the same the rest of the season.



#64 coppilcus

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 18:06

Why people have so much trouble in reading an article and just keep jumping at the first clickbate they see?!

Edited by coppilcus, 15 April 2019 - 08:51.


#65 coppilcus

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 18:08

I know that this is regular stuff from this team throughout the years, accentuated this season thanks to the economic issues from last year, but oh boy: Can’t the 2019 car come much faster?!

Edited by coppilcus, 14 April 2019 - 21:35.


#66 Berner

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 18:15

When does Papa Stroll cut his underperforming son and hire any of the drivers sacked over the past two seasons? Lance is useless. Full stop.



#67 jannyg

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 18:34

Useless is a bit strong. He needs to improve his one lap pace which leaves him with too much to do on Sundays

His race pace looks okay

Stroll is against an underrated Perez who has been with the team for a number of years. You'd expect Perez to win over the season, Stroll will have his moments when he can get out of Q1

The performances of Gasly/Giovinazzi are more alarming imo

#68 Celloman

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 18:43

Wonder if Perez still feels the same :rotfl:So Stroll slower qualifer then Perez who was slower then Ocon by a huge maring in 2018 ..

 

Way to go Stroll Sr..talk about setting your team back significantly.

 

Page 3 no less.. from a very liked team and well respected group that Vijay assembled to this.. wonder if Stroll Sr. will ever make the tough call and put another driver in that seat if his son keeps lacking performance.  Kid needed soo much extra work at Williams with older chassis runs and still with all that privledge can't keep up with Perez who had tonnes of struggles keeping with Ocon on Saturdays.  Thereby, making Sunday results soo much harder.  Hard to watch.   My 3yr old daughther who loves "the pink ones" even said "papa, why dont I see the pink cars too much and walked out of room"... she pretty much mic dropped me..

Perez is generally speaking underrated. Yes Ocon beat him in quali battle last year, but the average gap was still only something like 1 tenth between them. Stroll is more or less exactly where I expected him to be, 2-3 tenths off Perez in quali. It's not a good result by any means, but Perez showed against Hulkenberg that he belongs to the upper level of F1 drivers, while Stroll was always in the bottom category.



#69 TomNokoe

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 18:49

Perez working wonders :up:

#70 coppilcus

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 21:39

Useless is a bit strong. He needs to improve his one lap pace which leaves him with too much to do on Sundays
His race pace looks okay
Stroll is against an underrated Perez who has been with the team for a number of years. You'd expect Perez to win over the season, Stroll will have his moments when he can get out of Q1
The performances of Gasly/Giovinazzi are more alarming imo


Indeed...

Gasly is taking the heat, not Giovanazzi, which is understandable: the performance from the former is just underwhelming...

#71 Paco

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 22:04

Useless is a bit strong. He needs to improve his one lap pace which leaves him with too much to do on Sundays

His race pace looks okay

Stroll is against an underrated Perez who has been with the team for a number of years. You'd expect Perez to win over the season, Stroll will have his moments when he can get out of Q1

The performances of Gasly/Giovinazzi are more alarming imo

 

Perez was never unrated until Ocon trounced him last season handily in qualifying.  He's still very much a good racer just not a tier 1 guy.



#72 Paco

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 22:06

Perez is generally speaking underrated. Yes Ocon beat him in quali battle last year, but the average gap was still only something like 1 tenth between them. Stroll is more or less exactly where I expected him to be, 2-3 tenths off Perez in quali. It's not a good result by any means, but Perez showed against Hulkenberg that he belongs to the upper level of F1 drivers, while Stroll was always in the bottom category.

 

Yes, but doesn't change the fact he couldn't get the most out of the car unlike Ocon, even 1/10th...   Considering how much tighter this year.. that makes all the difference to be honest, let alone 2-4ths that Stroll is leaving behind.. So the net result is actually Stroll dropping 0.4+ ths to what Ocon could be delivery on.  Imagine how much higher up the grid and points would be in the bag just after 3 races with all that lost performance.



#73 coppilcus

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 08:56

Yes, but doesn't change the fact he couldn't get the most out of the car unlike Ocon, even 1/10th... Considering how much tighter this year.. that makes all the difference to be honest, let alone 2-4ths that Stroll is leaving behind.. So the net result is actually Stroll dropping 0.4+ ths to what Ocon could be delivery on. Imagine how much higher up the grid and points would be in the bag just after 3 races with all that lost performance.


Qualifying does not equate instantly in a better position on Sundays, and Ocon is exactly the proof of that. He “destroyed” Perez in qualifying and yet he managed to score less points than the Mexican and ended four positions down the ladder at the end of the championship.

Edited by coppilcus, 18 April 2019 - 13:29.


#74 Paco

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Posted 26 April 2019 - 14:25

Stroll Jr. being his usual self :drunk:   Stroll Sr. (cough cough owner) must be so proud :rotfl:-- rather then getting a talking too, kid gets a hug from his boss :kiss: ..


Edited by Paco, 26 April 2019 - 14:26.


#75 BRG

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Posted 26 April 2019 - 17:04

Stroll Jr. being his usual self :drunk:   Stroll Sr. (cough cough owner) must be so proud :rotfl:-- rather then getting a talking too, kid gets a hug from his boss :kiss: ..

It's disgraceful!  I've NEVER seen a Formula One driver crash his car in free practice before.



#76 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 26 April 2019 - 17:11

I don't think Lance is that bad. Sure, he's not Verstappen, but I've seen worse performance from a lot of younger drivers that were supposed to be "the next best thing".

 

Yeah, his dad is paying a lot for the team, that means we get to see one team, a decent driver and we're still left with a racing seat. Perez is strong and not an easy to push around



#77 theflyingwheel

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 15:10

Amazing Q for Perez P5 ! He always does great in Baku.

Stroll, what is it ? The 8th time in a row he can’t pass Q1 ? Gez...

#78 Viryfan

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 15:14

Well well
Perez being always right there.

Stroll jr really starting to hinder the team chances by just being not quick enough.

#79 DeKnyff

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 15:49

I don't think Lance is that bad. Sure, he's not Verstappen, but I've seen worse performance from a lot of younger drivers that were supposed to be "the next best thing".

 

Yeah, his dad is paying a lot for the team, that means we get to see one team, a decent driver and we're still left with a racing seat. Perez is strong and not an easy to push around

He was annihilated by Felipe Massa in his first year. He seemed to improve a bit by the end of the season, but when Felipe found true motivation (this is, his home race and his farewell race) he was again left in the dust. The second year, he was barely better than rookie paydriver Sirotkin, if at all and looking slower by the end of the season. And this year (already his third year in F1!), he has never passed Q1, when his team mate has comfortably put the car twice in Q2 and twice in Q3. Also, he has been involved in countless crashes in practice and race incidents. And that, despite daddy being the owner or main financial backer of the teams he has driven for, which means it's sure as hell he has always got absolutely top attention from the team.

 

Sorry, but I don't see the need to soften the reality: Stroll is below par material, he reminds me of the hopeless paydrivers of the seventies, like Rikky von Opel, Ricardo Zunino or Héctor Rebaque. Formula 1 is a way more professional word today and even paydrivers have a minimum of quality, like Maldonado, Petrov or Ericsson.



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#80 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 17:01

I liked the battle between Perez and Ocon a lot more. Perez vs Stroll isn’t a battle. I know his dad is the boss, but surely he’ll want to finish fourth in the championship and therefore earn more money right?

Perhaps it’s better for Lance to become a third driver for a year or two and get Ocon back in that car.

#81 screamingV16

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 17:53

2018 - Stroll after 4 races

Qual - 14-20-18-11

Race - 14-14-14-8

 

2019 - Stroll after 4 races

Qual - 16-18-16-16

Race - 9-14-12-?

 

Stroll isn't really doing much better than last year. Makes you wonder how bad last years Williams really was/wasn't?


Edited by screamingV16, 27 April 2019 - 18:26.


#82 ARTGP

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 18:21

Wow seems like Perez has access to a different racing line than all the others. Impressive! Within 1 second of the mighty Mercedes.



#83 sopa

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 18:25

How many times does one expect Stroll to outqualify Perez this season? Maybe if we have a wet qualifying somewhere...



#84 Honor

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 18:34

Perez is a top driver in my opinion, this season will be very delightful for him with no real competition from a teammate. I really don't think Stroll will stay in F1 for very long if he gets beaten in the same fashion as Vandoorne got against Alonso last season, I mean Stroll jr can't feel good about himself if that would of happend.



#85 Pete_f1

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 19:05

Perez handed Stroll's ass on a plate in qualifying. Wonder what dad thinks?

#86 Collective

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Posted 28 April 2019 - 14:13

Great drives from both drivers today. With those starts, Stroll could do wonders if he sorted out his Saturdays.

 

BTW, anyone noticed how Checo passed Verstappen on turn 2 without diving for the apex? Now compare that to what Ocon did vs Raikkonen in exactly the same situation last year... It's the kind of crap that translates to championship points and WDC position. I know people love to pretend that the WDC position doesn't matter, but just leaving it out there.


Edited by Collective, 28 April 2019 - 14:14.


#87 sniper80

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Posted 28 April 2019 - 16:06

This ex-Jordan team just keeps on impressing me. I wonder what they will have in Spa again this year.



#88 warp

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Posted 28 April 2019 - 22:41

Great drives from both drivers today. With those starts, Stroll could do wonders if he sorted out his Saturdays.

 

BTW, anyone noticed how Checo passed Verstappen on turn 2 without diving for the apex? Now compare that to what Ocon did vs Raikkonen in exactly the same situation last year... It's the kind of crap that translates to championship points and WDC position. I know people love to pretend that the WDC position doesn't matter, but just leaving it out there.

 

I loved that little battle. Sure, there was little chance Sergio could keep the Red Bull behind but he did while he could.

 

OTOH... I think Checo benefits more from a stronger team mate.  I hope Stroll picks up over the season.



#89 HeadFirst

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Posted 29 April 2019 - 03:49

I loved that little battle. Sure, there was little chance Sergio could keep the Red Bull behind but he did while he could.

 

OTOH... I think Checo benefits more from a stronger team mate.  I hope Stroll picks up over the season.

 

I dunno ^, seems he is doing quite well without the pressure. Being the defacto #1 does have some advantages. Stroll looked decent in the race today, but he's got to improve his Q results.



#90 Baddoer

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Posted 29 April 2019 - 05:11

Stroll was useless in qualifying. But in the race he is a force to be reckoned with.


Edited by Baddoer, 29 April 2019 - 05:11.


#91 Lights

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Posted 29 April 2019 - 05:37

Yeah it's nice that Stroll got 9th after such a bad qualy, but apparently he had the car for 6th. So what looks like a strong race from him still means a lot of wasted potential. He also benefited a lot from grid penalties and people starting from the pits.



#92 Pete_f1

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Posted 29 April 2019 - 05:44

I was surprised at where Stroll ended up. Fair play.

#93 sopa

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Posted 29 April 2019 - 06:41

Yeah it's nice that Stroll got 9th after such a bad qualy, but apparently he had the car for 6th. So what looks like a strong race from him still means a lot of wasted potential. He also benefited a lot from grid penalties and people starting from the pits.

 

Stroll is rubbish in qualifying, and average in the race. Looks like he finished some good 25+ seconds behind Perez in the end. It's not like Stroll has fantastic races. He just isn't as bad in them as he is in qualifying, and doesn't look out of his depth. But still nothing great. By the end of GP's he is still some 25-30 seconds behind Perez. That's a pretty thorough beating. Last year, when Vandoorne regularly finished 30s behind Alonso, he was called rubbish. Expectations on Stroll as so low that whenever he gets points, it is celebrated like a big achievement.


Edited by sopa, 29 April 2019 - 06:42.


#94 BRG

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Posted 29 April 2019 - 15:06

I see the baying mob with the flaming torches and pitchforks is out again.  How dare Lance Stroll only score two points?  He should have won and lapped the entire field.



#95 KWSN - DSM

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Posted 29 April 2019 - 16:03

Racing Point is once again batting above their weight class, is it not now we should re-access their weight class and simply place where they finish season after season?

 

:cool:



#96 StanBarrett2

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Posted 29 April 2019 - 16:08

Stroll was useless in qualifying. But in the race he is a force to be reckoned with.

Makes you wonder why pop Stroll changed the team name ?



#97 rocque

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Posted 29 April 2019 - 16:17

Looks like he finished some good 25+ seconds behind Perez in the end. 

 

Perfect teammates :rotfl:  

https://www.motorspo...4359777/?nrt=54  

https://twitter.com/...793717027790849



#98 Collective

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Posted 30 April 2019 - 14:45

I see the baying mob with the flaming torches and pitchforks is out again.  How dare Lance Stroll only score two points?  He should have won and lapped the entire field.

Staying within 20 seconds of his teammate is a reasonable expectation. That said, he lost a lot at the first pit stop (to avoid an unsafe release), he was actually not that far from Checo and the McLarens towards the end of the first stint.


Edited by Collective, 30 April 2019 - 16:17.


#99 coppilcus

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Posted 30 April 2019 - 17:34

Perfect teammates :rotfl:  
https://www.motorspo...4359777/?nrt=54  
https://twitter.com/...793717027790849


Starting ten places behind and ending three down...

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#100 Paco

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Posted 30 April 2019 - 18:02

I'm not Strol jr. fan but 20s is nothing considering a street circuit and where he started from.  The guy probably did the most he could have and he's done well here before so it is fine where he finished.  He should have finished higher.. yup and it was his own fault he didn't but give the guy a bit of credit to the gap and reasoning.  He did better then a lot of other guys out there..  HE still cost the team valuable points and places but he made the most of his outcomes.