9766 replies to this topic

[jstrains]

Published 1 minute ago, Vettel to Aston Martin a done deal

https://www.bild.de/...Login.bild.html

 

The article does not say any details except that the salary is not an issue and that Perez' exit clause needs to be activated by 31 July 2020

Edited by jstrains, 14 July 2020 - 17:28.

[SonGoku]

Problem for Russell is that he has no influence on Bottas performances, Wolff was Bottas former manager and just said in the media that Valterri is improving year after year, doesn't seem to me like a boss that is ready to replace his friend. Plus Merc would be not wise to put a new driver in the team when the biggest rule changes since 2014 are arriving and testing is more limited than ever before.

[TomNokoe]

It would be a travesty if Perez, who has been carrying the team for 6 years and was instrumental in saving them in 2018, is unceremoniously dumped.

[SonGoku]

It would be a travesty if Perez, who has been carrying the team for 6 years and was instrumental in saving them in 2018, is unceremoniously dumped.

 

Yeah but the son will never lose his seat, so Perez would always be the one in the hot seat.

[Lennat]

Damn, harsh on Perez, but sure, the chance to sign a 4 time champion is hard to turn down. That basically means Alfa, Haas or retirement for Perez. Personally, I'd think he'd be a perfect number two at RB, but don't see that actually happening.

[TomNokoe]

Yeah but the son will never lose his seat, so Perez would always be the one in the hot seat.

You have to draw the line.

You can very easily argue that Stroll/Vettel is a weaker lineup.

It's a very big IF, anyway. I don't buy the exit clause rumour.

[Jvr]

Come on, it's not like Bottas is being universally praised is it?  I don't think i'm saying anything shocking here?

Your lack of "universal praising" is rather biased, I think.

Let's be honest, you see Bottas as a roadblock to your supported driver and you do your best to push Bottas down and promote Russell.

 

I'm also honest: I like Bottas and I think he has done well enough to stay at the Merc.

[theflyingwheel]

The exit clause seems like fake news, given there is no exit clause Buying out Perez and bringing Vettel will be about 40 m usd with the budged limit, the finances of the team and the fact that Vettel wouldnt be a huge improvement in his current form over Perez seems like a publicity stunt rather than actual news. Dont see it happening.

[Marklar]

The exit clause seems like fake news, given there is no exit clause Buying out Perez and bringing Vettel will be about 40 m usd with the budged limit, the finances of the team and the fact that Vettel wouldnt be a huge improvement in his current form over Perez seems like a publicity stunt rather than actual news. Dont see it happening.

There is no budget cap yet and Vettel certainly doesnt cost 40 m.

What would happen to the sponsor money would be interesting tho.

[shure]

Your lack of "universal praising" is rather biased, I think.

Let's be honest, you see Bottas as a roadblock to your supported driver and you do your best to push Bottas down and promote Russell.

 

I'm also honest: I like Bottas and I think he has done well enough to stay at the Merc.

ah, I see, you think I have some hidden Russell agenda?

 

I don't have any particular feelings towards Russell.  It's more that I think Bottas isn't setting the world alight and I don't think he's a good long-term prospect for Mercedes.  If anything I'd prefer to see Vettel there but I don't think that's realistic.  I'm looking at the Merc junior program and Russell stands out for me.  Think suggesting someone like Perez would be highly unlikely, so the reality is that the toss will probably come down to Ocon or Russell.

[milestone 11]

apparently there is a exit clause (for the team) that can be triggered until the end of this month to terminate Perez' contract, they would have to pay Sergio a single million digit compensation if they do it tho.
I still find it rather doubtful that they would do it, but maybe it's worth the publicity.

Thanks. I don't see them dumping Sergio either.

[Viryfan]

There is no budget cap yet and Vettel certainly doesnt cost 40 m.

What would happen to the sponsor money would be interesting tho.

 

Well Stroll has deep pockets.

 

Also Aston Martin in itself has corporate sponsors such as Total which can bridge the gap.

 

They paid 15 million € to give a seat to Grosjean and they won titles with Vettel.

[Venom]

If this comes to fruition I think it’s a nice move for Seb.

We have no idea how the new regulations and cost cap will impact the field but certainly the engineers at Racing Point think they are well placed for it. He should have at least a semi-competitive car next year if this season’s form carries over at all. And, with Stroll as a teammate it’s a team where he can be in complete competitive command again as the focal point.

Sucks for Perez. I’d like to think he’d be in running at Haas but I don’t know what it will take for Grosjean to lose his seat.

[Viryfan]

If this happens i'm pretty sure that Checo will leave the sport unless he gets the red bull seat.

 

He has seen enough of F1 to waste his time in a backmarker car such as Haas.

[SonGoku]

Would love Perez at Mercedes, but that is never going to happen, both drivers are doing well.

[milestone 11]

There is no budget cap yet and Vettel certainly doesnt cost 40 m.
What would happen to the sponsor money would be interesting tho.

Does this Bild site only open in Germany? I can only get to the headline.

[Red5ive]

Perez to RB then........

[Viryfan]

Does this Bild site only open in Germany? I can only get to the headline.

 

It is a pay per view article

[milestone 11]

I want Seb in a decent seat, no doubt, dumping Sergio to achieve that would be a travesty.

[theflyingwheel]

Only german sources and very coincidental with Mercedes signing again Bottas and Rb closing the door to their german driver, rather than actual news this feels more than a fruitless push by german media to get their german driver in a seat that its not open.

Edited by theflyingwheel, 14 July 2020 - 18:04.

[Risil]

I like this development. Where could Perez take his talents and sponsorship? Haas? Alfa? Williams? Indy?

He could do a job for Alpha Tauri, come to think of it. Be the benchmark for the rookie, fund the team...

[Risil]

Only german sources and very coincidental with Mercedes signing again Bottas and Rb closing the door to their german driver, rather than actual news this feels more than a fruitless push by german media to get their german driver in a seat that its not open.

German media has source close to German driver.

[theflyingwheel]

German media has source close to German driver.

Motorlat is reporting that this “famous clause” is in case that Sergio received a better offer from other team in which case he wanted to leave RP he would had to pay his contract in full plus a fee for breaking the contract.

If they decide to break the contract with Perez bt his salary, his sponsors and the salary of a new driver the total cost would be 40 million usd.
This seems like a desperate attempt from the german media to get their german driver a seat in a team that is already closed and is very coincidental with both Rb and Merc closing the door. Wont happen.

Edited by theflyingwheel, 14 July 2020 - 18:15.

[KWSN - DSM]

Rumors and all, could Racing Point and Ferrari make a straight swap immediately? Vettel to Racing Point, Perez to Ferrari, next season when Sainz comes in, Perez either Haas or Alfa Romeo?

[1Devil1]

Only german sources and very coincidental with Mercedes signing again Bottas and Rb closing the door to their german driver, rather than actual news this feels more than a fruitless push by german media to get their german driver in a seat that its not open.

 

Your phrasing sound more like speculating more than the actual article. When it comes down to sport information Bild has one of the best source, despite being the german sun. 

[thegamer23]

Rumors and all, could Racing Point and Ferrari make a straight swap immediately? Vettel to Racing Point, Perez to Ferrari, next season when Sainz comes in, Perez either Haas or Alfa Romeo?

Makes zero sense for Perez

[Hakki069]

Vettel to Aston Martin I see as likely. I believe they want a big name signing and Mercedes would probably love for him to lead basically the B team.

Totally unfair on Perez tbh. But that's the harsh world of F1. But Perez will defo end up at Haas to hopefully replace Roman

[Piif]

Russel deserves the same chance that Verstappen and Leclerc got.

 

Why?

[rodlamas]

Published 1 minute ago, Vettel to Aston Martin a done deal

https://www.bild.de/...Login.bild.html

 

The article does not say any details except that the salary is not an issue and that Perez' exit clause needs to be activated by 31 July 2020

If that happens I guess Haas would take Perez instantly for 2021. Nevertheless it would be a shame for Perez to drive at the back of the grid.

[jstrains]

Honestly the drivers that will change their seats for 21 and we shuld be happy that the season is so short, as the suffering of Vettel, Ricciardo, etc. will be shorter too.

[TomNokoe]

If that happens I guess Haas would take Perez instantly for 2021. Nevertheless it would be a shame for Perez to drive at the back of the grid.

The only silver lining being he reignites the Ferrari link. Other than that, na da.

[Anderis]

ah, I see, you think I have some hidden Russell agenda?

 

I don't have any particular feelings towards Russell.  It's more that I think Bottas isn't setting the world alight and I don't think he's a good long-term prospect for Mercedes.  If anything I'd prefer to see Vettel there but I don't think that's realistic.  I'm looking at the Merc junior program and Russell stands out for me.  Think suggesting someone like Perez would be highly unlikely, so the reality is that the toss will probably come down to Ocon or Russell.

In my opinion, Bottas is doing better than Webber or post-accident Massa, who also kept their top team seats for many years.

 

Some F1 fans don't understand that "good enough" is often way better than "go for someone that might or might not turn out to be a more exciting option, but destabilise the team or risk that you end up with a driver who actually does a worse job than the previous one (if you go for a young, unproven one) ", especially when your 1st driver already does the job better than you could ask for. It's no coincidence that Bottas/Webber/Barrichello/late Raikkonen type of drivers are repeatedly being chosen by top teams over the years- because team principals know what they are doing and are aware that it's not that easy to find improvement over that and even if there is SOME chance for improvement, it's not worth the risk if the current pairing works well enough. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

People often don't appreciate that drivers like Webber or Bottas basically outperformed all of their previous team-mates on their ways to the top seats. Just because there's a promising young driver somewhere among backmarker teams does not mean he will be an upgrade. It's a matter of perception because it's so much easier to hide your shortcomings everywhere outside the top teams. If top teams were quicker to give chances to various promising drivers, there would be much more flops and in the end those teams would be worse off in the long run.

[Piif]

Would be insanely sweet if Perez got his chance at Red Bull. Vettel to Aston Martin/Racing Point and Perez to replace Albon. Everybody happy.

[jstrains]

Would be insanely sweet if Perez got his chance at Red Bull. Vettel to Aston Martin/Racing Point and Perez to replace Albon. Everybody happy.

Except Albon

[Jvr]

ah, I see, you think I have some hidden Russell agenda?

 

I don't have any particular feelings towards Russell.  It's more that I think Bottas isn't setting the world alight and I don't think he's a good long-term prospect for Mercedes.  If anything I'd prefer to see Vettel there but I don't think that's realistic.  I'm looking at the Merc junior program and Russell stands out for me.  Think suggesting someone like Perez would be highly unlikely, so the reality is that the toss will probably come down to Ocon or Russell.

Ok.

 

So your agenda is "anybody but Bottas" even an unproven rookie.

 

I get you.

[Emilvang]

Except Albon

He'll probably get a seat in Alpha. Saves him from being wiped out by Max every weekend, so maybe a little happy.

[William Hunt]

And let me add that I think Russel is minimum as good as Bottas, that he likely is better, that I think he is very possibly better than Norris, and I am certain better than Ocon

 

First of all: you have absolutely no proof for any claim you make, the word THINK is important in your sentence. 

 

In reality all those drivers you mention are very talented and it is not proven that one of them is better as the other. On one day Bottas will be the best performer of them, on another day Norris and on another day Ocon or Russel. It surprises me how people keep on underestimating Ocon & Bottas. Bottas may not be as good as Lewis but he still is a damn fine driver and the ideal second driver for Mercedes and he could still mount a title challenge this year, in fact he is the tables leader currently.

[shure]

Ok.

 

So your agenda is "anybody but Bottas" even an unproven rookie.

 

I get you.

No, not anybody.  I already explained my position and the options I felt were viable.  If you're reducing that to "anybody but Bottas" then you clearly have either not read what I wrote or you're just being deliberately obtuse.  So we'll leave it there as you're obviously not interested in a proper discussion on it

[Lights]

Vettel to partner Stroll. Ha, how could I not have seen this coming. Yeah that move has Vettel written all over it.

[Anja]

I'd rather see Perez in IndyCar than in that dreadful Haas. 

[KWSN - DSM]

Makes zero sense for Perez

 

Unless it is that or nothing I would think.

[KWSN - DSM]

First of all: you have absolutely no proof for any claim you make, the word THINK is important in your sentence. 

 

In reality all those drivers you mention are very talented and it is not proven that one of them is better as the other. On one day Bottas will be the best performer of them, on another day Norris and on another day Ocon or Russel. It surprises me how people keep on underestimating Ocon & Bottas. Bottas may not be as good as Lewis but he still is a damn fine driver and the ideal second driver for Mercedes and he could still mount a title challenge this year, in fact he is the tables leader currently.

 

Proof??????

 

This is a forum where we exchange views and opinions based on what we THINK, I am not and did not say any of the drivers were poor, said what I personally THINK.

 

Asking for proof of an opinion is inane.

[danmills]

No way will Perez be ditched, I'm certain that Stroll has brains and Totos input to run Perez and Vettel.

But in a shock ditch, Perez will definitely be swooped, surely either as a Ferrari stand in for an ever disgruntled Vettel this year, or Red Bull next year if Albon doesn't shine sooner. I think time is up for Kvyat or Gasly, and Albon back to At.

Perez at Haas or Alfa, reallllllly? What a waste!

Wasn't Perez rumored to be Renaykts target a few season ago too?

[Henri Greuter]

I'd rather see Perez in IndyCar than in that dreadful Haas. 

Given the fact that Haas has retained Grosjean the past two seasons despite....

Makes me wonder if Perez has enough backing to begin with to get Grosjean out of that Haas to begin with.

 

 

If he wants it first of course

[UltimateLegacy]

If an overrated driver like Vettel replaces Perez, who spent most of his career carrying that team through thick and thin whilst the likes of Stroll keeps his seat, then it just confirms to me F1 has become a joke. Especially when there are arguably better drivers on the market who are more effective at bringing in the ad views and the fans than Vettel, such as Alonso. And he would actually be a step up in performance from Perez. I guess Lawrence is getting tired of his son getting thrashed by an above average and consistent driver like Perez and wants someone like Vettel to increase his sons stock.

Edited by UltimateLegacy, 14 July 2020 - 20:16.

[Marklar]

Motorlat is reporting that this “famous clause” is in case that Sergio received a better offer from other team in which case he wanted to leave RP he would had to pay his contract in full plus a fee for breaking the contract.

If they decide to break the contract with Perez bt his salary, his sponsors and the salary of a new driver the total cost would be 40 million usd.
This seems like a desperate attempt from the german media to get their german driver a seat in a team that is already closed and is very coincidental with both Rb and Merc closing the door. Wont happen.

those clauses are often two sided for both driver and team, so both things can be right.

Aston Martin having an option to terminate Perez' contract makes sense. We were all confused last year how a team with heavy investments could commit to a driver pairing (that definitely can be upgraded) over the next 3 years. Being able to terminate the contract surely makes this a lot more sensible.

Edited by Marklar, 14 July 2020 - 19:12.

[shure]

In my opinion, Bottas is doing better than Webber or post-accident Massa, who also kept their top team seats for many years.

 

Some F1 fans don't understand that "good enough" is often way better than "go for someone that might or might not turn out to be a more exciting option, but destabilise the team or risk that you end up with a driver who actually does a worse job than the previous one (if you go for a young, unproven one) ", especially when your 1st driver already does the job better than you could ask for. It's no coincidence that Bottas/Webber/Barrichello/late Raikkonen type of drivers are repeatedly being chosen by top teams over the years- because team principals know what they are doing and are aware that it's not that easy to find improvement over that and even if there is SOME chance for improvement, it's not worth the risk if the current pairing works well enough. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

People often don't appreciate that drivers like Webber or Bottas basically outperformed all of their previous team-mates on their ways to the top seats. Just because there's a promising young driver somewhere among backmarker teams does not mean he will be an upgrade. It's a matter of perception because it's so much easier to hide your shortcomings everywhere outside the top teams. If top teams were quicker to give chances to various promising drivers, there would be much more flops and in the end those teams would be worse off in the long run.

Yes I think there's some sense in this.  It's just that I think that at 35 years of age Hamilton is probably entering the twilight of his career and Mercedes could probably do with planning for his eventual retirement.  Not that I think it's imminent, necessarily, but the possibility is certainly there.  Bottas is a solid #2 but I don't think he's strong enough to lead the team and they're better of grooming a potential successor at this stage than be caught short.  And for reasons already given I think now's a great time for that

[Risil]

Some F1 fans don't understand that "good enough" is often way better than "go for someone that might or might not turn out to be a more exciting option, but destabilise the team or risk that you end up with a driver who actually does a worse job than the previous one (if you go for a young, unproven one) ", especially when your 1st driver already does the job better than you could ask for.

I think most people here understand that, it's just more fun for us when teams take risks on an unknown who might upset the order.

[Jvr]

No, not anybody.  I already explained my position and the options I felt were viable.  If you're reducing that to "anybody but Bottas" then you clearly have either not read what I wrote or you're just being deliberately obtuse.  So we'll leave it there as you're obviously not interested in a proper discussion on it

I think calling for a head of a driver who, when I last time checked, is leading the WDC is a bit "premature".

[Jovanotti]

If RB were to substitute Albon, surely it would be with their former golden boy Vettel and not with Perez. Also, if Vettel sees a chance for an opening at RB, he won't sign with RP already now.

If Vettel signs with RP, I guess Albon will stay and Stroll might be forced to look for a seat elsewhere.

Edited by Jovanotti, 14 July 2020 - 19:36.