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2020 Alfa Romeo C39 (Technical thread)


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#51 lahill

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Posted 20 February 2020 - 15:58

I hope this we seen so far isnt the true pace of the car, will be horrible season ahead if that is the case. Not even glimpse of speed so far.


I just might be too optimistic, but I see this testing so far as a sign that they are confident that the pace is there for good midfield battle. No fast laps needed so far...

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#52 Vesuvius

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Posted 20 February 2020 - 16:52

Kimi said that main focus isn't yet to do performance runs, they focus on doing milliage, getting used to car, try out different things and do some setup work.

He also said that despitate Simone Resta leaving last year, this car is mainly designed by him since the beginning of 2019.

#53 johnnyw

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Posted 20 February 2020 - 16:53

Not very impressed. Only 2 tenths faster than perez using 2 steps softer compound.

 

Drivers always tells the same story that they are not interested about performance, but still each year testing pace usually gives atleast some guidelines of pecking order.


Edited by johnnyw, 20 February 2020 - 17:32.


#54 Paco

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Posted 20 February 2020 - 16:58

Kind of surprised based on how different cars that they are where they are. Not very promising.

#55 Perfection

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Posted 20 February 2020 - 17:08

This is a slow car



#56 Vesuvius

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 08:51

Well Kimi was positive about the first day and said car balance was good, a step forward from last year. Of course early days.

#57 Zilbert

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 09:10

I'll take a car that is a bit slow in first couple of weekends as long as it has some potential for development. Its a long season...



#58 Perfection

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 10:33

I couldn't get much positivity from Kimi's statements tbh. They were some generic answers and he explicitly said there are a lot to do.



#59 Balnazzard

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 13:05

Well  I cant quite understand where this negativity comes from....its too early to draw much any conclusions from testing, cause as usual the times dont tell much anything when everyone is running their own program. The main thing that matters in testing is the mileage and that they get things done/tested without too many problems and losing valuable time while the car sits on the garage.

In Australia we shall only really see where they are with their pace, but since I dont really expect much things to change from 2019 in terms of pecking order, its ofc gonna be challenge for Alfas to get both of their cars into top 10 regularly. Again the gaps between midfield teams are so small that until we really see the first few weekends we cant really be sure of anything and again I expect other teams to perform better around certain tracks than others.

Anyhow if we are all realistic we shouldnt really expect major change from 2019 and thats why I cant quite understand what ppl are/were expecting here in the first place. And so far I havent seen much indication from just 2,5 testing days that Alfa would be considerably more slower than other midfield teams, cause again we cant just blindly look at the testing times. I still fully expect Alfa to be in the fight for positions 7-8 in WCC, propably not higher than that, but much depends also on Haas and have they found their solutions to problems from last year.


Edited by Balnazzard, 21 February 2020 - 14:18.


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#60 barzini

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 13:14

Well I mean I cant quite understand where this negativity comes from....its too early to draw much any conclusions from testing, cause as usual the times dont tell much anything when everyone is running their own program. The main thing that matters in testing is the mileage and that they get things done/tested without too many problems and losing valuable time while the car sits on the garage.

In Australia we shall only really see where they are with their pace, but since I dont really expect much things to change from 2019 in terms of pecking order, its ofc gonna be challenge for Alfas to get both of their cars into top 10 regularly. Again the gaps between midfield teams are so small that until we really see the first few weekends we cant really be sure of anything and again I expect other teams to perform better around certain tracks than others.

Anyhow if we are all realistic we shouldnt really expect major change from 2019 and thats why I cant quite understand what ppl are/were expecting here in the first place. And so far I havent seen much indication from just 2,5 testing days that Alfa would be considerably more slower than other midfield teams, cause again we cant just blindly look at the testing times. I still fully expect Alfa to be in the fight for positions 7-8 in WCC, propably not higher than that, but much depends also on Haas and have they found their solutions to problems from last year.

 

As long as Alfa's team and drivers deliver enjoyable midfield racing, I'll be happy.



#61 Starish

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 14:44

I actually think testing is going pretty ok, Team seems to be clocking in the miles and getting through their programme. The car won't be a world beater but if they can understand the tyres and get optimal setups then we have a solid foundation.  



#62 Vesuvius

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 15:23

Yes, there is lots of positive things happening, reliability seems good and they are doing lot of laps.About the pace can't really say, but not too far from others.

As long as they won't take wrong path in development like they did on last years winter testing, which almost ruined everything.

And like I wrote, Kimi was happy with the balance, he told it to Heikki Kulta, does it mean something? Maybe not.

Edited by Vesuvius, 21 February 2020 - 15:26.


#63 barzini

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 15:40

If Kimi is happy and confident with the car, he’ll bring it to points no matter what kind of a **** box it is

#64 haryantofan666

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 16:24

Realistically with the B teams (Force India, Toro Rosso, Haas) and the factory teams (Renault, McLaren), it's gonna be tough to expect anything better than p9. 

 

Even if the car handles great, you still need some grip to go fast. Sector 3 looks worrying, even on the C5's. 



#65 anyeis

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 19:04

If Kimi and Bottas were on the same fuel it dosent look that bad

#66 Balnazzard

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 20:32

If Kimi and Bottas were on the same fuel it dosent look that bad

Yea though I honestly doubt Mercedes was still running on their "A-game" either...

Anyhow we are not really using Mercedes as the benchmark, but the other midfield teams. And imho its impossible to say yet how good/bad Alfa really is. Atleast they dont have any major issues and are not dead slow like Williams last year, so honestly there isnt that much to be negative about if not overly excited either. Having 3rd most laps completed out of all teams is good start, much better atleast what Ferrari had relatively speaking.

Im interested to read what the "experts" are going to say in their reports about the pecking order, although we have seen how dead wrong they have also been, so again wouldnt draw too many conclusions out of this till we see pratice times in Melbourne.



#67 Starish

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 21:05

Hopefully the upgrades we bring next test will work from the get go and not set us back as was last year, I think that put a bottleneck in the 2019 development schedule. 

 

Also bear in mind this is one of the worst tracks for the team last year.


Edited by Starish, 21 February 2020 - 21:11.


#68 AlexS

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 21:41

The first team that Alfa has to beat is Haas and it seems to be in front of them at this time.



#69 chhatra

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Posted 22 February 2020 - 15:37

I couldn't get much positivity from Kimi's statements tbh. They were some generic answers and he explicitly said there are a lot to do.


That sounds like Kimi all the time.

#70 Vesuvius

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Posted 26 February 2020 - 15:53

Not a very good afternoon session it seems...

#71 Balnazzard

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 14:43

Just wondering how is the car looking during long runs?...Im also starting to worry a bit how much pace the car has in short quali laps, but how the car is behaving/how the lap times are looking during those longer stints?

Cause it seems like Kimi has managed to score good amount of laps today, if nothing else



#72 anyeis

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 15:10

Just wondering how is the car looking during long runs?...Im also starting to worry a bit how much pace the car has in short quali laps, but how the car is behaving/how the lap times are looking during those longer stints?

Cause it seems like Kimi has managed to score good amount of laps today, if nothing else

 

Pace is shocking in the long runs just like that headline time suggests. They are slowest



#73 Balnazzard

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 15:24

Pace is shocking in the long runs just like that headline time suggests. They are slowest

Well honestly it would be shocking if they would be even behind Williams....its bit hard to believe that they would have fallen so much behind. Definitely would be depressing to see Kimi having the slowest car under him in potentially his last season in F1.



#74 Vesuvius

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 15:34

Pace is shocking in the long runs just like that headline time suggests. They are slowest


Really? Yet Vasseur said long runs were good.

#75 anyeis

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 15:37

Really? Yet Vasseur said long runs were good.

 

Where? Kimi just did them. Or maybe they have just turned something down for today


Edited by anyeis, 28 February 2020 - 15:37.


#76 Vesuvius

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 15:47

Where? Kimi just did them. Or maybe they have just turned something down for today

They have focused on long runs for past few days. I haven't seen any of Kimi's times from today mentioned everywhere, so to compare them with other teams, we would need times.

Wouldn't be surprised to see some low fuel load run from him in the end.

Edited by Vesuvius, 28 February 2020 - 15:49.


#77 Trust

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 15:55

I'm worried.



#78 Zilbert

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 16:04

For all we know they could be running setups not necessarily 100 % suited for this track. Today's pace is dreadful though.



#79 Balnazzard

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 16:10

Well again the one thing positive is that they have managed to run their programs without having to spend much time in garage. But one thing is for sure, cant really feel confident about the pace compared to other midfield teams. If Kimi was to do a quick quali lap at the end, preferably with compound 3 or 4 tyre, then it could atleast shed some light (or add more worry) about their pace.

Edit: ah nvm, just reported they would have finished 50 mins before the end of the day...disappointing.


Edited by Balnazzard, 28 February 2020 - 16:11.


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#80 Trust

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 16:18

Well, what is the tyre delta here? Cause  Ricciardo on C5 is faster 1.2 seconds than Kimi who is I think on C3?


Edited by Trust, 28 February 2020 - 16:19.


#81 Vesuvius

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 16:19

Lets just wait for season to start, if it even will...

#82 Vesuvius

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 16:27

Well, what is the tyre delta here? Cause Ricciardo on C5 is faster 1.2 seconds than Kimi who is I think on C3?


Both are C5 I think, fast times don't matter much as Kimi hasn't focused on short runs today.

#83 Balnazzard

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 16:28

Lets just wait for season to start, if it even will...

True, you never know now with Coronavirus pandemic...heck just read that they are even considering to cancel the whole of Premier League....and many other major events are already being cancelled.

If things get out of hand in most countries like in China and South Korea especially, then we really might have to kiss 2020 season goodbye before it even starts.



#84 Starish

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 17:15

Things aren't looking Rosey, but we clearly tried to make up the time lost yesterday from GIO's crash. The team may already understand their qualy form from the earlier stints with Robert and even with Kimi who I believe could have gone much quicker (If Russell was 1 sec quicker Kimi has to be around that mark). 

 

A positive is the top speed, which leaves room to add downforce on the car.



#85 JRodrigues

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 17:59

Kimi did 2 long runs this afternoon with hards. 1st run had 18 laps with average os 1:24.45, the 2nd had 23 laps and an average laptime of 1:24.18



#86 Vesuvius

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 18:00

Kimi's press confrence was cancelled and he left home with his family, while others were still testing.

Did Alfa test new nose today?

#87 Balnazzard

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Posted 28 February 2020 - 20:00

Kimi's press confrence was cancelled and he left home with his family, while others were still testing.

Did Alfa test new nose today?

Hmmm, doesnt sound too promising then.....I mean one would think that they would use all the testing time and not quit early, unless they really would have completed everything they wanted to.

But I fear more like the team concluded that it made no sense to run the car around any further because they had some big issue with the pace to solve...

any idea how Kimi's long run average laptimes compare to the other midfield teams?



#88 Apex11

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Posted 29 February 2020 - 10:22

Gio did some good runs in the first test, from information I found on day 3 I think. Three stints all on C2:

Stint 1
1:21.859
1:22.052
1:22.342
1:22.817
1:22.921
1:23.213
1:23.124
1:23.052
1:23.074
1:23.333
1:23.456
1:23.392
1:23.212
1:23.644
1:23.155

Stint 2
1:21.855
1:22.510
1:22.965
1:23.036
1:23.028
1:23.305
1:23.801
1:23.550
1:23.761
1:23.297
1:23.511
1:23.380
1:23.388
1:23.228
1:23.421
X
X
1:23.470

Stint 3
1:21.533
1:22.585
1:22.861
1:22.800
1:23.491
1:23.440
1:23.363
1:23.430
1:23.352
1:23.227
1:23.282
1:23.065
1:23.310
1:23.358
X
X
1:22.931

#89 Jovanotti

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Posted 02 March 2020 - 12:15

Take it with a table spoon of salt, according to AMuS it's back to P9, 0.1s ahead of Williams for Sauber. If true, that's a bloody desaster. I'll reserve my judgement until Melbourne, but realistically it will be extremely hard to better P8 in the WCC from last year.



#90 Vesuvius

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Posted 03 March 2020 - 17:41

Take it with a table spoon of salt, according to AMuS it's back to P9, 0.1s ahead of Williams for Sauber. If true, that's a bloody desaster. I'll reserve my judgement until Melbourne, but realistically it will be extremely hard to better P8 in the WCC from last year.


Nothing new really, Alfa was 9th or 8th last year as well. We can beat Haas over a race distance, and perhaps fight with some others here and there. McLaren was clearly faster last year, Renault will be too and Racing point is last years Mercedes, Alpha Tauri gets bigger and bigger support from Red bull.

Anyway, things are never like testing suggest, I believe Haas will again be a super fast over one lap, Red Bull will be a lot closer to Mercedes (RBR have had their best winter testing ever).Aloha Tauri will be fast over a race distance.

#91 Jovanotti

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Posted 04 March 2020 - 08:26

Aloha Tauri

That's what they should be called :lol:
 



#92 Vesuvius

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Posted 04 March 2020 - 17:21

That's what they should be called :lol:


Lol :'D