988 replies to this topic

[Alburaq]

Renault F1 confirms that the RS20 driven by Esteban Ocon and Daniel Ricciardo will benefit from updates to its aero package this weekend for the British Grand Prix.
As Silverstone is a completely different circuit to Budapest, which was visited recently, Renault F1 decided to wait until the fourth race to introduce a number of technical changes to the car, notably to the front wing and the flat track floor.
"We'll be introducing several new features this weekend while driving at different levels of downforce . "Pat Fry, Renault F1's chassis technical director, confirms.
"It's a decent development and it will be interesting to see how it performs at Silverstone. I wouldn't say it will be enough to upset the hierarchy, but it's a good step forward at this stage of the season. »
"Silverstone is a good track to test this with enough straights to evaluate the aerodynamic elements and a wide variety of corners to really gauge the effects on the car's handling.  
"Another aspect to take into account will be the wind that can be strong at Silverstone and we will be able to see if we have made any progress in these conditions since the Barcelona tests. If the weather is dry we will have a clear idea of where we stand. »
"Silverstone is a mixture of medium and high speed turns. The oldest part is fantastic, especially the sequence between Maggots, Becketts and Chapel. »
"It's an excellent track to highlight any problems with a car's performance and to identify what works and what doesn't work. »
"It requires a certain degree of efficiency in the single-seater and it is also an engine-type circuit. The last race in Hungary was extreme in the sense that downforce was maximum. »
"However, Silverstone requires more efficiency in fast curves. In the past, our car was not suitable for this type of track, but the signs are that we are heading in the right direction this year. »

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
https://f1only.fr/re...20-saison-2020/

 
 
 

https://www.gpfans.c...-double-header/
Renault to deliver upgraded car for Silverstone double-header

Renault will hand drivers Daniel Ricciardo and Esteban Ocon an upgraded car for the forthcoming double-header at Silverstone.
The team has endured a mixed start to the new season, finishing a high of eighth in each of the three grands prix to date, while also retiring a car in the first two races.
Although chassis technical director Pat Fry believes the results have been "where we deserve to be" he also at least feels the R.2.20 is an improvement compared to last year's car, proclaiming Renault to be "amongst the teams to have made the most progress from last year"
But Fry warned: "There’s obviously a lot of work to do and we have to keep developing. Reliability has been disappointing and it’s frustrating to have those problems.
"We’re working hard on this and we need to improve all of our processes, from quality assurance through manufacturing and the build phase, all the way to the implementation on the car."

Edited by Alburaq, 28 July 2020 - 12:37.

[Alburaq]

"First estimates show that Mercedes has 25 hp more than Renault, 30 hp more than Honda and 50 hp more than Ferrari."

https://www.auto-mot...errari-schwach/

 

If Renault is slightly ahead of Honda in Q and not too far behind Mercedes this year, that's a good thing because Renault is more about long term than Honda: Renault has just brought an evolution of the PU 2019 and has focused on reliability while Honda, pushed by RBR who wants to fight for the titles, has certainly invested more. Moreover Honda has been able to work on its PU more than the others before Austria, which is an advantage for 2020 (but it's a disadvantage for the next season as they will have to close their factory in summer, while the 3 others won't, because they did it earlier this year).

 

And AMuS figures tend to prove that Renault generates more drag than Mclaren, as in 2019, especially when DF is high. And if my theory is right, it's mainly because of the CCS and the XXL roll hoop : ) 

[ARTGP]

 

"First estimates show that Mercedes has 25 hp more than Renault, 30 hp more than Honda and 50 hp more than Ferrari."

https://www.auto-mot...errari-schwach/

 

If Renault is slightly ahead of Honda in Q and not too far behind Mercedes this year, that's a good thing because Renault is more about long term than Honda: Renault has just brought an evolution of the PU 2019 and has focused on reliability while Honda, pushed by RBR who wants to fight for the titles, has certainly invested more. Moreover Honda has been able to work on its PU more than the others before Austria, which is an advantage for 2020 (but it's a disadvantage for the next season as they will have to close their factory in summer, while the 3 others won't, because they did it earlier this year).

 

And AMuS figures tend to prove that Renault generates more drag than Mclaren, as in 2019, especially when DF is high. And if my theory is right, it's mainly because of the CCS and the XXL roll hoop : ) 

 

 

 

Yes, I recall it was mentioned somewhere that Renault did not just give up on an engine program, but rather they have begun to lay out groundwork for the beast of Gévaudan, also known as the 2022 power unit. An engine designed with a reduction of aerodynamic cooling need in mind (so no more XXL roll hoop  )

Edited by ARTGP, 30 July 2020 - 10:03.

[Alburaq]

Yes they are focusing on that engine which is said to feature big conceptual breakthroughs... Reading between the lines, Renault is very interested in the operating temperatures of the 2022 PU. They probably want to increase and homogenize them in order to reduce the size of the cooling system by using smaller radiators and less types of coolants/less radiators...

https://f1i.auto-mot...-a-progresse/4/

 

I hope the team will do everything to introduce that PU in 2021. It wont be an easy task because of the freezing and the limited tokens, but if that PU has a similar turbo architecture (no split turbo for example), Renault could do that IMO by spending its two tokens on the new cooling system and by adapting the rest of the PU to the 2020 monocoque.

 

If they retain the same 2020 PU (which wont be great because MCL will get a 'better' PU next year), I think it is possible for Renault to relocate the 2020 CCS for free, to improve aero, and spend the tokens slimming down the roll hoop : ) 

Edited by Alburaq, 30 July 2020 - 10:42.

[Alburaq]

But If they retain the same 2020 PU (which wont be great because MCL will get a 'better' PU next year), I think it is possible for Renault to relocate the 2020 CCS for free, to improve aero, and spend the tokens slimming down the roll hoop : )

 
Renault has two possibilities IMO   
- actually their CCS seems to feature two twin radiators. If they can split them, they can go the 2014 -2016 STR route (a very stylish cooling layout) by putting each rad lower, around the engine, partly in the sidepods, and feed them via the roll-hoop (but from a smaller intake)
 
- Or go the more classic Mercedes route, which Enstone used in the past: try to place the rads above the gbox, in a more horizontal position

 

2015-2016 STR: 

 

 
2014: https://i.imgur.com/C1Ie69E.jpg

 

 

- Merc / Lotus - Renaullt: 

 

https://i.imgur.com/oa7Vtpx.jpg

 

https://imgur.com/0Vc85G2

 

Edited by Alburaq, 30 July 2020 - 11:06.

[ARTGP]

 

Yes they are focusing on that engine which is said to feature big conceptual breakthroughs... Reading between the lines, Renault is very interested in the operating temperatures of the 2022 PU. They probably want to increase and homogenize them in order to reduce the size of the cooling system by using smaller radiators and less types of coolants/less radiators...

https://f1i.auto-mot...-a-progresse/4/

 

I hope the team will do everything to introduce that PU in 2021. It wont be an easy task because of the freezing and the limited tokens, but if that PU has a similar turbo architecture (no split turbo for example), Renault could do that IMO by spending its two tokens on the new cooling system and by adapting the rest of the PU to the 2020 monocoque.

 

If they retain the same 2020 PU (which wont be great because MCL will get a 'better' PU next year), I think it is possible for Renault to relocate the 2020 CCS for free, to improve aero, and spend the tokens slimming down the roll hoop : ) 

 

 

This makes sense to me listening to what Alonso has told the team. Alonso said in no uncertain terms to focus on the 2022 car. Using the 2021 car as a powertrain test bed for 2022 would fit that bill largely. Aerodynamic development for 2021 has limited value. We've all witnessed how a monster engine can make even the worst car look good.

Edited by ARTGP, 30 July 2020 - 11:43.

[Amz964]

Looking at Ocon got quite a skinny rear wing like last year so again looks like the car still maybe prefers lower DF configuration. Will be interesting to see what Danny Ric has on.

Edited by Amz964, 31 July 2020 - 10:29.

[Alburaq]

Yes last year they raced Ric's RW here:

 

"Hülkenberg thinks that the new asphalt will completely change the basic conditions. "In recent years the asphalt here has been rather bumpy. In 2018 we had to drive at maximum downforce to keep the cars on the track. That hurt us, because last year we still had a big power deficit. Now we are top with the engine. And the track seems much smoother. We will go into the first practice session with less downforce for the moment."

Edited by Alburaq, 31 July 2020 - 12:35.

[ARTGP]

 

Yes last year they raced Ric's RW here:

 

"Hülkenberg thinks that the new asphalt will completely change the basic conditions. "In recent years the asphalt here has been rather bumpy. In 2018 we had to drive at maximum downforce to keep the cars on the track. That hurt us, because last year we still had a big power deficit. Now we are top with the engine. And the track seems much smoother. We will go into the first practice session with less downforce for the moment."

 

 

 

IT's interesting and I've noted it over the last year or so.  Ocon and Hulkenberg always tended to run more wing than Danny.  Your picture at Silverstone shows as much. But also this season Ocon is slower in the speed traps regularly.  Danny likes to let it all hang loose   

Edited by ARTGP, 31 July 2020 - 13:02.

[krapmeister]

IT's interesting and I've noted it over the last year or so.  Ocon and Hulkenberg always tended to run more wing than Danny.  Your picture at Silverstone shows as much. But also this season Ocon is slower in the speed traps regularly.  Danny likes to let it all hang loose   

 

As you say, interesting - as IIRC when RIC was at RBR it was usually VER that went for less wing...

[Ivanhoe]

Said it before and say it again, this thread is a real pleasure to visit with so many knowledgeable members. Keep it coming

[Alburaq]

Edit: lol never mind 

 

Regarding the floor, that thin winglet on the edge of the floor is longer now (and they removed the two vertical vanes in front of it)

 

Edited by Alburaq, 31 July 2020 - 15:50.

[Amz964]

Losing so much time in S2. Not enough Downforce maybe? Again on soft tyres not looking brilliant but conditions gonna be different tomorrow and the cooler ambient and less humid conditions will help the lower DF.

[Alburaq]

Looks like they tested an interesting new rear bodywork today. It seems to be inspired by Mercedes: the air exits are angled more aggressively downwards, maybe to enhance the channeling of the air over the edge of the diffuser.
Looks more agressive the other designs

[https://media.gettyi...066?s=2048x2048

Edited by Alburaq, 31 July 2020 - 20:31.

[Flasheart]

Thanks for the pics Alburaq. I heard Ted talking about the new barge board area, but hadn’t seen it yet.

[Alburaq]

Didnt find any change on the BB 

[Flasheart]

Shoulder shrug emoji. Thanks anyway.

[ARTGP]

Reading between the lines, I think they've had a development on the POU suspension to lower the outboard front wing tip. Riccaiardo mentioned getting that part loaded in the high speed stuff. Just watched some footage and the outboard endplate is scraping the ground through Abbey more than I remember.

Edited by ARTGP, 07 August 2020 - 14:58.

[Flasheart]

That’s interesting. Reading through the week, I got the impression that they wanted the new suspension to help mitigate roll, and try to keep the front wing more level while cornering. The more roll, the less stable the airflow under wing. What would I know...

[ARTGP]

That’s interesting. Reading through the week, I got the impression that they wanted the new suspension to help mitigate roll, and try to keep the front wing more level while cornering. The more roll, the less stable the airflow under wing. What would I know...

 

Both effects can be achieved at the same time. If you have a steering geometry that can lower both the left front and right front corners, there is no roll in the wing.

Edited by ARTGP, 07 August 2020 - 15:10.

[rootten]

They didn't test medium tyres. Strange

 

[Viryfan]

They didn't test medium tyres. Strange

They will use them in fp3.

[pryanjack]

Fastest time on hard?

[gowebber]

Said it was on softs on Sky. Long run looked good too.

[Viryfan]

It was on soft.
Ocon lost all the time to danny on s1 and s3 during his run on softs.
They were on par in s2.

[TomNokoe]

Weakness cured?

[Neno]

Weakness cured?

It's always amusing to read this type of articles given whole car is literal definition of weakness. Losing everywhere time. 1+ second per lap off the pace compared to Mercedes and more than full half a second compared to 2nd fastest (to team which actually made setback and moved backwards). But hey "weakness cured"!  If true I guess people enjoy taking non existent victories. All I took from this is wind tunnel and track correlation is getting better and moving in positive direction. For what you asking - 2022.  

 

But I wont lie even on FP session seeing Renault on 3rd place does still look damn nice. 

Edited by Neno, 07 August 2020 - 15:52.

[pryanjack]

FIA timing app still showing hard tyre for Dans fastest lap

[Alburaq]

Is their S2 better?

Ric definnitely used the soft tire in his best lap.

But Ocon did a much longer run in his 'qualy sim' with S AFAIK.

 

Edit: Yes S2 looks better but I dunno https://pbs.twimg.co...=png&name=large

Edited by Alburaq, 07 August 2020 - 16:03.

[pryanjack]

Is their S2 better?
Ric definnitely used the soft tire in his best lap.
But Ocon did a much longer run in his 'qualy sim' with S AFAIK.

Edit: Yes S2 looks better but I dunno https://pbs.twimg.co...=png&name=large

Even that link showing the hard tyre ... wishful thinking on my part I guess ...

[Alburaq]

It shows the tire that is currently used / the last used tire ; )

AFAIK everybody in the top 10 used S in their 'qualy sim', except HAM and the RP https://pbs.twimg.co...jpg&name=medium

Edited by Alburaq, 07 August 2020 - 16:19.

[pryanjack]

Ah balls ... still not a bad time relatively

[rootten]

Is their S2 better?

Ric definnitely used the soft tire in his best lap.

But Ocon did a much longer run in his 'qualy sim' with S AFAIK.

 

Edit: Yes S2 looks better but I dunno https://pbs.twimg.co...=png&name=large

 

that's actually impressive 

[vee10]

https://twitter.com/...8306656256?s=19

Down at Renault doing post session interviews. Ricciardo the least jokey and most serious he’s been all year. Not in a negative way. Quite the opposite. Genuinely high hopes down here of a really decent showing this weekend.

[Amz964]

Must not get hopes up.... But that was a pleasant surprise getting to P3 but yeah Dan way quicker than Ocon in S1 and S3.

[masa90]

Could it be? That Alonso FINALLY is switching to a team on the rise?

[Viryfan]

Must not get hopes up.... But that was a pleasant surprise getting to P3 but yeah Dan way quicker than Ocon in S1 and S3.

 

Seems like, they were testing different items today.

 

Dan did a very short run of soft while Esteban was running a bit longer.

 

Both drivers are happy with the car.

 

https://www.renaults...iday.html?r=331

[vee10]

Seems like, they were testing different items today.

Dan did a very short run of soft while Esteban was running a bit longer.

Both drivers are happy with the car.

https://www.renaults...iday.html?r=331

Has a Renault driver ever used the word great since the glory days?

'For the afternoon, we had a bit of a warm-up, made a change to the car, which worked, and it felt great.'

[Alburaq]

It seems both drivers only used the old floor today.

[SonGoku]

The engine is the second best and very reliable, it's all about the chassis, if that becomes elite, I don't see why they cannot do well.

[Amz964]

Danny Ric very bullish about the chances this weekend. Maybe they've found a breakthrough with this new suspension components? And as others said looks like has changed the roll of the car with the front wing ride height and maybe they've found a sweet spot. However looks like the wind is changing tomorrow so let's see if it effects it hope not of course.

[ARTGP]

So Dan has been talking alot about how the tail end is hooked up on corner exit compared to last year, and now there's talk about some mechanical development to get the front wing working better in the high speed. I can't wait for Saturday.  Dan has been feeling like this is a Top 6 car all season.

Edited by ARTGP, 07 August 2020 - 20:56.

[eREr]

Don't know what to stay. I will stick to "this looks promising". Dan is really on it, his comments were really bullish.

Hope they will confirm this both in qualy and the race.

[Gambelli]

I think we need to be cautious regarding qualifying hopes.

 

I think the one thing that has affected them this year is tyre warmup (but the flip side is better tyre life) but on this overly soft tyre that very same thing probably assisted them hit a sweet spot over the lap

 

So the big test will be getting though Q2 on the Medium, if they can't, and are forced to start the race on the softest tyre, they'll be at a big disadvantage in the race.

 

Once in the top 10 though hopefully they can make good use of their tyres over 1 lap and get in the top 6

[ARTGP]

I think we need to be cautious regarding qualifying hopes.

 

I think the one thing that has affected them this year is tyre warmup (but the flip side is better tyre life) but on this overly soft tyre that very same thing probably assisted them hit a sweet spot over the lap

 

So the big test will be getting though Q2 on the Medium, if they can't, and are forced to start the race on the softest tyre, they'll be at a big disadvantage in the race.

 

Once in the top 10 though hopefully they can make good use of their tyres over 1 lap and get in the top 6

 

I'm not sure the Q3 on mediums will be possible with both cars.  Seb and Albon are the variables...

 

Otherwise you'd say Merc and Red Bull lockup 1-4th, and then a fight to backfill 5ht -10th with Mclaren, Ferrari, Racing Point, and Renault.....and 8 cars into 6 spaces...well you know the saying...One of them can easily bolt on the softs and leap ahead of everybody to P5. and that just sets a chain reaction of the cars from those 4 teams going out on softs.

[Gambelli]

I'm not sure the Q3 on mediums will be possible with both cars.  Seb and Albon are the variables...

 

Otherwise you'd say Merc and Red Bull lockup 1-4th, and then a fight to backfill 5ht -10th with Mclaren, Ferrari, Racing Point, and Renault.....and 8 cars into 6 spaces...well you know the saying...One of them can easily bolt on the softs and leap ahead of everybody to P5. and that just sets a chain reaction of the cars from those 4 teams going out on softs.

 

Yep, and if the temps drop a bit it will help everyone relative to Renault regarding tyre warmup (or lasting the whole lap I mean), and it will also increase the delta between the medium and soft making it even more likely that the softs will need to be used to progress to Q3.

 

I suppose though they can then go soft, medium, hard in the race but then by my reckoning if they wanted the medium and hard as new sets for the race it would mean not using either of those compounds in FP3 which wouldn't be possible.  So I'm not sure how that will all play out

[Astandahl]

 

Comparison between Danny Ric and Max lap time. The car seems very good in low speed stuff but suffering in high speed corners.

 

I also suggest following this channel because is always uploading very interesting content about F1.

[Ivanhoe]

Ricciardo on Renault's transformation

 

https://www.autospor...sformed-renault

[Alburaq]

Found something interesting yesterday: the engine that Alonso is watching on the dyno seems to be a split-turbo engine. A novelty for Viry. It's probably the 2022 PU 

The thing compared to the other two split-turbo engines:

-Yellow: roll-hoop duct
-purple: air filter enclosure
-turquoise: compressor entry air duct
-green: engine intake plenum
 

 

How the standard Viry dynos look : https://i.imgur.com/b8c2fGX.jpg

Edited by Alburaq, 25 September 2020 - 15:42.

[ARTGP]

Made a nice discovery yesterday: the engine that Alonso is watching on the dyno seems to be a split-turbo engine. A first for Viry. It's probably the 2022 PU 

 

 

This is monumental. Renault really are giving it there all. So now that Renault do not have customer teams, will they attempt to install this engine in the 2021 car for testing?

Edited by ARTGP, 25 September 2020 - 15:34.