31 replies to this topic

[William Hunt]

     kart 2017 2018 2019 2020 Total n.o.p. '20   

Nick Cassidy AUS  20 36 41  97 -- S. Form./ GT Toyota TOM'S

Luca Ghiotto ITA  30 6 40  76 -- F2  Hitech

Robert Schwartzman RUS  10 30 30  70 -- F2 Ferrari Prema

Naoki Yamamoto JAP  4 45 21  70 -- S.Form./ GT Honda Dandelion

Marcus Armstrong N-ZL  22 13 32  67 -- F2 Ferrari ART

Artem Markelov RUS  40 20 0  60 -- F2  HWA

Nyck de Vries NL  8 4 40  52 -- Form. E  Mercedes

Ryō Hirakawa JAP  24 23 0  47 -- S. Form. / GT Toyota Impul

Christian Lundgaard DK  24 12 9  45 -- F2 Renault ART

Liam Lawson N-ZL  7,5 12 22 7 41,5 -- F3 Red Bull Hitech

Sérgio Sette Câmara BRA  0 10 30  40 -- S. Form. Red Bull Motopark

Jack Aitken ENG  20 0 20  40 -- F2 Williams Campos

Mick Schumacher D  0 30 0  30 -- F2 Ferrari Prema

Dan Ticktum ENG  7 30 1  38 6th F2 Williams DAMS

Ukyo Sasahara JAP  10 10 18  38 ? ?  ?

Jüri Vips EST  12 10 15  37 3rd S. Form. Red Bull Mugen

Ritomo Miyata JAP  12 12 12  36 / Sup. F. Light Toyota TOM'S

Sacha Fenestraz FRA  15 0 15  30 ? S.Form./ GT Toyota Kondo

Jehan Daruvala IND  7 1 20  28 5th F2 Red Bull Carlin

Yuki Tsunoda JAP  7 12 10 3 29 5th F2 Red Bull Carlin

Bent Viscaal NL  20 12 0  32 1st F3  MP

Jake Hughes ENG  8 16 7  31 3rd F3  HWA

Victor Martins FRA 4 10 5 12  31 / F. Renault  ART

Álex Palou ESP  10 4 15  29 2nd IndyCar  Dale Coyne

Kenta Yamashita JAP  0 1 27  28 ? S. Form./ GT Toyota Kondo

Dennis Hauger NOR  0 5 22  27 4th F3 Red Bull Hitech

Enzo Fittipaldi BRA  0 19 8  27 4th F3  HWA

Sho Tsuboi JAP  12 15 0  27 1st S. Form. / GT Toyota Inging

Oscar Piastri AUS  10 1 15  26 2nd F3 Renault Prema

Callum Illot ENG  10 15 0  25 4th F2 Ferrari Virtuosi

Pedro Piquet BRA  7 5 12  24 2nd F2  Charouz

Aleksandr Smolyar RUS  14 0 10  24 1st F3  ART

Felipe Drugovich BRA  7 15 0  22 4th F2  MP

Nirei Fukuzumi JAP  15 4 3  22 ? S.Form./ GT Honda Dandelion

Enaam Ahmed ENG  10 2 10  22 1st F3  Carlin

Nikita Mazepin RUS  1 20 0 12 21 8th F2  Hitech

Max Fewtrell ENG  3 15 2  20 3rd F3 Renault Hitech

Nobuharu Matsushita JAP  10 0 10  20 4th F2 Honda MP

Richard Verschoor NL 3 5 7 5  20 1st F3  MP

Pietro Fittipaldi BRA  20 0 0 6 20 / F1 test Haas

Ugo De Wilde BEL  7 10 2  19 / F. Renault  Arden

Jack Doohan AUS  1 3 14 14 18 5th F3 Red Bull HWA

Clément Novalak FRA 7 0 1 10  18 1st F3  Carlin

Gianluca Petecof BRA  0 5 13  18 / F. Regional Ferrari Prema

Lirim Zendeli D  5 12 0 0 17 1st F3  Trident

Logan Sargeant USA 3 7 7 0  17 / F3  Prema

Caio Collet BRA  0 12 5  17 / F. Renault Renault R-Ace

Lorenzo Colombo ITA  7 3 7  17 / F. Renault  Bhaitech

Kiern Jewiss ENG 2 0 12 3  17 / BRDC F3   Douglas

Frederik Vesti DK  1 5 10  16 1st F3   Prema

Ayrton Simmons ENG  1 10 5  16 / Euroformula  Double R

Teppei Natori JAP  0 12 3  15 / Sup. F. Light Honda Toda

Marino Sato JAP  0 0 15  15 4th F2  Trident

Zane Maloney BAR 3 0 0 12  15 / Euroformula  Carlin

Ms. Jamie Chadwick ENG  0 0 15 10 15 / W Series 

Leonardo Pulcini ITA  0 10 5  15 / ?   ?

Toshiki Oyu JAP  5 3 7  15 ? S. Form. / GT Honda Nakajima

Guanyu Zhou CHN  3 3 8  14 4th F2 Renault Virtuosi

Lucas Auer AUT  5 3 6  14 / DTM  BMW

Lukas Dunner AUT 2 0 2 10  14 1st F3   MP

Théo Pourchaire FRA 1 0 0 12  13 / F3 Sauber ART

Paul Aron EST 5 0 0 8  13 / F. Renault Mercedes ART

Hadrien David FRA  0 0 13  13 / F. Renault Renault MP

Guilherme Samaia BRA  10 3 0  13 3rd F2  Campos

Colton Herta USA  7 1,2 4  12,2 1st IndyCar  Harding

Luca Allen IRL  0 0 12  12 / Sup. F. Light  Albirex

Kazuto Kotaka JAP  0 7 5  12 / Sup. F. Light Toyota TOM'S

Yifei Ye CHN  1 10 0  11 / Euroformula  Crypto Tower

Ulysse De Pauw BEL 4 0 7 0  11 / BRDC F3   Douglas

Sena Sakaguchi JAP  3 7 1  11 / Sup. F. Light  Motopark

Yuji Kunimoto JAP  0 7 4  11 ? S.Form./ GT Toyota KCMG

Olli Caldwell ENG  0 8 2,8  10,8 1st F3  Trident

Giuliano Alesi FRA  7 3 0  10 3rd F2 Ferrari HWA

Igor Fraga FIN  0 4 6 10 10 3rd F3 Red Bull Charouz

Arthur Leclerc MC  0 3 7  10 / F. Regional Ferrari Prema

Devlin DeFrancesco CAN  10 0 0 3 10 / F3  Trident

Reshad de Gerus FRA  0 0 10  10 / F. Renault  Arden

Sebastián Álvarez MEX  0 0 10  10 / BRDC F3   Double R

Yu Kanamaru JAP  3 5 1 4 9 / TCR Japan  Team Goh

Kush Maini IND  0 5 3  8 / F. Renault  Bhaitech

Louis Deletraz CH  0 1 6  7 3rd F2 Haas Charouz

Sebastián Fernández VEN  7 0 0  7 / F3  ART

David Beckman D  0 7 0  7 / ?  ?

Glenn van Berlo NL  0 0 7  7 / Euroformula  Drivex

Louis Foster ENG  0 0 7  7 / BRDC F3   Double R

Antonio Felix Da Costa POR  0 0 6 30 6 ? Form. E  DS Techeeta

Petr Ptacek CZE  0 4 2  6 / F. Renault  R-Ace

Sean Gelael MAL  4 2 0  6 3rd F2  DAMS

Roy Nissany ISR  6 0 0  6 3rd F2 Williams Trident

Cameron Das USA  1 5 0  6 / F3  Carlin

Victor Bernier FRA  0 0 5  5 / F4  R-Ace

Rinus Van Kalmthout NL  0 2 2,4  4,4 1st IndyCar  Ed Carpenter

Oliver Askew USA  0 1 3  4 1st IndyCar  McLaren

Roman Stanek CZE  0 0 4  4 / F. Regional Sauber Prema

David Schumacher D  0 0 4  4 / F3  Charouz

Charles Milesi FRA  1 2 0  3 / Super Form.   Motopark

Fabio Scherer CH  3 0 0  3 / DTM  Audi WRT

Federico Malvestiti ITA  0 2 0  2 / F3  Jenzer

Patrik Pasma FIN  0 2 0  2 / F. Regional  KIC

Patricio O'Ward MEX  0 1,5 0  1,5 1st IndyCar  McLaren

Ms. Sophia Flörsch D  0 0 1,2  1,2 / F3  Campos

Oliver Rasmussen DK  0 0 1  1 / F. Regional  Prema

Esteban Muth BEL  0 0 1  1 / ?  ?

Alex Peroni AUS  0 0 0  0 / F3  Campos

Niko Kari FIN  0 0 0  0 / F3  Charouz

Matteo Nannini ITA  0 0 0  0 / F3  Jenzer

Tadasuke Makino JAP  0 0 0  0 / Super Form. Honda Nakajima

Calan Williams AUS  0 0 0  0 / F3  Jenzer

 

 

Remarks:

 

- I applied the 2020 Super Licence Points system, some slight changed were made: FIA F3 points were slightly upgraded, championships with less than 16 cars were downgraded in points: in particular the European F. Regional championship suffered because of this (under previous rules drivers would have scored 75% of the points there, now only 40%). IndyLights would under the previous ('19) system not have scored any points at all because of lack of cars, now that would score 10-20% of the score if they had a full 16 car field in every race.

- Naturally drivers like Frederik Vesti or Enzo Fittpaldi lost points because of the rules adjustment, if Formula Regional can't secure 16 car grid races this year they will not score 100% points either there this year.

 

- Because of the upgraded FIA Formula 3 points Jüri Vips now has to finish 3rd overall this season in Super Formula, under previous rules he had to finish second overall in Super Formula this year. 

 

- I did not include Formula E (apart from de Vries, many of the Formula E drivers already posses a Super Licence anyway) or IndyCar drivers (bar some young ones) in this list and also excluded the oldest Super Formula drivers

 

- Drivers in junior single seater classes that posses a Super Licence (and don't have to worry about the 40 or more points rule anymore the next couple of years since they already went over the limit):

 

Nick Cassidy  (Australia)             

Luca Ghiotto  (Italy)                     

Robert Schwartzman  (Russia)  

Naoki Yamamoto  (Japan)

Marcus Armstrong  (New Zealand)

Artem Markelov  (Russia)

Nyck de Vries  (Netherlands)

Ryo Hirakawa  (Japan)

Christian Lundgaard  (Denmark)

Liam Lawson  (New Zealand)

Sérgio Sette Camara  (Brazil)

Jack Aitken  (England)

Mick Schumacher  (Germany) *

 

* Mick Schumacher scored 30 pts the past 3 years but he already obtained his Super Licence in 2018 (for 2016-2017-2018)

 

So of the current F1 junior drivers we have the following situation:

 

Ferrari:   Schwartzman, Armstrong & Schumacher all have their F1 licence already!

 

               Illot needs to finish 4th in F2

               Giuliano Alesi needs to finish 3rd in F2

               Enzo Fittipaldi needs to finish 4th in F3

               

               The other Ferrari junior drivers are: Arthur Leclerc & Gianluca Petecoff in Formula Regional and Dino Beganovic in Formula 4 (I expect them to add F4 driver Gabriele Mini to their roster in the near future)

 

Renault:  Lundgaard has his F1 licence already

 

               Zhou needs to finish 4th in F2

               Fewtrell needs to finish 3rd in F3

               Piastri needs to finish 2nd in F2

               their other junior drivers are Caio Collet & Hadrien David but both are still in F. Renault

               Martins & Lorandi were released by Renault

               

Red Bull: Liam Lawson has his Super Licence already obtained!

               Sérgio Sette Camara also has his Super Licence, he is already Red Bull & Toro Rosso reserve driver this year

     

               Tsunoda needs to finish 5th in F2

               Daruvala needs to finish 5th in F2

               Jüri Vips needs to finish 3rd in Super Formula

               Jack Doohan needs to finish 5th in FIA F3 this year

               Dennis Hauger needs to finish 4th in FIA F3 this year    

               Jonny Edgar & Jak Crawford are still too young to obtain the licence

 

Williams: Jack Aitken has his Super Licence

                Dan Ticktum needs to finish 6th in F2

 

Haas:     Louis Deletraz had the bad luck that his 2nd place overall in F. Renault & in the World Series by Renault are now more than 3 years ago, he would need to finish 3rd in F2 to get his Super Licence

 

Mercedes has the still very young Paul Aron in Formula Renault this year. It's unclear whether Sauber is stopping their junior program (I assume they are).

 

The conclusion when you look at these facts & numbers is that Helmut Markko is doing a very poor job at Red Bull.

 

Another strange fact that I discovered: Nikita Mazepin only needs to finish 8th overall in F2 this year to get his Super Licence, I had not realised he was so close to it

Edited by William Hunt, 17 May 2020 - 06:12.

[registered]

I guess they will count one more year for next season since this year there no lower series running.

[Kalmake]

I guess they will count one more year for next season since this year there no lower series running.

Almost certainly at least some of them will run. Much of the year left still.

[BRG]

Thank you for doing this work, WH.  Very enlightening.

 

The BIG question must be - whose drink did Nick Cassidy spit into that he has never once been seriously linked to any F1 seat?

[Ben1445]

The BIG question must be - whose drink did Nick Cassidy spit into that he has never once been seriously linked to any F1 seat?

Just how it seems to be really. Sometimes you can have all the skill and none of the luck. F1 is just really rubbish like that. 

 

He's even into that terrible position of, among other things, 'genuinely' evaluating a drive in that driver dustbin of hopeless souls who were never truly good enough 

[maximilian]

I wish the FIA would maintain a LIVE "leader board" just like this!

[balage06]

Liam Lawson has his Super Licence already obtained!

 

Are you sure? By my calculations, he still needs a few points.

[jcbc3]

I'm confused about your table and conclusions. I don't believe Lundgaard has enough points yet for a Super License. What am I not understanding?

[maximilian]

Thank you for doing this work, WH.  Very enlightening.

 

The BIG question must be - whose drink did Nick Cassidy spit into that he has never once been seriously linked to any F1 seat?

 

I also don't understand that!

[muramasa]

　

Nick Cassidy is typical case of talented but unlucky white drivers with no strong backers. Being white means you are in the market where drivers are always saturated because Europe or Western in general is major motorsport scene hence competition is severe. Being Japanese or Asians or Eastern European or South Americans of course has its own cons, but in cases of drivers like Cassidy, if he was from non-European countries or at least not from remote place in NZ it would have been easier to find backers. There have been many such drivers, top on the list is Lotterer, then Duval, Treluyer, etc. Palou is another prominent one among young drivers. There are many others who raced in F2 for just one or 2 years only to find places at FE, WEC, etc.

While it's good that we have drivers like Russel, Norris, Albon rightly linked and going up to F1, we also have Latifi and most of those test/development drivers in most F1 teams dont deserve it either. So it's shame that drivers like Cassidy Palou etc keep being overlooked.

 

[William Hunt]

Are you sure? By my calculations, he still needs a few points.

 

I just double checked and you are correct, must have made a rare error there.He would have had a couple of points less due to me not substracting % of a series he was in with no full field but...

he still has the Super Licence anyway because of the Toyota Series points he earned from early this year added to his tally end of 2020 (I noted them but did not add those yet since they're only added end of season)

 

That would bring his total end of 2020 at 41 points and that is without any possible points he could still score in F3 this year so yes Lawson will have a Super Licence 100% for sure end of 2020 that in theory allows him to do F1 in 2021.

Edited by William Hunt, 17 May 2020 - 16:10.

[Ivanhoe]

Thanks for this overview William, always hard to find the actual standings. don’t understand why FIA hasn’t a table on their website.

[William Hunt]

I'm confused about your table and conclusions. I don't believe Lundgaard has enough points yet for a Super License. What am I not understanding?

 

Double checked Lundgaard again, and his points tally is correct, very sure about that.

People should however look out to not use the Super Licence points table posted on wikipedia because that table is the one from 2019, there are slight differences with the 2020 version (somehow they didn't update that on wiki). But with the 2019 points system Lundgaard would still score 46 (instead of 49 pts) so he would still be over the 40 pts limit.

 

Lundgaard scored 24 points for his Spanish & SMP F4 titles (twice 12 pts) in 2017, he scored 12 pts for 2nd overall in F. Renault Eurocup, that makes a total of 36 already. And he scored 9 pts for finishing 6th overall in FIA F3 (according to the old, 2019, pts system he would have scored 6 instead of 9 there so he would have had 42 instead of 45 with the old system, both over the limit).

 

Now end of 2020 and going in to 2021 Lundgaard would lose those 24 pts from 2017 but that doesn't matter since he is at this point already over the 40 pts limit: you only need to cross that once, Mick Schumacher dropped below 40 afterwards but still kept his licence.

 

Some rules were tweaked the last couple of years. At one point (prior to 2018 I believe) they were only allowed to count points from one championship per season but after '18 they could choose 2 championships per year so Lundgaard's two F4 titles (those champ. had enough cars on each event) both count.

 

Also there is a point for a driver who runs a Friday F1 practice per session if that session is at least 100 km in length. To be able to drive on Friday practice one needs either 25 Super Licence Points or having completed 6 F2 races. 

 

Also in 2018 there was a rule that any driver who drove a full championship (every race) without any penalty points (on his licence? unclear) for bad on track behaviour or dangerous driving etc... would receive up to 2 Super Licence Points per year (or per championship, that was also unclear). That would mean drivers could potentially have more pts with that added.

But .... to my knowledge this rule was abandoned in 2019 but I am not 100% certain of it since the FIA website actually still mentions this rule but on a page from 2018 that was not updated! So I think they don't give those 'points for clean driving anymore' but I cannot tell for certain....

 

The lack of transparency of the FIA is staggering. They don't publish a list with driver pts, their rules pages are not all updated (in particular document L)... it's so bad that I had to search myself to first of all find the correct points system of 2020 (since wikipedia mentions the outdated one with less points for FIA F3) and calculate all points myself per driver.

Edited by William Hunt, 17 May 2020 - 17:35.

[jcbc3]

No, still don't get it.

 

https://www.planetf1...aard-formula-1/

 

I've read several articles in Danish papers about him not being eligible yet. I'm sure they would play up, rather than down.

[William Hunt]

No, still don't get it.

 

https://www.planetf1...aard-formula-1/

 

I've read several articles in Danish papers about him not being eligible yet. I'm sure they would play up, rather than down.

 

The mistake they are making is that they are not counting the 24 points he scored in 2017, they only drop off in december 2020 and they have substracted them already but Lundgaard already was above the treshhold in december 2019. The 2020 points are only added in december of that year so at this point the 2017-2019 points count (last 3 years).

 

And also note that a driver can score points from TWO different championships and not just 1 as some people seem to think, that's why Nikita Mazepin had entered Asian F3 and why several drivers hunt for licence points in the Toyota series in the winter, it's also why some FIA F3 drivers did some Euroformula Open races). People may not realise this but it is written black on white on Document L (that specifies the rules for the licences) of the FIA and that is also written on wikipedia.

When the FIA started the Super Licence system you could only score from one championship per year but this was changed in 2018 and it counted in retrograde so also 2017.

 

Because of lack of transparency of FIA Red bull (well that mostly down to massive stupidity of Helmut Marko) even thought last year that Patricio O'Ward could still somehow score a Super Licence, madness because he only has 1.5 points on his licence, what was Red Bull thinking!

I remember that I was saying all year long that there was no way that O'Ward could score a Super Licence because he had zero points at that time (with 2020 rules that changed to 1.5 points because there were hardly any cars in Indy Lights, with the 2019 pts system not even enough to score a single point, with 2020 rules they could score some points in retrograde).

Yet many people kept saying (on this forum, in the press...) O'Ward could still get a licence, we know better now.

 

The mistake Markko made was thinking that he would score full points for his Indy Lights results (he only got 10 or 20% for that) and Markko 'overlooked' that O'Ward raced in a second division prototype sportscar class in the States and not in the top division (that for example Nasr drove in) of the Weathertech championship so he scored zero points for that yet there were people, including Marko, who added points of an IMSA title to his tally. This just proves how teams often don't even know but franky Markko was very stupid there because if I can find the FIA documents then he should be able to do so as well and of all people who should know he is one of them because he is in charge of a driver program.

He even moved O'Ward shortly to F2 and Super Formula, a driver who had no points on his Super Licence...how stupid can Marko be?

 

And the winter before Red Bull entered Dan Ticktum in the F3 Asian Winter Series but FIA rules say that Super Licence points are only awarded if the championship runs over 5 races at 3 different FIA sanctioned circuits, that was not the case here yet Red Bull did sent Ticktum and found out later...

These things just show that Marko is completely incompetent.

 

Please note that I never counted points for the Spanish F3 championship (since that was technically a part of the Euroformula Open series) and I also did not count points for the MRF Series in India since it was nowhere specified in FIA documents if they could score there (Jamie Chadwick lost points there in my list because of this reason).

Edited by William Hunt, 17 May 2020 - 17:37.

[jcbc3]

I wont ask you if you are sure, because you very apparently are.

 

So someone should inform the Renault F1 team they already have a qualified driver there. And cheap to boot.

[William Hunt]

No, still don't get it.

 

https://www.planetf1...aard-formula-1/

 

I've read several articles in Danish papers about him not being eligible yet. I'm sure they would play up, rather than down.

 

Okay so let's just say that I would only count the years 2018 and 2019 even though that's wrong sine it's the last three and not two years. He would lose his F4 title points then (24 pts) but the article claims he has 18 points... just count with me: he was 2nd in F. Renault Eurocup that's 12 points, last year he was 6th overall in FIA F.3 that's 9 points totalling to 21!

They can only get 18 if the used the old points system which had only 6 pts for 6th in F3 (it's 9 now) but that doesn't explain why they didn't count the three last years... That article is utter crap, written by people who don't know the rules.

Edited by William Hunt, 17 May 2020 - 17:43.

[jcbc3]

Do you know for a fact that the new point rule is applied retrospectively? Because if not, we may be closer to an answer.

[William Hunt]

Do you know for a fact that the new point rule is applied retrospectively? Because if not, we may be closer to an answer.

 

I see now what this mistake is that they made.

What makes it even more strange is that it would not matter for Lundgaard if it was retrospectively or not because... he would have actually scored a bit more points then (due to F. Renault Eurocup beiing downgraded, I counted the lower points for F. Renault! A F. Renault title used to be 18 pts in the past, I always counted 15 for it, the current tally) but that's balanced off by the fact that FIA F.3 now scores him 3 pts more!

The Formula 4 points did not change the past couple of years! And even if you would count only one title of Formula 4 you would never end up at the 18 pts of that article, it would have been 30 (actually 33 more correctly with the current FIA F3 system).

 

First of all they used the older (and not the latest one, in december '19 released pts system) calculation, second of all they only counted points for 2018-2019-2020 but the current licence points a driver has is dated from december 2019 thus you don't have to include 2020 (which has not finished yet) but do have to include 2017.

But as I mentioned before the difference for Lundgaard between the previous system is 3 pts less for FIA F3  and the difference with older systems is that F. Renault had slightly higher points so if it was retrograded then Lundgaard would have scored 2 or 3 more points there so that balances out with the new FIA F3 system.

 

Possibly they do not realise that a driver keeps his licence at least three years if he passes the treshhold once! This is specified in detail in document L from the FIA. They write that any driver who passes the treshhold has to re-apply for the licence if he had it more than three years ago and the FIA can still grant it back then if the driver has driven in a series at a standard considered high enough by the FIA and the FIA could demand a F1 test of 300kms obtained within 2 days as well. But that's only after you have not used (and paid) the Super Licence for 3 years!

 

And also note that drivers, according to Document L, also score 2 pts per year per full championship that they didn't get penalty points for misconduct on track. Since I'm not sure if they still use that rule (it's still on the FIA website though) that could mean that Lundgaard has even more points as we assume since I never counted that.

Edited by William Hunt, 17 May 2020 - 18:08.

[Ivanhoe]

I don’t think any new points system has been introduced retrospectively. This is the wording of Supplement 1 to the 2020 Appendix L of the ISC.

 

 

 

Notes:

i) The following points table is applicable from 2020 onwards and considers championships that were completed in 2020.

ii) Points are awarded according to the applicable regulatory text of the year in which the final championship result has been achieved.

Edited by Ivanhoe, 17 May 2020 - 18:11.

[William Hunt]

all this counting and looking up obscure documents and rules on their site would not be necessary if they just published at the end of each year in December how much Super Licence Points each driver has.
There have been problems with Red Bull not knowing how many points O'Ward had and how many Ticktum could still score (that was clearly stated on FIA site though) and now there are problems with Renault not knowing (or Danish journalists or even Lundgaard himself not knowing that he passed the treshhold).... Why isn't the FIA more transparent then? 
 

[William Hunt]

I don’t think any new points system has been introduced retrospectively. This is the wording of Supplement 1 to the 2020 Appendix L of the ISC.

 

As I had mentioned it absolutely doesn't matter in Lundgaard's case because he actually would have scored 2 or 3 more pts for his F. Renault year, 3 less points for Formula 3 so it balances out. F.4 points have not changed the past 3 years.

 

Also Mick Schumacher, who only reached the treshhold once and only just but who is below it now mentioned that he has the FIA Super Licence hanging on his wall! So you don't have to go over 40 points every year, once is enough.

Edited by William Hunt, 17 May 2020 - 18:17.

[johnwilliamdavies]

　

Nick Cassidy is typical case of talented but unlucky white drivers with no strong backers. Being white means you are in the market where drivers are always saturated because Europe or Western in general is major motorsport scene hence competition is severe. 

 

Race obviously has nothing to do with it. You either need money or talent, and Cassidy doesn't have enough of either. 

[Ivanhoe]

As I had mentioned it absolutely doesn't matter in Lundgaard's case because he actually would have scored 2 or 3 more pts for his F. Renault year, 3 less points for Formula 3 so it balances out. F.4 points have not changed the past 3 years.

 

Also Mick Schumacher, who only reached the treshhold once and only just but who is below it now mentioned that he has the FIA Super Licence hanging on his wall! So you don't have to go over 40 points every year, once is enough.

Wasn’t attacking your list WH, just answering jcbc3’s post   A Super License expires after 3 years if not followed by an F1 seat (practice sessions excluded) by the way, it’s not an indefinite thing.

Edited by Ivanhoe, 17 May 2020 - 18:55.

[William Hunt]

I don’t think any new points system has been introduced retrospectively. This is the wording of Supplement 1 to the 2020 Appendix L of the ISC.

 

Well this would make a significant difference for some driver, it would mean that drivers who were in European Formula Regional last year (like Enzo Fittipaldi, Igor Fraga or the title winner Frederik Vesti would all score ZERO point for that season.... I calculated the new system that would still give them 40% of the total (also not that much off course). Before a championship needed to have 12 car minimum entered in every race weekend + 16 competitors across the championship, if it as between 12 & 75% would be awarded but the first race weekend of Formula Regional only had 10 cars entered, below 12 so no points then....under the new system they would still get 40% of the points...

Another consequence is that I gave Jüri Vips a bit too much now and that he would have to finish second overall in Super Formula after all and not third (2020 F3 pts system), oh boy that does make a considerable difference to Vips or the Formula Regional drivers...

Edited by William Hunt, 17 May 2020 - 18:51.

[William Hunt]

Wasn’t attacking your list WH, just answering jcbc3’s post 

 

well my list has considerable faults now concerning drivers who had a top 10 score of FIA F3 in 2020 (previous seasons F3 = correct) and who were in Formula Regional last year (they would score nothing) + possible variations of drivers who did F. Renault in 2017 ....

[Ivanhoe]

It’s a complicated thing WH, FIA should really be more transparent on the system and share a list on their website. Really appreciate your effort to provide us with a list though 

Edited by Ivanhoe, 17 May 2020 - 18:58.

[William Hunt]

It’s a complicated thing WH, FIA should really be more transparent on the system and share a list on their website. Really appreciate your effort to provide us with a list though 

 

Next winter I will calculate it again but with the '17, '18, '19 & '20 points systems in my hand since I clearly used the '20 system for '19 (only changes F3 & Regional) but oh boy I would love it if the FIA just published it...saves a lot of effort, I really don't feel like re-calculating the '19 scores now...

[maximilian]

Palou etc keep being overlooked.

 

Palou is no longer overlooked, he is making his IndyCar debut this season.     

[balage06]

An update for the OP would be great now that the F3 season ended. I guess Piastri and Lawson have enough points now, not sure about the others.

[Viryfan]

An update for the OP would be great now that the F3 season ended. I guess Piastri and Lawson have enough points now, not sure about the others.

Lawson lost 5 points for 2017.

[balage06]

Here is the latest FIA Appendix L if anyone is in the mood for calculation:

https://www.fia.com/...nd-conduct-2019

 

Apparently the FIA increased the points for the 4th-10th place finishers in FIA F3, so Lawson actually has 43 points now:

2018 - 10 points (2nd in ADAC F4)

2019 - 14 points (1st in TRS and 2nd in Euroformula Open)

2020 - 19 points (2nd in TRS and 5th in FIA F3)

 

Piastri comfortably has it with 48 points:

2019 - 18 points (1st in FR Eurocup)

2020 - 30 points (1st in FIA F3)

 

Pourchare is an interesting case, because he didn't won the main French F4 in 2018, but the Junior category with only 4 contestants, I don't think that's eligible for points?

2019 - 12 points (1st in ADAC F4)

2020 - 25 points (2nd in FIA F3)

 

Sargeant isn't there yet

2018 - 3 points (4th in FR Eurocup)

2020 - 20 points (3rd in FIA F3)

 

Vesti also eligible with 45 points

2018 - 5 points (4th in ADAC F4)

2019 - 25 points (1st in Regional F3 Europe)

2020 - 15 points (4th in FIA F3)

Edited by balage06, 13 September 2020 - 12:32.