24 replies to this topic

[Gary C]

lads, can anyone give me any info about this event?  I'm presuming it was in Singapore in the early 60's. I tried to take a quick look through Wikipedia but could only come up with a passing mention of it in the general section about the much more recent Malaysian Grand Prix at Sepang. Particularly interested in info one the Thompson Road Circuit but any info gratefully received, especially a list of starters.

[Vitesse2]

Gary: the Thomson (no P) Road Circuit was indeed in Singapore and in operation from 1961-73. As that article makes clear, the history of the races there is complicated: "races until 1965 are now considered part of the lineage of the Malaysian Grand Prix, and races after Singapore's independence in 1966 are considered part of the lineage of the Singapore Grand Prix."

 

However, Johore (now Johor) is on the mainland, adjacent to Singapore. The first Johore GP, held on a public road/street circuit called Johore Bahru, was actually run in 1940, although it seems to have been organised by the Singapore Motor Club.

 

We've had previous threads on the 1960 Johor GP and the 1963 Johore GP if those are of any help.

[Gary C]

this is one of the images I have just acquired.

 

 

 

click on the photo for a larger image

Edited by Gary C, 14 January 2018 - 17:12.

[Stephen W]

I am sure Autosport covered the events.

[D-Type]

this is one of the images I have just acquired.

 

 

 

click on the photo for a larger image

Methinks the photo is mirrored.  Unless someone produced a LHD Lotus XI clone!

[RogerFrench]

By the way, Johor is the State, Johor Baru is the capital city at the end of the old causeway from Singapore.

[Gary C]

'Methinks the photo is mirrored.  Unless someone produced a LHD Lotus XI clone!'

 Thanks  indeed for that, Duncan. I should have noticed it myself. Now corrected

Edited by Gary C, 15 January 2018 - 17:02.

[Ray Bell]

Could be Tony Hugget's Lotus 11 in 1961...

It broke a con-rod while in third place.

[Porsche718]

The "Johore Grand Prix" ran from 1948 to 1953, the "1st" Johore" Coronation Grand Prix in 1960, then the "2nd" Johore Coronation Grand Prix in 1961. Confused yet?

 

The 1948 event was really only a charity "War Benefit" event. I've had some difficulty getting detials but from 1949 I have this.

 

 

 

1949 October 2             Pasir Oudang              Malaysia

Johore Grand Prix      15 laps 52.5 miles

Entry:

21 Mick Jennings   MG TC                  4 1250 C O Jennings

   Lim Peng Han    LA Ford Special       V8 3917

   Neil Montcrieff Kudensay Ford Special V8 3917 J Montcrieff

   Jim Milne       J D Special              3750 J A Milne

   S Theraviam     MG TC                  4 1250

   Chow Ah Teng    K & K Special

   Yip Peng Lin    LA Special               1493

   S Theraviam     MG TC                  4 1250

   Kok Kum Wah     K & K Special            1490

   S A Dawood      D L A Fiat Special     4 1098

   H F Hellya      Singer                 4 1074

   Fred Pope       Fiat                   4 1098 C F Pope

Results:

  1 Jennings   MG       34:36 53.63 mph

  2 Milne      JD

  3 Threaviam  MG

dnf Montcrieff Kudensay 13 laps engine

dnf Han        LA       12 laps steering/accident

Fastest lap: Jennings MG 57.36 mph

 

1950 August 6                Pasir Oudang                Malaysia

Johore Grand Prix         20 laps 41.25 miles

Entry:

18                 MG

26 Wong Loo Cheong Silver Arrow II

34 Pat Pattinson   MG TC s/c              4 1250 J M Pattison

38 Lim Wong Nyan   LA Ford Special       V8

   Lim Peng Han    LA Jaguar Special        3500        

   F M Ferguson    Jaguar XK120           6 3442

   J Montcrieff    Kudensay Ford Special V8 3917 J N K Montcrieff

   Johns           Jaguar Special

   Fred Pope       Fiat 1100 S            4 1100 C F Pope

   Peter Laws      PAL Special                   P A Laws

   Middleton       Fiat

   Jim Milne       J D Special           V8      J A Milne

   Mick Jennings   MG TC                  4 1250 C O Jennings

Results:

  1 Pattinson  MG       49.8 mph

  2 Ferguson   Jaguar   48.7 mph

  3 Jennings   MG       48.4 mph

  4 Pope       Fiat

dnf Johns      Jaguar   15 laps accident

dnf Laws       PAL              engine

dnf Han        LA        0 laps accident

dnf Montcrieff Kudensay  0 laps accident/overturned

Fastest lap: Ferguson Jaguar 55.64 mph

 

1951 August 5                             Pasir Oudang                       Malaysia

Johore Grand Prix                       25 laps 52 miles

Entry:

 7 Jim Milne           J D Special            V8 3917

18 Chia Eng Quee       Airhen Javelin Special  4 1486

21 Mick Jennings       MG TC                   4 1250                    dns - engine

22 Fred Pope           Jaguar XK120            6 3442 R Donovan

27 Lim Peng Han        LA Special                3500

29 Roy Kendall         Kudensay II            V8 3917 V F Kendall

30 Paul Gibbs-Pancheri Bentley                   4485 P J Gibbs-Pancheri

33 L C Chan            MG TD                   4 1250

34 Jim Pattinson       MG TC s/c               4 1250 J M Pattinson

35 L H Chan            MG TD                   4 1250

39 Peter Laws          Fiat                    4 1500 P A Laws

45 Brian Hawes         Jaguar XK120            6 3442 B R Hawes

63 Bill Ferguson       Cooper JAP                 996 J G M Ferguson

71 H Alford            LA Special             V8 3917

79 Derek Bovet-White   Jaguar XK120            6 3442 C D B White

80 F M Ferguson        Jaguar XK120            6 3442

81 Ho Yue Kong         Jaguar XK120            6 3442

82 S A Dawood          D Special                 3250

Results:

  1 Ferguson       Cooper  57.81 mph

  2 Hawes          Jaguar

  3 Ferguson       Jaguar

  4 Bovet-White    Jaguar

  5 Gibbs-Pancheri Bentley

dnf Pope           Jaguar   23 laps brakes

dnf Kong           Jaguar

dnf Kendall        Kudensay

dnf Han            LA       14 laps accident

dnf Pattinson      MG       11 laps overturned

dnf Quee           Javelin   8 laps engine

Fastest laps: Ferguson Cooper 2:04 59.68 mph

              Hawes    Jaguar 2:04 59.68 mph

 

1952 August 3                  Pasir Oudang                 Malaysia

Johore Grand Prix            35 laps 72 laps

Entry:

11 Phil Caroline     Allard J2 Ford  V8 3917        P J Caroline

13 F E N Wills       Jowett Jupiter   4 1485

15 M G Nettlefield   Special         V8 3972

21 Mick Jennings     MF TC s/c        2 1250        C O Jennings  

23 Fred Pope         FP 23            4 1250 S1581  C F Pope

24 Saw Kim Thiat     Jaguar XK120     6 3442 BB1111

25 Au Nai Fai        Jaguar XK120     6 3442

27 Lim Peng Han      LA Special       4 1250

28 F D Johns         FA Ford Special V8 3917

29 Neil Montcrieff   Cooper             1096        J N K Montcrieff

30 L H Chan          MG TD            4 1250

33 L C Chan          MG TD            4 1250

39 F J Dollin        LS 3               4260

51 G A Linney        JD Ford Special V8 3917

60 Derek Bovet-White Jaguar XK120     6 3442        C D B White

63 Bill Ferguson     Cooper JAP          996

77 N G Reddish       A40 Sports       4 1260

Results:

  1 Bovet-White Jaguar 58.27 mph

  2 Thiat       Jaguar 58.25 mph

  3 Ferguson    Cooper 51.39 mph

  4 Chan        MG

  5 Chan        MG

  6 Han         LA

  7 Montcrieff  Cooper

dnf Jennings           32 laps engine

dnf Fai         Jaguar 27 laps accident/radiator

dnf Pope        FP             engine

Fastest lap: Montcrieff Cooper 62.87 mph

 

1953 August 2                        Pasir Oudang                      Malaysia

Johore Grand Prix                 40 laps 82.5 miles

Entry:

21 Syd Anderson    Double V8            V8 7500

22 Fred Pope       Jaguar XK120 Special  6 3442

   W H Davis       Jaguar XK120          6 3442

25 Au Nai Fai      Jaguar XK120          6 3442

81 Carlo Vigano    Alfa Romeo 8C         8                       dns - accident

   L C Chan        Cooper

   L H Chan

   HO Yue Chong    Jaguar                6 3442

   Au Nai Faf      Jaguar XK120          6 3442

   Phil Caroline   Allard J2X Ford      V8 3917 P J Caroline

   Chan Lye Choon  Cooper                  1096

   Chan Lye Huat   Cooper

   Mick Jennings   MG TC                 4 1250 C O Jennings

   Bill Ferguson   Cooper                       J G M Ferguson

   D I Jansz       Kieft                   1096

   Neil Montcrieff Cooper                       J N K Montcrieff

   Chia Eng Quee   Jowett Jupiter        4 1496 Douglas Frank

Results:

  1 Fred Pope Jaguar 1:23:48

  2 Fai       Jaguar

  3 Caroline  Allard

  4 Quee      Jowett

dnf Chan             38 laps engine

dnf Anderson  Double 19 laps clutch/overheating

Fastest lap: Chan 1:57 63.25 mph

 

Aussie readers please note - the 1953 entry of the "Double V8" IS the aussie special built by Eldred Norman. Mick Jennings is another Oz driver who went over for a number of years.

 

In these early years, the driver with "English" surnames were all English and some US military men still stationed at Singapore.

Edited by Porsche718, 25 January 2018 - 14:34.

[bill p]

By the way, Johor is the State, Johor Baru is the capital city at the end of the old causeway from Singapore.

Pedant time!
Capital is Johor Bahru. Sorry to be picky, Roger

Bill P

[Porsche718]

........ and Pasir Oudang (or Pasir Udang) is the name of the district where the street circuit was. It is now a major industrial area and known as Pasir Gudang.

[Ray Bell]

Our very welcome returning friend, a note about the 'Double V8'...

Within the Norman family, and presumably much of the Adelaide racing circle, it was known as the 'Double Eight'. It, of course, went through many forms between its construction in the late forties and when Norman sold it to Sid Anderson in 1951.

I notice that the Johore Grand Prix gets a number of mentions in AMS, I will try to remember to look them up when I get home and see if other years are covered.

[john medley]

Steve

      A charming Graham Howard explanation, perhaps self-created, re a Johore-racing singleseater with Ford V8 power on a Fiat 1100 chassis and parts of many other cars, called the Kudensay, was that it was so named because the builders Couldn't Say (Kudensay?)what it was.

[Ray Bell]

Well, Graham did do an article for RCN about Strine...

Surely that's in keeping?

[Porsche718]

HI John. Yes, they could never come up with a name so it became the "Kudensay". The first Kudensay was written off by Neil Montcrieff in the 1950 Johore GP, then the rebuilt Kudensay 2 was driven by Roy Kendall in 1951.

 

Montcreiff and Kendall were both Qantas engineers based in Singapore (or Malaysia). Without going to my pre-war Aus files, I seem to recall that Montcreiff raced in Oz immediately prior to WW2

 

(photo VintageRacecar)

 

This would be 1950 Johore GP

[Ray Bell]

Not a bad looking thing...

And it obviously entailed a lot of input, hence it just had to be rebirthed after being crashed.

The bodywork, the knock-off wire wheels, both obvious signs of expenditure of both time and money.

[Porsche718]

Yes it is quite attractive, but the nose is a bit "Massey Ferguson"!

[Ray Bell]

At least it's not 'Lockheed Constellation'...

The tail is also a disappointment. I wonder if Mk 2 cleaned this up?

By the way, Steve, you left us hanging on a question in James' quiz thread.

[Repco22]

A short story;--
      In either '94 or '95 we went down to Albany for the annual R-t-H re-enactment and at breakfast in the guest house we met
a retired chap who hailed from our home town of Mandurah.
     Turned out to be Gordon Linney--number 51 in the 1952 Johore GP list above.
Gordon was a Brit who had been in the army in post war Malaya at the time of the communist insurgency.
     He told of the special he built which incorporated some unlikely ingredients including a Ford V8 motor and from memory, Fiat 500 suspension.
He gave me a photo which showed his car and a number of other starters but I'm having trouble locating it.
Will post it when it turns up.

 

[Team Result]

There is a Pasir Gudang circuit currently in operation in Johor State. In fact, I was there last year when the pits were used as a Service Park for Rally of Malaysia.

Rumour has it that the Sultan of Johor is a motor sport fan and is involved in a large re-development plan for the track (several other major track plans for the region have all fallen over).

Edited by Team Result, 26 January 2018 - 05:47.

[Repco22]

 Here is the start pic of the '52 Johore Grand Prix mentioned in post 19 above.
            Neil Montcrieff, Cooper, leads [left to right], Au Nai Fai, XK120 [25], Bill Ferguson, Cooper JAP,
            Derek Bovet-White, XK120 [60], Saw Kim Thiat, XK120 [24] and what could be the LA Special of
            Lim Peng Han.
                 Further back [left] are the MGTDs of L H Chan and LC Chan [ 30 & 33]. Extreme left, N G Reddish, A40 Sports.
            That's according to the start list above.
            Gordon Linney's Cadillac-Mercury-Fiat is the white car in the centre.

Edited by Repco22, 20 February 2018 - 09:49.

[Rupertlt1]

this is one of the images I have just acquired.

 

 

 

click on the photo for a larger image

 

Could this be the Lotus-Climax of Englishman P. A.G. Brown, 2nd to Chan Lye Choon (Lola), 25 June 1961?

Peter Brown, Singapore Motor Club secretary. No, said to be a Mark 17.

70 laps, just over 2 miles circuit.

So is it the car of A. J. Huggett, registration SS 769?

Both Lotus cars entered in the Singapore G.P., 16-17 September 1961.

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, Today, 12:05.

[BRG]

[LittleChris]

Roads are still there though have improved over the years

[Porsche718]

Could this be the Lotus-Climax of Englishman P. A.G. Brown, 2nd to Chan Lye Choon (Lola), 25 June 1961?

Peter Brown, Singapore Motor Club secretary. No, said to be a Mark 17.

70 laps, just over 2 miles circuit.

So is it the car of A. J. Huggett, registration SS 769?

Both Lotus cars entered in the Singapore G.P., 16-17 September 1961.

RGDS RLT

 

Definitely Tony Huggett at the 1961 Johore Grand Prix. Retired when a con-rod decided to depart and go elsewhere.