28 replies to this topic

[SophieB]

If this is definitely footage of what did for Leclerc, 3 places for blocking is incredibly harsh:

 

@F1

Charles Leclerc was handed a three-place grid penalty following this holding up incident with Dany Kvyat in Saturday qualifying

Leclerc will start the Styrian Grand Prix from P14 on Sunday

#AustrianGP 🇦🇹 #F1
 

https://twitter.com/...4381867009?s=21

 

[jcbc3]

All penalties can be argued in the severity. I agree that when even Kvyat said he didn't think anything of it, it probably shouldn't have been assessed. 

 

But there must have been 'something' in the telemetry that proved the case and Ferrari/Leclerc had an opportunity to defend themselves. And since we are down to micro managing racing (looking at last weeks GP), them's the breaks.

[SophieB]

Well I also thought last week’s was harsh but not nuts. This seems crazy on the face of it!

[Muppetmad]

That's outrageous. When there's a clear instance of blocking, it should of course be investigated, but ridiculous penalties like this make clear that the "let them race" mantra of last year has gone out the window. If I were Leclerc, I'd feel aggrieved.

[ARTGP]

Wasn't Leclerc on his own lap, and just trying to keep that glorified dump truck on the track? Is it really his fault he was so slow in the Ferrari? What can you do.

Edited by ARTGP, 12 July 2020 - 10:15.

[SophieB]

That's outrageous. When there's a clear instance of blocking, it should of course be investigated, but ridiculous penalties like this make clear that the "let them race" mantra of last year has gone out the window. If I were Leclerc, I'd feel aggrieved.

It would seem so. It would be helpful if the approach has changed that they communicated this to the audience.

[ANF]

I don't know. Leclerc seems to slow down onthe racing line to build a gap. Kvyat was probably on a fast lap and may have lost half a second. One might argue that Leclerc didn't didn't see him because of the spray, but then poor visibility is a good reason not to slow down on the racing line.

[baddog]

I understand he said he slowed to make his own next lap better, but the lap of the car behind (which he had been informed of) was impacted and the view is that outlaps are not important compared to a fast lap, so it tends to be ruled pretty harshly.

 

Given he slowed on purpose its open and shut isnt it?

[Marklar]

by those standards we would have 50 penalties every Monaco qualifying

[Mila]

 

Given he slowed on purpose its open and shut isnt it?

 

Yup.

 

He butchered DK's lap:

 

Edited by Mila, 12 July 2020 - 10:40.

[pdac]

Without being specific about this particular incident, they need to have less rules that require judgement and more rules with pre-defined and/or measurable parameters. But then, when they do, they still add judgement (e.g. unsafe pit release)

[Sam1]

From where he was starting its not that big of a deal he will pass them pesky black markers soon.

[pRy]

The pants quality of the onboards here doesn't seem to fit what the cars are doing on the track in terms of grip/throttle etc. Do they have an issue or are the 2020 cars just a lot easier to drive in the wet?

[ARTGP]

Without being specific about this particular incident, they need to have less rules that require judgement and more rules with pre-defined and/or measurable parameters. But then, when they do, they still add judgement (e.g. unsafe pit release)

 

  .  Don't kid yourself....

[SenorSjon]

Without being specific about this particular incident, they need to have less rules that require judgement and more rules with pre-defined and/or measurable parameters. But then, when they do, they still add judgement (e.g. unsafe pit release)

We had that. You got a 10 second stop & go for speeding a tiny bit in the pit lane.

[FullOppositeLock]

It looks harsh based on that footage I must admit, but wasn’t it the case that Leclerc got pre-warned twice by his race engineer over team radio that a car on a hot lap was approaching? Taking that into account he probably shouldn’t have been cruising on the racing line in the corners 9-10 complex in order to get himself a bigger gap to the car in front.

Having said that, in these conditions and if Kvyat or Alpha Tauri didn’t protest I would have let is slip.

[PayasYouRace]

 

If this is definitely footage of what did for Leclerc, 3 places for blocking is incredibly harsh:

 

@F1

Charles Leclerc was handed a three-place grid penalty following this holding up incident with Dany Kvyat in Saturday qualifying

Leclerc will start the Styrian Grand Prix from P14 on Sunday

#AustrianGP #F1
 

https://twitter.com/...4381867009?s=21

 

 

Does seem a bit harsh from that point of view, but I can only assume the telemetry showed it to have held Daniil up.

[Clatter]

I thought there had to be a protest before they investigated these sort of incidents.

[F1matt]

They probably just relied on Karun Chandok's opinion. 

[pdac]

We had that. You got a 10 second stop & go for speeding a tiny bit in the pit lane.

 

But, at least you can argue about the severity of the penalty or the rule, itself - not about whether it was broken.

[Lights]

I don't get the fuss so much. Leclerc wasn't on a hotlap and did slow Kvyat down who was on a hotlap.

 

Penalty feels consistent to me.

[TomNokoe]

I've just checked live timing. The incident happened with 8:50 remaining in Q2.

Both drivers were on flying laps until Leclerc backed off by 5s in the final sector.

Kvyat had recorded two personal bests and was -0.665s up on his first flying lap. He ended the lap +0.264s slower.

He did improve later in the session, but the lap he was blocked on would have been faster still.

If you take the 0.665s that he lost, and assume he would've matched his previous final sector, it would've put him on a 1:19.373, good enough for 10th, clearing Vettel by 0.172s.

This is a big assumption, however, because even before meeting Leclerc he didn't have one green mini-sector in S3, so it's borderline to say it actually cost him a place in Q3 (which shouldn't really be a consideration, anyway).

Edited by TomNokoe, 12 July 2020 - 11:30.

[jjcale]

Well I also thought last week’s was harsh but not nuts. This seems crazy on the face of it!

 

That's what happens when you get pictured partying outside your "bubble" between doubleheaders and Liberty/FIA cant punish you for that because .... reasons. 

 

You need to stay completely out of their gaze ... or this is the result.

[Yamamoto]

by those standards we would have 50 penalties every Monaco qualifying

 

That just makes it sound more attractive to me.

[Claudius]

But what about FIArrari? I thought Ferrari had FIA in its pocket...

[GlenWatkins]

I don't know. Leclerc seems to slow down onthe racing line to build a gap. Kvyat was probably on a fast lap and may have lost half a second. One might argue that Leclerc didn't didn't see him because of the spray, but then poor visibility is a good reason not to slow down on the racing line.

I agree, but a 3 grid penalty?  With the conditions, a stern warning would've sufficed.  Now he starts 14th.

[Garndell]

But what about FIArrari? I thought Ferrari had FIA in its pocket...

 

For that see the red flag investigations.

[FLB]

But what about FIArrari? I thought Ferrari had FIA in its pocket...

This just shows how far they've fallen and not just because of Binotto... though I imagine Emanuele Pirro may not have wanted to show any leniency after the way he was treated after Montreal last year.

[KWSN - DSM]

Personally I would get rid of the impeding all together, but now that it is here Leclerc need to suffer the consequences, and there should be zero interpretation... impeding = 3 spots no if's, and's or but's.