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Roger St John Hart


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#1 dolomite

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Posted 31 August 2020 - 09:10

Have recently discovered that I am related to 1970s historic racer Roger St John Hart, one time owner of the well known Aston Martin Zagato 2 VEV which in later years sold for a record price at auction. He died in 1989. The information that I can find about him online seems to be mainly focussed on his association with said vehicle, with little mention of the man himself. I was wondering if anybody here knows of him and could help to fill in any more details about him or his racing exploits?

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#2 Red Socks

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Posted 31 August 2020 - 09:38

Your best bet is his brother Tony Hart IIRC.

He had a Stag tuning, repairing business down in Fulham back in the day.

Roger was a type but he was a good bloke-had a lot of laughs with him.



#3 Vitesse2

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Posted 31 August 2020 - 09:54

His full name was Roger Alfred St John Hart, born June 1st 1943, Marylebone, died May 25th 1989, Westminster. Two marriages, again both in Marylebone, 1968, 1973. Home address at the time of his death was Hinton House, Longbottom Lane, Beaconsfield; estate was worth a cool £8.3 million.

 

Seems to have been a very private man (or very good at keeping his name out of the papers!) - the only press mention I could turn up was in The Times' 'latest wills' column. I'd guess he was probably one of those whose profession was 'something in the City'. Stockbroker? Commodities trader? Lloyds?



#4 Red Socks

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Posted 31 August 2020 - 10:32

He was in property in the West End with an office in Wimpole St.



#5 dolomite

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Posted 31 August 2020 - 13:40

Thanks guys. I already know the basic family background. I was looking for any more info about his motor racing Involvement - what events he took part in, what he drove, any photos etc. I’ve already made contact with Tony Hart recently, will see what he can tell me about his brother.

#6 Belmondo

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Posted 31 August 2020 - 14:34

I remember him racing a DBR2 and DB4 Zagato in the mid-80s:

 

http://img4.imagetit...brands-85-3.jpg

 

http://img4.imagetit...brands-85-3.jpg


Edited by Belmondo, 31 August 2020 - 14:35.


#7 68targa

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Posted 31 August 2020 - 17:01

I too remember him racing fairly frequently during the 1970's and early 80's  Always seemed to be in Astons and a frequent entrant/driver at the JDC and  AMOC St John Horsfall meetings. In 1972 he is shown as entrant of a 1961 AM Zagato (presumably 2VEV) and also a DB4 GT. Nick Cussons was one of the drivers on that occasion.

 

 

I have a couple of photos if of him if of any interest - 

i1982-BH-mg490.jpg

This is in 1982 at Brands Hatch - pressing on a bit in 2VEV

 

i1982-OP-mg255.jpg

 

and again in 1982 this time at Oulton Park

 

There is another Aston Martin Zagato (reg 22XKX) from the Hart Racing stable photographed in 1976 - this one I seem to remember was dark blue.

 

1976-sil-img401.jpg



#8 dolomite

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Posted 01 September 2020 - 07:19

Many thanks 68targa and Belmondo, great phiotos!

#9 Gregor Marshall

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Posted 03 September 2020 - 10:58

According to the 1992, 1996 and 2000 AMOC Registers Some Who Served section, he was Social, Entertainments, Southern Entertainments or Membership Activities Sub Committee 1975 -1976.

His listed club competition history with 2 VEV is:-
1972 Donington Concours 2nd, Fort Belvedere Concours 2nd, HSCC Concours 2nd, With Cussons entered at Wiscombe (1st), Curborough (2nd) and L&CMCC (1st) events.
Then for 1973, Hart entered WECC Snetterton (1st), BDC Silverstone (5th), FOC Goodwood (2nd).
1974 to 1981 is listed as an extensive rebuild by Richard Williams.
1981 is Hart, Dubai (4th).

1982 is Hart, Brands Hatch (3rd), BRDC Silverstone (2nd), St J. Horsfall Silverstone (5th), Oulton Park (6th) Allcomers, (7th) Historic race and then car was tested for June edition of Thoroughbred & Classic Cars (might be more information on Roger in the article).
There is nothing until
1985 Brands Hatch (5th), St J. Horsfall Silverstone (5th), Silverstone Concours (3rd), Curborough (no result listed) and Oulton Park (5th)
1986 Featured in Classic Car
1990 Featured in The Times
From 1991 it features with Cussons as the driver, who had driven it from 1969 to 1972. in 1993 it was returned to AML for accident repairs after a road accident, with 1995 being returned to its owner after repairs, during which the car was returned to its August 1963 specification.
Maybe Nick Cussons owned the car, with Roger driving or maybe they owned 2 VEV together?

For 22 XKX, there is the following Hart listings:-
1974 JDC Silverstone (2nd) and BARC Thruxton (7th)
1975 North Weald Sprint (1st), Silverstone (3rd) and then A.Hart (4th) - maybe his brother Tony?
1976 Brands Hatch (1st), Silverstone (1st) and BRSCC Mallory Park (1st).
Nothing else listed until 1980, car featured in February Car Graphic (so might have more information on Roger)
The next entry is 1981 were is is used in Japan with a Kobyashi with other results after, so potentially had been sold and 2 VEV had been restored, as it looks like he bought 22 XKX to use whilst 2 VEV was being restored.

In the 2001, 2002 and 2003 AMOC Members Lists, there is a Mr A. Hart in East Cladon, Surrey (full address listed) with a DB4 (full chassis listed) and member ship number (listed) - I won't post these details here though for obvious reasons. Is that his brother?

Also, I have six Roger St John Hart Challenge Trophies (three silver trophies and three crystal wine glasses) that my late Dad won in 1991, 1993, 1994, 1996, 1999 and 2000 and these were awarded for the fastest lap in an Aston Martin at the annual St John Horsfall meeting in any race.

I hope the above helps you to learn a little bit more about him, if not some of his AMOC competition history.


Edited by Gregor Marshall, 03 September 2020 - 10:59.


#10 bradbury west

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Posted 03 September 2020 - 11:28

22XKX was indeed dark blue, the colours of its first owner RRC Walker , for Sir Stirling to race, but he only practised it , IiRC, prior to his terrible accident at Goodwood. The prettiest Zagato DB4 imho...
Roger Lund.

#11 dolomite

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Posted 03 September 2020 - 12:10

@Gregor Marshall thanks very much for all that info. Yes, I would think that the references to A Hart are his brother Tony. Nick Cussons owned 2 VEV from 1969 to 1971, when he sold the car to Roger. After Roger died in 1989 his widow allowed Nick to compete in it again which he continued to do until it was damaged in a road accident in 1993 according to the history given here: https://www.bonhams..../24876/lot/335/

Edited by dolomite, 03 September 2020 - 12:22.


#12 RCH

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Posted 03 September 2020 - 15:28

22XKX was indeed dark blue, the colours of its first owner RRC Walker , for Sir Stirling to race, but he only practised it , IiRC, prior to his terrible accident at Goodwood. The prettiest Zagato DB4 imho...
Roger Lund.

I think Stirling may have raced it somewhere? I suspect he considered the 250 GT SWB a better proposition. I believe the car was owned later by Mike Salmon and driven by him Ian Baillie and Brian Hetreed.

 

Edited to add, Stirling finished 3rd. in the Fordwater Trophy at Goodwood in 1961 but doesn't seem to have raced it subsequently.


Edited by RCH, 03 September 2020 - 15:49.


#13 Belmondo

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Posted 03 September 2020 - 18:04

AMOC-Brands-85-4.jpg


Edited by Belmondo, 03 September 2020 - 18:05.


#14 F1matt

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Posted 04 September 2020 - 08:45

Some very nice photographs there. Out of interest is the name pronounced "Sinjin"? 



#15 dolomite

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Posted 04 September 2020 - 09:50

AMOC-Brands-85-4.jpg

Thanks Belmondo, do you know if that is Roger in the photo? I haven't previously seen a picture of him but I'm wondering if he could be the guy in the flat cap?



#16 Belmondo

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Posted 04 September 2020 - 19:35

I'm not sure. The photo was taken in the early-morning queue for scrutineering and the meeting is AMOC Brands, May 5th 1985, at which Roger raced both 2 VEV and the DBR2 pictured in a previous post. I think we can say with some confidence the guy in the leather jacket next to him is probably NOT Roger St. John Hart.



#17 Red Socks

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Posted 05 September 2020 - 07:42

Some very nice photographs there. Out of interest is the name pronounced "Sinjin"? 

Yes



#18 Red Socks

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Posted 05 September 2020 - 07:44

Thanks Belmondo, do you know if that is Roger in the photo? I haven't previously seen a picture of him but I'm wondering if he could be the guy in the flat cap?

No its not.



#19 dolomite

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Posted 05 September 2020 - 07:47

No its not.

 

OK, thanks



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#20 cedricselzer

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Posted 05 September 2020 - 22:25

I use to socialise with Roger and his first wife in the 60's. He also owned COB 1 which he rolled and put himself in hospital for some time. He died of stomach cancer. His second wife is godmother to my daughter. When I first met him he had 1600 Alfa GT. He sold it as he needed the money for  some property development he was involved in. The St.John part of his surname came later on.



#21 clivekay

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Posted 30 March 2021 - 17:00

I remember Roger very well . He worked for my Dad in the property business in the 60's He was Motor Racing mad in those days and he took my brother and I to many races .. His mode of transport then was a white Fiat 500 !! I believe he lived then in Wembley . He was very friendly with Paul Michaels and and Ronnie Spiegel in the early Hexagon days in a mews garage off Fitzjohns Avenue in Hampstead/Swiss Cottage ! Daleham Mews I believe ! He was I think just getting married for the first time !!  Great times !!



#22 Red Socks

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Posted 01 April 2021 - 11:46

In 1980 Roger was somehow inveigled by Gerard Sauer into managing the Hot Car Magazine entry in the Willhire 24 Hour race at Snetterton. The entry was in essence a road going 2.8i Capri on long term loan from Ford Motor Company press department

I cannot for the life of me remember why or what the connection was between Gerard and Roger. Whatever I was 2 i/c.

Roger arrived very professionally complete with his secretary from the office to manage the team.

Good practice so good grid, come 4 pm good start.

At about half past seven Roger announced that he was off for dinner-complete with his team- and would be back later.

Fortunately we had no major problems during the night, had to pinch the rear brake drums off Mike Andrew's road car in the paddock in the morning appart from that all was well.

Roger reappeared with his team about 10.30 AM- Sunday morning- looking suitably rested from a night in a local hotel- we of course had not slept.

He left shortly after lunch.

Good team manager with great style I always thought.

Still we came third -eventually - and picked up a cheque for so doing.


Edited by Red Socks, 01 April 2021 - 11:47.


#23 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 01 April 2021 - 12:30

The St.John part of his surname came later on.

Can someone explain to this Yank how this works?

:) :wave:

#24 Red Socks

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Posted 01 April 2021 - 13:57

Common law dictates one can call oneself what ever you like provided they is no deception involved.

Thus one can add, remove or change names to your hearts content .

My driving licence gives me the prefix of Dr.a status I have no legal right to but I have always found the police are much more polite when addressing one than I was as a simple Mr. Critically I under no circumstance make any authoritative claim to the title, or claim any job rights etc.

Unlike your proud country there is also no requirement to carry any form of identity -the police can only require you to present at three days notice for example in the case of driving licence, unlike the US where the ''Drivers licence'' is in effect a mandatory ID card.



#25 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 01 April 2021 - 15:16

Common law dictates one can call oneself what ever you like provided they is no deception involved.
Thus one can add, remove or change names to your hearts content .
My driving licence gives me the prefix of Dr.a status I have no legal right to but I have always found the police are much more polite when addressing one than I was as a simple Mr. Critically I under no circumstance make any authoritative claim to the title, or claim any job rights etc.
Unlike your proud country there is also no requirement to carry any form of identity -the police can only require you to present at three days notice for example in the case of driving licence, unlike the US where the ''Drivers licence'' is in effect a mandatory ID card.


Thanks for that explanation. I have learned something. Did Mr. Hart acquire the St. John purely as an affectation, or was there some other reason?

Just for clarification, in the US there is no federal mandate or requirement to carry personal identification. It is a matter left to each state. There are some exceptions that are circumstantial: boarding a commercial aircraft, passing through customs or immigration, receiving federal subsistence, etc., but one is not required to carry identification just on the chance that a trenchcoated federal agent might appear demanding, “Papers, please.”

#26 Red Socks

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Posted 01 April 2021 - 16:39

I suspect pure affectation; St John-pronounced Sinjun - is pretty high end affectation.

I refer you to the third wedding in the movie ''Four Weddings and a Funeral '' for an instance of use/misuse thereof.

Apologies for my misunderstanding of US law-clearly I understand the Federal Aircraft situation but on the few occasions when asked for ID outside airports I never got the impression that it was optional !

Clearly the states where it occurred meant it was not many many years ago before UK driving licences had photos I provided my UK and International permit to be told that I had been asked for a Drivers Licence ''Not a club card Boy!!'



#27 Jack-the-Lad

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Posted 01 April 2021 - 16:57

I suspect pure affectation; St John-pronounced Sinjun - is pretty high end affectation.
I refer you to the third wedding in the movie ''Four Weddings and a Funeral '' for an instance of use/misuse thereof.
Apologies for my misunderstanding of US law-clearly I understand the Federal Aircraft situation but on the few occasions when asked for ID outside airports I never got the impression that it was optional !
Clearly the states where it occurred meant it was not many many years ago before UK driving licences had photos I provided my UK and International permit to be told that I had been asked for a Drivers Licence ''Not a club card Boy!!'


Roger Moore in the role of James Bond (I can’t remember which movie) used St. John as an alias...St. John-Smythe, I believe...also pronounced Sinjun.

No apologies necessary, I assure you. You were likely stopped by a local or state officer (there are no federal traffic police) and they typically ask for “license, registration and proof of insurance, please.”

#28 Thart

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Posted 11 April 2021 - 11:36

Good morning, I am Anthony St.John-Hart, brother of Roger, better known as Tony Hart, got fed up with all the mispronunciations. If anybody would like more information about Roger please feel free to contact me. Oh, it wasn't an Alfa he sold for his first property deal it was an MGB.



#29 bradbury west

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Posted 11 April 2021 - 14:38

Welcome here. I think you will find you are leaning on an open door.

Roger Lund