25 replies to this topic

[FirstnameLastname]

The two support championships seem to be bringing the most excitement to race weekends, and will be sorely missed in the latter part of the F1 season.

Plenty of action, a championship fight... things that F1 can only dream of.

Is there anything that could be taken from these two championships and applied to F1 in order to fix some of the long standing problems with F1? And would they be palatable to the sport/fans or would they just detract from the dna of F1?

[Ben1445]

Well, a spec car would be the obvious one...

...but that’s go down like a lead balloon...

[PayasYouRace]

Have a single make of car.

[CountDooku]

Nothing. Those who like watching slow cars in a spec series with a relatively low standard of driving can watch F2 and F3.

[Kalmake]

The two support championships seem to be bringing the most excitement to race weekends, and will be sorely missed in the latter part of the F1 season.

Is there anything that could be taken from these two championships and applied to F1 in order to fix some of the long standing problems with F1? And would they be palatable to the sport/fans or would they just detract from the dna of F1?

Subjective. They don't seem to pull many viewers. I watch the feature races sometimes. Reverse grids detract from the dna of sport and it's hard to give a toss who wins such championships.

[Cyanide]

Here's an idea: the FIA launches a spec car each January that all teams get. The teams have no background info on the spec car before its launch. 

 

Each team can develop the car throughout the year with a tight budget cap in place. By the end of the season, the spec car is handed back. The next year the FIA launches another spec car that's slightly different to last season and the cycle re-starts. 

 

This way you have a semi-spec racing series without compromising the development race. 

 

I'm free on Wednesdays, FIA if you need me for the details. 

[noikeee]

You don't need to make all cars exactly equal, you just need to make teams closer to better approach this kind of racing (which I agree is much more exciting than F1 although I haven't watched this morning's races yet).

A good direction is the budget cap that's coming, and simplifying the tech in some way. I believe the engine largely stays the same for 2022 but sooner or later they'll converge.

And tbh behind Mercedes we already get this in F1, qualifying yesterday was extraordinarily close behind the top 2 and apart from the Ferrari engined cars who are behind at the moment. It's just not clear what exactly Mercedes are doing that's so ridiculously better than everyone else. The budget cap will slightly erode their advantage, but whether they'll be pegged back to a human level remains to be seen, as lots of their knowledge they accumulated over recent years should remain relevant even under different car design regulations.

And I understand not everyone thinks it's a problem and that Mercedes should be rewarded for doing a better job, but I do think it's a problem. They are a bigger/larger/better/more committed organisation than anything they're fighting in F1. You wouldn't watch a heavyweight boxer beat up some lightweight guy, but that's kinda what we've been having in F1 for nearly a decade now. I think it's a very real problem and quite crap to have a massive manufacturer splashing literally billions (cumulative over the years) to beat up some modern garagistes like Racing Point or Williams - and then even partially turn some of their competitors into affiliate teams. It would be much more interesting to watch 10 organisations of similar size/nature fight each other, which of course is what we have in F2 or F3. I'd just pass up on the absolutely identical cars.

Edited by noikeee, 06 September 2020 - 11:08.

[Anja]

And tbh behind Mercedes we already get this in F1, qualifying yesterday was extraordinarily close behind the top 2 and apart from the Ferrari engined cars who are behind at the moment.

 

That's perhaps the weirdest thing about F1. Every team has to spend these ridiculous amounts of money cause we want independently built cars... but at the same time we're always trying to make their performance as close as possible cause that's what the show demands. Makes total sense.

 

 

If F1 went spec the racing would instantly be 10x better and it wouldn't be so insular with all kinds of teams and drivers able to enter thanks to reasonable costs. The loss of that famous "engineering warfare" is a small price to pay. The only complaints would come from the tech-obsessed handful and those unwilling to accept that things are changing and the "F1 DNA" no longer works. 

[TomNokoe]

Massive grids

[Ali623]

Spec cars obviously, but the worse standard of driving in F3/2 makes things more interesting. Especially watching the F3 race yesterday, some of the driving was terrible, but it makes it fun I guess.

 

Best way to get similar results in F1 would be to make the cars far more diffcult to drive.

[P123]

Well, a spec car would be the obvious one...

...but that’s go down like a lead balloon...

 

Has to be the 'right' spec car too- like current Indycar chassis gives great racing or the FE chassis looks a bit lively (though may be the bumpy tracks).  

 

I don't think current F2 holds a candle to the original incarnation of GP2.  In fact it's a huge shame that F2 and F3 have resorted to being scale models of F1 cars.  F1 should definitely not look to these two for inspiration, as they took theirs from F1.

[steferrari]

Make cars shorter again! 

They look better and probably it could boost track battles.

[LiftAndCoast]

Lower downforce = better racing.  F2, F3 and Indy all demonstrate the folly of the current generation of F1 cars.

 

The 2022 cars are a step in the right direction, but personally I wish they'd aimed for a bigger reduction in downforce.

[Spillage]

Try to equalise the performance of the cars to ensure the championship is competitive. Much easier in a spec series than in F1.

[balage06]

Hopefully nothing. Monza is an exception, but races tend to be quite processional these days.

[Chunkinator]

Lower downforce = better racing.  F2, F3 and Indy all demonstrate the folly of the current generation of F1 cars.

 

The 2022 cars are a step in the right direction, but personally I wish they'd aimed for a bigger reduction in downforce.

 

Not gonna lie, pretty sure every Indy 500 itself has been worse since they introduced the new cars. Haven't really watched Indycar with the old 'Aerokit' cars on road courses so can't compare that to now.

[Marklar]

I'm quite sure that spec cars wont solve any issues in all likehood. Prema is dominating for 10 years straight in F3 for example. And the racing in F1 is usually as good in the midfield as there. Anything else is a bit more extra craziness due to 17 years old naturally having lower driving standards. Engineers can still make a huge difference even in a spec series, too many people forget that.

[Anja]

I'm quite sure that spec cars wont solve any issues in all likehood. Prema is dominating for 10 years straight in F3 for example. And the racing in F1 is usually as good in the midfield as there. Anything else is a bit more extra craziness due to 17 years old naturally having lower driving standards. Engineers can still make a huge difference even in a spec series, too many people forget that.

 

Nobody's saying spec series is completely equal, no racing ever will be. And F3 is a weird one but that's just one series, GP2/F2 had a different team winning the team championship every year in the past five years. 

[Dhillon]

Reverse Grid.

[AlexPrime]

To be honest, most championships are quite interesting, F1 is the exception. It is the domination - with such huge advantage of Merc, I think only BoP can help, but purists will hate it. I think that today LMP2 cars have the best racing, although this year there is domination in ELMS as well.

[William Hunt]

Nothing. Those who like watching slow cars in a spec series with a relatively low standard of driving can watch F2 and F3.

 

the standard of driving isn't 'low' in F2 & F3: those fields are filled with bright young talents. And how fast a racecar can drive is no factor in how exciting a series is to follow. And btw: an F2 car is not slower as an IndyCar, it's probably slightly faster.

[ArrowsLivery]

Remove the front wing and most car to pit telemetry for a start!

[moreland]

A lot of radical ideas being suggested above, and nothing wrong with that, but I'm going to go with something a little more mundane and suggest that I think having only 2 tyre compounds and being obliged to use both works better than F1's current rules of having 3 and choosing your favourite 2. The problem with the F1 rule is that the best 2 tyres are normally both quite good, and as a result tyres don't really become much of a factor in the race. F1 did have the the current F2 rules until the end of the 2015 season IIRC. There were some decent tyre-based races, I'm thinking of Grosjeans' recovery drive at India 2013 and possibly my favourite race of the 10s which was China 2011, when Webber almost won from way down the grid. I can't think of an F1 race that's been good in the same way since 2016.

[ANF]

I guess F1 teams could hire less experienced and more error-prone drivers.

[Joefane]

Less minor aerodynamic bits on the car. More simple front wings and bargeboards. Less practice time.

[OvDrone]

To never have Ticktum on the grid.