74 replies to this topic

[Risil]

Fontana, California’s Auto Club Speedway will be transformed into a half-mile short track beginning next season.

The Athletic first reported the plans. NASCAR did not offer additional information, but confirmed it has submitted site plans to San Bernardino County for a remodeling of the existing infrastructure.

Auto Club is a 2-mile oval that hosts one NASCAR weekend each spring. Construction is not expected to affect its 2021 race schedule.

“We are still very early in the process, but we are excited about what this ambitious project could mean for our loyal fans in Southern California,” said Craig Neeb, NASCAR executive vice president and chief innovation officer. “This is our first step towards creating a state-of-the-art facility that would deliver the intense short-track racing our fans love, an intimate viewing experience, and upgraded suites and hospitality areas that would position Auto Club Speedway among the top entertainment venues in the market.”

 

https://racer.com/20...le-short-track/

 

Er, unexpected news? What will this mean for Indycar, NASCAR, racing in California in general?

 

Any other tracks you'd like to see given a radical redesign?

[PayasYouRace]

That's less a conversion and more a complete demolition and building something new. I guess that means they've given up on Indycar ever returning, because half a mile is really too short for them. Shame, because the 2-mile D-shape was ideal for Indycars.

 

I presume they've worked out that the short track stuff is going to make the track profitable, to the point that demolishing the circuit and building a new one is worth the risk.

 

I suppose Henri will be happy.

 

If there's one track that could do with a similar treatment, it's Yas Marina. Knock it down and start again.

[AustinF1]

Wow. This is really something. There are 1/4 mile, 3/8 mile, and 1/2 mile ovals all over the place in the U.S. I guess this just reflects the condition of motorsport these days. Super speedway and big venue road course racing seems to be slowing down while short track racing is thriving and growing by leaps and bounds. Seems they're trying to position themselves as the big dog in the western US short track scene while still potentially keeping a NASCAR date. Probably a smart move, imho. I don't like big oval racing much, but short oval racing (esp on dirt) is just fantastic.

Edited by AustinF1, 08 September 2020 - 20:46.

[djparky]

That's less a conversion and more a complete demolition and building something new. I guess that means they've given up on Indycar ever returning, because half a mile is really too short for them. Shame, because the 2-mile D-shape was ideal for Indycars.

I presume they've worked out that the short track stuff is going to make the track profitable, to the point that demolishing the circuit and building a new one is worth the risk.

I suppose Henri will be happy.

If there's one track that could do with a similar treatment, it's Yas Marina. Knock it down and start again.

That last sentence made me laugh

I didn't think there was ever much chance of Indy Car returning to Fontana. There are other tracks Nascar uses I would have demolished first though.. number one would have been Pocono, followed by Atlanta

[boomn]

I could have seen a resurgent Indycar doing a race at some future time in Fontana if the track converted to something friendlier to Indycars.  Especially if they ever lose Long Beach GP.  But not if its a 0.5 mile oval.  Something more like Iowa would have been great

[FLB]

At least it's not (completely) Ontario 2.0.

[maximilian]

Wow, what a shame.

 

If there ever was a way to Mickey-Mouse a track...!  It would have been better off dying the same way Ontario did.

 

[FLB]

What baffles me completely, though, is that they're doing this while Irwindale is in major, major trouble.

[Dmitriy_Guller]

If there's one track that could do with a similar treatment, it's Yas Marina. Knock it down and start again.

The second part is entirely optional, as far as I'm concerned.

[Afterburner]

What a shame... the first oval race I properly watched and enjoyed was the 2013 race there. The raw speed was unbelievably cool to me and the 2015 race there is still probably the best race I’ve ever seen.

At least it went out with a bang:

[Atreiu]

I still watch NASCAR occasionally and I am under the impression cars are always spread out and every race sucks. So as a casual spectator I am indifferent to the circuits and more concerned these cars might just be the worse.

Am I right or just unlucky with the races segments I watch?

[Afterburner]

To those who may be unaware, the world record for fastest lap set at a closed-course facility was at Fontana–a 241.4 mi/h run by Gil de Ferran in a Reynard Honda in 2000:

[loki]

The issue with Fontana and Indycar was attendance and not the track.  I was at the last few Fontana races.  The packing issue was due to everyone being able to drive flat out. Give them more boost so the have to lift and brake and that would change things.

 

Looks like they’re going down more toward the size of Irwindale or Harvick’s place outside Bakersfield.  They haven’t made money on the superspeedway for years.  The Cup date is lightly attended as well.  They make it on the road course club and track day rentals and the small drag strip and parking lot karting track they have.  Even with those mods it doesn’t look like those other tracks may be impacted.

[Mila]

 

. . . the world record for fastest lap set at a closed-course facility was at Fontana–a 241.4 mi/h run by Gil de Ferran . . .

 

With enough banking, he could break that record at the new track. 

 

[racinggeek]

It's also been brought up in other locations that the property around there, even though it's intended for industrial use, is worth more than its value as a racetrack. Not that that's unusual for motorsports facilities, but some are saying it's a much greater difference because it's SoCal.

 

That's assuming the two-mile is going away; I haven't seen that specifically stated but that does seem to be the case. The diagram at RACER.com shows the half-mile placed along the front straight, kinda like the short track the Legends Cars use at Charlotte.

 

I can understand it from a cold business perspective, but it gnaws at me that another track is changing its layout pretty much to suit NASCAR needs.

Edited by racinggeek, 09 September 2020 - 01:33.

[loki]

It's also been brought up in other locations that the property around there, even though it's intended for industrial use, is worth more than its value as a racetrack. Not that that's unusual for motorsports facilities, but some are saying it's a much greater difference because it's SoCal.

 

That's assuming the two-mile is going away; I haven't seen that specifically stated but that does seem to be the case. The diagram at RACER.com shows the half-mile placed along the front straight, kinda like the short track the Legends Cars use at Charlotte.

 

I can understand it from a cold business perspective, but it gnaws at me that another track is changing its layout pretty much to suit NASCAR needs.

It’s a Superfund site.  Due to having the Kaiser steel mill on that spot for decades the use is restricted.  They won't ever be able to do residential there and not all of the site has environmental barriers, only the main buildings and grandstands.  Doing the rest of the site could be cost prohibitive even of you could get the zoning change and EPA sign off.

[red stick]

Shhhhh!

For a group that tried to take out the Migratory Bird Treaty Act, this would be child's play.

Edited by red stick, 09 September 2020 - 05:10.

[jonpollak]

For me, personally, if they turned it into a slurry pit that would be fine in my book. I hate that place.
Jp

[H0R]

As a Greg Moore fan I find this not soon enough and not thoroughly enogh. Just nuke that damn site, I don't ever want to hear the name Fontana again.

Edited by H0R, 09 September 2020 - 07:05.

[pacificquay]

As per the last two posts, I’ve hated Fontana since the 1999 race

[SenorSjon]

https://racer.com/20...le-short-track/

 

Er, unexpected news? What will this mean for Indycar, NASCAR, racing in California in general?

 

Any other tracks you'd like to see given a radical redesign?

 

Hockenheim could do with its old layout. Reinstating the northern part of Assen would also be on my to do list.

[Beri]

Pitty. There are not many ovals left where drivers can go 4 wide into a corner and come out unscathed.

[Beri]

For me, personally, if they turned it into a slurry pit that would be fine in my book. I hate that place.
Jp

 

 

As a Greg Moore fan I find this not soon enough and not thoroughly enogh. Just nuke that damn site, I don't ever want to hear the name Fontana again.

 

As someone who did saw the footage of the Moore crash, but not really have seen him race before, I do get the mourning over a fan favourite driver. Yet, why is it, after all these years, that there is so much hatred towards Fontana? Its not that F1 fans stood en masse at the Liberty offices with pitchforks and torches because Imola was announced for this season. Why is it that Fontana gets this treatment by many that I see up here?

[Risil]

Probs because Fontana was still a new circuit in 1999 and not particularly beloved as a venue.

Whereas Imola was and still is one of the great Italian road circuits.

[H0R]

 Why is it that Fontana gets this treatment by many that I see up here?

 

As far as I am concerned it is a completely irrational rection, I give you that.

 

But in the other hand I don't like open wheel racing on any Superspeedway, even IMS makes me feel uncomfortable.

[Ali_G]

Sounds like.a complete and utter rebuild.

A bit sad even with Greg Moore in mind. Similar to Hockenheim, I didn’t want to lose the OST Curve as Jim Clark died there.

Indycar could easily have started running a race there again. A half mile oval is no go sadly.

[PayasYouRace]

I guess we’ll have to just keep asking for IndyCar to return to Michigan then.

[BiggestBuddyLazierFan]

They should name the new circuit after Greg Moore.

[loki]

The superspeedway will be toast.  Jayski has the graphic that’s more clear than the one that was imposed under the oval in the Racer post.  

 

https://www.jayski.c...le-short-track/

[red stick]

So.  Bristol West?

[PayasYouRace]

So. Bristol West?

He says “high banked” so yeah, looks that way.

[red stick]

He says “high banked” so yeah, looks that way.

That's what I was working from.  ****!!! NASCAR.

[PayasYouRace]

That's what I was working from. ****!!! NASCAR.

Ok. Wasn’t quite expecting that reaction. Would you have preferred Martinsville West?

[red stick]

Even Bristol isn't Bristol any more. I can both understand the reasoning behind the decision and bemoan the fact that IndyCar has one fewer possible destination.

[red stick]

Also, California is purportedly a land of innovation and possibility. Knocking down what is basically a Michigan copy to build a Bristol copy seems . . . lazy?

[PayasYouRace]

It does look more like a mix of the two. The narrow “paper clip” of Martinsville with its long straights and tight corners with the high banks of Bristol. Bristol itself is more of a wide track with short straights and long corners. This could at least be a bit different.

I’m not an expert on short ovals, so I’d be interested if this plan matches any existing circuits more closely.

[shotcaller]

It’s a Superfund site.  Due to having the Kaiser steel mill on that spot for decades the use is restricted.  They won't ever be able to do residential there and not all of the site has environmental barriers, only the main buildings and grandstands.  Doing the rest of the site could be cost prohibitive even of you could get the zoning change and EPA sign off.

Warehouse (Amazon) stuff is what they are after.

[ExFlagMan]

I still watch NASCAR occasionally and I am under the impression cars are always spread out and every race sucks. So as a casual spectator I am indifferent to the circuits and more concerned these cars might just be the worse.

Am I right or just unlucky with the races segments I watch?

 

Maybe you need a friend who can drop their hot-dog wrapper on the back straight?

[Risil]

I guess we’ll have to just keep asking for IndyCar to return to Michigan then.

 

Indy, Pocono, Michigan. That's my preference.

 

I get that Indycar never gave Fontana a stable date or even start time, but I don't think the 500-miler there ever built a following? The races were usually good.

[pacificquay]

An Indycar race on a 0.5 would be fun though

[Beri]

That's less a conversion and more a complete demolition and building something new. I guess that means they've given up on Indycar ever returning, because half a mile is really too short for them. Shame, because the 2-mile D-shape was ideal for Indycars.

I presume they've worked out that the short track stuff is going to make the track profitable, to the point that demolishing the circuit and building a new one is worth the risk.

I suppose Henri will be happy.

If there's one track that could do with a similar treatment, it's Yas Marina. Knock it down and start again.

I've been in contact with Henri, and he isn't happy nor sad about the track being remodelled. He explained to me that, prior to Moores fatality, there have been instances of heavy accidents as well. Even with Zanardi crashing twice over one weekend in 1997. And his replacement crashing out as well. Also Fontana was, at the time of Moore's, death more focused on hosting NASCAR races. So it makes sense now that they will remodel it into a NASCAR configuration.

[Risil]

There were some terrible crashes at Michigan in that period, and no doubt there would've been at Indy had CART been running there too. I think those cars on those tracks were at the limit, or possibly beyond it.

 

Perhaps it's different with the SAFER barrier and safer infields, but the cars are also many miles per hour slower.

[Beri]

Slower cars are always will have a positive effect on safety. 240mph is nutter.

[Atreiu]

Maybe you need a friend who can drop their hot-dog wrapper on the back straight?

 

Are drones allowed close enough for such shenanigans?

:-)

[eibyyz]

Will there be a roval?  LOLOLOL

[Ali_G]

There were some terrible crashes at Michigan in that period, and no doubt there would've been at Indy had CART been running there too. I think those cars on those tracks were at the limit, or possibly beyond it.

Perhaps it's different with the SAFER barrier and safer infields, but the cars are also many miles per hour slower.

Be thankful they ran the Hanford devices. Purported to slow the cars by 10mph minimum.

[jonpollak]

Will there be a roval? LOLOLOL

Seeing as we Californians copy circuits why not put a Mini-Riverside in the vast parking lot that no one will ever park in?
Jp

[Beri]

Seeing as we Californians copy circuits why not put a Mini-Riverside in the vast parking lot that no one will ever park in?
Jp

 

Shopping.. wait for it.. Malls..

[Makarias]

With enough banking, he could break that record at the new track. 

 

According to my calculations, equalling that lap record on a cylindrical wall with a half mile circumference would lead to a constant "vertical" (as experienced by the driver) g-force of 9.26 g.

[Risil]

According to my calculations, equalling that lap record on a cylindrical wall with a half mile circumference would lead to a constant "vertical" (as experienced by the driver) g-force of 9.26 g.