47 replies to this topic

[absinthedude]

Imola has been announced as returning once again to the F1 calendar this coming season.

 

While I applaud the FIA/Liberty in swiftly making the necessary changes to the calendar, I am disappointed that the one addition to the 2020 calendar which was a let down is the first to be confirmed. It would have been a lovely surprise to wake up to the news that Portimao, Mugello or even Instabul had a place in 2021.

[Barty]

Even though Imola was the least exciting addition to the 2020 calendar, I wouldn't call it a let down. The race was better than it was expected to be. 

 

But, I agree that any of the other three 2020 additions would be more preferable.

Edited by Barty, 12 January 2021 - 09:37.

[Ruusperi]

I'm glad. Imola should never have been dropped in the first place. It's as traditional as, let's say, Suzuka. The complete opposite of wide tilkedromes, the kinds we have plenty.

And I would say there's a pretty high chance they have to cancel more flyaway races, so in that case we probably see Mugello, Portimao and Istanbul again.

[owenmahamilton]

Mugello needs work on it's infrastructure if it wants to hold a regular grand prix in my opinion, the track layout itself is good but the fact that recovery vehicles cannot easily get to an incident without putting out a red flag every time is not good really.

Edited by owenmahamilton, 12 January 2021 - 09:57.

[Anja]

I liked Imola a lot last year. Not every race has to be a DRS fest, we saw some good action when it mattered. It really felt like something a bit different and F1 needs that with the ever-growing calendar. 

Edited by Anja, 12 January 2021 - 10:02.

[Goron3]

I enjoyed the Imola race last year. It was spectacular, and the fact that Lewis in part won the race because Max was stuck behind an ailing Bottas definitely highlighted the overtaking problem, it was at least great to see a relatively high speed circuit with hardly any tarmac run off.

 

I actually enjoyed it as much as the Porteguese GP, probably because the DRS was too strong there (and not strong enough at Imola!).

[Risil]

Imola's a beautiful, challenging, historic circuit. The races are normally not very eventful but I prefer to look at the pros and cons as a whole.

 

Portimao's probably coming back too, right? I enjoyed Mugello but people whose opinions I pay attention to have raised questions about its safety for F1 cars. And tbh I'd prefer them to focus on the MotoGP race this year.

 

Would be great to see Istanbul back although after last year's tarmac debacle (tarmacle?) I suspect the track operators may have burnt some bridges with F1. You need reliability and dependability from your backups after all.

[JimmyClark]

If Imola tightened up the Tamburello chicane, that would help with overtaking possibly. Or, even better, get rid of the Villeneuve chicane and cover it off with Techpro to make Tosa a great overtaking spot again (there's certainly enough space to give the corner less angle than it had in 1994). Surely that should be safe enough now? 

[Calum]

It’s a shame Imola only appears on the calendar when you can’t travel in good faith, and experience it in person.

It looks beautiful and has a historic charm that most venues don’t offer.

[Marklar]

Imo the current cars outlived this track and look awkward on it. I prefer it over some tracks on the calendar, but definitely not over Shanghai.

[William Hunt]

the environment, the hills, at Imola is absolutely spectacular, it's a wonderful region. Yes the track is hard to overtake but it's a beautiful circuit, unlike tracks like Abu Dhabi that feel artificial. Imola has a lot of history as well.

Edited by William Hunt, 12 January 2021 - 11:11.

[absinthedude]

Imola is beautiful, it has history....all this I know, I've been watching F1 since 1978...which also means I'm aware that after the necessary modifications for 1995, it's just not been much good for F1 racing. I had hoped that the changes made since the last grand prix would lead to some of the flowing nature of the track to return and to decent racing....but I didn't see that last year. 

 

So I'm disappointed that the first official announcement is Imola....and not one of the other "emergency" tracks from 2020....I hope I'm proved wrong and that the 2021 grand prix at Imola is a cracker. 

[krapmeister]

How cold is it going to be at Imola this early in the season?

 

Nevermind - just googled it. Could be mid teens in temps and a good chance of rain. 

Edited by krapmeister, 12 January 2021 - 12:13.

[Myrvold]

How cold is it going to be at Imola this early in the season?

Nevermind - just googled it. Could be mid teens in temps and a good chance of rain.

Well, San Marino GP used to be run late April/First weekend of May. Its only 2 weeks difference.

[JimmyClark]

Imo the current cars outlived this track and look awkward on it. I prefer it over some tracks on the calendar, but definitely not over Shanghai.

 

I sort of agree, but that's part of the charm of it - the calendar needs that variety. 

 

But I agree Shanghai is one of the better modern circuits. 

[Spillage]

Very happy to hear this. Cracking circuit. Wasn't a classic last year but it's just exciting to watch the cars go around the place.

 

I think Mugello is probably the better track but definitely has a few infrastructure deficiencies. They really struggled to clear away Stroll's car after his accident there last year.

 

EDIT: Just one small bugbear. Imola should be the San Marino Grand Prix!

Edited by Spillage, 12 January 2021 - 13:04.

[H0R]

Nice. Now if they only would get rid of the Villeneuve chicane to get a clear run towards Tosa and make some passing possible.

[Fastcake]

Imo the current cars outlived this track and look awkward on it. I prefer it over some tracks on the calendar, but definitely not over Shanghai.

Agreed. A bad case of the past is always better syndrome.

[noikeee]

Where did you guys wanted to go to otherwise? What's the other options?

 

It's too hard to overtake at Imola with modern F1 cars, but it looks nice on TV and the drivers enjoy driving on it. I think it's the right decision to hold a race there early season when travelling is almost certainly still going to be severely restricted.

[Beri]

I dont think the last race at Imola was a bad one. Not even when you exclude the safetycars. So I dont agree with most of what has been written above.

[PayasYouRace]

Always happy to see Imola back. I don't remember last year's race being particularly bad either.

[Londoned]

I was really pleased to see Imola in 2020 

 

It was like bumping into an ex partner...looks really attractive and you wonder why you're no longer together but after getting it on again you know why you separated

 

I'd like to see Imola every few years...

[Dunc]

I've never liked Imola to be honest. I would have preferred Mugello if the race had to be in Italy but I would have preferred it more if F1 had looked somewhere else for a race, maybe a return to Indy, Sepang, Istanbul or even a second race in either France or the UK?

[absinthedude]

Where did you guys wanted to go to otherwise? What's the other options?

 

 

 

Mugello? Portimao? Istanbul? Sepang? 

 

I used to love Imola but I agree with those who say that the cars have outgrown it, and I also believe that it just hasn't flowed or offer decent overtaking since 1994. Even the 21st century upgrades haven't really resulted in restoring the old flow to the circuit. 

 

I'm grateful Imola was able to step in last year, but it just doesn't add much to the calendar. It's pretty, it always was....but it's just not suited to this version of F1. That's a separate problem, we need shorter cars. 

[Beri]

Mugello? Portimao? Istanbul? Sepang? 

 

I used to love Imola but I agree with those who say that the cars have outgrown it, and I also believe that it just hasn't flowed or offer decent overtaking since 1994. Even the 21st century upgrades haven't really resulted in restoring the old flow to the circuit. 

 

I'm grateful Imola was able to step in last year, but it just doesn't add much to the calendar. It's pretty, it always was....but it's just not suited to this version of F1. That's a separate problem, we need shorter cars. 

 

Trust me, aside from Sepang, F1 will race in all those places in 2021.

[cpbell]

Mugello? Portimao? Istanbul? Sepang? 

 

I used to love Imola but I agree with those who say that the cars have outgrown it, and I also believe that it just hasn't flowed or offer decent overtaking since 1994. Even the 21st century upgrades haven't really resulted in restoring the old flow to the circuit. 

 

I'm grateful Imola was able to step in last year, but it just doesn't add much to the calendar. It's pretty, it always was....but it's just not suited to this version of F1. That's a separate problem, we need shorter cars. 

Indeed, there's little wrong with the track, other than the fact that the modern hybrid canalboats aren't suited to that type of circuit, having been optimised for modern circuits with short-duration angled corners and runway-width straights.

[William Hunt]

they should drop the Villeneuve chicane imho, that would restore the flow and the entry in Tosa would be great.

[Beri]

Problem being that the Tosa runoff isn't big enough for current safety standards.
I'd say tighten the Villeneuve into a off camber (double) hairpin whilst reinstating the Tamburello.

Edited by Beri, 13 January 2021 - 17:52.

[LucaP]

There is no room to change Villeneuve or Tosa, guys...

The only chance would be eliminating Variante Alta making Rivazza a prime passing zone.
Or tightening Tamburello..

[AlexPrime]

Great to see Imola back again. Wonderful and historic place.

[absinthedude]

they should drop the Villeneuve chicane imho, that would restore the flow and the entry in Tosa would be great.

 

That would help....but for reasons stated probably cannot be done. I wonder if they could do something more imaginative with Tamburello other than a medium/fast chicane. 

[PayasYouRace]

With modern barrier technology, Tamburello could easily be restored into something like it was pre-1995. (They could probably have done so 20 years ago to be fair. They just weren't quite there with SAFER type barriers in 1994/5.)

 

The Villeneuve chicane is still awkward in that its a decent driving challenge but absolutely kills the overtaking option at Tosa. However 

 

I'd say tighten the Villeneuve into a off camber (double) hairpin whilst reinstating the Tamburello.

 

there's a special place in Hell reserved for people like you.

[William Hunt]

Problem being that the Tosa runoff isn't big enough for current safety standards.
I'd say tighten the Villeneuve into a off camber (double) hairpin whilst reinstating the Tamburello.

 

How would you do that? Behind the Tamburello is water, you can't move that wall back. The only option I would see to reistate the Tamburello is to move the corner forward but even then there wouldn't be enough runoff most likely, it's just too dangerous.

Is it really so that they can't create more runoff at Tosa? I don't really see why that wouldn't be possible there. That Variante Villeneuve section really ruins it for me, I wish we could re-use the old configuration there, that was so exciting: at full throttle through the Villeneuve kink to Tosa: it was epic.

Edited by William Hunt, 13 January 2021 - 21:24.

[PayasYouRace]

How would you do that? Behind the Tamburello is water, you can't move that wall back. The only option I would see to reistate the Tamburello is to move the corner forward but even then there wouldn't be enough runoff most likely, it's just too dangerous.

Is it really so that they can't create more runoff at Tosa? I don't really see why that wouldn't be possible there. That Variante Villeneuve section really ruins it for me, I wish we could re-use the old configuration there, that was so exciting: at full throttle through the Villeneuve kink to Tosa: it was epic.

 

With SAFER or Tecpro barriers. Much like we'd be expecting to see at Zandvoort, or as we saw at Indy. It's not hard. It's what I was referring to before. We now have the technology to have made Tamburello safe without putting a chicane in. We've had that technology for a good 20 years. But we didn't have it in 1994/5.

 

As for Tosa. There's not a lot of room for runoff, which without the chicanes would be approached at about 200mph in an F1 car.

 

[Beri]

How would you do that? Behind the Tamburello is water, you can't move that wall back. The only option I would see to reistate the Tamburello is to move the corner forward but even then there wouldn't be enough runoff most likely, it's just too dangerous.
Is it really so that they can't create more runoff at Tosa? I don't really see why that wouldn't be possible there. That Variante Villeneuve section really ruins it for me, I wish we could re-use the old configuration there, that was so exciting: at full throttle through the Villeneuve kink to Tosa: it was epic.

PAYR answered these questions for me. But hypothetically seen, it would be some epic scenery should the Tamburello and the Villeneuve be reinstated to their former glories including having the current setup of the Rivazza to start/finish without the Variante Bassa. One amazing speedfest that would be.

[dannyricsshoe]

Call me old fashioned but I'd take any race from a country with motor racing pedigree any day over some of the others on the calendar. Couldn't care less about sports washing and not that bothered about track design either. Could be the best design in the world but still would be lifeless for me without some true fans.

[Hellenic tifosi]

Call me old fashioned but I'd take any race from a country with motor racing pedigree any day over some of the others on the calendar. Couldn't care less about sports washing and not that bothered about track design either. Could be the best design in the world but still would be lifeless for me without some true fans.

 

Absolutely.

 

Just take a look at this picture - says it all, really....

 

[BRG]

All this chatter about changing the Imola circuit.  Who is going to pay?  No spectators means the track gets no income so where is the money coming from?  Too many people here are cavalier about spending other people's cash!

[Hellenic tifosi]

The big problem is that the Tamburello chicane is fast and that the track kinks slightly right before the braking zone.

[wj_gibson]

I very much feel Imola should be classed as a historic circuit like Spa and Silverstone, and always be on the calendar. It might not throw up a great race every year, but then it’s not like Spa provides scintillating Grands Prix all the time either.

 

More to the point, an uneventful race at Imola is still far more eventful than an uneventful race at Sochi or Abu Dhabi.

Edited by wj_gibson, 16 January 2021 - 09:03.

[William Hunt]

Racing in Italy is always special, there's just that unique atmosphere there, they've got several great tracks and the fans are passionate. We should always have 2 Italian races on the calendar just because it's Italy.

Edited by William Hunt, 16 January 2021 - 10:12.

[William Hunt]

I very much feel Imola should be classed as a historic circuit like Spa and Silverstone, and always be on the calendar. It might not throw up a great race every year, but then it’s not like Spa provides scintillating Grands Prix all the time either.

 

More to the point, an uneventful race at Imola is still far more eventful than an uneventful race at Sochi or Abu Dhabi.

 

I would prefer to have Monza always on the calendar and to have Imola alternate with Mugello (or even better... all 3 of them). Mugello is a better track for me as Imola but Imola is also very atmosferic and the hills surrounding it are so lovely.

[Hellenic tifosi]

I would prefer to have Monza always on the calendar and to have Imola alternate with Mugello (or even better... all 3 of them). Mugello is a better track for me as Imola but Imola is also very atmosferic and the hills surrounding it are so lovely.

 

My personal preference would be to alternate between 2 of the 3 Italian tracks every year, but still, having Monza every year and alternate between Mugello and Imola is also a fantastic prospect

 

Anyway, the race would have been much more interesting if the tyres were one step softer.

[wj_gibson]

In so many ways I think both Imola and Mugello superior circuits to Monza, though of course Monza has the history. I’d have the three rotate between two GPs. When Monza is on the calendar, either of the others can function as a San Marino GP.

 

In the years that Imola and Mugello are on the calendar together, Mugello would be the Italian GP.

 

Completepy unrealistic, of course, but all three have far better claims to races than several other current circuits. Or Jeddah.

[BRG]

Personally, I'd take Mugello over Imola, and both over Monza.

[Beri]

Personally, I'd take Mugello over Imola, and both over Monza.

No matter how much I love Monza for the times I have been there, it pains me to agree with you.

[Hellenic tifosi]

Personally, I'd take Mugello over Imola, and both over Monza.

Absolutely.

[LucaP]

Just 3 tracks? Make it 4..Vallelunga would be epic with the fast outer sweeper

Edited by LucaP, 16 January 2021 - 19:09.