59 replies to this topic

[AlexS]

Is this the most idiotic FIA Penalty?

 

https://www.fia.com/...nfringement.pdf

 

If this stands FIA is disrupting the Sport in name of "consistency".

Edited by AlexS, 18 April 2021 - 18:37.

[Zesus]

Ridiculous and crazy.

[Jvr]

So Perez was slapped 10 seconds for overtaking during SC and Kimi slapped 30 seconds for not doing so?

   

[anyeis]

Formation lap when there is safety car on the track

[dreamer]

Ridiculous...

[masa90]

This is absolute crap. I would use harsher words, but I believe that would be against the rules of the forum.

 

Stuff like this makes the sport look like absolute joke.

[Marklar]

Mandatory penalty, quite clear then.

[MortenF1]

Still unbelievable

[barzini]

What a YOKE! 

 

Why the FIA gave Mercedes a fine in Bahrain last year when they fitted Russel with Bottas' tyres? How was this not a "team fault" then? This sport and it's stewards are a bad joke.

Edited by barzini, 18 April 2021 - 18:45.

[Myrvold]

Mandatory penalty, quite clear then.

 

That's what I get from it as well.

 

"Mandatory penalty" and implied "this is confusing and not something we would've applied if we were free to do what we would like".

[Vesuvius]

What a YOKE!

Why the FIA gave Mercedes a fine in Bahrain last year when they fitted Russel with Bottas' tyres? How was this not a "team fault" then? This sport and it's stewards are a bad joke.

Indeed and stewards didn't have time to answer to Alfa team, when they asked for clarification lol

[AlexS]

If this stands FIA destroyed the race sporting truth.

[Muppetmad]

If it's really necessary to apply a penalty in circumstances like this, I do rather wish the report would emphasise the efforts the stewards and the FIA will go to to make the necessary changes to the regulations to avoid a repeat scenario.

[Mark521]

Does this push Kimi out of the points for this race?

[Vesuvius]

Does this push Kimi out of the points for this race?

Yes, he drops to a place 13.

[Mark521]

Yes, he drops to a place 13.

Thanks, sorry for Kimi, seems very harsh considering the circumstances but as stated above the stewards didn't have much leeway.  I wonder who complained to the race director?

[masa90]

This is just sad. Pretty much every time after a race someone feels shafted by the stewards.

[Topsu]

If it's really necessary to apply a penalty in circumstances like this, I do rather wish the report would emphasise the efforts the stewards and the FIA will go to to make the necessary changes to the regulations to avoid a repeat scenario.

It is not always necessary to apply the correct penalty.

 

No mitigating circumstances for Kimi I guess

Edited by Topsu, 18 April 2021 - 18:55.

[johnnyw]

Yeah, sadly it seems the rules are always different for "big teams".

[Starish]

F1 really does know how to ruin a race over stupid technicalities. Hope they appeal. 

[AlexS]

It is not always necessary to apply the correct penalty.

 

No mitigating circumstances for Kimi I guess

 

That is an excellent evidence of double standards by the stewards.

Edited by AlexS, 18 April 2021 - 18:59.

[ANF]

It is not always necessary to apply the correct penalty.
 

No mitigating circumstances for Kimi I guess

But in this case Article 42.6(a) explicitly says, "A penalty under Article 38.3(d) will be imposed." And 38.3(d) is "A ten second stop-and-go time penalty."

[Baddoer]

Disgusting.

[barzini]

That is an excellent evidence of double standards by the stewards.

 

Difference here is the team. Mercedes > Alfa Romeo. On track and in the cabinets.

[Jerem]

Comedy gold.
Hopefully they appeal and get the penalty removed.

[ANF]

You obviously can't have cars retaking their positions after the SC lights are out and the field is bunched up behind the leader who dictates the pace. It would lead to chaos! So I think Kimi, Alfa and the stewards did the right thing. (Well, Kimi made a mistake when he went off and lost those positions...)

[Myrvold]

It is not always necessary to apply the correct penalty.

 

No mitigating circumstances for Kimi I guess

 

"Up to" means it's not written that it will be thus the stewards have leeway to apply common sense/subjectivity(which might not always be common sense). Where here the rules state flat out what the penalty is, case closed.

[Jovanotti]

That's what I get from it as well.

"Mandatory penalty" and implied "this is confusing and not something we would've applied if we were free to do what we would like".

If only they always were this consequential (see the other example above)... For the top teams they usually pull a reprimand or team fine out of the hat in these cases. Surely acting in the intent of safety and not overtaking cars should be mitigating circumstances as well.

Edited by Jovanotti, 18 April 2021 - 19:14.

[Myrvold]

If only they always were this consequential...

 

Don't they usually give the correct penalty when the rules states exactly what penalty will be given? 

Or do I only remember all the times the have to apply whatever they feel?

[Taxi]

Pathetic. There is no way Hamilton or Leclerc would be penalized by this. Alfa simply has no power. The guy lost 2 places and they go like "well take another 5 places"!

[FunBobby]

This is getting more and more embarrassing. Kimi should leave this clown show. 

[Topsu]

"Up to" means it's not written that it will be thus the stewards have leeway to apply common sense/subjectivity(which might not always be common sense). Where here the rules state flat out what the penalty is, case closed.

Sporting penalty up to DSQ. A team fine is not that. They bent the rules for Mercedes, not for Alfa Romeo. Simple as that.

Edited by Topsu, 18 April 2021 - 19:19.

[Clrnc]

What a stupid rule. Needs to be removed ASAP. Ridiculous pen

[DaddyCool]

The whole package of 'behind the Safety Car' rules are a huge cluster****

 

The purpose of the SC should be to bunch up the field so that it can lead the pack through the track safely and to allow workers to clean up / maintenance the track. Instead of we have these ridiculous unlap rules (who was it last year here in Imola who almost collected a bunch of track workers?), regain your position rule (if you spun, tough ****, you should join back to the pack safely and accept the places you've lost), lead car controls the pace BS (went pretty weel in Mugello last year innit?), and this absolutely pointless rule Kimi was penalized for. 

 

Great job again by the FIA.

[Jovanotti]

Don't they usually give the correct penalty when the rules states exactly what penalty will be given?
Or do I only remember all the times the have to apply whatever they feel?

Yeah you're probably right. But then again enforcing track limits is pretty clear cut as well, but there they seem to just do what they like every other weekend during races. I don't think you'd find anyone here who thinks their ruling is even remotely consistent.

Edited by Jovanotti, 18 April 2021 - 19:19.

[AlexS]

Yeah you're probably right. But then again enforcing track limits is pretty clear cut as well, but there they seem to just do what they like every other weekend during races. I don't think you'd find anyone here who thinks their ruling is even remotely consistent.

Another good point, lack of consistency of track limits don't seem to bother the stewards.

[AlexS]

Evidence of double standards

 

https://www.formula1...8ACA5DcDKj.html

 

“However, the responsibility to fit tyres in compliance with the regulations, still rests with any team and thus a penalty is considered as being required. It is recommended that the FIA consider amending Article 24.4 b) to accommodate this type of breach when it is rectified without delay.”

[Oho]

It would lead to chaos! So I think Kimi, Alfa and the stewards did the right thing.

So its effectively a catch 22, aka ****ed up set of rules.....

[ensign14]

Mmm...I'm not impressed with Kristensen as driver steward.  When Magnussen took Leclerc out at Suzuka in 2018, Kristensen said that Leclerc was just as much to blame.

 

[SophieB]

Indeed and stewards didn't have time to answer to Alfa team, when they asked for clarification lol

I would be super interested in the teams and FIA expanding on this aspect. If they were asked what should Kimi do and basically answered ‘umm...not sure’, for example.

[masa90]

I would be super interested in the teams and FIA expanding on this aspect. If they were asked what should Kimi do and basically answered ‘umm...not sure’, for example.

Excactly. How can they have people in there, who do not know? Yet the teams should know this? Nevermind the driver, or what the hell even the spectators.

[sheSgoTthElooK]

That is so stupid. He lost 2 places and the jerks give him a penalty because they are not capable to respond to a simple question. You know, I believe they don‘t know their own rules. They have to re-read their Encyclopedia.

30 Seconds, what the ... anyway too much.

[AlexS]

Note that almost spin  Verstappen had at restart, if he would have been passed by Leclerc  he would get also a 30 sec penalty...

 

Imagine the F1  and this  forum in circumstance like that and not even talking about a decisive race for championship.

[SophieB]

Excactly. How can they have people in there, who do not know? Yet the teams should know this? Nevermind the driver, or what the hell even the spectators.

I don’t know If they said they don’t know, it’s possible they couldn’t get hold of the right people, I guess.

[ensign14]

That is so stupid. He lost 2 places and the jerks give him a penalty because they are not capable to respond to a simple question. You know, I believe they don‘t know their own rules. They have to re-read their Encyclopedia.

It comes down to the safety car rules being BS.  Letting lapped cars past to get their lap back and lining up in whatever order the FIA dictates or so on.  All for The Show - and because yellows breed yellows and Danny Ric is right, crashes bring in teh ratingz.

[Jovanotti]

Note that almost spin Verstappen had at restart, if he would have been passed by Leclerc he would get also a 30 sec penalty...

Imagine the F1 and this forum in circumstance like that and not even talking about a decisive race for championship.

Rest assured it wouldn't have been a 30s penalty in this case.

[Augurk]

The sh*t they let people get away with - and then penalize this with 30 seconds. 

Wow. 

[Fastcake]

Interesting steward critique on the regulations seeming a bit confusing.

 

Nevertheless, rules is rules...

 

That is so stupid. He lost 2 places and the jerks give him a penalty because they are not capable to respond to a simple question. You know, I believe they don‘t know their own rules. They have to re-read their Encyclopedia.

30 Seconds, what the ... anyway too much.

A five second penalty would have also knocked Raikkonen out of the points.

[Augurk]

Interesting steward critique on the regulations seeming a bit confusing.

 

Only when it suits the stewards.

[uzsjgb]

Excactly. How can they have people in there, who do not know? Yet the teams should know this? Nevermind the driver, or what the hell even the spectators.

 

The driver and the team have to play by the rules. If they have to ask the FIA what those rules are, something has gone wrong already. I cannot see the stewards having any obligation to answer a team's question in the heat of the moment. I would assume they have no capacity for this.

 

Concerning the rule itself, that seems to be quite sensible. You can't have drivers restarting from whatever position they want to. In addition you can't have a driver speeding through the field when everybody else is weaving and preparing for a restart. Quite dangerous.