498 replies to this topic

[Vielleicht]

 

Who will reign in Spain?

Formula E takes on a permanant race track facility to hold its first race in Spain at the Circuit Ricardo Tormo. Coming quick off the back of a Rome double header two weeks ago and ahead of a return to Monaco and the full Grand Prix layout two weeks later, this shouldn’t be one to miss. And yes, you heard that right, this is a permanant circuit not a temporary/street circuit. The ongoing pandemic has meant this race replaces the planned Paris ePrix and, in the process, looks like it may help answer a question everyone has been asking... how well does Formula E work at a permanant facility?

Schedule CEST | BST (UK) start
Saturday 24th April
Practice 1
07:20 - 08:05 | 06:20
Practice 2
09:15 - 09:45 | 08:15
Qualifying and SuperPole
11:00 - 12:00 | 10:00
Race: Round 5
15:04 - 16:00 | 14:04
 
Sunday 25th April
Practice 3
08:00 - 08:45 | 07:00
Qualifying and SuperPole
10:00 - 11:00 | 09:00
Race: Round 6
14:04 - 15:00 | 13:04

 

A permanant track, you say?

Yes! Technically, this will not actually be the first Formula E race at a permanant racetrack. The very first Formula E races were test events ahead of the very first season in August 2014 at Donington Park. Highlights are still available on YouTube for anyone curious to see how that went - it features some early race heroics from none other than two time Indy 500 champion-to-be Takuma Sato. Formula E has also been visiting the Autódromo Hermanos Rodríguez, itself a permanant racetrack in Mexico City, since the second season on a shorter loop loosely based around the old one mile oval. In general though, both the original FE track in Mexico and the slightly extended version of it used in 2020 had a certain feel of being a typically unique FE track, in part thanks to the close proximity of both temporary and permanent barriers.
 
Valencia, meanwhile, has hosted pre-season testing since the third season, as well as a number of unseen simulation races to test out the Gen2 cars and updated race procedures. Now this venue will host the Valencia ePrix, using slighly novel version of the Circuit Rocardo Tormo, loosely based around the International layout, to form a 15 turn, 3.376km course:
 

The first of the minor but notable notable modifications are at the regular T6, where the run-off is used to tighten the apex of the corner. Attack Mode is placed around the outside of the regular T8, after which the cars will use part of the School Circuit layout to cut through ina  street-circuit-esque sequnce to the sweeping T11/12 sequence. A chicane - mercifully not as insanely tight as the one used in pre-season testing sessions - will be placed just before pit-entry (diagram illustrative, may differ from final chicane):
 


The season so far…
Well, it’s been a little bit of a rollercoaster already.  Two night races in Diriyah got us going with victories for the clearly fast but incident prone Mercedes EQ team by 2019 Formula 2 Champion Nick de Vries, his first win in Formula E and for Jaguar Racing by Britain’s Sam Bird, who continued his unique streak as the only driver to have won a race in every season so far.
 



A double header in Rome provided us with rounds 3 and 4 on a tricky and damp circuit. The first race was won in calm and collected style by double Formula E champion Jean-Eric Vergne, a debut win for the newly introduced DS Techeetah powertrain. The second race saw Stoffel Vandoorne bounce back from a disappointing Saturday to take his second career ePrix win for Mercedes EQ.
 


 

What does all that mean for the championship standings?

Jaguar Racing currently leads both championships, having scored more points in the opening two events than they did in the entirety of last season. British driver Sam Bird currently leads the driver’s championship with his Kiwi teammate Mitch Evans right behind him in second. Robin Frijns has stealthy put himself third place in the standings for Envision Virgin, ahead of the two Mercedes EQ drivers of Vandoorne and De Vries.
 

 
Ok, I'm in, what can I expect to see in Valencia?

A good question indeed! On the championship front, expect to see the early leaders in Jaguar Racing, Mecedes EQ and DE Techeetah trying to make the most of their good start to the season. Porsche and Mercedes customer Venturi have been showing front-running promise from both of their drivers which they will surely want to try and turn into their first on-track victory sooner rather than later. Evision Virgin are looking like strong contenders (as ever) with the custumer Audi powertrain, with it surely only being a matter of time before Super Formula and Super GT ace Nick Cassidy finds his feet and scores a good result. Mahindra, Dragon and NIO333 have also made gains coming into this season and will be looking to continue their improving form. Meanwhile, the automotive giants Audi, BMW and Nissan will be looking to get back on track after dissapointing starts to theor season.

 

Ricardo Tormo also poses some unique challenges. Word has it that teams were practicing slipstreaming here in pre-season testing, something which it is believed made DS Techeetah so strong in last year’s 9 Days in Berlin season finale. It could be a feature in the racing as drivers attempt to make the most of their energy allocations on this wider circuit with sweeping turns.

Something which FE hasn’t had to deal with too much in previous years is gravel. There’s lots of it in Valencia should drivers stray too far off track to either get stuck in or drag back onto the circuit. Gravel should help police track limits at some turns, though FE’s solution for some of the flat-kerbed, tarmac run-off sections remains to be seen.

Another unknown is how much track evolution will come into play through the qualifying sessions. FE’s usual street tracks are usually very dusty and dirty roads which exhibit anything from significant to severe track evolution through qualifying, leading to the championship leaders out in qualifying group 1 to be at something of a disadvantage. That usually puts them further back in the pack and leaves them having to fight their way back to maintain position as champinship leaders. A permanent facility such as Ricardo Tormo may mean going out in group 1 isn’t as much of a disadvantage as it might usually be.

 

Lots of quesitons, lots of drivers and teams hungry for results. It is all to play for in the quest to become Formula E's first official World Champion.

 

Valencia Awaits...

[thegamer23]

Another week, another Double Header!
YAY!

Proper momentum building on this Season 7, love it.

And love the OP vielleicht!

Valencia will be so different than what we're used to, i can't wait to see how the action unfolds there.


Track limits could be an issue, expecially in Turn 1.

In the 2019 testing they allowed cars to go wide basically each corner, but this weekend there will be some deterrent solutions

(still not clear what's going to be, if sausage kerbs, or walls)

https://www.youtube....h?v=VJR0675k304

Edited by thegamer23, 19 April 2021 - 21:46.

[PayasYouRace]

This might get me to tune in again. I've grown so tired of the endless street tracks.

[M66R]

Bring it on.

[Ben1445]

Jaguar Racing currently leads both championships, having scored more points in the opening two events than they did in the entirety of last season. 

 

That's a bit mad. 

 

It has been great to see the team improving year on year. Really glad that they've signed up for Gen3 as well. 

[Ben1445]

I think we need some actual rules to 'Jack and Dario Catchphrase Bingo' because that sounds like fun. 

[Heyli]

I like the idea of a permanent circuit. Occassional street circuit is fine, but it still looks better on a real circuit!

[SB]

Since the last race weekend (Italy) my local sport channel, which has showing all the races since Series-1, race 1, is no longer showing Formula E races ( although still showing other series like F1, Indycar or even Extreme E !)

 

Instead , according to the official web, the FE main race could only be watched via a paid online boxing channel -

 

https://www.fiaformu...c430020ef5cb561

https://www.dazn.com...LOBAL/l/sports/

 

What the hack the FE promotion team thinking ?   

[Ben1445]

A boxing channel is a very weird choice, but their UK prices sound pretty reasonable. Two quid a month compared to trying to watch F1/IndyCar live on Sky platforms for £9.99 a race for one day streaming passes or the full £43pm for the right TV package. I've stopped following both of them properly ( ) because of those insane paywalls. 

 

But sounds like a weird choice for Hong Kong.

[thegamer23]

Since the last race weekend (Italy) my local sport channel, which has showing all the races since Series-1, race 1, is no longer showing Formula E races ( although still showing other series like F1, Indycar or even Extreme E !)

 

Instead , according to the official web, the FE main race could only be watched via a paid online boxing channel -

 

https://www.fiaformu...c430020ef5cb561

https://www.dazn.com...LOBAL/l/sports/

 

What the hack the FE promotion team thinking ?   

 

It's a shame, but DAZN is really getting bigger & bigger everywhere, so it's hardly surprising.

Here in Italy they have rights for Football, Indycar & MotoGP, for example. 

 

Hopefully the youtube streaming will be still availalbe for you.

Edited by thegamer23, 20 April 2021 - 07:58.

[Ben1445]

I'm really not against new-age streaming options in the least, as long as it's on a platforms which are good value for money and in wide use by audiences.

 

It is the 21st Century after all...

Edited by Ben1445, 20 April 2021 - 08:08.

[registered]

I wonder why they went with this weird config of using part of the school circuit as 8,9 and 10 instead of just using the national layout

[Ben1445]

I think the idea is to keep a level of uncertainty in set-up/preparation given that the national layout has been used extensively in pre-season testing these last few years

[Peat]

 

 

A permanant track, you say?

Yes! Technically, this will not actually be the first Formula E race at a permanant racetrack. The very first Formula E races were test events ahead of the very first season in August 2014 at Donington Park. Highlights are still available on YouTube for anyone curious to see how that went - 
 

 

 

 

Oooh, that's tantalsingly close to showing the sizeable crash between Chandhok and Buemi after the flag. So, the footage MUST exist. (Chandhok was late and missed the briefing where it was explained that after the flag, cars would do a u-turn into the pit exit)

WE, THE PEOPLE, DEMAND TO SEE THIS BANDITRY!

Edit: I misremembered. It was Buemi who missed the breifing: https://the-race.com...ormula-e-shunt/

Edited by Peat, 20 April 2021 - 10:24.

[thegamer23]

Oooh, that's tantalsingly close to showing the sizeable crash between Chandhok and Buemi after the flag. So, the footage MUST exist. (Chandhok was late and missed the briefing where it was explained that after the flag, cars would do a u-turn into the pit exit)

WE, THE PEOPLE, DEMAND TO SEE THIS BANDITRY!

Edit: I misremembered. It was Buemi who missed the breifing: https://the-race.com...ormula-e-shunt/

Never heard of this, fascinating story.

Sounds completely bonkers, but no surprise that the King of Controversy Buemi was involved 🤣

[Risil]

Formula E on a road course! Yay!

[MattK9]

I seem to remember Formula E had a full test race in Valencia one year. I hope (but doubt) that they release the test race footage.

[johnbarton]

looking forward to this - have really enjoyed the season so far!

[Ben1445]

I seem to remember Formula E had a full test race in Valencia one year. I hope (but doubt) that they release the test race footage.

 

I think they've done at least two in Valencia. Once with the then new Gen2 cars before Season 5 to get everyone rehearsed with the new car and then again the year after for race control/teams to test out new SC procedures. 

 

Pretty sure they held another one last October ahead of the current Season 7 as well, but participation was option and some peeled into the pits early according to reports. 

[thegamer23]

I seem to remember Formula E had a full test race in Valencia one year. I hope (but doubt) that they release the test race footage.

 

They did, and in 2019 the Race simulation was decided at the very last meter. 

A Photofinish between Di Grassi (Audi) & Sims (BMW)

 

 

[Ben1445]

Them there be walls, they be... 

 

[thegamer23]

Them there be walls, they be... 

 

 

 

Yep, you just know somebody is going to foksmash those barriers during the weekend 

Edited by thegamer23, 20 April 2021 - 19:21.

[PayasYouRace]

Them there be walls, they be... 

 

 

I'm beginning to think FE is suffering from agoraphobia. Cant wait for them to reinstate the Eau Rouge chicane when they finally go to Spa.

[Anja]

Chicane sponsored by Elon Musk's tunnel company.

 

[Ben1445]

It still looks far, far better than the pre-season testing chicane. 

[Vielleicht]

Righty.

 

Chicane set up guess number two based upon new evidence:

 

 

Should have known there would be walls.

 

New guess for Turn 6 modifications with temporary walls and FE kerbing:

 

Edited by Vielleicht, 20 April 2021 - 20:00.

[Peat]

Catch fencing???

[Vielleicht]

Cant wait for them to reinstate the Eau Rouge chicane when they finally go to Spa.

I'd say go one further and have them reinstate the original Virage l'Ancienne Douanne hairpin.

[PayasYouRace]

I'd say go one further and have them reinstate the original Virage l'Ancienne Douanne hairpin.

 

Which knowing FE they'd put a concrete chicane in the middle of.

[Ben1445]

If FE end up racing at Puebla later this year instead of the Mexico City race, as has been reported as a possibility, I wouldn’t see any need for them to make changes there.


Most of this circuit should be as normal anyway, save for a couple of areas.

[PayasYouRace]

They shouldn’t need to be making any changes by now.

[thegamer23]

 

Nice video by Trivedribe, never saw that

[Ben1445]

They shouldn’t need to be making any changes by now.

 

By now being... Gen2? 

 

Have to remember that Gen2 is effectively 2018 battery technology at its core. It's actually outdated already and, as you seem to identify, that's perhaps a bit of an issue. The original intent was to run on three year chassis cycles (as is the current plan for Gen3) but Gen2 has been pushed to four so we've got one more after this now. 

 

Even then though, I don't know how much these changes are about the capability of the technology and how much it is about a) increasing the challenge given that team already have loads of data from running an unmodified international layout last time out in pre-season testing or b) an attempt to keep some element of the unique FE challenge/aesthetic (even if that's exactly what some critics want to avoid). I actually suspect it's a mix of all three. 

[Ben1445]

Nice video by Trivedribe, never saw that

That video shows just how bad the season 5/6 pre-season testing chicane was! 

[MattK9]

Them there be walls, they be... 

 

 

That looks horrific. It will ruin the flow of the circuit and potentially give us an automatic red flag if anyone gets it significantly wrong during the race

 

What is the point of this chicane? What are they trying to achieve?

 

• Overtaking opportunity?  -  Well the chicane is too close to the final corner to create real overtaking into the chicane. If anything this chicane will reduce overtaking by spreading the field out before turn 1.
• Regen opportunity? - Any regen gained in braking for the chicane will be deployed down the start/finish straight. There is no energy gain per distance travelled by having a tight chicane.
• Slower Average speed? - The chicane will slow the cars down and reduce the average speed. This will help the cars save energy in the race, by simply driving less laps in a timed race

 

I am 100% against these mickey mouse chicanes. The highlights of the Donnington race (link in the OP) were fantastic. It was great to see the cars on a proper race circuit and the cars looked a lot faster than I remember Gen 1 being.

[Ben1445]

Interestingly, when they visit Monaco a couple of weeks after this race they will use the GP circuit but with the original 1929-1975 configuration of St Devote. 

[Vielleicht]

I think that photo might be a bit misleading on how the tight the walls will be because of the angle it is taken from. The first wall weems like a logical extention of the existing circuit barriers leadign towards the apex and then the chicane profile should be pretty similar to what was expected before we saw the real-life picture.

 

 

[Vielleicht]

The highlights of the Donnington race (link in the OP) were fantastic. It was great to see the cars on a proper race circuit and the cars looked a lot faster than I remember Gen 1 being.

That's genuinely really intersting, as I thought that they looked slower than I remember in that video. I wonder what the reason is for that difference in perspective...

[MattK9]

That's genuinely really intersting, as I thought that they looked slower than I remember in that video. I wonder what the reason is for that difference in perspective...

 

My reference for Donnington is BTCC. Maybe that explains it.

[Peat]

Interestingly, when they visit Monaco a couple of weeks after this race they will use the GP circuit but with the original 1929-1975 configuration of St Devote. 

 

A fast right hand sweep?

[Ben1445]

A fast right hand sweep?

That's the one

 

[thegamer23]

Simulator Lap with Alexander Sims

https://twitter.com/...877194497953792

 

Edited by thegamer23, 21 April 2021 - 17:07.

[Imateria]

Will be interesting to see if they can put on a good race, my memories of the WTCC around here are... not good.

[M66R]

Chicane looks real tight

[SB]

That's the one

 

 

Well well they should also straight out the chicane after the tunnel (pre-1987 layout ? altogether !! 

[thegamer23]

Last day of Pre-Season testing in Valencia looked like that

 

Slightly different track, true, but will we see the same kind of pecking order?

Dragon Penske looked super strong  there, despite the one season old powertrain.

 

 

[Ben1445]

I seem to remember Günther being fast here on more than one occasion in pre-season testing 

[Peat]

That's the one

 

 

Have they announced anything specific or are you just going by this image? It could simply be the social media kid mistakenly tracing the outline of the actual road in that area. 

The tighter kerbed apex there is to create a trajectory to utilise the natural run off area/escape road under the arch of the road bridge. I'd be surprised (delighted) if the FIA would homologate that profile of turn. 

[Ben1445]

Have they announced anything specific or are you just going by this image? It could simply be the social media kid mistakenly tracing the outline of the actual road in that area. 

The tighter kerbed apex there is to create a trajectory to utilise the natural run off area/escape road under the arch of the road bridge. I'd be surprised (delighted) if the FIA would homologate that profile of turn.

It was specifically announced with the release of the news on their website
 
"The FIA homologated track will consist of different kerb placement at Sainte Devote, exactly as its inception in 1929..."
(https://www.fiaformu...-circuit-layout)

 

There still seems to be a 'subject to homologation' caveat on the official circuit diagram, but unless there's a late change of mind it seems to be the official intention. 

[thegamer23]

Nice weather expected this weekend! 

 

 

 

Edited by thegamer23, 22 April 2021 - 09:34.